Coraggio Consulting Prince William Board of County Supervisors Meeting, Tuesday, October 24, 2023 Date: Tuesday, October 24, 2023 Place: Prince William County Board of County Supervisors, Virginia Length: 5h 54m (video) Official meeting video (Prince William County, Granicus): https://pwcgov.granicus.com/player/clip/3388 Official Board of County Supervisors page (Prince William County): https://www.pwcva.gov/department/board-county-supervisors Machine transcript (speech-to-text) produced by Coraggio Consulting. Not an official county record. Names and numbers may be misspelled; check the video at the timestamp before quoting. Speech-to-text: whisper.cpp, model large-v3-turbo. Produced 2026-11-02. Timestamps are [HH:MM:SS] into the meeting video. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [00:29:35] Check 1-2, check 1-2, check 1-2, check, check. [00:36:45] Good afternoon. [00:46:35] It's 2 p.m. on Tuesday, October 2023. For those who wish, please join me in a moment of silence. If we could all rise for the reciting of the Pledge of Allegiance. [00:47:01] To the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. I will note Supervisor Franklin's just running a little bit late, but she will be joining us probably within the next 10 minutes. [00:47:23] So that brings us on this afternoon to Agenda Item 3, which will be our accommodations and proclamations. We have three items on the agenda today. I will entertain a motion to approve Agenda Items 3A through 3C. So moved, Madam Chair. [00:47:38] Second. Motion made by Supervisor Bailey, seconded by Vice Chair Bodie. Is there any discussion? Seeing none, please vote. Can we work on getting that fixed? [00:48:04] I do want to give notice that while we just approved item 3A, which is the proclamation for the Boy Scouts, the accommodation for the Boy Scout troop, we will be doing that because they're obviously in school at the 7.30 session tonight. [00:48:29] With that, we're going to start with item 3B, commend the Lynx Incorporated Old Dominion chapter for 30 years of service. And if Supervisor Bailey could join me down at the podium and members of the audience who are representing Lynx Incorporated, please gather in the front of our chambers. [00:48:44] Thank you. [00:48:58] Thank you so much, Madam Chair. It gives me great honors to be here with my Lynx sisters today. [00:49:17] Don't they look beautiful? Yes, thank you so much. This is an accommodation for the Lynx Incorporated, the Old Dominion Chapter. Whereas, the Lynx Incorporated is an international non-for-profit organization established in 1946 by Margaret Rose Zell Hawkins and Sarah Strickland Scott in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, and exists in one of the nation's oldest and largest volunteer service organizations committed to enriching, sustaining, and ensuring the culture and the economic survival of the African American [00:49:55] and other people of African descent. And whereas among the core values of the links incorporated are friendship, integrity, honesty, service, and commitment, [00:50:10] As well as five facets, which include the arts, health and human services, international trends and services, national trends and services, and services to youth, which promotes educational, social, and civic enrichment opportunities, with the organization being the recipient of several prestigious awards for its premier programming related to those values and facets. [00:50:37] And whereas the Old Dominion chapter of the Lynx Incorporated was charted on September 18, 1993, as the 250th chapter of the organization, which their initial chapter organizers being Diane Horner Little and Willa Rawls-Duma. [00:50:58] And, whereas, the Old Dominion chapter of the Lynx Incorporated has evolved as an award-winning chapter with members of who are committed to exceptional philanthropic service to the Prince William County area, including the Food and Security Program, which has provided over 1,500 boxes of food to local elementary schools, the Backpack Program, which has provided over 425 backpacks to local youth, and their Saturday Academy programs in collaboration with the local elementary schools [00:51:38] with focus on science, technology, engineering, and math, commonly known as STEM. And whereas, the chapter also actively engages with the communities through initiatives like Night at the Arts, a showcase of the artistic talent of local high school students, collaborations with Colgate to have the Colgate van visit a local elementary school, AARP to provide programs to each of the senior centers in the county, and many other [00:52:11] partnerships with civic organizations to educate the local community. Now, therefore be it resolved that the Prince William Board of County Supervisors hereby commends, recognizes, and honors the Lynx Incorporated Old Dominion Chapter on the occasion of their 30th anniversary. Be it further resolved that the Prince William Board of County Supervisors hereby commends and honors the original organizers of the Old Dominion Chapter of the Lynx Incorporated and their current members of the chapter for their continued service and dedication to the Prince William County community. [00:52:51] Ladies, congratulations. So sealed by Ms. Ann Wheeler, Chair of the Board of County Supervisors. Good afternoon. [00:53:17] Thank you, Madam Chair, to the County Executive Officer and staff, to the County Attorney. My name is Anita Young, and I am Chapter President. On behalf of our active and alumna members of Old Dominion Virginia Chapter, the Lynx Incorporated, we thank you. [00:53:40] It is our privilege to accept this proclamation, and we are honored for this recognition by Prince William County Board of Supervisors. As stated, the Lynx Incorporated is an international not-for-profit organization that was established in 1946. [00:53:59] The membership currently consists of over 17,000 professional women with 299 chapters across 41 states, including the District of Columbia, the Commonwealth of the Bahamas, and the United Kingdom. [00:54:21] It is one of the nation's oldest and largest volunteer service organizations. More importantly, we are an organization that is grounded in friendship and service. As noted, Old Dominion is 30 years strong and striving in Prince William County. [00:54:42] Our chapter consists of not only just professional women, but women who give back to the community. And, of course, our dynamic individual member, the Honorable Andrea Bailey, is also a member of our chapter. [00:54:58] But we also stand on the shoulders of community leaders such as Fannie Fitzgerald, whose daughter, Benita Fitzgerald Mosley, serves within our chapter. As a chapter, not only are we bonded in friendship, but we are committed to continual service in Prince William County, Virginia. [00:55:21] Chapter members' presence may be observed, as we stated, distributing food to food insecurity in Title I schools, presenting monetary donations to organizations within the county, distributing coats, and presenting and volunteering in all K-12 schools. [00:55:41] As a chapter, we are steadfast in our civic engagement, addressing educational gaps, dismantling health care disparities, pursuing economic development, and social justice advocacy. [00:55:58] So again, we thank you for this recognition and the opportunity to continuously serve in Prince William County. Thank you. [00:56:10] now on to items 3c proclaiming november 18th adoption day i believe courtney tierney uh chair [00:56:55] of the dss board wilson ms wilson and other members of the human services team please join us at the front of the chambers you know national adoption day one of my favorite events november 18th 2023 whereas prince william county recognizes the importance of giving [00:57:33] children permanent, safe, and loving families through adoption. And whereas more than 117,000 children in the United States foster care system are waiting to be adopted, whereas more than 700 children in the Virginia care foster system are waiting to be adopted, whereas more than 20 children in Prince William County foster care system have or had the goal of adoption, and whereas to help these children find permanent nurturing families, the local courts of the 31st Judicial District will open their doors to celebrate National Adoption Day on Saturday, November 18, 2028, to finalize and recognize adoptions of local children and join [00:58:12] other organizations to commemorate all adoptions. And whereas the effort along with similar celebrations in all 50 states around the country will offer children the chance to live with stable and loving families and encourage other dedicated individuals to make a powerful difference in the lives of children through adoption. Now therefore be it resolved that the Prince William Board of County Supervisors hereby joins with the Department of Social Services in proclaiming November 18th, 2023 as National Adoption Day. Prince William County will celebrate on November 18th, 2023. The Prince William Board of County Supervisors urges all citizens to join in a national effort to raise [00:58:49] awareness about the importance of adoption. Thank you. Madam Chair, members of the Board, thank you so much for the recognition and proclamation. It aligns with National Adoption Day which is November 18th. We will be celebrating new adoptions at the courthouse that day and although the event is not open to the public you all are invited because of space and confidentiality but we hope everyone will take the opportunity to appreciate those in their families that are adopted and for those that are interested in adoption that they would [00:59:27] call us at 703-792-7500. I want to acknowledge our staff. We have DSS Deputy Director Phyllis Jennings Holt. We have DSS Assistant Director for Family Support Services, Bridget Alston, and we have Adoption Permanency Team Member Diane Gestrick. Now the three of them have 90 years of experience in the child welfare system in prince william county so we are very glad to have them [01:00:04] and all of the staff and thank you very much okay that moves us back to item number four the consent [01:01:00] agenda welcome supervisor franklin the consent agenda today consists of 20 items are there any items that any board member wishes to remove from the consent agenda items because they have specific questions or concerns that they haven't been able to have answered before today. [01:01:22] Supervisor Weir. Thank you, Madam Chair. 4A and 4E, please. E as in Edgar. Supervisor Vega. Okay. [01:01:42] Okay. With that, could I get a motion for 4B through 4S with the exception of 4O and 4E? So moved, Madam Chair. Second. Motion made by Supervisor Bailey, seconded by Vice Chair Bodie. [01:02:00] any discussion on those items anyone want to comment madam chair supervisor Vega thank you I just want to talk a little bit about 4n I see Seth in the back and Seth first off I want to thank you very very much for all of your hard work and helping me bring this forward and finally making it happen after many many years even before I got on the board um it's really exciting on this item has to do with friends of the horticultural therapy Inc and I'm really excited about this because this board has taken steps to address the mental health crises if you will that we're facing not just in this county but in our nation and what I really love about this program is this is a nonprofit [01:02:38] organization and they serve adults with mental illness and or intellectual disabilities by providing opportunities through therapeutic horticultural activities to improve the quality of their lives and increase their independence in the community. I am really excited about being able to bring this forward it's going to be in the Coles district but of course I've asked Seth to speak to supervisor Bailey and to my colleagues here to see how we can incorporate this and make it an arm if you will of the crisis receiving center so Seth thank you again for all of your help and I want to thank some other folks that have assisted in in kind contributions to ensure that this [01:03:18] comes to be and also to include of my staff for also alerting me to some of funds that we had available that we've put towards this program so really excited about it again thank you seth and thank you to the folks that represent uh this group really excited about this happening here in this county thank you madam chair thank you supervisor bailey thank you madam chair uh supervisor vega thank you so much for the uh open door to discuss this i think this is a great opportunity uh just like you had an opportunity to talk to this organization when i first was elected in the Potomac District and I think that the service that you have rendered has been more than outstanding and so we appreciate that and we look [01:03:57] forward to the opportunity and following through on that discussion as it relates to the crisis receiving center and how we can bond that together and so with that I fully support what we're about to do thank you madam chair supervisor I'm sorry I was not aware that these fine folks were here could you all please just stand I want everybody to know who's responsible for for making this actually happen. [01:04:20] So thank you all so much for being here and for reaching out to my office and for working with us. It's greatly appreciated. Thank you. Seeing no further discussion, please vote. [01:04:43] Thank you, and thank you for everything you do in Prince William County. Thank you. That brings us to the three pulled items. First is 4A, Supervisor Weird. Thank you, Madam Chair. [01:04:59] As a matter of order of operations, I think we should defer 4A until adoption of 6A because entering into an agreement before we've executed the lease or approved the sale is probably doing it backwards. [01:05:17] Ms. Robel, I'll sort of defer to you on that. He's probably right, and I'm looking at Christina Wynn, so I don't think there's any issue with waiting until. Okay. We'll defer for, without objection, we'll defer 4A to after we do item 6, whatever it was. [01:05:35] That's what I do. Okay, and then 4E. Madam Chair, do we have anybody from waste management there's solid waste here on this that could elaborate on something. Well, in that case, I'll just, looking at this item, and although there's no immediate cost, I've been apprised that the potential cost runs in the tens of millions, and I don't see that anywhere in the search, or in the staff report, and I'm not real comfortable with this item as it stands, given past history of how this contract has been handled. [01:06:16] Since there's nobody here to elaborate, I'll just be voting in opposition to it. Thank you. If I can get a motion for 4E, and then we can have discussion. Second. [01:06:31] Motion made by Supervisor Bailey, seconded by Vice Chair Bodie. I know that they actually just want to enter into negotiations, determine what that is. I don't believe it's tens of millions of dollars, but, of course, I could be wrong. And that's neither here nor there. It's really just to explore the cost of what that would—this has no commitment to. [01:06:49] It's just a letter of interest to enter into negotiations. It's the very first step of determining the cost of that facility. So I think we actually need to proceed. But that's just one. Anyone else? Okay. Seeing no further discussion, please vote. [01:07:13] And that brings us on to 4-0. Supervisor Bailey. Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to be consistent. In the past, I have been opposed to public money being used to favor one charity over another. So for those reasons, I will not be supporting this item. Motion to approve, Madam Chair. Second. [01:07:29] Motion made by Vice Chair Bodie, seconded by Supervisor Bailey. You signed up to speak? Okay. Yes. Thank you, Madam Chair. I have a few questions, and I do understand the process that we're going by to make sure that this continuously flows, but my question is, are these the traditional groups who receive these funding, and will there be an opportunity for there to be other groups to be a part of this? [01:08:02] And as you're coming, Seth, the reason why I'm asking is because I've had other arts groups that have expressed an interest and so i just just wanted to ask on their behalf yes ma'am madam chair members of the board seth hendler voss honored to serve as your director of parks recreation so we welcome and encourage all our organizations that qualify to apply for this funding we typically get applications from many of the same organizations year over year and that's why we're always eager to welcome new faces and consider new organizations so provide equal [01:08:41] opportunity to to all parties so so the so this is only for the existing organizations no ma'am this is open to every arts organization serving the greater Prince William area just so happens that a lot of the applicants are repeat applicants okay I got you but we welcome all new applicants we encourage new applicants okay and so I should just refer them to your office or yes ma'am okay okay just want to make sure and then and then I'm just to go back and we [01:09:12] may have said this before, but I missed it. I know that we had a new, we had a part-time arts council event planner. Have we replaced that person yet? We have a part-time arts council liaison. Okay. So we haven't replaced that position yet. He's still employed, ma'am. And he's a liaison. So actually one of the roles he has is to manage the art grant panel process as [01:09:43] well but the position is still occupied okay okay thank you supervisor lawson thank you madam chair i i'm actually not clear seth on what supervisor bailey was asking and correct me if i'm wrong supervisor bailey but i think she was asking the list of awardees is that the same as the list like from last year and are there new what because i'm curious as well are there new organizations on [01:10:20] this list that that did not receive it last year because it sounds like there's a lot of interest from other non-profits it sounds like they have an opportunity to apply as well but is this the same list every year year after year is that supervisor bailey's that help i appreciate the yes yeah because i i no offense but i i thought your answer was not clear seth so that's why i'm It was clear, but not clear. [01:10:52] There are many of the same organizations from last year and years past are on this list to receive funds this year. We often experience the same applicants applying each year. I can't say off the top of my head by looking at these names which of these organizations are first-time applicants. [01:11:09] I can get that information. What I can assure the board of is that this is open to all organizations every year. And, in fact, this year, I believe, we advertised the opportunity twice because we didn't have enough applicants at first time. We're not questioning that. We're not questioning if it's open to everybody. [01:11:26] What we're questioning is, is it the same recipients, though, year after year, and other nonprofits apply year after year and get rejected? And if that's the case, maybe we need to dig into why. I'm not sure that's accurate, that there are a lot of applicants getting rejected. [01:11:42] Usually it's the case that we're trying to bring in more applicants. Okay. but I can confirm that with you uh offline as we get a chance to look through more of the data together oh no I'm I'm trusting you to do it yeah I was just looking for clarity is all like Gainesville Community Choir appears to be new to me but I don't recall it in past years but I was just trying to help with clarity from an earlier question yes ma'am I'm happy to talk with my staff find out who on this list is the first time applicant and send it out to the board I think [01:12:18] that would be helpful supervisor Bailey yeah I don't that's what I mean by it was clear and was not clear I guess what I would like to entertain is there are I'm looking at a list of four organizations that have been interested in becoming a part of the arts council that were not a part of the arts council so I guess what I was looking for is for if you could just [01:12:46] Humor me and making sure that we either send the application process out again, make a focused effort to bring in other, because I know there are other arts, artistic organizations that serve the community that might want to be a part of this. [01:13:04] How do we go about making sure that that happens? Because the traditional partners will know how to do that. The nontraditional partners will not. So I hope that's more pointed to you in helping us partner together or the board to bring on other organizations that might want to be a part of the Arts Council. [01:13:26] Sure. Just a point of clarification, the Arts Council, the Arts Grant Panel Program, which is different from – Oh, the Arts Grant Panel. Okay, two different – What you're addressing here on the agenda today. They're interested, if I may please, they're interested in becoming a part of that so that they could, particularly coming out of COVID, they can make sure that their organizations are sustained as well and serving the community. [01:13:49] So I'm just opening it up so you can, in a brief moment, explain how that's done. Sure. And I can get back with you and let you know exactly how the opportunity is advertised. It's done through our Arts Council liaison. We also work through the Arts Council. [01:14:05] So word is getting out, but there's probably always opportunities to expand our strategy for getting the word out. We're happy to entertain any ideas that you have. But let me talk to my staff, and I can get back with you and let you know exactly how we do it now so I can hopefully ensure some level of confidence that we're going far and wide to make sure that we're widening the applicant pool and make folks aware of this opportunity. [01:14:27] Yeah, I would appreciate that. Thank you. And I'll end with it. It's not necessarily just only making them aware. it's making sure they know how to go through the process successfully and filling out the paperwork and the tax forms and everything else. We have a mandatory pre-application meeting. Yeah it's not not not easy so okay with that I will entertain a motion for oh okay please vote no she abstained [01:15:06] oh no she voted nay okay sorry well okay um and as I mentioned 4A as pointed out by supervisor where we will do probably after all three public hearings um under item number six. So that brings us to public comment time today today we have nine people in person who are signed up to speak each speaker will have three minutes to share your views and opinions regarding matters before the board we ask that all speakers state their name and magisterial district or generally where they reside at the beginning of their remarks and I will point out if you're here to comment on any of the public hearings do that during the public hearing time and not [01:15:46] during public comment time, and then we will close the in-person sign-up list after the first 15 minutes of in-person public comment. Our first five speakers are Martin Jeter, Warren Beaton, Joe Botte, Carl Greeton, and Rachel Ellis. You fooled me. You moved the mic a little bit. [01:16:11] Good evening, or good afternoon, rather, Chair Wheeler and members of the board. I'm Martin Jeter from the Occoquan District. I'm speaking to you today as the Coles representative of the County Sustainability Commission, and we have three or four other members of the commission speaking today. Warren Beaton and Joe Boutte are here in the room, and Tiziana Bottino will be zooming in from Italy a little later on. Chris Carroll may also speak remotely a little later. [01:16:39] Our topic is the Community Energy and Sustainability Master Plan and the two resolutions the commission sent to you for consideration. But first, I want to congratulate the board for adopting fairly aggressive greenhouse gas reduction goals for forming an office of sustainability and a sustainability commission. I think these are all very important for the future of the county. [01:16:59] The sustainability commission resolution included in your board packet outlines our recommendations which basically asks the board to prioritize the strategies that you have direct control over that are able to be quickly implemented and provide the most bang for the buck. The resolution sent previously from the sustainability commission deals with the commercial building energy usage and the importance of reliable information up front before you make decisions. [01:17:24] The CESMP has important carbon reduction strategies within it. One of these is protecting mature tree cover. This is obviously important for carbon sequestration, but also for wildlife protection, stream health, temperature reduction, mental and physical health, and more. The plan includes enhanced environmental reviews that will evaluate land use applications through the lens of sustainability. [01:17:46] And it promotes concentrating more intense development near high-capacity transit, which will reduce vehicle miles traveled. And these are just a few examples of what's in the plan. So we're also asking that you keep the Sustainability Commission in place after the end of the year. [01:18:01] We need to continue to have an independent citizen-driven group that advises the board on changes and updates to the plan as new information and data comes in. The CESMP is a starting point. But we also need to look at all the facets of sustainability, including groundwater reserves, impacts of county land use policies, sprawl and the result in road congestion, stream and general environmental degradation, etc. [01:18:24] So I know that there are concerns about the cost to the taxpayers of this plan, and we share those concerns. Please keep in mind that approving the CESMP and the Sustainability Commission resolutions won't obligate $1 of the taxpayers' money. Spending is all in your control. [01:18:41] We recommend you take an a la carte approach and pick certain low-cost, high-benefit strategies to start with. Once a plan is implemented, there will be funding for more analysis along with better cost estimates before initiating any actions. It's all up to you to decide what strategies to prioritize and to pursue. [01:18:58] We realize a CESMP isn't perfect, but it is needed to provide the framework to implement important actions and strategies as outlined in the SC resolution. It will allow us to get started with the hard work of creating a more sustainable future for all of our residents. Thank you, and now I'll turn it over to Warren Beaton. [01:19:16] Thank you. Next speaker, please. Good afternoon, Chair Wheeler and members of the board. My name is Warren Beaton. I'm a resident of Haymarket, and I'm the at-large representative on the Sustainability Commission for the county. I will be speaking to the specific greenhouse gas emission reduction measures endorsed by the commission. [01:19:37] The commission has endorsed five actions that the CESMP designate as having high potential for reducing greenhouse gas emissions in the energy and transportation sectors, and I'll go through those five. The first is number E4 in the CESMP, promote programs within the community that allow customers to purchase clean electricity through an added fee on their utility bills. [01:20:00] Both Dominion and Novec offer 100% renewable electricity options. The second one is T1 in the CESMP, improved pedestrian and bicycle infrastructure, sidewalk and trail connectivity, and overall safety to support walking, biking, and rolling. [01:20:18] Improvements could include bike lockers, curb ramps, crosswalks, and speed bumps. This action would involve developing a strategic active transportation plan that prioritizes improved and new infrastructure. Three is number T2, incentivize transit-oriented development within a half mile of high-capacity regional transit stations through developer incentives, such as streamlined permitting or zoning amendments. [01:20:43] The county could also require bicycle parking minimums in transit-oriented development areas. Number four is T.5, incentivize zero-emission vehicles and charging for residents and businesses to purchase zero-emission vehicles and install charging equipment. [01:21:00] Such programs could include streamlined permitting and group buy programs for chargers as well as EV purchasing co-ops. P6 is the fifth one, expand public EV charging infrastructure, especially along main routes and in popular destinations. [01:21:17] This would require developing an EV infrastructure plan to guide community deployment and electric bike charging. I'd also like to highlight that the Sustainability Commission also recommends exploring the possibility of requiring clean energy for energy-intensive commercial buildings, such as data centers. [01:21:39] CESMP does call for incentivizing, but the commission recommends considering to evaluate strengthening this to a requirement which may require legislation. And finally, adopt natural open space requirements to establish guidelines incurring preservation of natural open spaces in new and existing developments. [01:22:03] Finally, in full disclosure, I'm also chapter lead for the Prince William County Citizens Climate Lobby chapter, a national organization with over 200,000 members. We have 263 registered volunteer supporters in the county, and we unanimously have endorsed the Sustainability Commission's recommendations. [01:22:28] Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. Good afternoon, supervisors and fellow citizens. I'm Joe Butte, a resident of the Potomac District and a member of the Sustainability Commission. [01:22:44] We recommended several program-wide measures to assure that the CESMP is well-managed and cost-effective while reducing uncertainty over time. Three of those measures included adoptive management, capacity building in the Sustainability Office, and fully integrating CESMP into county planning and decision-making activities. [01:23:07] I'll focus my comments on adoptive management and capacity building in the sustainability office. First of all, adoptive management is an active approach consisting of four actions, plan, do, measure, adjust. [01:23:25] The action-oriented approach assures cost-effectiveness for taxpayers and drives continuous improvement. It is also a dynamic and iterative approach to decision-making that is particularly valuable in the context of sustainability. [01:23:42] Here's why it assures cost-effectiveness and drives continuous improvement for taxpayers. One, it minimizes risk. Two, resource optimization. Three, enhanced decision-making. Four, flexibility and adaptability. [01:24:00] And five, public support. And just a little bit more on public support, it involves stakeholders in the adoptive management process. It fosters transparency and community engagement. When the public understands that adjustments are made based on measured outcomes, it can enhance trust and support for the CESMP. [01:24:23] The second area I want to address is capacity building for the sustainability office. Building the capacity of the Sustainability Office is vital for the successful implementation of the CESMP. We recommend adding grant writers to obtain federal funding and building a robust communications and outreach program. [01:24:48] Why? Grant writers for federal funding can provide substantial financial support for sustainability initiatives. Having dedicated grant writers within the Sustainability Office increases the likelihood of securing these funds. [01:25:06] This, in turn, reduces the burden on taxpayers as it leverages external resources to support sustainability projects. Secondly, effective communications and outreach. To effectively engage with citizens and the business community, the Sustainability Office needs a robust communications and outreach program. [01:25:28] This program can inform stakeholders, foster transparency, encourage businesses to participate, share their expertise, and invest in sustainability efforts. Thank you for your time. Thank you. Next speaker, please. [01:25:44] Good afternoon. I'm Carl Gretton of the Gainesville District, and we are against the Democrats' version of the Digital Gateway Bankruptcy Plan. The reason for this synopsis is due to the $400 million income over 20 years and the $16.7 billion expense for Dominion Power Towers. [01:26:06] During the 17 October 23 board work session, Chair Wheeler proposed looking into another tax increase to residential tax bills. This time to pay for government subsidized housing throughout Prince William County. We do not need this because Pageland Lane landowners have said there are huge amounts of money coming into the county from data center revenue. [01:26:27] From the Page on Lane website, they said they were going to donate $30 million to the Prince William County General Fund. They have lied, and they have removed this from their website. This is why Democrats need to be voted out. Democrats do not have the interest of Prince William County citizens in their heart. [01:26:42] Why would you tax residents, increase the Bidenomics interest rate, and then let residents with lower income be allowed to purchase their living quarters? Reduce taxes, reduce interest rates, and then Prince William County residents can buy. Chair Wheeler and Democrat Majority have already increased the average residential tax burden by nearly $2,200 in just four years. On top of this, the five Democrats have increased the property and vehicle tax you were just blindsided by. The creation of the meals tax at restaurants and on all prepared food is the brainchild of the Democrat Majority. Many of you will see your [01:27:18] trash bill increase because of the increased tipping fees at the landfill that was passed by the Democrat Majority earlier this year. We believe we need to lower the cost of living burden on our residents so that they can better afford things like their mortgage, rent, vehicles, and food. Increasing taxes yet again does not help in achieving that goal. In fact, it hurts. What do you think? Should we increase these taxes yet again to pay for taxpayer subsidized housing throughout the county? The answer is to vote out the Democrats on the Board of Supervisors, School Board, Attorney General, Virginia Senate, and Virginia House. Thank you Supervisor Vega for your input. Chair Wheeler, you have received donation for re-election, and Supervisor Angry, [01:27:59] you do not have an opponent. Please donate this money to the Affordable Housing Fund. Voters, please write in Bud Light as a Neabsco District opponent, and let's see who wins. Early voting has started. As a goal, let's see how many lame ducks we can get out of this group. [01:28:15] Go to elections.virginia.gov. Thank you. Next speaker, please. And after that, I'm going to call up the next four, Dave Seary, John Bloxton, Kevin Parker, and Teresa Menz. Please proceed. [01:28:31] Can I get the overhead? Is that possible? Maybe you can give your remarks and we can make copies [01:30:48] and distribute them to the board. Yeah, we can do that. Thank you. My name is Rachel Ellis and I live in the Gainesville District. Bullying is an ongoing and deliberate misuse of power in relationships through repeated social behavior that intends to cause physical, social, and or psychological harm. It can involve an individual or a group misusing their power or perceived power over one or more persons who feel unable to stop it from happening. Democrats equal bully. Residents stand before you with shaking voices only to feel powerless as the five Democrats disregard their [01:31:25] voice. There is no discussion from the Democrats after comment time. There is an automatic motion to hold a vote. The decision by Chair Wheeler has been made and the four of you vote accordingly. It is demoralizing to know that a decision has already been made without any consideration from public input. [01:31:43] While you may not see this behavior as bullying, it is exactly that. There is an imbalance of power. No matter how many citizens show up to speak or email, you have been unduly influenced by the money flowing from data centers. The voice of the citizens that these projects will directly impact do not bear any weight compared to those looking to profit off of these decisions. [01:32:03] Look at the monstrosity of Village Place. As a voting unit of one, all five Democrats voted for this. Since it's construction, the board has seen the so-called promises of data centers versus the reality. Supervisor Franklin, I ask you, do the buffer screening, the buildings from view, still look like, and I quote, one of the best I've seen? [01:32:23] One Village Place resident is quoted saying, I realized partway through that nothing's going to change. There is nothing we could do to change things. That is how all residents feel when they stand before this board. The Democrats continue to attack middle-class neighborhoods with data centers. The biggest investment a family makes is in their home. [01:32:40] People work 40 to 60 hours a week to be able to come home. Economic development should not trump quality of life when it comes to people in their homes. Democrats push a NIMBY narrative around the rejection of data centers. You dismiss real environmental concerns, yet you push a sustainability agenda at the cost of taxpayers. [01:32:57] The best way to address sustainability is with conservation and smart land use votes. You disregard any objections raised regarding neighborhood, noise, historical resources, and power. This is not a NIMBY issue. There is not enough power to support these projects. The cost of bringing in the power will be on the backs of every Virginia resident, including those living in the eastern part of the county. [01:33:20] Why is a billion-dollar industry forcing residents to pay for the necessary power infrastructure that only it needs? How many neighborhoods will need to have additional or new transmission lines brought in to power them? Democrats equal bully. As a supervisor, ask yourself, if you really consider the voice of those who have no power in your votes, are you actually free to vote the way you want to vote? [01:33:42] Do those working in the planning office have the freedom to analyze these projects without a predetermined end goal? Is the planning commission free to vote the way they see fit without your interference? Democrats equal bully, but we will continue to speak up for those with no power. Thank you. Next speaker, please. [01:34:04] Good afternoon. My name is Dave Sari. I've been a president of Gainesville for 24 years, and I support the Digital Gateway. There's so many projects and services the county would like to provide for all of the citizens of the county, and the Gateway will provide that funding. I urge all of you to vote in favor of it, and then I'm sure you all would have a lot of fun arguing among yourselves trying to figure out how best to spend it. Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. [01:34:39] Yes, good afternoon. My name is John Bloxton. I've been a resident in the Prince William County area since May of 1980. I've lived in Cat Harpen since fall of 1982. Four generations on our farm and we've lived it here. [01:34:59] Cat Harpen was always meant to be the farming community, rural and pristine, gas and grocery at Alvey's, plus the post office was all we ever wanted. Everyone in Prince William County is going to benefit from the budget increases that Prince William County will receive from this upgraded deal. [01:35:16] Let's get this upgrade deal done so we can move on to the next task because there's a lot more going on in Prince William County than rehashing decisions that have already been made. Not a question of building thousands of homes that will further increase our traffic problems. [01:35:33] Not a situation where an outside entity is trying to exploit the residents of Pageland. This is an initiative started by us. We've lived here for 30, 40, 50 years to leave this area, which has grown up around us over time. Benefits of job creations, tax revenues, landowner support makes this an easy win for everyone. [01:35:55] In closing, I want to make it clear that my family and friends who are residents along Pageland support the proposed data center for the comprehensive plan for Prince William County. Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. Kevin Parker, Neabsco District, speaking on behalf of the Prince William Conservation Alliance. [01:36:18] PWTA is a grassroots environmental nonprofit working in the county for 21 years. We aim to create sustainable, equitable communities throughout Prince William. Establishment of the Sustainability Office and Commission is a significant step in recognizing environmental challenges we face, and both are important to retain. [01:36:38] While adopting the Energy and Sustainability Plan could contribute to addressing challenges, we're concerned, in its current form, the plan appears prohibitively costly and falls short of adequately addressing climate change given the lack of studies surrounding the sharp increase of data center development. [01:36:58] To achieve sustainability, conservation and smart growth must be central tools. Reforestation, stormwater upgrades, stream restorations, and the installation of charging stations are important, but they alone may prove insufficient. Protecting open spaces and natural areas and countering sprawling development through thoughtful land use planning is essential. [01:37:22] Conservation and smart planning are not only cost-effective methods for achieving climate mitigation goals, they also protect what makes Prince William unique. We could pave over the entire county with solar panels, which would help with emissions, but do nothing to support the quality of life for county residents or protect the biodiversity of plants and animals that rely on the quality habitat we have. We endorsed the two resolutions passed unanimously by the Sustainability Commission. The first, urging the planning staff and commission to study the impact of the rapid increase in data centers on greenhouse emissions. The second, identify [01:38:00] several aspects in the plan to be incorporated into the comprehensive plan rather than adopting it in its entirety. Ultimately, a comprehensive sustainability plan must recognize the interrelated nature of environmental issues. It's not solely about mitigating climate change. It's also about protecting biodiversity, preserving air and water quality, and maintaining the beauty of our natural and rural areas in essence it's about the well-being of our community ensuring this county [01:38:37] remains a place where its residents can thrive and the ecosystem can flourish thank you thank you and before our next speaker we have two last speakers alicia gloss and alan gloss please proceed threesome ends the potomac district i want to thank law enforcement and first responders for all they do. And I've got some sad news over in Montgomery County, which is predominantly Democrat. You can see where my loyalty is. There was a law enforcement gentleman that was [01:39:16] deliberately hit by a 19-year-old. That law enforcement gentleman has lost the use of his legs. They are being amputated. So I congratulate the Democrat voters and the Democrat politicians for this then for our open borders our government is the middleman for the cartels sex trafficking pedophilia and all that is evil yes our government is the middleman look in the mirror look at [01:39:51] yourselves okay you had a workshop in one of the buildings you didn't have it here where there's plenty of places to sit where we have the microphone for citizens time. You made sure we were not represented. These citizens need to know what is being built here in Prince William County. You threw that away from them. You are, like that woman said, the one with the light hair. [01:40:25] You Democrats, you are bullies. You've got the gang of five. And that 28 bypass, those people that live in those places. They came here. They were absolutely respectful, fluent. They were wonderful. And you five Democrats disrespected their rights. And you bring in your pet projects. [01:40:53] I belong to this group. I belong to that group. Why you shaft these people. You didn't give a two hoots about those, the Latin community or whoever they happen to be, the low income. You did not care, Bailey. You did not care. But you sashay up here, wanting us to donate our tax dollars. Those people have a right. This bypass is no good. It has been ignored for a long time. [01:41:22] And this is another thing. Abortions are not health care. They are not health care. Okay? Get that through your head. They are not health care. And our tax dollars shouldn't be supporting and you have no morality, if you can continue to have abortion after abortion after abortion, you know what? I'm not cutting you down if you've had one. But when you've had many, and then how a Democrat minister can be a Democrat and support all the evil that's going on is beyond me. So [01:42:02] God help us. Next speaker, please. Good afternoon. Alicia Gloss-Kohls. As we all know from our cell phone batteries. Battery cells lose the ability to hold a charge as they get older. Electrical vehicle batteries in moderate climates may have or may last 12 to 15 years, but in extreme climates maybe 8 to 12. How much does an EV replacement battery cost? The average range is $4,000 to [01:42:42] $18,000. And let's talk about the lack of the traveling range issues with EVs or the lack of infrastructure and charging stations available. What about the disgusting, inhumane mining practices done to mine for the rare earth materials needed for these batteries? We don't want to talk about that, do we? Or how we recycle or dispose of them since the actual process is very complex. [01:43:12] That is why there are few companies in the world that can even do that. Or how the batteries frequently catch fire and fire departments are having to use 24 gallons of water to put out EV fires. Did you know that it takes 40 times more water to put out a fire in an EV compared to a standard gasoline vehicle? The average citizen can't even afford an EV. And who are we subsidizing with these free EV chargers? At the expense of the taxpayers always. The cost of an EV and the [01:43:52] battery issues are just a small fraction of the problems and concerns with this energy and sustainability plan. We as taxpayers deserve the answers and there are so many questions regarding this plan and how will it impact citizens of Prince William County. I know in the plan it states these are goals but we all know you will force implement a policy with technologies that aren't fully developed, and that will cost the taxpayers millions. And data centers are included in that technology too. You guys have ran through so many data centers, so many that the public doesn't even [01:44:29] know because they're still being built, and many more lined up to approve. But you don't care how they affect our environment when it comes to them, do you? So we all know what that makes you, right? Hypocrites. I will ask you to vote no on this plan, but we all know you love spending our tax dollars. And voting on things without having all of the information needed are hiding it from us and without weighing the cost to the taxpayers. We're still waiting on the data center studies [01:45:03] that you all voted to get the information and you're not giving it to the public. Where is that data? Where is that information? We want it. Thank you. Next speaker, please. Ellen Gloss-Coles. To answer her question, who are we subsidizing with this? [01:45:26] We're subsidizing people, rich people like Ann Wheeler, who charges her EV on the taxpayer dime right out here out front. That's who we're subsidizing. Today, the board is discussing this economic and sustainability plan. The goals that I read through are very lofty, and they put us on the right path to leaving no trace after we leave. [01:45:45] That is the end of the good this does. I have three questions. Why now, how much, and with what? Why now when even the feds of the state don't have achievable plans? How much is it going to cost the county and how much is it going to cost every single one of us taxpayers? Now I've seen estimates up to $400 million to achieve these goals. Even if you don't agree with that number, certainly you can't be that obtuse to think that we all aren't going to pay something. We all will pay for this. And with what? What technology do we have that will allow [01:46:20] for even the closest goals to be achieved? We don't. And the tech we do have has simply atrocious pollution, humanitarian, and child labor issues attached to all of it. So why is this board running headlong into creating such a policy? Is it just to tell the special interests they are funding you, that you are doing something for them? Are you scared that the majority of you have a good chance of being tossed out on your butt like we did to Ann Wheeler in the primaries? Why now? I suspect it's the money, but I'm sure it's a combination of both. Look folks, we got 14 days to make sure [01:46:57] the majority of this board gets tossed. All these lofty but costly goals need to be vetted by others before it gets put on our shoulders and paid for with our wallets. Surely this board has better things to be doing with our money than funding these pipe dream goals. We've already seen Ann Wheeler's five million dollar self stealing electricity from taxpayers. Don't make this policy. Thank you. That concludes our in-person public comment time today. That will move us on to our remote public comment time. Ms. Van, do we have anyone online? Okay, then I'll turn it over [01:47:34] to Vice Chair Bodie and I'll let him go. Sure. Thank you, Madam Chair. As with in-person public comment time, folks have three minutes to speak. Please identify where you are and who you are in the county. And Ms. Van, that's how we begin. We have four speakers. Your first speaker is Tiziana Botina. Good afternoon. My name is Tiziana Botina. I'm a resident of the Occoquan District, and I'm the NEAPS co-representative for the Sustainability Commission. My earlier [01:48:08] fellow commissioners already focused on important points regarding the CS&P. Today, I'd like to specifically bring to your attention to the fastest growing greenhouse gas emission source in the county, which is energy used by commercial buildings. If we're going to meet our greenhouse gas goals of reducing emissions by 50% by 2030, we need to be very thoughtful about emissions coming from this sector and bend the emission curve down rather than letting it continue to go up. Using the MWCOG's greenhouse gas inventory that the county is relying on as the basis of [01:48:44] the CSMP, 2005 emissions from electricity use in commercial buildings were about 640,000 metric tons of carbon dioxide equivalent. By 2020, they already had grown to 1,480,000 metric tons of CO2 equivalent, an increase of 84,000 tons. This increase by 2020 has been happening while the county is trying to reduce the emissions by 2030 by 2.4 millimetric tons of CO2 equivalent. And if the board is really serious about stated climate goals [01:49:20] and greenhouse gas reduction goals, we need to limit the number of planned energy intensive commercial buildings. It will be essentially impossible to hit our greenhouse gas goals unless the new data centers are supplied by 100% clean, zero-carbon electricity. Fortunately, most of the large data center companies already have carbon neutrality commitments. If the county can secure meaningful guarantees that these commitments will be met in all facilities in Prince William County, data centers and climate mitigation goals could coexist. But at this point, the county hasn't developed good estimates of the greenhouse gas implications, and there is no [01:49:59] binding requirement by the county for, as far as we know, commitment from the applicants to use clean energy. The recommendation in our resolution to evaluate the greenhouse gas, energy, and climate resilience implication of major commercial building projects is mirrored in our broader recommendations on the CSMP, where the sustainability commission recommended collection of similar information for all CPAs, rezoning, and CIP projects. But for now, there is a time-sensitive need to address critical information requirements for the Prince William Digital Gateway rezoning application and similar decisions. The Sustainability Commission is asking the board to approve the [01:50:37] CSMP, as well as acting on our energy-intensive commercial building resolution. Last July, we have seen the hottest month ever recorded, and we are seeing record wildfire and floods of worsening up air quality, the effects of climate crisis are right in front of us right now. [01:50:53] So we ask you to act swiftly and to produce the S&P. Thank you for your time. Thank you, Ms. Botaino. Next speaker, please. Your next speaker is Mike Ketchmerick. Mike Ketchmerick, Heritage Hunt, Gainesville. I oppose your plan to vote on the Prince William Digital Gateway during the lame duck period. I think you should defer to the will of the voters and allow the new board to address this issue. The voter's voice needs to be heard and respected on this issue. The chair in the primary was defeated on this issue, and it should not be up to the current board to push this [01:51:32] plan despite what the voters want. Let the new board decide this critical issue and not impose your defeated agenda on the county. You should not give away all future county authorities to regulate data centers. Past Republicans boards did this, but this Democratic board needs to take the responsible course and preserve the future county options. You still have plenty of hard work to do before you should even consider the Pageland Industrial Park and other data center projects. You should first approve a modern-day industrial noise or regulations before any [01:52:06] approval. Approving new projects is the easy part. The hard part is developing the regulations and establishing the monitoring oversight and enforcement provisions. Prince William County needs to start doing the hard work now. This has to be done before, not after approval. You need to set the regulations while you still have the leverage to do so. You should not surrender all future county authority to the data center industry by improving projects before regulations and enforcement procedures are established. Supervisor Bodie, when you win re-election, you will have four years to do the process right. The county has to first establish who will be [01:52:45] responsible for noise monitoring, and how will this be conducted? Then, what enforcement procedures do you have, if any? How will you ensure that developers and data centers will be held to whatever standard is established? Saying the noise level can be the last step in this process. It should not take three years to establish as it is now planned. Such a delay will only hand all power to the data center industries. Delays will cause regulations to be non-applicable for PageLine and other projects. Only DeShondra Jefferson can take on this effort because she will attack the problem with new perspectives. She will not follow bad practices of previous [01:53:21] Republican-led boards. Supervisor Lawson previously was the leading data center supporter. She fought for low tax rates for data centers and their approval anytime, anyplace. Only in the last two years has she changed her position. And if she wins, she will go back to her pro data center position because that's what Governor Youngkin wants. Set up controls before any new approvals. [01:53:43] Take on the difficult effort first before considering new approvals. Do not cave in to the trillion-dollar data center industry and large landowners who are only interested in cashing in on their half-million-to-a-million-dollar-per-acre windfall. [01:54:02] Five to ten million or much more, depending on how many acres they will be selling. Look out for the interests of all county residents first and foremost. Thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. Kashmirik. Next speaker, please. The next speaker is Ken Nahr. [01:54:21] Good afternoon, Ken Nahr, Gainesville District. A quick recollection. 18 months or so ago, I stated at a school board meeting and a board of county supervisors meeting that the Prince William County School budget was $1 billion short per year. [01:54:37] A gasp of disbelief and a slight look of contempt was thrown my way. Well, here's the math. Prince William County schools invest roughly $8,000 less, only 50% or 60% of what our neighboring Nova counties invest per student. [01:54:54] Prince William County has roughly 91,000 students. Therefore, this calculation alone suggests Prince William County schools should be spending roughly $725 million more per year. Prince William County schools annual budget is more than $1 billion less than Fairfax. [01:55:12] Granted, Fairfax has roughly 115,000 total students, however, they also invest roughly 8,000 more per student than we do. Prince William County Schools is at least five schools short and has a 10-year laundry list of backlogged capital improvement projects. [01:55:31] This doesn't account for the projects associated to the 18% growth of student population over the next 16 years. This board is responsible for providing the school district with adequate resources to compete locally, regionally, and globally. [01:55:48] I respectfully request you support the Princewood General Gateway in the coming months to increase our commercial tax base so our schools can be competitively and adequately resourced. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Nahr. Next speaker, please. Your next speaker is Mally White. [01:56:13] Hello, this is Mally White. I'm a resident in the Gainesville District, and I want to confirm that you can hear me. We can indeed, Ms. White. Please proceed. [01:56:30] Thank you. The PwC Board of Counter Supervisors are professional. They are respectful, and they are open to consider public comments. I'm a resident here in Gainesville who is grateful for public comment times for many, many years. [01:56:48] It's been a pleasure to have this opportunity to speak what I believe, just as everyone else is allowed to do so. I thank God for our constitutional republic. I thank you that this is a two-way discussion, because for years, as I've made comments, you have considered them. [01:57:08] You've not held it against me as to whether you agreed or not. You considered my comment, and I believe you're doing that of all people who are speaking today and in the weeks and years, past and future. So the will of this voter and the majority of faithful voters is to continue all standard governance procedures and finish the next standard milestone of the vote that is due in November 2023. [01:57:37] All participants want you to function with standard governance legal procedures, and I thank you that that's what your plan is, and it's a wise plan. You have done extremely well in researching and considering all the aspects for a long, long time. [01:57:55] I do think that there are a few people that have recently begun to give comments, and they're feeling a little bit hurt because their comments may not be in agreement with what your long-term research has provided for decision-making. [01:58:11] But it's because they didn't get in at the beginning and make their comments. But you took all of our comments for those who did choose to participate, and I thank you for that. So I want you to know that I fully support the Prince William Digital Gateway Plan, getting it voted upon here in just a few weeks by the Planning Commission because you've done your research. [01:58:33] It's an excellent decision for Prince William residents, and I, for one, can confirm that. I lived in Heritage Hunt for quite a while. Then I sold from there because I wasn't pleased with that situation. But I have moved and stayed here in the Gainesville area, and I love Prince William County, and I think you're making the right decision for all people concerned. [01:58:57] It's just my preference is to live in more of a rural environment than every, you know, half acre have a house next to me. So I thank you for your consideration about the will of the voters and the majority, again, of faithful voters that you are going to keep to the standard governance procedures and not change that. [01:59:20] You'll finish the next standard milestone and vote in November 2023. I just want to attest that as a project manager, you can't change things at the last minute just because people didn't come in at the beginning and give their input. [01:59:35] So thank you for listening, and God bless you all. Thank you, Ms. White. Do we have anyone else signed up for this afternoon's public comment time? There are no more speakers for public comment time. Thank you, Ms. Mann. Thank you to all that spoke. Back to you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Vice Chair Bodie. Thank you, Ms. Mann. [01:59:51] As always, that moves us on to our public hearings for this afternoon. We have three public hearings. There are no presentations associated with these items that I'm aware of, so I will now open the public hearings on items 6A through 6C. [02:00:10] Ms. Madden, do we have anyone signed up for public hearings 6A through 6C? No. Okay. If there is anyone in chambers or in the atrium who wishes to speak on 6A, public hearing 6A through 6C, now is the time to approach the microphone. [02:00:32] Seeing no one approach the microphone in the back of the room, this will officially close the public hearings for 6A through 6C. I believe we can take these all together as a vote. Is that correct, Ms. Madden? If I could get a motion on 6A. Second. [02:00:48] Motion made by Supervisor Lawson, seconded by Vice Chair Bodie. Is there any discussion? Madam Chair. Supervisor Bodie. Thank you, Madam Chair. Just very quickly, 6B for folks who are watching or may not know what's going on because of how quickly we're going through these consolidated items, is the next step in the Occoquan Road and Old Bridge Road improvement project. [02:01:11] As always, I'd like to thank Rick Canizales and his team for moving through that process. That's going to be a really great improvement to the Old Bridge Road corridor that we've been working on for the past few years now. It's a bumps here and there, but it's moving along will really help traffic flow, safety, pedestrian safety. [02:01:29] A whole lot of good will come out of that. I'm sure the town of Occoquan will appreciate it as well because it won't get people locked up hitting southbound on Occoquan Road onto Old Bridge. So, again, just want to make sure everyone knows that we're doing moving ahead, full seam ahead. And, again, thank you so much, Madam Chair. Thank you. Supervisor Bailey. [02:01:45] Thank you, Madam Chair. rick i just have a quick question for you please and not trying to confuse anything but just for clarity um on um i'm looking at there's a in terms of the the piece in the brentsville area and the the truck traffic there okay and this i'm just asking you know i'm not a transportation [02:02:19] person but uh will this interfere with the truck lanes on 234 at all going east Madam Chair, members of the board, Rick Canizales here, Director of Transportation. Thank you for the question, Supervisor Bailey. [02:02:35] I don't think this interrups it. Again, it is a no-through truck restrictions, and as you see in the maps, we do identify detours that they can take to make sure they can get back to where they need to go to to get through those truck areas. But the no-through truck restrictions just serve so we don't have trucks going through those two streets. [02:02:55] I believe it's Bethlehem and Coverstone here. Okay, it's just on that. Just on those two roads only. Okay. Not what we've talked about before, down? Down below, no, ma'am. Okay, I'm good. Thank you. All right, thank you. Thank you. [02:03:12] And I will just add about 6C that I know it's pretty exciting because, you know, I don't know how many years ago we ended up putting housing right next to industrial, and so the people of Coverstone have sort of suffered for that. I know it's not a – no, we didn't do that. [02:03:29] It was done many years ago about – I don't know. Janine, do you remember when that was done? It was, I believe, in 2015, and it was a 7-1 vote, and I voted against it. So you're exactly right. None of us up here did it. Good memory. No, touche. No, just to be clear. [02:03:45] And so I know that the people in the Coverstone area have really suffered because of that. And I don't know if it's a done deal. I know we're going to request it. We can't do it without the Commonwealth, the CTB board, but we will try. So I get a bunch of stuff in my office about this. [02:04:02] So with that, I believe we have a motion already. Seeing no further discussion, please vote. Okay, awesome. Which brings us back to item 4A. Supervisor Weird, do you want to move item 4A? [02:04:18] Second. Motion made by Supervisor Weird. Second by Vice Chair Bodie. Any discussion? Madam Chair. Supervisor Bodie. Yes, very quickly. Really appreciate the work that's being done on this. I know Christina Wynn and other folks have been working on this for a little while. I say this all the time that, you know, although this is in the Brentsville District, we all sort of share as a board that area of the county. [02:04:41] So innovation, Farm Brew Live, Two Silos, all these sort of jewels around the county, especially in that area. And this idea and process of having a boutique hotel there really will be a game changer for this area and really help put it up to that next level. So I wanted to again say thank you to Christina Wynn for all her work on this and her team. [02:04:59] And also, I'm really looking forward to moving this forward. Are you pointing to Mr. Austin? Thank you. Yes, Mr. Austin, good to see you again. Okay, with that, we have 4A on the floor. [02:05:18] Please vote. [02:05:27] Okay, thank you. Thank you very much. Moving on to item number seven, county executive time. Mr. Shorter, the floor is yours. All right, good afternoon. Thank you, Madam Chair. Board members, just a few quick updates just to bring to your attention. [02:05:44] And just as a reminder, I sent out a few memos responsive to last week's discussion at the work session. One regarding affordable housing, really just to answer questions that the board collectively put forward to us, wanted to be responsive there. Also highlighted in that memo some projects that were affordable housing related that have since been either put in the pipeline or approved since the comprehensive plan update. [02:06:14] Also sent a residential solar program update. As a reminder, a few of you asked questions about the complete plan review and just wanted to make sure that that memo covered those questions and am happy to respond to any questions that you might have as follow-up. [02:06:37] Also sent a memo related to the FY23 fourth quarter revenue and expenditure report preliminary and unaudited. As usual, we will come back in December with audited versions of that report and be available to answer questions, present the fund balance, and reserve requirements, along with our recommendations for any surplus. Also, as a reminder, and I said this during our work session last week, the Office of Management and Budget will be holding a virtual session on the 26th, that's at 7 p.m., related to the Community Partners Program. And so for those [02:07:17] who are in as part of the Community Partners Program or who are partners interested in serving, that work session really is for you, virtual, to ask any questions about the changes in the program. And certainly, last but not least, and finally, I want to recognize Michelle She just graduated from the Virginia Women's Municipal Leadership Institute, an institute that really recognizes and works to make sure that they amplify all of the great work women leaders in government in the Commonwealth do. [02:07:52] And I just wanted to make sure that I acknowledge Michelle for her great leadership and congratulated her on the graduation. That is all for me, Madam Chair. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Shorter. We are now on to the county attorney's time. [02:08:10] Ms. Robel, the floor is yours. Thank you, Madam Chair, members of the board. This afternoon in closed session, we will have consultation with legal counsel and briefings by staff members regarding plans to protect the public safety as it relates to cybersecurity threats and vulnerabilities with briefing by staff members and legal counsel concerning actions to respond to such matters. [02:08:29] Discussion of the information subject to the exclusion in subdivision 2 of section 2.2-3705.2, Virginia Code annotated, where discussion in an open meeting would jeopardize the security of the county's information technology system and software programs, the discussion of reports and plans related to the security of county governmental facilities, buildings, and structures, and the safety of persons using such facilities, buildings, and structures, along with the legal advice and personnel discussion regarding the following pending internal audits on procurement and physical security assessment, all where discussion in an open meeting would adversely affect the litigating posture, bargaining position, or negotiating strategy of the public [02:09:08] body. And then we will have personnel discussions and considerations relating to the hiring of a new Department of Developmental Services director, where consultation, briefing, or discussion in an open meeting would adversely affect the bargaining position, litigating posture, or negotiating strategy of the public body. These items are appropriate for closed session pursuant to 2.2-3711A1, 8, and 19 of the Virginia Code. [02:09:33] Move to authorize, Madam Chair. Second. Motion made by Vice Chair Bodie, seconded by Supervisor Bailey. Any discussion? Seeing none, please vote. Okay, thank you. [02:09:51] That moves us on to the agency section of our agenda. We have one presentation regarding the CESMP. I just want to emphasize before Ms. Mano starts, we regularly approve plans and strategic documents, And that is separate from investing in everything that's listed in those documents. [02:10:16] You know, investment decisions regarding future investments are handled separately through the budget process. You know, and I anticipate the county will present items that are related to the recommendations in the proposed FY25 budget, which is sort of covered in this document. [02:10:32] but just because we approve this document does not mean that we approve the budget expenditures even suggested in this document. I just want to make everybody clear on that so sometimes there's some confusion. So Ms. Mano welcome. Thank you. And if we could all give Ms. Mano our undivided attention. Thank you. Good afternoon Chair Wheeler, members of the board, Julia Mano, Director of the Office of Sustainability. Today I'm excited to bring to the board a presentation of the Community Energy and Sustainability Master Plan for consideration for adoption. [02:11:07] As you know, this plan is meant to serve as a roadmap for the county to strive to meet our climate mitigation and resiliency goals that the board adopted in November of 2020. The Office of Sustainability was stood up last March to lead this process, and planning began last June when we brought on consultants AECOM to support this work. [02:11:24] The Sustainability Commission was established to serve as the public advisory body throughout the development of the CESMP. And before we begin, I would like to thank the Sustainability Commission for all of their time and effort in providing recommendations throughout this process. I know we have some sustainability commissioners here with us who spoke earlier, and that goes for past and present sustainability commissioners. With that, I would like to introduce Tahira Abdul-Mateen, who is the lead project manager with AECOM and will be presenting [02:11:58] the summary of the cesmp and we also uh have vanessa go who is the greenhouse gas mitigation with lead with aecom joining us virtually and i will be available to answer any questions after the presentation thank you uh chair wheeler and the board tahira oh it's hard to hear you so either yeah tilt them up or you can also raise the podium up too if it's is this any better thoughts a little [02:12:32] bit yeah see if you can raise she's thank you is this better okay chair wheeler and the board Tahira Abdul-Mateen with AECOM I AECOM was hired by the Office of Sustainability through Julia Mano to facilitate the development of your CESMP the climate and energy climate and energy sustainability master plan right now what we'll do is just give a brief overview of the work that was done to put the plan together we will review [02:13:11] we'll review the goals that were the foundation of the development of the plan we'll take a look at who is involved in the plan of the development we'll connect those goals to the actual actions that came out of the plan we'll review the actions very briefly and then talk about next steps the goals were the foundation of our development of our plan they were directives and goals of this plan were developed and adopted by the board in 2020. Goals one and five were adopted from MWCOG's [02:13:47] regional climate goals. And the Office of Sustainability, as Julia mentioned, was stood up in 2022 to task with facilitating the development of this plan that addresses the goals. Speaking of the Office of Sustainability, who was involved? This was not primarily written by AECOM. The Office of Sustainability was at the center of the development of the plan. The Office of Sustainability was at the center of the development of the plan, the Office of Sustainability put together [02:14:19] a core team of department heads that were crucial in understanding, facilitating the progress, reviewing milestone deliverables that were a part of putting this together, facilitating the development of the implementation plan at the end of the plan as well. [02:14:37] Many of the departments shown here directly authored the implementation plan, so I didn't want to mention that. The Sustainability Commission, appointed by the board, is a public advisory body made up of Prince William County citizens and utility reps. [02:14:59] They were involved in reviewing the plan's development with key milestones along the way. They reviewed our technical analysis, the actions themselves assisted with reviewing the priority evaluation criteria, and passed a unanimous resolution in support of the plan and included in the board packet for your review. [02:15:28] My team at EECOM, made up of subject matter experts and analysts, was hired by the Office of Sustainability, again, to complete the technical analysis of the plan and facilitate the development of the document that you put forward for the vote. Finally, stakeholder engagement was really at the center of the development of the CESMP. [02:15:53] The Office of Sustainability and Income facilitated five workshops with the community and industry participants and provided input on the action evaluation process. They answered questions such as what are the priorities of the community in terms of action for this plan and also what evaluation criteria should be used to evaluate which action should be prioritized. [02:16:15] speaking of engagement with community members the majority of the high priority actions identified in the plan were actually incorporated into the the the cesmp oh i'm sorry okay we conducted two surveys in two town halls some of the examples of high impact actions that we had that were in agreement with the community members were things such as planting and protecting trees protecting natural water resources these actually facilitated they were actually facilitated within the plan and and became higher high priority actions. [02:16:55] And you'll see those in the top 25. So one of the first things that we did when we were developing the plan was to understand what sectors in the county made up, contributed to the majority of the greenhouse gas emissions. [02:17:13] This is connecting to the goals related to reducing greenhouse gas emissions by 50%. So to answer that question, we first looked at the 2018 greenhouse gas inventory completed by MWCOG. [02:17:28] The first sector that we looked at, the three that stand out as the biggest impacts are transportation energy made up of commercial and residential energy. So these are the sectors within Prince William County that contribute to the majority of those greenhouse gas emissions. [02:17:46] The inventories are created every two years by the Metropolitan Washington Council of Governments, and we use the 2018 inventory because the 2020 was a little bit skewed by COVID. The high priority actions in the plan address emissions in transportation such as reducing vehicle miles traveled in the transportation sector and commercial and residential energy. We have strategies such as reducing increasing energy efficiency in buildings [02:18:18] as well as decarbonizing the electric grid. So after we evaluated the 2018 inventory the next thing that we did was answer the question what would happen if the county did nothing and how far would the county have to go to actually meet that goal. And that takes into account how the county would grow over the next handful of years to 2030. That top green line shows what happens to the greenhouse gas emissions in the county if the county does nothing. They increase due to [02:18:54] growth factors that were established in the comprehensive plan that include population, job projections, and square footage projections from the digital gateway. It also considers other regional growth indicators such as increase in vehicle miles traveled. The bottom line shows the goal, the target goal, and the space in between is the remaining emissions to meet the goal or the gap. So this analysis was foundational for our understanding of how to meet those goals one through four, reducing greenhouse gas emissions. The next question that we answered was, is there [02:19:33] anything that's happening outside of Prince William County that could help the county meet the goals without the county doing anything. So this next slide shows the impact of external market and regulatory forces. So if you think about things such as Virginia's Renewable Portfolio Standard, which requires electricity generation from 41% renewables by 2030, these are things that happen without the county doing anything, but they impact the county and actually help you guys meet your goals. [02:20:05] So again, what this shows is the impact. Again, if the county did nothing, there's still a gap of 2.5 metric tons of CO2 equivalents. There's a gap that needs to be met. So the next question was, okay, so if the county did do something, what effect would that have on the county's ability to meet the goals? [02:20:25] Assuming that there was a high adoption, everybody did everything, there was really aggressive action, and what if there was not aggressive action to meet that goal? So what this shows is the yellow line shows what would happen if there was not aggressive action. [02:20:41] the county took to meet the greenhouse gas mitigation goal. And the green line below that shows what if there was aggressive action to meet this goal. The third thing that it shows is that even though there is room for aggressive action to meet the greenhouse gas mitigation goal, there's still a gap. [02:21:00] And what could happen in 2030 is that the county could, at that time, review after implementing a bunch of actions, see if there is still a gap, and then address that gap with high-quality carbon offsets. The second type of assessment that we did was we looked at the county's assets and vulnerable populations and tried to understand what climate hazards directly impact the county. [02:21:31] There is no doubt that there is an increased experience of flooding, extreme heat events, things like that that affect the county. Understanding the greenhouse gas mitigation piece is a little bit kind of vague, but it is undeniable that there is increased flooding in the community as well as extreme weather events. [02:21:54] So we completed a vulnerability assessment where we looked at those climate hazards, looked at how much it is affecting the county, and came up with actions that address the ability of the county to be adaptive to climate change. Some of those prioritized actions include adopting natural open space requirements, and restoring streams to reduce flooding. [02:22:16] So the assets and climate hazards through the vulnerability assessment facilitated the development of the adaptation actions. So we have greenhouse gas mitigation actions. We have adaptation actions. We had a list of about 66, about 60. [02:22:35] The next thing to do was prioritize. The prioritization process basically answered the question, what should we start with first? Which actions should the county start with first? And so with the help of the Sustainability Commission, the county core team and departments, a list of evaluation criteria is put together. [02:22:53] I'll just highlight a couple of these. This answers the question, how does the county prioritize which actions to start first? And it wasn't just this reduces the most greenhouse gas emissions or this costs the least to people. It actually included looking at the social and environmental and economic impact to the county or savings to residents and community and businesses as well. [02:23:17] The full list is here and is available in the CES&P. Using the longer list of actions and the evaluation criteria through our stakeholder engagement activities, that list of about 60 was prioritized to start with 25 first. [02:23:38] The remaining list is actually still included in the plan, but we wanted to focus on the high-party actions. So all of the actions align with the comm plan and the strategic plan and smart growth strategies in those plans. The actions build upon what the county is already doing and focus the county in these areas. [02:24:03] And the majority of the plan focuses on implementing the high party actions first. So looking at those, I wanted to run through a few. I will not read every one, but as we reviewed previously, transportation was one of the largest sectors that contributed to a large portion of the county's greenhouse gas emissions. [02:24:29] We came up with the high priority action. Some of them that shook out in this category were T1 and T2, such as improved pedestrian and bicycle infrastructure, enhanced connectivity, and encouraging transit-oriented developments. The second two areas are related to energy, residential energy, commercial energy. [02:24:53] This is building energy and energy efficiency. This is largely a consequence of the region's reliance on fossil fuels, such as natural gas and coal, for electricity generation. The actions focus on installing solar locally or purchasing green power. [02:25:12] One of the high-party actions that came out of the residential and commercial energy sector are E2, such as promoting renewable energy incentives programs and develop additional solar incentives. We knew this was a hot button for the county. This was the feedback that we incorporated into the plan. [02:25:31] Related specifically to buildings, this is the last group of, one of the last groups of high priority actions. Buildings generate about 55% of the total emissions through their use of electricity. The actions focus on increasing building energy efficiency for both existing and new constructions, such as for B1 and B3, encourage energy efficiency and electrification, retrofits, and a new construction. [02:25:56] And finally, thinking about the climate adaptation piece, which is addressing, you know, the extreme weather events, flooding and extreme heat. A handful of adaptations rose to the surface as high priority, such as N1, which we discussed already, the Adapting Natural Open Space A4 and A5, which is implementing shoreline protections and nature-based solutions, as well as restoring streams to reduce flooding. [02:26:33] Throughout this process, again, stakeholder engagement was crucial. Some of the priorities which we showed on the previous slides for the public were things such as the desire to prioritize planting and protecting trees or streamlining solar permitting. [02:26:54] Some of the actions that directly connect to those were mentioned before, which I won't go over again, but continued streamlining, solar permitting, and continuing to protect natural resources are things that rose to the top and were also prioritized for the county and the CESMP. [02:27:13] So we just reviewed the high-priority actions that were a large chunk of the CESMP. The next step is actually moving towards implementation. The county departments, the implementation roadmaps were developed for the 25 high-party actions by the county core team, which is relevant county departments. [02:27:39] The roadmaps were developed by county government departments that will lead the implementation, and they provide input on things like implementation steps, estimated ballpark cost ranges, and high-level performance indicators, and the Office of Sustainability will have an oversight role in guarding and tracking implementation, but actual implementation will be led by those county departments. They are simply a recommended starting point to begin action. So finally, just highlighting another piece of the implementation plans. Again, the CESMP includes [02:28:18] wide cost range estimates for implementing the high-priority actions. Again, these are very ballpark. We're starting off with wide ranges, and then ongoing feasibility studies would revise those cost ranges. So the cost ranges that are shown here are not budget requests. They are high level. They're broad estimates. Just to give the county an idea of what it would take to complete the actions, some of the things we wanted to highlight about the costs are that the costs [02:28:56] are assuming this is all new funding that would be needed to complete those. But that is not reality. In reality, there is a lot of funding available for things like this, such as from the federal government, the Inflation Reduction Act, locally, regionally, federally, there is funding available. [02:29:15] There are also several actions that could potentially save the county money. That analysis was not done. in detail but would be done upon the request and moving forward of some of the high priority actions during the implementation phase not all actions are high cost some of them are low cost with high high impact some of them are are high if they're like public transit upgrades so for example some of the actions require a staff member to facilitate public outreach or [02:29:54] reviewing grants finding grants and applying for them one staff member could be used for multiple for several of those actions to complete that task the majority of the high party actions that we have included in the plan would be need would need to be completed and would be completed by 2030 so the cost the high level cost for that is about 400 million up to 400 million i should say however the number doesn't include again it doesn't include grant funding it doesn't include the up the offset of operational [02:30:26] costs and I apologize my slides my slides okay and again one of the points that we wanted to make was just that this is not a budget request hopefully that's heard okay moving on to our next steps so some of the proposed next steps [02:31:00] included in the plan are based on three foundational program wide sustainability initiatives designed to improve the county's ability to implement to monitor the progress of the plan. The first one is the implementation of an adaptive management approach. [02:31:20] We already know that this work is very dynamic. There are new technologies and policies, opportunities for regional collaboration happening all the time, especially with the Inflation Reduction Act, guidance coming down on the federal level. This isn't a static strategy. So there's a lot of changes happening. [02:31:37] And that's made very clear in the plan. This is a live living document. This is not static. it would be updated, and we have to be flexible to pivot and strategically take advantage of opportunities presented. Adaptive management is strategizing, acting, analyzing, and adjusting when advantageous. The second foundational program-wide initiative would be assessments for climate mitigation and resiliency impacts performed by the county. The county currently conducts environmental reviews for rezoning, comprehensive plan amendments, special use permits, and major road projects. [02:32:14] We recommend amending policies to assess greenhouse gas emissions and climate impacts for major projects from climate mitigation and resiliency goals. And the third foundational program-wide initiative would be increasing the institutional capacity, which essentially means a staff member that could be dedicated to serving multiple uses such as pursuing federal grants for green programs and increasing capacity for communication and outreach that would engage residents and businesses in voluntary measures recommended in the plan. [02:32:48] We also, one of the things that was recommended in the plan was the consideration of the CIP funds for FY25, general fund budget. This was included in the executive summary and the final, within the next steps implementation piece of the plan so these are these just summarize what would come next and how the county could stay on track hopefully this provides a bit of an overview of where we came [02:33:24] from where we're at where we're headed and we're now open for questions thank you thank you anything else with manor or is that now time for questions are there any questions this afternoon i know this has been presented to the certain offices supervisor franklin sure i have a question but just want to make a comment about transit oriented development obviously something i think probably all of us support but one of the challenges and this is something that i wanted to address [02:34:01] when i first came into office but then covet hit but one of the things that i wanted to try and tackle was making our bus system more efficient in terms of the routes in terms of encouraging people to use the bus more than hopping in your car i always said that you know the perfect idea would be you know if you're celebrating your birthday you want to go to stonebridge and you live 10 minutes away be nice to hop on the bus and get to stonebridge within 10 minutes but unfortunately to get in and around the county because of the way the routes are structured [02:34:38] it's not that efficient it's much more convenient to hop in your car and just drive and so that's one of the things that you know I was looking to tackle but then of course COVID hit and now we're in a position where you know the goal was just to sustain our transportation systems so that's something that I think now that we're kind of out of the woods with COVID that we need to look at again because i do think that prince william has the potential to really trans transition [02:35:12] from being car oriented to relying on our public transportation but we have to make our public transportation where it's convenient for residents to hop in hop on a bus go to stone bridge even go as far as if you live in woodbridge to manassas i mean just being able to traverse this county in a more efficient way. So that's something that I think we should continue to think about. Thank you. [02:35:38] Thank you. Any other questions? Okay. Seeing no questions on the item, I will entertain a motion to approve 9A. So moved, Madam Chair. Second. Motion made by Vice Chair Bodie, seconded by Supervisor Bailey. We are now into discussion. Madam Chair. Supervisor Bodie. Yeah, thank you, Madam Chair. Ms. Mano, thank you for the work you put into this. Thank you to our friends at for helping to facilitate this thank you to our sustainability commissioners for all their hard work on this as well i know that there weren't always agreements between all the parties involved [02:36:18] um and but i i appreciate that we have in before us both a sort of consensus document but also some great recommendations by the sustainability commission that goes alongside it um just as a point of sort of history um and you all did a good job of sort of highlighting the sort of structural and historic from a policy perspective but this actually all kicked off back in 2020 when i was actually reviewing the prior comprehensive plan in the 2041 and there was this one section called uh look into and analyze a community energy master plan and it was such a shell [02:36:54] of a policy had nothing in it just had that staff was at some point going to look into it and do something about it but there was really literally nothing there beyond that one line so So after asking questions back then, planning director Rebecca Horner and some other folks, it sort of came about that, hey, there needs to be work done here on actually getting staff moving and really changing the paradigm about how staff views projects, how the lens we could look at when it comes to environmental sustainability as we continue to grow as a community. [02:37:27] And that then, as was said, led to the adoption of the sustainability goals, clean energy goals that we adopted back in 2020 the creation of sustainability office the sustainability commission the joint environmental task force and so on and so forth um but i i just wanted to highlight that this has been sort of a a long time coming a many years journey that's finally we're on the cusp of of adopting something that will really transform if implemented properly the way we do business in princelium county um because there's a lot of folks out that have a lot of heartburn about a lot of different subjects and again I want to restate for everyone this is [02:38:06] not a budget request as of this time it's the adoption of a plan that will be able to implement that framework to allow staff to look at things from the lens of environmental sustainability resiliency and I want to highlight that last part too because frankly we have a lot of vulnerable communities all throughout the county that are even more at risk of the ever strengthening storms uh flooding uh extreme weather and those things come about because of climate change but they also come about because frankly as we grow as a community our our streams erode you know uh our [02:38:42] our riverbanks begin to degrade over time you know we have dead trees throughout the county that need to be refurbished and this looks at all that in a very comprehensive way so regardless of how you feel about clean energy electric vehicles we've heard some people have have some concerns about that this also looks at that environmental stewardship side and really looking at shoring up, pun intended, the shores of our county, the shores of our river banks, the shores of our streams and our river valleys to make it so regardless if you live in the rural area of the county, the semi-rural area, or even the more suburban urbanized parts of the county, we have [02:39:18] strategies and we have the policy framework to look at shoring those things up, improving them, really reinforcing those environmental aspects of our community to really improve the quality of life and protect our residents. So no matter how you look at this, there's something that everyone should be able to sort of stand behind and say, yes, we should be doing this. But more than anything else, I want to highlight the fact that for folks that are concerned about energy draw from data centers and other commercial buildings, energy draw from the residential sector, all of that will be able to eventually be addressed if we're able to implement this plan because it will finally give staff the tools to look at those things through those lenses and look at really doing [02:39:58] our part as a community to tackle these climate issues, these energy issues, and these environmental issues. Thank you so much, Madam Chair. Thank you, Supervisor Bodie. Supervisor Angry. That's quick. Thank you, Madam Chair. So Dwight D. Eisenhower said, plans are nothing. Planning is everything. So you've got to have a plan, but we're more than likely going to deviate from that plan at some point but the fact of the matter is we've created a plan so team ACOM all of our planning commission excuse me sustainability commissioners Julia thank you for this I know [02:40:34] it hasn't been easy and you know there's a lot of even inside of this plan like dollars and potential loss factors and all that but it it is not guaranteed or it's not set in stone and so I just want to thank you for the work you put in for this I don't I don't have any questions about or anything but the fact is this is what the folks wanted they want us to have a plan you put a plan in place we've got the team together i will agree that you need more staff we'll have to work on that that's a board discussion but what you have brought to us i thank you for your your time on that i will speak and just simply say when we start talking about electric vehicles one of the [02:41:10] things i keep talking about is you know probably 50 of this county doesn't even have a car yet so And I'm talking folks who are working, and they rely on public transportation. So when we start talking about electric vehicles and cars, there's folks who, again, they're not going to be able to buy an electric car. [02:41:28] So it's going to take some time to get to that goal, to where we're really out of combustion and out of all of that era into a new electric area that really benefits this total package. because there's going to be discussions, again, that we're going to have to have about certain pockets and population that we're going to have to figure out how we're going to move that group around if we, in fact, ever reach these goals. [02:41:54] And it is my whole goal to be on this board, or as long as I'm on this board, to add this into every decision I make that eventually is going to result in probably the old saying, one step backwards, two steps forwards. But the plan is here. [02:42:11] I thank you for the work, and, you know, I will definitely adhere to adding this to my process as I go forward in my decision-making. So thank you. Thank you, Supervisor Angry. Supervisor Weir. Thank you, Madam Chair, and forgive me if I bounce around a little bit. [02:42:28] I've got all sorts of notes. Let's address item number one. I've heard it repeated. This is not a budget request, but adoption carries with it a budget requirement, and a significant one. [02:42:44] And to adopt this without consideration of that budget requirement in some firmer numbers is not wise. And I'll say the unpopular. Adoption of this would amount to the largest act of hypocrisy by this board in history. [02:43:12] Given its actions and given its planned actions, it's nothing more than greenwash. And very expensive greenwash at that. It transforms nothing. You've already set the stage for the damage that can't be undone. [02:43:31] Let's look at a couple of realities. Clean Virginia Act is essentially dead. Not dead by the legislature yet, but it will be. It's dead by Dominion's IRP. They've already realized the Clean Virginia Act cannot be attained, and it will have to be amended significantly. So you lose your gains from that particular aspect of the curve. [02:43:54] You preach transit-oriented development. The comp plan just adopted is the exact opposite of that. Sprawl throughout the county, and especially through the rural area. We're talking tree save but at the same time that we're clear-cutting the mature forests and the trees. [02:44:13] You want to address carbon capture? Leave the trees up. I looked back at the original resolution creating the Sustainability Commission, and I sat on it for a couple of months. [02:44:33] It says, now, therefore, it be resolved that the Prince William Board of County Supervisors hereby creates a Sustainability Commission with the authority to make recommendations for a community energy sustainability management master plan and hereby defines their scope of its mission, membership, resources, duration, etc. [02:44:50] But having talked to a number of Sustainability Commission members, it seems that their role was largely to act as a rubber stamp and that their recommendations were given little heed and that this was essentially a core team project and not a Sustainability Commission project. [02:45:12] AECOM is putting the onus on staff, not on the Sustainability Commission. That wasn't my understanding of when I sat on the Commission of what the role was. using 2018 data instead of 2020 data because it's skewed by COVID. I would argue COVID's the new normal. Transportation, commuting norms have changed since COVID. Where the economy's going [02:45:49] has changed since COVID. Energy requirements have changed since COVID. So using data that's now five years old, much like using the data a couple of weeks ago that's five years old for affordable housing really doesn't cut it with me. I'm a data guy. I do data every day. I do research professionally. Five-year-old data is not acceptable. With respect to the clean energy slash renewable options for purchasing electricity, let's get another dose of reality. [02:46:27] That's limited by Dominion in the state of Virginia to their suppliers, at least to the residential aspect. There is a limited green supply of energy. It might be different for commercial applications because of how they purchase that power through other options not available to the residents. But at the end of the day, does it really matter? Because the electricity being delivered to those commercial operations in this state will be derived from largely one of two sources, either coal-fired plants or natural gas-fired plants, be they in the Commonwealth [02:47:01] or in other states, as we're seeing from PJM. You can buy all the green energy you want. It's like buying green energy tax credits or carbon credits. Buying carbon credits in Malaysia does nothing for the atmosphere here, especially if those carbon credits are resold multiple times over. If we're going to adopt something, and I think something should be adopted because there are certain things that we can do. Supervisor Rear, your first five minutes are up. You can go again after everybody's [02:47:38] been through one time. Thank you. Supervisor Bailey. Thank you, Madam Chair. First of all, Let me just thank you for your presentation. It was very thorough and very easy to follow through from the beginning until now. [02:47:58] And I want to thank our commissioners for the hard work that you've done. I think that you have done your homework and you understand what you're doing. So I really appreciate that. And to Dr. Joseph Boutte, I appreciate you helping me to understand some scientific things that I knew nothing about. [02:48:18] So thanks for that communication. But I wanted to say to Ms. Mono, it's easy to follow because you're following the strategic plan. It's compatible with what you're doing, and it certainly helped me. [02:48:35] I don't know about my colleagues, but it really helped me as you're going along and you come back to us and you explain to us how that is interrelated to what we're trying to do in the future. And so to AECOM and your group, thank you for your patience and how you've kind of laid things out. [02:48:54] It's very detailed. I'm a little ADHD, so it's kind of hard to keep me focused a little bit, but I got it. I got it. But what I've kind of seen is that we're on the right track in terms of solar. We're beginning to do some things in solar. [02:49:12] We're not there yet, but we're on the right track in terms of that. And so I'm appreciative that your data shows us that this is what we need to do, and we're beginning to do it. So the board passed that earlier, so I'm glad to see that. [02:49:28] The other thing that I'm glad to see is when you talk about completing the GHG inventory for county government operations, We kind of touched on that in a meeting today, as well as the fleet, the low and zero emissions fleet. [02:49:49] And so that says that we're moving in the right direction, too, because I'm always looking for continuity, and that says we're moving in the right direction. I think the key to that, as we move in the right direction with all of this, is the grant piece as well, because we don't want to have the burden on the taxpayer. [02:50:13] So we get that. But I would encourage you to help us with that grant piece because it's a lot of money in that grant piece, both state and mostly federally, that will help us with this. But we need to understand what that means as we go forward. [02:50:29] So I'm just letting that resonate for a minute because I think that's an opportunity for us because we haven't really delved into that opportunity. Am I on point with that a little bit? Okay, all right. So with that, I want to go also to, I remember when I was on the Wetlands Board about under former Supervisor Frank Principi in the past, and we didn't really understand, we're on the Wetlands Board, it's like a check the box kind of thing. [02:51:00] But the Wetlands Board today has major significance in what we're doing as we go forward. And so when we talk about the Wetlands Board and we were talking about things like stormwater management, things like that. I think it's a great opportunity. [02:51:17] Can you talk to me just a little bit in terms of that? Because we have a lot of problems in that area as it relates to... We're in discussion. No, we're in discussion. Okay, sorry, don't answer the question. But I do have concerns about that. And so as we come back, I would like to have that addressed. [02:51:35] Okay, that's very important as it relates to this. And then lastly, thank you, Madam Chair, for that. And then lastly, I wanted to say that as we go forward, as it relates to the funding of what we need to do, I, as the one-eighth of this, need for it to be explained very strategically and succinctly, because I don't want there to be a burden from a funding standpoint on [02:52:09] the county and on the taxpayer, but I do want there to be a picture painted about the grants piece. That's really important, I believe, in what we're doing. This is the environmental resiliency and sustainability piece has been put on the shelf for a long time, and now we're pulling it off the shelf, and it's something new to us. So basic stuff is important, and the continuity of meeting with us is essential. So thank you for that. And the last part about hiring a sustainability communications outreach manager, environmental analyst, that's key [02:52:46] to to keep us walking along the path that you need to to make a to make a dent in what we're trying to do we need to have eyes and ears and hands on it sorry your time's up I'm shutting up okay supervisor Vega thank you madam chair supervisor we are thank you for highlighting the obvious in your first round of remarks if you will you know folks making prudent land use decisions that our residents actually support and that directly impacts a lot of the items listed [02:53:23] here is much more less expensive than what is being proposed here today. I've always said that the biggest impact that we as supervisors have to the environment comes through our land use votes and I will put my land use votes up against anybody on this dais on any given day because that is the biggest and most single impact, significant impact that we have when it comes to the environment. You know, when the conversations about this first began and I began to see some of these goals that were proposed, I called those pie in the sky goals because are they really [02:54:03] realistic goals? Are they really achievable goals? You know, I'm tired of folks on this day as proposing things that just want to make themselves feel good and want to serve as trickery, if you will, to their constituents, especially during an election year. If it were up to me, I would love to defer this after the election because I would feel more comfortable in knowing that, in fact, whatever the board looks like next year will be responsible and not stick the taxpayers with the figures that you've seen in this proposal. But I know that that's not going happen. It's going to pass like everything else that you see coming down the pipeline. To include [02:54:42] the digital gateway, we're sitting here talking about goals, folks, but yet again, we're okay with approving the largest data center hub anywhere. And I was distracted talking to Supervisor Franklin, so the chair closed the moment of questions, and I wanted to ask Julie about that. [02:54:59] How is approving this massive project going to help us get closer to these goals? I'm tired of being counterproductive to what it is that we're trying to achieve and that has been a long problem a history that this board has so so so emboldenedly gone after and I'm tired of that again your supervisor impacts the environment through their land use votes you can go back and look at how your supervisors have voted when it comes to the most controversial land use cases we've taken over the last four years and to sit up here and act like we care about the environment that we care [02:55:36] about this that we care about the other when we're okay with the 28 bypass that's going to impact our watershed paving over it when we're okay with destroying the rural crescent but yet again we're talking about preserving trees or replanting trees that's an oxymoron come on let's get real are we really serious about this or are we not and that has been my biggest frustration i've been doing this for almost four years now and in the four years that i've been doing this very rarely rarely do things cost less as advertised. Of course, I sent an email and we saw a $650 million cost [02:56:13] savings that was found overnight on all electric vehicle fleet. When they want to, they can find cost savings. But when we're asking to alleviate the burden that you, the taxpayers, are experiencing, there is no cost savings anywhere to be found. I will say that there are things that I can support. [02:56:30] The open space requirements is less effective, yes, than simply preserving the rural crescent, but one that i can absolutely support make no mistake we have to balance what we do for our local environment versus what the taxpayers will support and what they can afford but what we're being presented with here is not a serious plan because if it was a serious plan one those goals would be attainable achievable and two we would we would we would make an even bigger impact through our land use votes julia and to your team this is not directed to you or to anybody on your team because when we initiated those conversations you hadn't even been hired but I do want to publicly [02:57:07] say that I thank you for taking the time to meet with me with my staff and I know that I've asked you some hard questions but I want you to understand that it's my duty to ask those tough questions because I've been elected to represent my constituents and I want them to be informed I want them to know what's coming what's been projected because approving this today is going to have a significant impact not just on how we move forward as a county but in the pockets books of the residents of this county i also want to thank you martin jeter you truly are a treasure and a gift to this county your service not just on midco but on this commission is one that i truly admire and i thank you for all of your contributions and i think all of the commissioners [02:57:46] for their contributions to this plan it's not perfect i think that it could have been but the politics is not for you all to sort out but i want to thank you all supervisor franklin thank you So, I'm not interested in having a discussion that's doom and gloom because, quite frankly, I haven't seen an alternative plan from those in the minority here on this board. [02:58:15] I think when it comes to sustainability, you know, Supervisor Bode has kind of, you know, been leading this effort, but I haven't seen any alternative plan. You know, talking about the different projects that we've approved or not approved or whatever, I haven't seen not one plan from the minority here on this day as to say, instead of 9A, why don't you all consider this plan instead? [02:58:41] I don't know what this plan is because it doesn't exist. So that's number one. Number two, look, I put forth the directive to create the Sustainability Commission, and it certainly wasn't to make myself feel better. It's because I've heard from a number of advocates that said the county needs to start getting serious in terms of sustainability efforts. [02:59:03] So create an office, create a commission, and had some other recommendations, and I took on creating the commission. Now, if there are some people that got on the commission in an effort to push a certain agenda, you know, that's on them. So I just want to be clear about why the Sustainability Commission was even created. [02:59:21] because there were advocates out there that said, and I agree with them, that this county needs to start getting serious and start addressing those issues. Number two, one of my colleagues just mentioned about sprawl in the comprehensive plan. And let me be clear about what's in the comprehensive plan. [02:59:39] It's not sprawl. We actually added a number of clustering units that could be put across the county. And if you know anything about clustering, that's quite the opposite of sprawl. Clustering is where you plan a certain amount of houses in a particular area and then you leave the rest of the space open. [02:59:59] It's different from a 10-acre lot in which you have private land where you have open space that belongs to a private entity. The public doesn't have a right to 10-acre lots. That's private land. Now, perhaps we can all say we wish that the public did, but that's the reality. That's what's in the comp plan that we voted on. [03:00:15] So you've got to get that straight. And then the last thing, we talk about transit-oriented development and not being serious about it. but here's the deal. At some point, we have to start addressing these issues. Are we going to get it right the first time? In policy, you often don't. That's just a reality. Governing is tough. [03:00:32] Creating legislative initiatives is hard, and you don't always get it to be perfect. I have not seen one piece of legislation, either on the federal, state, or local level, that is perfect. But starting the discussion, I think, is important. And so, again, I haven't seen an alternative plan, and so I don't know how we can sit up here and say that we're not serious. Next up is Supervisor Lawson and I'm giving everyone who hasn't spoken a chance and then we'll go back for second turns including myself. Supervisor Lawson. Thank you Madam Chair. I'd like to first thank Julia and AECOM for the [03:01:07] work that you are doing and I imagine you'll continue to do. I certainly want to thank the commissioners. My commissioner is not here today but I've communicated with him a little bit and And just to echo Supervisor Vega Martin, I'm guessing that you've been a leader in the commission on this effort. [03:01:32] Matter of fact, did I see that, yeah, that you were the sponsor of the motion for approval of the master plan? So, first of all, I just want to thank you. And I know that there are absolutely elements in this plan that I really appreciate, especially related to land use. [03:01:55] And I agree. I think that this board's biggest, most significant opportunity to affect our local environment, reduce greenhouse gases, is absolutely tied to our land use votes. [03:02:12] Is it everything? No. but it's a very key component to the sustainability of Prince William County. And I certainly have made it very clear up here that I believe the restoration of the Royal Crescent is imperative to reach goals such as our goals that have been laid out in this plan and many of the resolutions that the board has passed. [03:02:41] What I really like and want to compliment you on in the work that you've done is initiatives such as the restoration of streams and our shorelines, promoting green zoning, that's really good, promoting suburban and rural tree planting. [03:03:02] And I think I saw Julie Flanagan in here, our county arborist, and I definitely would like to see more initiatives of that. Management stormwater flooding outside the floodplain. I mean, I could go on and on. Improved pedestrian and bicycle infrastructure, enhanced connectivity. [03:03:20] Those are all great initiatives. And this is a big document with lots of things that I could continue to highlight. But I, again, want to thank the commissioners for all the time and help that you have done to create this master plan. [03:03:40] And I also don't have the opportunity to ask questions, but I can't help but ask, I guess rhetorically. It says some existing data centers in the county are already procuring 100% clean electricity for their operations. [03:04:00] I'd like to know who they are, because that's not my understanding. So, Julia, I would absolutely like to visit with you after today about that. Do we have proof of that? [03:04:17] Are we verifying that, or are we just taking them at their word? It's on page 26. So, I'm doubtful. I'm very doubtful. One of the things that gives me pause about adopting this plan is because we know that the data center industry is a huge reason why our emissions are climbing. [03:04:46] And I can't help but think of analogies like running the air conditioner and keeping the windows of your home open. So it does seem like it would be counterproductive. [03:05:03] On the fiscal side of it, I appreciate that you stand up there and say it's not a budget request. It's not, but if we adopt policy, the county executive is naturally going to consider it when he is creating his annual budget. [03:05:22] And this alone, I believe, had a $10 million FY25 budget request with the general fund and the cip is that correct 10 million total and then implementation full implementation of the high priority actions could cost as much as really granted over the next 25 years well some of them over the next 10 years if you will anywhere from you know a quarter of a billion [03:05:53] dollars to a half a billion if if we're rounding that's a lot of money and we've all agreed up here in various conversations in the past. And I'll wrap this up and then come back. Thank you. That, excuse me, I'm just finishing my thought, that we all agree going green is expensive. [03:06:17] So I just, anyway, I'll finish the rest of my comments next round. Thank you for waiting. So before we go on the second round of comments, you know, there are just a few things I'd love to sort of point out. And I'm going to start with sustainability. You know, sustainability, in my understanding of it, and perhaps I'm differing from my seatmates, but sustainability doesn't mean not doing anything. [03:06:41] It means what we do, we pay attention to what we're doing, whether it be, you know, and it has to have an economical component. Like we can't, you know, spend billions of dollars putting in concrete roads because it's not economical. [03:06:57] So sustainability has an economic component. It has an environmental component, and it has an equity component. And so just saying, oh my gosh, just keep the Royal Crescent, we're not going to develop the county, or we're not going to do a project and let someone use their land for something that they've asked us to do, is not how it works. [03:07:15] The idea is that we're supposed to do it better. You know, when we got here, there was no look at doing anything better from an environmental or energy standpoint, or, you know, the things that we could do for long-term investing in things like EVs. You know, I will say one of the major problems with, and I take credit for this too, our goals, you know, our goals didn't include any kind of growth, whether it's our population, because we know it's going to increase, or even just commercial buildings. [03:07:44] We knew those were coming, and we didn't build any increase in our goals, and so it's almost unattainable if you look at our goals, but that's okay, because, you know, goals can be either attainable, and we went through this at COG and TPB, or they can be aspirational. [03:08:00] And just because goals are aspirational doesn't mean you just throw the whole baby out with the bathwater and you can't do it and it's $835 million. No, you look at it and say, okay, here's what we were given. We're doing the best. And thank you, Julia and EECOM, for doing the best you could with some really strict goals that are probably not attainable. [03:08:20] But that's okay because we have to start somewhere. And people can say, oh, my gosh, it's hypocrisy to put in data centers. But, look, those are going to go in somewhere. You know, it's the idea of, like, you know, closing our eyes and holding our ears. Oh, no, don't put them in here. [03:08:36] They're not going to go in somewhere else. And so it's not like we're having an impact on global climate change by not approving any kind of commercial or, you know, commercial projects that are out there. It just doesn't work that way. We don't, we're not living in our Prince William County bubble. [03:08:52] And, you know, they're already hopscotching over us and using groundwater and other things out in other areas that are more rural to us. And I often say I would rather have projects here because we do stormwater management well in Prince William County. We do water well. [03:09:08] We do tree preservation. We have a level of sophistication that can handle some of these larger projects that other people can't. And so to say it's hypocrisy is a little off. So, you know, I'm just, I'm grateful that we have a plan in place, that we're moving towards something, and, you know, but, yeah, these are, it's going to be a budget decision, you know, we do a lot of things that are budget decisions, and, you know, it depends on what the projected revenue is, and, you know, what's going on in the community, and so, you know, next budget season, people will decide what they want to support, and we don't always do everything that's in our plan, we don't, but that's okay, at least we have a plan, you know, and that's what we're being [03:09:47] presented with today you know I'm grateful for all the work I know it wasn't easy and it is you know it isn't increased it is a growing county and we are going to continue to grow and we can stick our head in the sands and say that's not the case but I think we need to embrace it and realize that we need to grow well and I'm not going to say smart growth because that's been so overused but the idea someone was mentioning earlier that yes as we develop the the ventile corridor we don't get sprawl, we get clustered housing that has open space. This is progress for this board as opposed to chopping up everything around Prince William County into 10 acre lots. And with that, [03:10:27] I'll wait till my next turn. Supervisor Brody. Thank you, Madam Chair. And I appreciate the discussion that we've had as a board thus far. You know, we disagree on aspects as we also disagree fundamentally on some philosophy around land use. But I do agree with those who have said that one of the most impacts we have are our land use votes and that's why i think number two on this last slide is so important because it implements if we adopt this plan uh the the next step would be to then have staff look at implementing environmental reviews for project impacts on climate mitigation resiliency goals it was mentioned earlier that's land use cases that's [03:11:06] cpas that's rezoning that's cip products that's transportation projects you know potentially if you really want us to have more information as a board when we're making these land use votes, you want to support that. You want us to be able to have, again, in that lens of sustainability and environmentalism, how is this housing project going to impact greenhouse gas emissions? How is this CIP project with the right criteria be able to be, in some cases, carbon neutral, depending on what we're looking at? How is having certain additions to certain existing county buildings [03:11:42] through solar, through energy efficiency, through lead design, what have you, how is that going to help us move the ball forward on being a more sustainability county? So again, I agree with what people are saying in impacting our land use votes, but you want to be able to instill that kind of framework by implementing this plan. Otherwise, you're not going to be able to do that. So I just want to put that out there too. Secondly, I just want to sort of wrap up my feelings on this in that we cannot let the perfect be the enemy of the good. I know there are flaws here. I know that [03:12:17] we have a room for disagreement on even the methodology and even the data that was used to be the benchmarks here. I'm not disagreeing with any of those points, but without putting some flag down somewhere at some point to then allow our staff to then go back and get better data to see where we're going, we're just going to keep spinning our wheels here. As some other folks said we continue to be the donut hole of the region when it comes to having anything to move the ball forward on this so we we do have a long ways to go i think this next step slide is is a great way to to to move forward after we adopt this plan if we get enough votes to do it [03:12:55] i hope i'm hopeful that we are um but but i i like supervisor franklin uh do not like to sort of view these sort of policy decisions as worst case scenario, you know, it's doom and gloom, we can't reach these goals, so why should we even bother, why should we do this? [03:13:11] I see this as the chance for us to finally move to become leaders in the region on sustainability, environmental stewardship, and environmental justice, as opposed to just throw our hands up in the air and say, hey, we can't reach them, so why should we bother? So I'm looking forward to supporting this, I hope we get enough votes to do it, and I look forward to what comes next. [03:13:31] Thank you so much, Madam Chair. Thank you, Supervisor Bodie. Supervisor Weir. Thank you, Madam Chair. Aspirational is an interesting word, and it carries with it a number of problems. You know, if you look at aspirational power demand by data centers, as reflected by their low demand letters, what you get is Dominion Power and other power agencies having to build to that aspirational demand. [03:14:05] Whether or not they actually achieve it or not is irrelevant. dominion has to respond to that aspirational demand. Now, you can have aspirations in a plan, but if your aspirations are set so unrealistically high, it diminishes the value of the plan. [03:14:28] Supervisor Franklin, you ask why we don't have an alternative. I've actually got one. I have the bones of one. I've been worked on by several members of the Sustainability Commission, and I'd be more than happy to flesh it out and work it out in the next couple of weeks, essentially go for the low-hanging fruit, establish some future goals, but get what's attainable at this point in time. [03:15:01] And I'm more than willing to spend the time and send that out to everybody. Hell, I could probably get it out by the end of the week. As to why I don't have it ready for you right now, it's real simple. Coming into this afternoon, I had no doubt that this canned policy, this canned plan would be adopted by this board. [03:15:33] It's just a question of what the vote was. If the board is willing to defer action on this, and I don't see any particular urgency to it. I mean, it's not going to change anything if we defer it a couple of weeks. [03:15:49] I'll be more than willing to put forth some suggested amendments and make it a little more realistic in terms of achieving those goals. But I'm not going to waste my time doing it if there's no interest in discussion on that. It's real hard to have a discussion on something as all-encompassing as this when we get the final staff report and all of the other information that attach to it on a Thursday, and we're expected to make a decision on a Tuesday because we're not just going to get briefed on it, work on it, and then handle it at a later meeting. You would think that something of this magnitude [03:16:25] would have more than simply a move for adoption of the project as presented, rather than having a work session on the final project and then making a determination a week, two weeks, three weeks, whenever, later. And I'll leave it at that. I'm not going to beat this dead horse anymore. [03:16:46] Thank you, Madam Chair. Supervisor Vega. Thank you. You know, Supervisor Franklin, refer to it as doom and gloom. Sadly, based on the emails that I get on the daily, that is exactly what people in this county have felt over the course of the last four years. Doom and gloom. [03:17:03] I mean, pick and choose, whether it be land use votes, whether it be taxes. Again, there's a list that you can pick from. And so the irony, right, of the description, which is why, you know, I took it upon myself to ensure that my constituents and everybody else that is a part of our mailing list has access to all of the information so that they can prepare themselves for what's coming. [03:17:25] It's heartbreaking to get these emails from a single mom who is struggling to pay her bills, who is struggling to get by. This is, again, not an insignificant proposal that we're being asked to approve here today. It is going to absolutely impact people's lives and the way they move forward. [03:17:42] They have to plan for it. It's easy for us to sit up here and press yes, no, or abstain, Especially when the bulk of the people we represent are not in chambers and are not watching at home. That's easy. But it's difficult when you have to give explanations as to why the majority keeps voting the way that they're voting, hurting people on the daily. [03:18:02] And that's why, that's why I don't believe that we should be voting for this today. Again, you say, it's not a budget request, it's not. If the dollar amounts or if the dollar figures don't matter, why even post them? [03:18:20] Why? But I just want to be very clear, because I haven't heard any allegations of the commissioners pushing agendas. And I don't want any of you all to be offended by those comments. If anything, I've heard that out of all of the commissions that this board has enacted, you all have done tremendous work and you work together in unity because you really want to better this county and leave it in a better place than what you all founded for generations to come. [03:18:50] And I believe that with my heart. And because of that, I do hope that we continue to get more input from you all. I'm going to go ahead and give, you know, my colleagues here saying that it's not a budget ask, not a budget request, the benefit of the doubt. You know, when the next board comes in, maybe some of us won't even be here, and that's okay because you, the voters, decide if we come back or if we don't. [03:19:13] But be that as it may, I'll give them the benefit of that and say, oh, there's no specific ask, if you will. But just remember the – I'm sorry, Madam Chair, what? Well, you're distracting me because you're also talking. So I even lost my train of thought. [03:19:28] I apologize, you all. Yes, wow, that's what happens. So anyways, just want the commissioners to know that to the contrary, I've heard that you guys do great work, and I hope that you guys continue to do that great work and that you continue to provide your valuable input so that as we continue to navigate these waters, you know, for all of the unanswered questions, for all of the data that we don't have access to, you know, that we have your input and expertise added to this so that they can bring it back to whoever is going to be representing you all for the next four years. [03:20:01] I think that's what happens when you have three members of the OCCA Con district on a commission. I just want to say that. One appointed by me. Next up, we have Supervisor Franklin. Yeah, I just want to remind everyone that this is a sustainability plan to adopt environmental goals. I feel like the way the discussion has been, quite frankly, demonized is as if we're about to vote on the worst thing on this planet, no pun intended. [03:20:30] But I'm just like, this is a sustainability plan to help the county. There are multiple ways to get there, but this is a positive thing. This should be a positive discussion. Even if you disagree with what's in here, the overall tone of this discussion should be positive, because this is an effort to help us move further into our sustainability and environmental goals. [03:20:58] There shouldn't be a negative connotation around sustainability and environmental, and I would argue that the tone of this discussion is offensive to the commission. So let's just change the tone, if not anything else. Supervisor Lawson. [03:21:16] Thank you, Madam Chair. so i'll try and bring this back to the plan that we're voting on um so julia uh it was page 26 that that i referenced earlier about the data centers and um maybe we need to take a break for should madam chair should we i know there's a lot of should we recess for a minute no why because i'm trying to talk i'm sorry well well no not just no no no you were guilty of it too so i asked [03:21:47] My point is, just like Supervisor Vega, it's distracting, and I'm just trying to concentrate and talk to the chamber. So anyway, Julia, the 100% is page 26. [03:22:05] I looked it up while I was waiting for my second turn. It's definitely in there. And you guys look surprised, which concerns me because that's a big deal if we're claiming that data centers are already procuring 100% renewable energy and we don't know for certain that they are. [03:22:24] Huge piece of it. This is a plan that does set a framework. I believe that we all are interested in doing everything we can to protect our environment and be sustainable. But it's a serious plan that comes with a serious price tag. [03:22:44] And that's why it's a heavy discussion. I mean, you're looking at a few hundred million dollars to implement this plan of public funds. So it's to be taken very seriously. [03:23:02] The Judicial Center, it's very needed. It's well overdue. That's a $300 million CIP project. this board a couple weeks ago had a public hearing for you know indoor rec we're looking at a very expensive facility so we have to weigh all these and uh i i like a lot of components in this plan what is weighing on me is the price tag of this plan and knowing that so many people in prince [03:23:38] william county so many businesses are stretched thin especially during record inflation and i like to manage expectations and i certainly want to manage the expectations of prince william county residents and if i were to just blindly say yeah let's do this let's adopt this plan we're giving direction to the county executive and he's going to follow the board majority's lead on any given [03:24:09] plan that we approve that has a price tag with it. Today it doesn't, but it certainly will have price tags as you implement it. And that's why this is a serious conversation. I like a lot of things about it. I definitely think it needs more work. It needs more measures baked into how we are going to develop this county. And Madam Chair, our comprehensive plan, the plan that, the [03:24:47] comprehensive plan that I didn't vote for but you did absolutely has smart growth principles baked into the comp plan. I thought it did advance a lot of sprawl which is why I voted against it but our strategic plan also suggests for environmental sustainability preservation of the rural area. I looked it up while I was waiting. Objective SG3 encourage the preservation expansion and protection of agribusiness agri-tourism and protect rural areas so you can [03:25:26] lecture me all you want on the preservation of the rural area but it's baked into the plan that you supported the strategic plan I did vote for that plan so there's a lot of things in here that I want to rally around but there's some things in here that give me pause considering that there is election coming up i don't know if i'll be sitting on this board come january i don't know who else will be sitting on this board come january other than supervisors we're and angry there's a really [03:26:06] there's a really good chance they'll be sitting on this board there's a really really good chance they'll be sitting on this board and they're the only two out of the rest of us so i actually would like to move a substitute motion to defer the adoption of this plan until the new board is seated and they can take it up when they so wish. Second. Motion made by Supervisor Lawson, seconded by Supervisor Weir. Discussion? Can we just vote? Madam Chair. Okay. Supervisor [03:26:44] Bodie's going to discuss. Thank you, Madam Chair. Supervisor Lawson, I appreciate your sort of outlook on on a lot of this um and then i agree that we should be concerned about who's going to pay for it and my i've thrown this out several times in other venues but i'll throw out here i think the data center industry should pay for it i think it should be uh tied to computer imperforables tax and continue to increase it so they can pay their fair share into it so i'm with you on that concern i think we have a solution that's for the next board to decide whether that's us or other people or some mixture of the two but i think the data center industry should be the ones to shoulder that burden. [03:27:16] So I just wanted to share that. Two, I don't agree in deferring this. I think that this has been a long time coming, like I said before. And frankly, with a lot of these, especially the resiliency side of it too, but also the climate goals themselves, we're already behind the curve. [03:27:36] And we're talking about deferring the plan further to then kick punts to another board to then not have budget discussions on this until probably FY26 or something like that, which to me is just kicking the can down the road, and we're, frankly, already behind. [03:27:55] So I'm not going to be supporting a deferral at this time, but I did want to allay some of the concerns about payment because, again, I agree that we should not be burdening the taxpayers necessarily with this. Make the day center industry pay for it. Thank you, Madam Chair. Next up on the motion to defer, Supervisor Franklin. [03:28:12] Sure. You know, I appreciate the fact that Supervisor Weir has a plan, at least in bones, that, and I love Supervisor Weir, I really do, but that no one has seen. No, he's been here for a little bit. [03:28:29] Look, I had this presentation to my office about, what, two, three weeks ago. And so I say that in the sense of we've had time, we've had time to present our ideas. We've had time to give our feedback. [03:28:46] So to ask for a deferral now, I just think that it's unnecessary. We've had enough time to do our work. Supervisor Weir. Just in response to Supervisor Bodie, I mean, I'd love for the data centers to pay it, but, you know, how much are they going to pay? [03:29:07] If they pay for that, are they going to pay for the schools? If they pay for that, are they going to pay to lower the real estate taxes? If they pay for that, are they not going to pay for other things? You know, it's a rather simplistic approach to it, sort of the problem I see that we're not looking at things in a comprehensive manner. [03:29:33] You can't just come up and come up and say, well, we'll have this industry pay for it and forget what you've already pledged their resources to. As to why I haven't put forward the alternate plan, it didn't seem to make much sense. [03:29:51] Why waste my time in making a complete? I've got a version that I could literally give you right now and email all of you. in its final form and if you want me if you want i can do it so we have a motion on the floor to defer seeing a further discussion please vote oh i'm sorry that was i've never done that okay we're [03:30:26] back to discussion i know that supervisor bailey wanted to say another thing on before we the csmp and i have another crack at it also would you like to go back to discussion supervisor bailey what do you want to say? I want to say, I want to say, I want to go back to, let me just, again, appreciate the work that the commissioners have done, because I think you've done Yonah's work, and I appreciate your communication with us in doing so, to make sure that you brought us along with the process, and you were very good at what you did, and so, just want to say that. Also, I want to say to AECOM, [03:31:02] I'm repeating myself, and to Julia for coming to our offices and explaining to us what this is to bring us along with the process. Not a surprise. Shouldn't have been a surprise to anybody. But if it was, it's OK. We should pick up the phone and call and ask you if we have some questions or if we're confused before we get up here on camera. [03:31:21] That's important. The next thing is, I'm going to go back to grants. Do you know how to write grants? Do you understand the grants that are needed for-- because that's what you told me. And so if you don't, we're in trouble. OK, but I think you know how to do that. [03:31:37] And I think when we talk about costs, That takes away from the burden on us as well. So we need to be big boys and girls and understand that because it's an opportunity for us to do that. [03:31:53] And I'm saying that to say we've got to embrace that as well as peripheral monies from, I think that the data centers has an ownership in this also, and we've got to go there. We definitely need to go there because we haven't gone there before now, but it's time. [03:32:10] So, with that, I think that you're on the right track. I think it's needed. I want to go back to just briefly. I'm going to shut up. I've got a few minutes. Just one more minute. Okay. Page 53 in your report, and you talked about the natural open space and requirements. [03:32:30] That was very key in reference to what Supervisor Lawson was saying as well, and you addressed that along with public works and the HOAs, and that's very key. So I appreciate you doing that as we go forward with the opportunities that we have in other areas. [03:32:49] Yeah, Bob, that's exactly what I mean, because that's important, because you did address it. And so if it means coming back and explaining to us, please do so. But thank you for that. That's all I got, Madam Chair. But the grants are key to this. There's money out there that we haven't captured, and we need to dig deep and get it. [03:33:08] Thank you, Supervisor Bailey. Supervisor Lawson, I have two check marks by your name. have you only I thought you've spoken twice yeah we're back to the original discussion and everybody's before the vote we're just going through you've spoken twice okay no no actually this is her second time supervisor angry hasn't spoken a second time and I haven't spoken a second time correct yes yeah the deferral vote was a different count um which um being big big kids [03:33:44] and big boys and girls I like that supervisor Bailey you know um you know I know uh you guys came to my office and presented this and you know uh and i love and i actually had the same exact phrase that supervisor brody vice chair brody had written down you know don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good um you know this is a first step and i'm sure this will change and i think somewhere oh adaptive management yes isn't that great because a lot of different um you know there might be better things coming up with ev charging there might be more grants that might be a better way to go that doesn't put a strain on our local tax system. And so, you know, I know that I have [03:34:20] complete faith in the Office of Sustainability and our county staff to figure out some of the things that we can go forward with. You know, I know that they do this for a living. So, and I will also say of having spent, you know, 15, 20 years in the energy industry, I can tell you that a lot of data centers, yes, they do do renewable energy and they're driving the renewable energy market in virginia and i think most people are aware of that so um you know i'm just grateful for all the work i'm grateful that we've actually started moving down the path in the right direction and uh seeing no further discussion because everyone's gone twice except for supervisor [03:34:55] anger who's not going to say another thing uh i will say please vote okay well thank you that moves us on to supervisor's time but before we begin we have um with the individual updates and i'm going to start to my right today we need to vote on two appointments can i get a motion for 10 a and 10 b please motion made by supervisor bailey seconded by supervisor franklin any [03:35:35] discussion seeing none please vote um and then on to actually 10 c which is referring our joint legislative meeting with our delegation um and where that's going to be located and the date and time for our counter change second motion made by supervisor bode seconded by supervisor bailey [03:36:13] any discussion seeing none please vote oh yes and i do have i actually have something in my notes i was going to bring up with regards to 10c and amending our board of county supervisors meeting calendar as we're all aware on the meeting calendar for december 12th is the digital gateway starting at 2 p.m i would like to suggest and ask for a vote that we start at that either at 9 or 10 a.m to make sure that the public isn't here in the middle of the night [03:36:49] I don't know whether 9 might be too early, 10 might be better, 10, okay, 10 a.m. You know, we do know it's going to be a long day. We do have three public hearings with people being able to speak three minutes each. [03:37:09] So there will always be a chance, I'm sure, for people to come out and speak as the hours go on. I can make a motion or someone else can make a motion to that effect. Madam Chair. Pardon me? I was just saying Madam Chair. Yeah, Supervisor. I appreciate you. Thinking outward on this and offering that, I don't have an issue with either time, to tell you the truth. [03:37:29] I know that's going to be a long day. So I think you've got 10 up there. Do you need a motion for 10? I believe, yeah, I need a motion. I'll make a motion. I usually don't make motions. Yes, actually, when waived, the rules of procedure are in the same motion. Correct, yes. [03:37:45] Thank you, Supervisor Weird. Motion made by Supervisor Engris, seconded by Supervisor Bailey. Discussion? Madam Chair. Bailey. Bailey, make the second. Yeah. Supervisor Weir, then Supervisor Vega. [03:38:05] I'm more than willing to go along with a 10 a.m. start, but in conjunction with a 10 a.m. start, I want a hard stop and a recess so that we're not here for, let's say we put a hard stop in at midnight or 2 a.m., because going beyond 14 or 16 hours in one go is not in anybody's best interest and certainly not in the county's interest or in the resident's interest to keep them here all night. [03:38:37] We can start it as early as you want, 8 o'clock for all I care, but I think we have to recognize that at some point in time there has to be a limit as to how long the meeting goes. Are you offering a substitute motion because we can discuss that in the legally event? [03:38:52] I would offer a substitute motion that we begin at 10 a.m., recess at midnight, to reconvene at a date to be determined. Okay. Before we get into discussion, Ms. Robill, can you talk about recesses and stuff that he was just talking about? [03:39:11] Madam Chair, members of the board, if you would like, I can provide you my legal advice in closed session with regards to the meeting. Oh, good idea. Okay. Can we add, well, how do we add that to our? It would be legal advice with regards to land use law, and it would be appropriate for closed session pursuant to 2.2-3711A8 of the Virginia Code. [03:39:32] So moved. Second. Can we vote on this in the middle of all this? Okay, fine. Motion made by Supervisor Brody. Okay. Yeah, he's got, okay, withdraw your motion. We'll withdraw the other motions. [03:39:49] And so, yeah, he withdrew his amended motion. And do you want to withdraw your motion? Okay. It was a substitute. I used the word amended. [03:40:08] You're right. We'll withdraw my motion. Thank you for that point of order, sir. So we do have a motion to certify on the floor. Okay. [03:40:42] No, this is for talking about it in closed session before we vote. Okay, thank you. [03:40:59] We'll talk about it in closed session. We'll come back and vote on that after closed session. Okay, Supervisor Vega, I was going to start to my right. Yeah. Right, and I had a question about that one. [03:41:16] We did approve it, but do you have a question? Right, because he asked, and then he made a substitute motion, but I was still in queue. But I just want to say I'm not opposed to it so long as we do not restrict people's ability to address the board. Correct. So they'll still have their same three minutes. Okay. [03:41:32] But I don't think we actually voted on 10C. Oh, yes, the legislative. Yeah, the legislative. Okay, sorry. Okay. [03:41:49] I'm not sure that people will have a chance to, it's a meeting with our school system and our legislative. I don't think there's any public comment time during that breakfast meeting. Is that what you're asking? The other thing. Okay. A few. Okay. Okay. So now we come to individual times. [03:42:07] If you don't mind, I'll start to my right. Sure. Thank you, Madam Chair. Just a few items here. I attended the Community Service Board Revive Training. If you have not taken it, it is available for the public to partake in it. It's great training, and I commend the folks that are putting it on for the community. [03:42:24] You don't have to pay. It's completely free. It just teaches you the ability to be able to detect who might be having an overdose and how to take action and how to use narcan which can be very helpful not just for the individual experiencing the crises but also to public safety also the annual coals district winter coat drive is in effect if you know of a child in need of a warm jacket to this winter season please reach out to our office so that we can get all pertaining information to ensure that we get that child [03:42:56] a coat for these um uh cold days that lie ahead and uh lastly um uh mr shorter i don't know if you've received um this email but it was brought to my attention that um the dmv is placing a hold on um i'm sorry a lock on vehicle registrations if they take advantage of the delay of um you know paying their personal property tax bills at a later time and i would like um for something to be done about this immediately because folks need to take care of things and if we allowed for a [03:43:33] delay in payment then we got to work in conjunction with sure so we are going to send and we're going to send a message out to the entire board actually supervisor we reached out to me a bit earlier today and michelle atria and i had a chance to talk with him about it we are going to follow with the DMV and then send an email to the entire board. [03:43:56] I understand from Michelle that typically when a hold is placed, it's because of a prior year delinquency, not current year. And so if that is still the case, and I want to make sure that we're verified, then we will send that out to the board with information to refer residents to, vehicle owners to. [03:44:18] Okay. And I assume that we can then send that as a response to whatever emails we continue to receive? Perfect. And I meant to ask you during executive time, but I forgot, so thank you. That's all I have, Madam Chair. Thank you. Supervisor Angry? Thanks. I've got a list here. [03:44:34] First, we're going to get Lorna Wallin reappointed back to the IDEA. Okay, we got it. Yeah, I have information. So tomorrow evening, salute to the Armed Forces, Prince William Chamber of Commerce. That is from 11 to 2 at Heritage Hunt Golf and Country Club. [03:44:52] So if you can make that, that would be great. Go to the Chamber site, sign up for it. I think there's still tickets. The ARC is doing a trunk-a-treat tomorrow night from 5 to 7, and that's at the ARC off of 13505 Hillendill Drive next to Fire Station 13. I want to thank Pickens, Park Valley Church, and Prince William Parks and Rec for sponsoring that event. [03:45:12] Great Big Kid event tomorrow night, Wednesday, 25 October from 6 to 7 p.m., 9501 Dean Park Lane in Manassas. Even if you can't attend, great organization to donate to, so I hope you can contribute. My colleague is going to talk about the Route 1 widening, so I'm going to leave that to you, okay? [03:45:31] Patriot High School is on their annual First Responders Day, so I got to go to that. Okay, that's Friday morning from 8.30 to 10 o'clock at Patriot High School. This is a special one here, Missing in America Project. [03:45:47] So Friday, 27 October, from 1 to 3 p.m., Quantico National Cemetery is going to be cremating, I think it's 25 veterans and three family members, if I'm not mistaken. But you can go to their Facebook page at Missing in America Project Virginia. [03:46:04] And so they find these veterans missing, and they have an entire burial or cemetery burial process for them. So I'd like to see as many people there as I can. That'd be great. I will be there as well. And Life Church having the 30th annual gala, and that's going to be the 27th of October. [03:46:21] I think that's Saturday from 7 to 11. garfield is having their garfield high school is having their howl o'ween trunk or treat that saturday morning uh so that was friday night for life church this is going to be saturday morning saturday from 10 to 2 at garfield high school uh we will be having our neapsco district dumpster and shred day uh pretty much same time from 10 to 2 that's going to be at neapsco baptist church that's 15545 cardinal drive so if you got some junk you want to get rid of bring it on over uh Lifting Others Up, their second annual performing arts scale is going to be Saturday, October 28th from 6 to 10 at Hilton Performing Arts Center. [03:47:01] We have annual Steps to Pathway Breakfast, November 1st. That's Wednesday from 8.30 to 10.30. And then Employee Connections Expo. And that's going to be November 1st, Wednesday, from 11 to 4 p.m., One County Complex. [03:47:17] Boxes of Basics Ribbon Cutting is 2 November Thursday, 4 to 5 p.m., 9-2-3-9 Mike Garcia Drive in Manassas. And then that final two, Veterans Day Parade or Veterans Parade is going to be 4 November. That's a Saturday from 11 to 1 p.m. at the corner of Prescott Avenue in Manassas. [03:47:35] And then last, but certainly not least, Willing Warriors Gala is going to be 4 November. That's a Saturday from 5 to 10 p.m. at 44050 Woodbridge, Virginia, 2-2-1-9-1. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Supervisor Angry. [03:47:51] Supervisor Weir. pass supervisor lawson thank you madam chair a couple things i want to announce uh wednesday night november 1st at the noakesville fire station in noakesville so that's station 5 beginning at 6 30 our prince william county transportation department will host a meeting regarding the intersection of aden and fleetwood and i will be there as well this is an intersection that has been very challenging in the last 10 years or so. [03:48:30] A lot of commuters from our neighboring jurisdictions that have been using that road ever since Quantico closed a road that used to be a cut-through. So I don't know if I should be tipping my hand and telling you what transportation is going to propose, so I'll leave it up to them. [03:48:52] But I think you're going to like it. That's all I'll say. So, again, that is, let's see, it's Wednesday, November 1st at the Noakesville Fire Station on Marsteller Drive, and it begins at 6.30 p.m. And then something fun for you all to do would be the Spirits of Brentsville's Haunted History this Saturday, October 28th, and hourly tours from 7 to 10. [03:49:21] Advanced ticket purchases, required tours, leave every 20 minutes. And I'm hoping that the forecast looks good. Does anybody know off the top of their head? Let's see. As of right now, my phone forecast looks like it's going, oh, wow, it's going to be warm in the low 80s. [03:49:40] So it will be a fun night if you like haunted trails. Anyway, that's all I have. Thank you very much. Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair. Just a few quick things from me. First, wanted to thank everyone that came out to Barktoberfest alongside the Chin Park Fall Festival this past Saturday. [03:50:04] Really great time. Both my staff and everyone who attended this past Saturday thinks it's a much better arrangement than we had last year when we just sort of went on it alone. So really looking forward to that in the coming years and want to thank all our vendors that volunteered and stood up their kiosk during the event. [03:50:24] We got quite a few animals adopted again this year. My chief of staff also adopted an animal, so leading by example there. So it was a really great event. Really appreciate Canine Gunner Dog Park folks, all the other folks that came out there. There was also a petting zoo, so there was a really great family fun event, so I wanted to thank everyone for that. [03:50:44] Also, this past week on Friday, I had a chance to reapprise my role as Sachala or Black Panther at the Lakeridge Elementary School Fun Run. Always a great opportunity to hang out with and participate in the fun run alongside our Lakeridge Elementary School families. [03:51:01] So I wanted to thank the PTO there for inviting me out to that. That's it for me for the past. Looking forward to the next couple weeks. Obviously, as a PSA, November 7th is Election Day. So please get out and vote. [03:51:17] And we do have early voting going on at different early voting locations throughout the county. We also have the two coming up Saturdays for early voting, so please get out and participate in the franchise of voting. And the last thing I have, you know, we had a very robust discussion about the CSMP this afternoon, had a lot of folks express a lot of concerns. [03:51:39] We had some folks express desires to see more. We also had some of our commissioners express a need to see us move forward with various things on that. So without objection, I would like to direct the county executive to provide recommendations defining what comes next, implementing strategies of the CSMP and next steps surrounding that. [03:52:01] Madam Chair. Thank you. Supervisor Vega. Is that, is a directive necessary? I thought that staff, I mean, I'm just, is a directive, isn't that already the plan? Why do we need the county executive to do that? If I could, Madam Chair. Supervisor Brody. [03:52:16] And I appreciate that question because there were resolutions that were passed by the sustainability commission that we didn't really look at as part of our adoption of the CSMP. And frankly, there's also the fast track recommendations that I made that the board adopted. [03:52:33] So there's a lot of things that we passed. And so this directive is to have the counties that go begin to organize and prioritize those things as opposed to just being sort of an amorphous mass of things that have been passed and given to the board. especially the sustainability commission resolutions that i know that we didn't really talk about okay sounds good is that it okay supervisor bailey thank you madam chair um good afternoon it is still afternoon almost evening to everyone october 21st i participate in the streetlight outreach ministries baby drop off and i was it was wonderful seeing the support [03:53:13] that was coming in from the community on October 23rd thanks to our CEO and president of our chamber Mr. Bob Sweeney we did a podcast with him and it was absolutely a wonderful podcast where he talked about the vision for our county and his excitement about being here working with the board of county supervisors as well as our new county exec upcoming events I'm looking forward to standing up, excuse me, attending the Quantico and Prince William County Elevate Job Fair tomorrow with our own Christina Wynn, and it'll be hosted by her department with the Marine Corps [03:53:52] at the Marine Corps Museum, so that should be fun. And without further ado, my last piece is to I want to thank the intentional movement that we've had by Elijah Johnson and his department and our executive director, Lisa Major, and as it relates to the CRC and for the collaboration that they've given us in moving this project forward. [03:54:16] And so I want to give a directive to our county exec to talk to them, to help them to establish a CRC advisory committee here in Prince William County as it relates to the CRC. And the purpose of that is to provide guidance in the community with stakeholders and partners, with feedback around the community for the needs that will have to be in the CRC, and there are vast needs that need to be addressed as we stand up that wonderful edifice. [03:54:48] And so we need a committee. I've talked to Lisa and Elijah, and they would like to see us have a committee to make sure that we're encompassing everything that's addressing mental health in that way. and so um just wanted to give you a directive to do that to proceed with that as a crc advisory committee and elijah and lisa has i've sent it to all of my board members and they have what they'd like to see in that committee so without any objections madam chair supervisor vega thank you um i saw the notification come up and we got this at 321 and i assume that that's [03:55:26] when all of us got it and so I was doing my very best to try to read it um I do have um an issue in the members clause it says committee chair will work with CSB executive director and the CXO office to select committee members to ensure community and diversified representation um you know I would prefer that we as as supervisors appoint the folks that we want to be on this committee okay am i yeah it's not a commission it's just a committee to help them stand up the crc and then afterwards if we want to have a commission they'll come back to us [03:56:05] and make the recommendation in terms of the commission it's an advisory but will those selected individuals remain or do then we get to a point then we get the opportunity to appoint who i think i would feel much more comfortable if that language was included okay and i and i can get Lisa to change that for you. Absolutely. I'm going to jump in and say I'm not sure we should start a whole other commission. Right, but I just want to make sure that, you know, the people that we select, that it is, in fact, diversifying, if you will. Diverse. Oh, I'm sorry. Were you [03:56:42] going to say something, Connie? May I? This is in reference to subject matter experts rather than community advocates on the commission these are the subject matter experts that Lisa wants to work with in terms of standing up the Gander Marlin building and what's needed inside of there so you know we're talking about the therapist we're talking about you know pharmacists those types of things as it relates to standing up not advocate I see I'm just trying to read it as you're as [03:57:14] explaining it um but i see here you you know csb representatives pwcs board members and i can just get her to change it uh supervisor vega because i told her to just get something to me in writing so we would have something the county attorney says she would like a copy absolutely absolutely but i agree with the chair for not sending it to you it's just a committee okay so where do we stand with that as it currently stands i understand the directive uh if i understand [03:57:49] supervisor vegas question it would uh it would be a commission in a separate matter but if it is the committee as it is currently described this is more of a technical advisory group uh and it if that is the case in the board's desire then i will move forward and certainly bring back to the collective board my recommendation for what that committee uh should look like in terms of composition madam chair supervisor i actually don't think it's necessary uh chris because i'm not proposing that we create a new commission um if if if it's just going to be um the way that it [03:58:26] was just described it's it's fine so just disregard my initial request thank you okay thank you for your comment um okay okay is that it yeah okay thank you thank you supervisor franklin sure um just very quickly on saturday this past saturday october 21st i hosted the second annual community Family Fun Day at Veterans Park. We had over 400 community members, including children and their parents, that came out to celebrate with us and enjoy music, food, and games. I want to thank everyone who attended and all of our volunteers. We had food trucks, a gaming truck, a bounce house, [03:59:06] and I can tell you that we were expecting about 100 people, and then 400 people showed up. But don't worry, we were able to feed everyone, we were able to accommodate everyone, and so we had a great time and looking forward to the next one upcoming events on October 26 this Thursday we have a ribbon cutting for the widening of Route 1 from Featherstone to Mary's Way and then on Thursday November 9th from 7 to 9 p.m. I'll be co-hosting alongside the Woodbridge Potomac Civic Association the Woodbridge International Festival it will be hosted in the Frollozzo building in the [03:59:44] atrium, and we will have authentic cuisine, song, dance, and poetry from the countries of Bolivia, Ghana, Nepal, El Salvador, Egypt, Scotland, Afghanistan, and other cultures and countries. So I'm hoping my colleagues will at least stop by. I think it'll be a great event. It is free to the public, and I'm hoping you all can come out and you can join or go to our website for more information. And then lastly, I heard too, Roger Vega, mention about the issue with the property taxes and the linkage to those getting services at the DMV. Thank you for bringing that up. I think [04:00:17] we all received some questions about that, and I know Michelle Attried, I believe, is following up with the DMV to kind of figure out what the disconnect is there. So thank you for bringing that up, and to those listening, we are aware, and we are looking to resolve that, because I don't think we've seen that before. So thank you. Thank you, Supervisor Franklin. I'll just end up with And last Thursday, along with Supervisor Angry, got to attend the 2023 John Jenkins Good Scout Award dinner, which was wonderful, presented to members of our community who in their daily lives exemplify the ideals of the Boy Scouts of America as expressed in the Scout Oath. [04:00:55] So congratulations to Joellen Benson, David Brickley, and Mark Olson. On Saturday evening, the 21st, my office attended the 6th Annual Bill Mayer Banquet hosted by the Cooperative Council of Ministries. They've been having that dinner for a lot of years. The banquet benefits the Bill Mayer Drop-In Center for the Homeless, which provides services for homeless members of our community. [04:01:17] I know it was a wonderful, well-attended night, so thank you to the CCOM. With that, we can go into closed session, and we will report out in a while. Okay. Sure, 10-minute recess. We'll come back to closed session at 525 in our regular room. [04:01:39] Good evening. [04:01:56] We are now back from closed session. we have i can i get a motion to certify so move madam second motion made by supervisor bailey seconded by vice chair rody any discussion seeing none please vote we have two items to report to and report on and then take an action the first one is supervisor body yeah thank you madam chair i move that we appoint mandy spina to be the development services director second motion made by vice chair body seconded by vice supervisor bailey any discussion seeing none please vote [04:02:34] Yeah. Do you want to invite her up? Sure. Sure. Thank you, Madam Chair and board. I will say, as Mandy stands to say a few words, as acting director, Mandy has really presented herself as a real leader in this county. But certainly prior to being named acting director, Mandy has made a real difference in this community and so this is not an introduction to this community just an [04:03:14] introduction as director of development services. I have had the privilege really of working with Mandy over the last few months in my coming to Prince William County and it really gives me great pleasure to be able to introduce her as the newest director here in the county. Welcome. [04:03:33] Thank you. Madam Chair, members of the board, thank you. Madam Chair, members of the board, County Executive Shorter, thank you for your vote of confidence. I am really excited for the chance to be the director of the department that grew me as a leader. So I think this is going to be a really awesome next step for development services. And thank you for your vote of confidence. I appreciate it. Well, thank you. Congratulations for seeing more of you. Thank you very much. [04:04:00] Okay. That moves on to our second item. Who's reporting out? Supervisor Angry. Thank you, Madam Chair. Madam Chair, I make a motion that we accept the internal audit reports on procurement and physical security assessment. Second. [04:04:16] Motion made by Supervisor Angry, seconded by Supervisor Bailey. Any further discussion? Seeing none, please vote. And then we go back to my idea of having a 10 a.m. start on December 12th versus 2 o'clock. [04:04:34] we need to waive the rules of procedure and do that supervisor angry i'll turn it over to you thank you madam chair i'll go back to my original motion waiving the rules of procedure to add the december 12th meeting starting at 10 a.m here second motion made by supervisor angry seconded by supervisor bailey any discussion seeing none please vote okay well i think that does it for closed session and our finishing up our afternoon session it's currently 10 of 7 we will be back [04:05:13] for our evening session at 7.30. Thank you. Good evening. Welcome back to the board chambers. It's now 7.30 p.m. and we're going to begin our evening session with something that we passed earlier, which is observing some special guests here with us tonight. We have individuals here [04:05:52] representing Boy Scout Troop 1396, the National Capital Area Council. If you can join myself and Supervisor Bode or Vice Chair Bode is going to read the commendations. Thank you. [04:06:29] there's plenty of them here for everyone okay yes but you only have to read one are you sure all right everyone ready all right okay oh and the picture oh yes the picture's up yeah is do we have just one picture okay all right commendation boy scouts of america troop 1396 national capital area council whereas the prince william border county supervisors wishes to [04:07:04] recognize and commend outstanding contributions to the community and whereas boy scouts of america Troop 1396 has demonstrated an exemplary commitment to community service within Prince William County, and whereas during the past summer, Boy Scouts of America Troop 1396 undertook the commendable task of watering and caring for 45 trees located around the new bridge of the Ococon Greenway off of Hedges Run, and whereas the care and maintenance of these trees significantly contributed to the beautification and ecological health of Prince William County, [04:07:40] and whereas, this is the last whereas, the dedication, hard work, and community spirit demonstrated by Boy Scouts of America Troop 1396 in this endeavor exemplify the values and principles that are the foundation of the Boy Scouts of America organization. Now, therefore, be it resolved that the Prince William Board of County Supervisors hereby duly commends and honors Boy Scouts of America Troop 1396 in recognition of their outstanding commitment to environmental stewardship, their service to the community, and the positive impact they have on Prince William County. [04:08:14] Congratulations, boys. Would any gentlemen like to say a few words? One of the boys? All right, well, thank you, team. We really appreciate it. [04:08:29] This was a wonderful opportunity to be out and about and to appreciate the Acaquon Greenway. How many trees did we all care for? Forty-five. Forty-five, some trees, right? And how many times did we go out? It was quite a few, right? It was like more than five, I believe. [04:08:44] It was like five trees. It was 17 times, so definitely more than five. It was pretty hot during some of the doldrums of the summer, so we kind of helped keep those trees alive. So we always did a lot of work. It's kind of a tall bridge, and so how did we get the water up there? There was a – we had buckets, and we had ropes, and we created a pulley system. [04:09:03] So anyways, we're really pleased for the Aquaconda Greenway. Thank you so much, team, for the opportunity to have the scouts here and to recognize their hard work. We appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you. [04:09:14] Okay. [04:11:16] Well, that's the nice part of the job. Tonight, we have a consolidated agenda, and we have six consolidated public hearings, and there are six items. There are no presentations at the moment associated with these items. We can ask questions if we need to after. But I will begin by opening the public hearings on items 12A through 12F. [04:11:37] And I see that we have three people signed up for 12C. We'll begin by calling those people. I'll just call all three, and then if other people want to speak in other hearings, they're welcome to do so. um al havrilla latonic hall and lawrence pemberton and at the beginning of your marks you'll have three minutes if you could just generally if you could state your name and generally where you live in the county or your magisterial district and there will be a timer if you haven't been here [04:12:07] before up on the screen so please proceed welcome may i begin may i okay just make sure you speak into the microphone good evening my name is al havrilla i live in a one of the housing areas on the corner of sprigs and minneville and we take a consensus of a few of the other homeowners and we decided that we do not think another car wash at the corner of sprigs and minneville is a good idea i've got a the traffic congestion there is horrible right now because of all the new housing [04:12:46] developments that's been going there if you'd like to see i brought a picture of some some of the traffic but from sprigs and minneville up past to the school sometimes in the morning you can't get out because of all the cars that are going through there and in the evening when everybody's picking up the kids from school it's the same way and in addition to that there's some other homeowners that are parking on luther allen and bel air estates that don't live there but they're walking their kids over to the schools okay so from a personal view i'd like to say [04:13:23] let's stop with all the development going on here in prince william county or at least in this area you build all these new houses across the street are they building any more water treatment plants are you building any water towers um what about landfill is there going to be another landfill coming so we can take all our trash this isn't an iterative process but you have three minutes to express your opinion no i think i'm i'm done um but if you'd like i'd like to maybe show you some of the disinformation. [04:13:59] Have you done a traffic study there to see what it's like at all? We can probably address that after we finish public hearing. Okay, now there are other car washes in the area. I have no, like on Dell Boulevard, there's one on Hoadley, you know, Route 1, you know, Miniville. [04:14:21] So there's plenty of car washes. And maybe the lot closer to 123, was it 123 or 234, by the CVS and All-American Steakhouse, maybe there's a better place for it down there because it's, you know, larger, okay? [04:14:41] It's really all I have. Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Next speaker, please. My name is LaTanya Hall. I also live in the Bel Air Estates in Woodbridge, Virginia. [04:14:59] And just to echo what Al just said, the traffic, I'm in and out going to work. And there's two entrances where we live. Both entrances are always backed up because there's two schools across the street from us. [04:15:17] Then there's two schools down the street. Then there's a grocery store. Then there's all the new homes that they built. And nobody has considered routing of the road, adding infrastructure to the road for all the increasing homes that they're building in the area. [04:15:38] Then on top of that, a car wash would just create an impossible route for us to get out of the neighborhood when we need to. We already have to wait five minutes just for traffic and the schools and the grocery store. [04:15:56] So it's just an impossible situation to add a car wash. Thank you for listening. Thank you. Next speaker, please. I am Lawrence Pemberton. I live on Southgate Court in Dale City, just a few blocks away from Spreeks and Minerville. [04:16:19] I'm opposed to the car wash. Just the traffic to get into the shopping center. You want to go into the shopping center to buy something. It's a one-way in and a one-way out, a different way. [04:16:37] And it's really difficult getting in and out. And I just feel adding a car wash there will add more congestion to the current traffic that's there. So, therefore, I'm totally opposed to a car wash at that corner. [04:16:57] Thank you for listening. Thank you. Is there someone else who would like to speak on item 12C or any of the public hearings? No, no, no worries. No worries. You can just approach the microphone in the back. [04:17:13] Just please state your name and generally where you live in the county. Again, I apologize when I signed up earlier. My name is Terrence Davenport, and I, too, reside in that area off of Minerville Road in the estates of Winding Creek. To reinforce what the ladies and gentlemen said earlier, there are exactly 23 existing car washes within 10 miles of the proposed site. [04:17:39] 23 already existing car washes. That alone should tell you we don't need any other. That alone. In addition to that, if you do a study about the effects of car washes on the environment, and I heard earlier today several of you talk about Prince William County's environment, how you'd like to preserve it, car washes deteriorate our water resources. [04:18:05] This water has to go somewhere. The area where the proposed site for the car wash is well known for its above-ground and below-ground waterway streams that are feeding to our local waterways, and the greater rivers, if you will, and streams, to include the Chesapeake watershed, to include that. [04:18:29] We don't need any more contaminated water affecting Prince William County's waterways, including the water that we drink. We just don't need it. I humbly request that you consider that before you take your vote. Thank you. [04:18:45] Thank you. Next speaker, please. Hi, my name is Franshell Beach, and I also live in the surrounding neighborhoods where this car wash is being proposed. And to echo fellow neighbors, it's not a really good idea. It's not a good location for the car wash. [04:19:01] And the car wash itself, we've seen that particular one on Route 1 and not even the conduciveness of it, but devaluing the area with the car wash and the safety of it all. So I think those things need to be considered in a very high-volume residential area that's not being taken into consideration. [04:19:23] As one of the gentlemen referenced, there are several vacant spots in the surrounding areas that's not close to all of these developments that should be considered. So, my husband and I emphatically oppose building the car wash there as well. [04:19:42] Thank you. Next speaker, please. Three Cements, the Potomac District. I haven't gotten involved in what has been going on because I'm just fed up with what I've seen people do. But everything that these citizens are saying is correct. [04:20:01] That is a horrible area for a car wash. And it's not safe as it is we're having to fight to get in to go shopping, fight to get out. So car wash, no. And I tell you what, we had a great car wash in Tackett's Mill. [04:20:19] It went out of business during COVID. They were great. I haven't enjoyed another car wash since. But I'm telling you, this is a lousy place. And for you people that are here now, please stay alert. See what's going on. Please. [04:20:36] I only got up to speak because you're here. I would have just let it pass. No, this is wrong. This is wrong, the wrong area. Did any of you go to see the area? Did you actually go see it to see what's happening? No, you didn't, did you? [04:20:52] You didn't. You just worked with the people that are building it. Yes, I have a bad attitude, but it's justified. My attitude is justified. I've been around since the 2000s. I've seen what's going on, and it's hurt me to see what's been going on. So I want to thank the people that are here. [04:21:10] I don't know if you're going to make out, because just good luck. Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. Hello, my name is Anita Bjornak. I also live at Bellaire Estates Place. I've lived there since 2007, at which time the entrance to Food Lion was an entrance and an exit. [04:21:33] They have since closed it. Anyone going to the shopping center, including the proposed car wash, goes directly through our neighborhood to exit. I have a terrible time going in and going out. It's unsafe for the children that reside there. [04:21:49] We are single-family homes. There's more and more children moving in. It's a safety issue. we do not need a car wash, so I am in opposition. Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. Hello, my name is Eric Beach, and I live in the surrounding area as well. A couple of things I'd like to bring to attention that may not have been said. I grew up in D.C., and around the car wash community, it brings crime, and we have a lot of, you know, well-established homes, and that's something that hasn't been said, but I just wanted to bring that to your attention that some of these [04:22:24] car washers even ones out here it brings an element that the homeowners would it would devalue their homes um and if you look on silverdale that is they're building this big tractor store which also will cause more traffic so with that on one end and the car wash on the other end it's going to be unbelievable traffic that you i mean rush hour traffic now is really bad as it is so you think if you continue to build in that area it's going to be unbearable to get around as the people has said already. So thank you for your time. Thank you. Is there anyone else in chambers who [04:23:02] would like to speak on 12C? Most people have spoken on 12C or anyone, any of the other public hearings that are currently open? No? Seeing no one approach the microphone, this will close the hearings on 12A through F. I assume Ms. Madden, we don't have anyone online. Okay, no one's online for the public hearing. Okay, thank you. We'll close our public hearings. I want to give the applicant a chance to I guess mainly specifically 12c and see if the board had any questions I know you don't necessarily have a presentation or if you could talk about traffic flow absolutely and [04:23:40] I do I don't need to show my sorry my name is Jonel Cameron for the record with Walsh Colucci here on behalf of the applicant edge express I don't necessarily want to go through my entire presentation but I do think I have a slide that helps speak to transportation and the concerns that were raised specifically on access if you can go to yes that's perfect so this property is [04:24:14] specifically part of a shopping center that was always planned to have a use on both this pad site and there is still a vacant pad site to the rear here and so when the project was originally developed it included additional traffic and trips at this intersection this is actually considered a pass-by trip. So essentially what that means is people are already on the road and they're passing through when they're out going grocery shopping or they are out dropping their kids off at daycare. The use, I also heard that there were concerns about traffic during the [04:24:52] school hours. The peak actually is off-peak hours. So the peak here is not during your normal school hours but on Saturday and Sundays. A traffic impact analysis was not needed for this specific site because the trip generation is so low it's under the threshold of trips so during the a.m peak hour the maximum trips are 49 and that's essentially in and out and 78 p.m peak hour trips again in and out from the site at the planning commission somebody did a planning commissioner [04:25:31] did request that at site plan we work with county transportation to help with any additional signage that may be needed for access and the access into the site there's a full access here on sprigs into the site and then this access here is right in right out at one point in time when the shopping center was constructed this access point was closed and so there was an agreement [04:26:05] that was made where this access point that was a full access would turn into right in only that was a specific request by county transportation and so this is actually a little bit wider than your normal travel lane for write-in only and we will work with county transportation at the time of site plan to add additional signage to make that clear if county transportation deems that necessary and i can answer any questions the board members may have i'm sorry i think there [04:26:41] was a specific question i didn't answer on the environment so i just wanted to address that really quickly. This car wash building will be designed as an express tunnel car wash system, which reduces the environmental impacts because it has recycling capabilities and it utilizes the tunnel's water reclaim system. So 75% to 90% of the water here is reclaimed. All of the water and any of the chemicals from your car are actually captured on site. There is an oil separator within the facility so the oil goes into one area within that facility and then [04:27:19] that oil is picked up by a company so it does not pollute our water it is actually more environmentally friendly to use a car wash specifically this design car wash than it is to wash your car at home and now i can answer any questions the board members may have i have a quick one but supervisor vega you want to start yes thank you madam chair i just like to thank the folks that came out. I did just receive one email, Jonel, and you kind of talked a little bit about the environment. It was specific to drainage of the water and the chemicals going into public waterways, but I believe that you've addressed that. Listening to some of the complaints here [04:27:55] about additional car washes, can you talk a little bit about that? I've been told that there are already 11 car washes within a five and a half mile radius. Is this true? I'm going to have Luke murray come up with edge express he is the car wash owner and does the market research so we did as luke murray as she said with edge express good to see y'all again um there are [04:28:29] within a 10 mile radius uh four express tunnel car washes uh within a three mile radius there are only two very small rundown gas station car washes which is totally different from what we do they don't have reclamation systems their water usage is far above i'm sorry you have to please okay thank you and i mean i can i'm happy to prestige car wash is 3.8 miles away [04:29:04] white horse is 5.7 miles away flagship is 3.8 miles away and then edge express which is us is 6.7 miles away in Dumfries. Thank you. I had a quick question. Someone said that all the traffic from the facility goes through their neighborhood. I don't think that is accurate. So Spriggs Road is here, and there's a main access point here. If there are people that live in the community here [04:29:44] to get to that grocery store or to the shopping center, so this area in here, they can use this here but that's the only access point that i see on county map or an aerial that allows for people to use this neighborhood the rest of this is actually sprigs road i apologize it's not an iterative process where we hear from people i'm so sorry and this is an overview that shows that neighborhood a little bit better so if what they're saying is if you're here in order to get [04:30:21] to the shopping center you come down here and then use sprigs but the only access again this is county mapper and aerial this is sprigs road here and there's this side road here that also accesses that shopping center so just at a just in terms of uses i mean there are two pad sites there that have been planned to go with this development that will be developed one way or another correct um what are other uses that might be used there in for example i mean is there you [04:30:56] can do a retail store here there can be a convenience store here there can be quick service restaurants at this location here there can be an office there can be a daycare i can read the entire list if you want it but there could be a vape shop those all fall within the retail sections or sectors there could be an auto zone at this location here i guess i guess my point being not knowing all that whole list but that something will go in those two pad sites no matter what correct and one thing i don't have an entire presentation but getting to that the landscaping [04:31:31] that is currently proffered for this property is actually subpar so it's less landscaping than what is required today under the zoning ordinance and what we have agreed to as part of this process is to significantly add additional landscaping and plant units both along sprigs road and on minneville as well uh supervisor bode then supervisor franklin thank you thank you janelle thank you the applicant um from the staff perspective were there any things that staff saw in their analysis i looked at the staff report quickly i didn't see too much there in terms of weaknesses or concerns but just wanted to hear it from staff you know a lot was sort of expressed [04:32:11] by constituents during the public hearing about especially traffic concerns and this overall area And it sounds to me like there's existing issues already when it comes to the schools, other usages in this general area. And obviously, it's not on the onus of this applicant to fix those. [04:32:29] But in terms of how this may add to an already concerning situation, just want to hear it from staff directly on what they saw and how these folks may have some of their concerns alleviated. Good evening, Madam Chair, members of the board. My name is Bryce Barrett with the Department of Transportation. [04:32:47] So as Janelle said, we looked at this site during the early application phases and we did an analysis, we did a traffic deferral impact, or traffic impact analysis deferral for this. Based on the ITE trips for this type of use, it falls underneath the traditional trip load that we would consider. [04:33:08] When we're looking at those deferral forms, we're looking at the trips that are being generated to the site and we're also looking at the road network or if there's anything that we see as potentially being a problem that we could mitigate through a further study. This intersection, it is a mature intersection, so it's built out to comp plan standards. [04:33:29] The access point that the use is proposed to utilize is an existing access point within the shopping center. So based on that preliminary analysis and summary and the trips generated for the site, we found that a TIA wouldn't be needed for this and that we likely wouldn't have any recommendations that came from it that would substantially change the application. [04:33:55] And so speaking to the other point that Janelle mentioned a little bit, typically car washes are pass-by trips or internal capture trips. So we don't typically see a vast increase in the number of traffic that's already on those roadways. We see people who are seeing, oh, there's a car wash, maybe it rained, maybe the snow plow came through, and they want to go in and wash the salt off their car, you know, maybe do a quick detail on the way home, or as the peak that they said on a Saturday weekend trip, go there and get your car detailed. [04:34:26] And if I could, Madam Chair, as a follow-up to that, I know that in some of these situations with especially these shopping, there's that sort of mix of usage, you know, you have a school up there, you have shopping there, and then you have this proposed car wash. Folks, to the point earlier on signage and things like that, could have queuing that occurs that you have folks that are waiting for the car wash, which might disrupt people who are trying to get into the food line, may disrupt people that are in the neighborhood trying to get up to Goddard School. [04:34:53] Did you work through with the applicant and, frankly, with the existing businesses there on any sort of traffic management plan or anything like that to help deal with that at all? So we didn't articulate a traffic management plan as part of this. The primary access into the site is the easternmost, so it's the closest to Minnieville Road. [04:35:13] In order for stacking to really disrupt the primary use, which is the food line, it would have to stack past the stacking that's provided on site and then all the way back through the travel way to get to the Staple Mills Plaza, which would be a pretty extreme line in that situation. [04:35:33] So we weren't really too concerned about stacking, flowing outside the site, and disrupting the existing uses in this situation. Okay. Thank you. Supervisor Franklin? Sure. A couple of questions. Actually, since we're talking about traffic, I'll just kind of start there. [04:35:52] And I will say that I know that there are some scenarios where having some type of analysis is probably not warranted because the trips are so small. But I think for transparency purposes, it's probably always a good idea to do a traffic analysis. [04:36:08] So just kind of, first of all, putting that out there. I live up the street from the edge that's in Dumfries. Obviously, I live in Woodbridge, but, you know, we share addresses. And I'll be honest, there's not a lot of traffic that's been impacted on Route 1 that I've seen. [04:36:26] So I will say the edge has done that well. And part of it is because I think the way it's structured by which it's basically going into the lot as opposed to off. Now, Whitehorse has a lot of traffic on Route 1 that can get backed up. [04:36:46] So there's a good way of doing it and a bad way. I will say Edge has done it well in terms of Route 1. I drive past there every single day. I've never noticed any traffic flowing onto Route 1 from there, so that's good. But what I want some clarity on, and I know you guys have already pointed this out, but just clarity, where is the entrance going to be? [04:37:04] Is it Miniville or is it Spriggs? And then is the layout similar to what it will be to the Dumfries location, or is it different? It's actually better because it's bigger than the Dumfries location. And so there are three access points to actually get into the shopping center. [04:37:21] so you can access from miniville road you can access from the write-in on sprigs or you can access from the full access on sprigs okay once you are on the site you enter through here you come all the way around you enter through here you come all the way around and there are two ordering points so they have license plate recognition so if you have a membership it already knows your license plate it knows what car you want the gate opens you don't have a membership you type in what you want you swipe your card the gate opens you then go through the [04:37:59] tunnel in this area in here you can decide that you want to vacuum your cars you vacuum here and here or you decide that you don't need to vacuum your cars and then you exit through here understood and then I guess my other question would be if if we find that moving forward there is some some challenges with the traffic mitigation this is more so to county staff what resources do we have once this is already done if anything richard wineman you i'll have county transportation answer but in my experience it's been richard wineman who's the county transportation chief [04:38:38] of safety and they will come on site and work with you for transportation related a lot of times it's stacking so during covid a lot of the drive-throughs had stacking issues and we worked with richard wineman to help with the transportation and he would say okay you're queuing your stacking this way and i think it would be better if you queue it this way to add more traffic but go ahead traffic mitigation yeah exactly and i have already made richard aware of this because we did discuss this in some detail during the planning commission hearing as well so he is aware of this [04:39:17] so we can look at different alternatives for how we can make this entrance specifically from sprigs a little bit safer. I know some of the concerns were based on that additional pavement and it not necessarily being initially apparent that it's a one-way. And so if there's any additional concerns as far as stacking or access to the site, we can look at it at that time as well. [04:39:40] Okay, because it looks like from how you have it structured, a lot of the traffic will really be concentrated once you get on the inside of the property, inside the parking structure, I should say. Yep. And then just wanted to address the concerns about security, and this may be for Mr. Murray, but what type of mitigation do you have in this plan in terms of security and full transparency? [04:40:06] You know, we've been talking a lot about public safety really over the past couple of years, and I know on Route 1, One of the things that we've started discussing with regards to both residential and commercial property is, you know, what type of security are you implementing in your projects? [04:40:22] And so talk a little bit about that. Do you have anything? And then if you don't, are you willing to implement some security measures? That's a great question. So we actually dive into that pretty deep. We have over 32 cameras on average at each of our sites, and those cameras are 360-degree coverage of the property. [04:40:45] We have security lights, down lights that are on the building. And to date, we've had zero issues with any kind of crime. There's no loitering. I mean, there are visible cameras at every corner of the building, out in the parking lot. [04:41:06] We have parking lot light pedestals, so we've covered that pretty thoroughly. Okay, and then what about any type of security personnel? We do not have internal personnel per se. [04:41:21] We just never had an issue or a need to do it. We'd absolutely look into that if that was warranted or if we needed to. Sure, I would just say just to keep that at the top of mind. Sure, absolutely. Thank you. Next up, we have Supervisor Lawson, then Supervisor Angry, and Supervisor Bailey. [04:41:38] Thank you, Madam Chair. So, Jo, now, when the neighbor spoke, I didn't have the advantage of this aerial. So, can you walk me through the concerns that they raised about cut-through traffic in their neighborhood now that I have a better understanding? And I don't recall what neighborhood they're from. [04:42:01] so they are from this neighborhood behind here okay so you will you address their concerns because i didn't have i tried to address it and i think i'm addressing it incorrectly but what i what i heard was that people are cutting through their neighborhood to get to the shopping center okay but the specific question supervisor lawson that you asked me there was a specific question that [04:42:38] you asked me so you just asked me please address their concerns when they mentioned that people were cutting through the neighborhood is that well that's one of the concerns I recall yes and again I didn't have the advantage of a presentation or anything you know up like right now but they clearly have concerns about traffic I do recall one of them said they have a hard time getting in and out of both entrances because of school traffic and unfortunately Kyle Wilson's close by yep um and unfortunately i don't have a blown up aerial to be able to show you all of the schools [04:43:17] but sprigs road is school alley so there is kyle wilson elementary school is here there's a high school further down sprigs road as you're going towards holy road and then saunders middle school is further down as you're going so in the morning time so during school hours sprigs and minneville are it's buses and school children going to school. [04:43:45] So I'm struggling with no TIA, and that's, you know, Bryce explained it. Don't know if I agree with it, but... And oftentimes when we are looking at these sites, when there are vacant pad sites, when the shopping center was originally developed, they include the trips for additional traffic. [04:44:14] So they assume not only the shopping center, but uses at the pad sites as well. Correct. But how long ago was that shopping center approved? Because that's pretty old. It is. It predates Miniville being widened. [04:44:30] Right. So my point is, I can't be assured that what was predicted back then is what is reality today. Because it was how many decades ago? And I understand that. [04:44:46] i think it's hard here because this is a vacant pad site that will be developed with a use that could have higher trips if that makes sense yeah that's exactly what i'm thinking um so bryce do you thank you jonelle you're welcome do you consider that when you when not you i don't know if it's rick or who signs off on you know no tia but it's something that should be a consideration i've got a rezoning or not a rezoning a special use permit application in brentsville for a car [04:45:25] wash on a similar scenario uh it's um flag what's the name of those flagship thank you um and i'm thinking they should get a tia i certainly hope you are you've required one so help me out with this yeah so we are looking at specific uses so that's part of the pre-submission packet that applicants fill out when they're looking to submit an application. [04:45:53] So in this situation, we had a SUP application that was targeting a car wash. So we looked at the specific ITE trip generation for that use to see if it met DCSM thresholds for whether or not we want to acquire a TIA, which is this additional traffic impact study. [04:46:14] I did want to note that while every case doesn't have a TIA, That doesn't mean that we don't review it for, you know, safety concerns or things of that nature. It's just the traffic impact analysis allows us to have a much more data-driven deep dive into the surrounding intersections and potentially come forward with recommendations for additional turn lanes, signal improvements. [04:46:38] Those types of things are typically what we would see. So, okay. So, again, when we look at this site, you know, we look at what's the surrounding road network. The DCSM does allow the director of transportation when they feel it's warranted to require a TIA, even if it doesn't meet the trip generation thresholds. [04:46:59] But when we're considering that, we're looking at what type of potential improvements could be identified in that analysis And what's the likelihood that there will be mitigation strategies that will come out of that analysis, if that makes sense. [04:47:14] So on that note, are you saying your trip generation thresholds were based on the rezoning of the entire strip center? For the TIA deferral, the trip generation was based on this proposed use, which is a car wash. On a proposed use. [04:47:29] So you have like a standard for a proposed use. So we utilize ITE, which is kind of a nationally recognized standard. They do a compilation of uses, and they come forward with trip generation rates, usually based on some type of variable, such as per 1,000 square feet, or in this case, number of car wash tunnels. [04:47:50] I was just going to ask that. So maybe square footage or how many lanes? Is this a two-lane? This is a one-lane car wash, and the variable in ITE for these types of uses is the number of tunnels okay and the reason i'm drilling down on this is because i'm kind of stunned at how popular car washes are now i mean we we've approved a lot and i'm stunned that there's still applications for more and more which tells me people like their cars clean um i just [04:48:24] supervisor weir was showing me it does look like the stacking is internal on the site which is good but I obviously wanted to make sure that the neighbors' concerns are addressed, and I'm not convinced that it is. [04:48:48] Supervisor Angry, Supervisor Bailey, then Supervisor Ware. Thank you, Madam Chair. I probably just have a comment for all of us on the board because this is the problem with developments that aren't finished out. So you have two pad-ready sites that at some point something's going in there. [04:49:07] Can you go back? There's this one slide that shows Spriggs and that little access road, I think, to one. Yeah, here, this slide here. So to me, and I don't know what can happen here, I get the car wash. I hear the concerns. I know this area very well. [04:49:24] You know, I've driven fire trucks in here many times. And that one lane that used to be two that's now one way out, I mean, for me, the design here with the opportunity that we probably have is that access road that the citizens were talking about. Is there any buffer between the yards? I think that's what she was referring to with her kids, so the kids can come out. You know what area I'm talking to here on this edge? Yeah, so that's the access road, right? And so is there any buffer or fence or something along that to those homes that's right up to the back of that road? And the reason I ask that, because I'm pretty sure people are going down that road to access into this. [04:50:04] Now, this may not be for you all. My comment for this board and that particular side is that when we start these type of developments with a grocery store and everything in there, and there's two paths that literally are ready for something to be built, all it takes is an end user to buy it and do what they're doing now. [04:50:21] But I see that that infrastructure could be better. Like, if that access road was not there, I'm not saying to get rid of it because this is probably what they love, But your main road was that road, and you actually got rid of that one-lane-out road, and you tried to figure out, really, I mean, we don't know what that other user would be on that site, but one day we're going to be doing this all over again with these same citizens talking about what's going there. [04:50:45] I think we got an opportunity to try to figure out that design in there to make it more safer for that neighborhood that's backed up to it, maybe with some fencing and buffering and that type thing to keep the kids out or lose that access street or something. I'm just talking out loud to the board because the issue here becomes everything that we do, and we do a development like this, and we leave pads just ready. [04:51:07] If they don't put something on it soon enough, then there's no way the people who move into these areas ever want to see anything going there because now it's going to create everything that we're talking about now. And, you know, so I hear the concerns. I know what we have to do as we start looking at these, you know, land uses and development and business opportunities. [04:51:26] But this is the problem when you don't finish out a development. We end up with these situations and conversations, and that road looks like we need to do something different to really help and accommodate that community. As far as that side road, we'd have to look in to see if it's a public street or a private street. [04:51:43] If it's public, then we'll need to coordinate with VDOT to come up with some type of mitigation plan. And just to add one additional note to talk about the TIA, for example, if we're looking at potential improvements, Typically, we look at intersection turn lanes or signalization. [04:52:01] If you look at the spacing between the median break, so this primary access point right here, that's not currently signalized, and it also wouldn't be approved for signal. VDOT wouldn't approve it because the spacing is too close to Miniville Road, that signal. [04:52:19] Another example is the existing turn lanes into the site. They're already along the entire frontage, basically. So there can't be an extension of additional turn lane storage or anything like that. So as far as road infrastructure improvements to get into the site, there's really not too much that we would be able to recommend, and that's something that we wouldn't be able to recommend through the TIA process. [04:52:47] Supervisor Bailey. Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I was just thinking the same thing that Supervisor Ingrid just said with that road. But what I was going to say to Mr. Murray was we had the similar kind of issues, yes, Johnnell, I know, with the Dumfries site, and we worked it out. [04:53:07] We really did work it out with the citizens. And so I just – it's a different scenario here because I get what the community is saying as well. but I would encourage you to take those same types of mitigation that you took in my district because it was similar to this, though smaller. [04:53:28] And we really have not had a lot of consternation there at all. And one of the things, as Supervisor Franklin was saying, was the security piece, and you really made sure that that happened. But I think that, as Supervisor Angry is saying, And with it being an older community, more seasoned community, not older, more seasoned community, there needs to be some kind of discussion in reference to what they're saying, as well as that being an open pad site, similar to what you did in my district, and it worked out in a positive way. [04:54:07] So I just wanted to offer that, not to help anybody make any decisions, but I know that that was something that we did go through, and that was in 2020, and we haven't had any problems just offering that. And, Bryce, thanks for explaining all that because it was confusing to me. [04:54:26] Supervisor Weir, then Supervisor Lawson again. Evening, Janelle. Good evening, Supervisor Weir. Sorry I didn't bring this up earlier. It kind of just occurred to me. Do I understand correctly that Staples Mill Plaza Road is now going to be right in, right out only, and you're going to get rid of that? [04:54:50] I'm sorry, it's right in only today. It is right in, so that little island there is. It is right in only, so here. Because on the original one, I'm showing an island of some sort there. Yes, this is right in only. So are you looking on Google Maps by any chance? [04:55:06] Yeah. Okay, so. No, I'm looking at the presentation, the county's staff presentation. This is currently right in only. So at one point in time, you couldn't actually enter the shopping center from Spriggs Road. And so this was write-in, write-out. [04:55:25] They've now made this write-in only. And one thing that somebody had mentioned was it would be helpful if you can add some signage here to make it very clear that it's a one-way, and we said we would do that at site plan. So it was write-out at one point in time. Correct. It is no longer something to change. [04:55:41] Okay, I don't have a problem with the ingress. I don't have a problem with the circulation. I don't have a problem with the stacking. It just suddenly occurs to me that without that ride out any longer, your two egress points are only going to be at Minneville or you're going to have to go down the backside of the food line, out that access road. [04:56:03] And I think that's where you're going to have the issue, especially if traffic is backed up on Spriggs, where you're going to have people to opt out to go through the neighborhood. And I just don't know that there's any way to fix that. As far as ITs go, I hate them. [04:56:20] They're horrible numbers. You should know that. Talking to Bryce. Yeah, I just – I don't know if there's any way to address that issue because it is – It's an existing condition. It also looks like it's an existing VDOT-controlled road, at least according to Mapper. [04:56:39] I'm not sure there's anything we can do about it, but I suspect egress is going to be the issue more than the ingress. Supervisor Lawson? Thank you. A couple things. Is that vacant lot the other pad site? [04:56:57] Yes, ma'am. So there's likely going to be – are they both zone B1? B2, yes, ma'am. Oh, B2. B2. that's how old the shopping center is yeah i haven't heard of b2 in a long time um so madam chair i actually and i know our board has done this before but i think it's fair to have somebody from the neighborhood come up when when they spoke earlier this was this was um pulled off of consolidated we didn't have a presentation i just want to make sure that we as a board are [04:57:36] hearing you can tell they're very anxious to get their point across is that because because typically when it's consolidated we don't have anyone speak against it so then there's i just hate to set precedent only because we've never i since i've been here in the four years we've never ever done that oh you don't remember the ladies in the front row the night of the coals uh joe jacobs project and and their driveways and the concern of yeah we we we worked it out in the the middle of i'll have jonell go speak supervisor lawson do you remember that i do we absolutely [04:58:14] honestly don't but that's i mean i can't remember everything i guess supervisor lawson uh alex vanagas from the planning office i'm actually the case planner for this case and i actually patronize patronize the food line i go to this food line so can you hold on for one second mister do you want to go out to the hallway maybe and speak to them that would be that's usually what we do often if you can go out and speak to some of the neighborhood with the applicant and then come back in full disclosure i met with walsh koluchy yesterday and the only concern that was [04:58:49] raised was a gentleman on the back on that cul-de-sac on the other side of manyville his view and his view this is all new to me yeah so mr venegas understood and i go to this food line i used to drop my son off at hilton high school which was about a mile and a half down the road on sprigs um and in the early morning uh during peak hours there are some transportation challenges uh where the the it stacks up a little here minneville road um and then people uh coming [04:59:24] on sprigs road taking a right onto minneville so i i hear what the people are saying and i understand it because i've experienced it okay um but uh i've also been to the same food line at different hours and never had a problem getting in or out so I think it really depends on the time of the day but when you look at the operational hours of the car wash usually people aren't going to that car wash when they're taking their kids to school or buses are going to school and I think that's a fair point and that I think that makes the difference because when people are utilizing [05:00:01] as the clients are primarily going when it's after school hours or when there's after the rush hour traffic so i think you know that uh that's an important part to mention uh in addition i'm not sure if this private road if this is a private road like bryce said or if it's a public road but what we can do is we can work with the department of transportation to see what we can do to mitigate whether it be speed tables or something of that nature signage to discourage people from cutting through because i think that's what a lot of the concern is of the residents that [05:00:39] live around there can't we can't we find that out pretty quickly looking at county mapper um can't we bryce yeah we can look at it really quick yeah um you know if it's private it's a lot easier the hoa can handle it but if it's a public road yeah then we have to get vdot involved in the decision i mean the project might be great but i do think it's important that you know we make sure that we're not driving more traffic down that road where there's at least what five houses and i'm assuming all of them are the majority of the folks that are here tonight probably live right there [05:01:18] yeah because i see that as a potential to mitigate um but like supervisor bode had mentioned you know this car wash isn't creating the problem problems exist already just throughout like the county we have several areas sure similar to this but i don't want to exacerbate it right i don't want to exacerbate it exactly and that other pad site if you think this is bad who knows what that one might be okay so it looks like it's a vdot probe so we would have to get vdot involved in [05:01:55] the process um but you know from the standpoint of staff uh the applicant has worked really hard it's vdot it is vdot yeah so and and commissioner fontanella put a lot of additional stipulations and the applicant agreed to them the signage the signage is going to make a big difference they provided us line of sight for issues that people might have with the car wash vehicles coming out of the car wash and how it might impact the neighborhood they really did a [05:02:30] lot for us in this process and you know again you know i use this i go to this food line i go to metas which is further down and and uh were these were these concerns raised at the planning commission yes some of them were there was uh people concerned with the open space going away where people felt like that was a park and in reality that was a right that was one of the concerns i meant i meant the traffic impact there yes there was like two or three people that had concerns with traffic and you know the we the applicant agreed that they would work with the [05:03:08] the owner of the plaza to try to work through mitigate look for solutions such as signage which they offered in the proffers that i think address some of that concern and and um you know we won't be able to fix every problem but we can you know work together with transportation to see if we can you know find some solutions and again i don't want my vote to exacerbate it if it's if it's existing and it creates frustration i i just want to be sensitive to that understood not throw salt [05:03:42] on the wound right and and the reality again is you got to consider the hours of operation and right it's mostly utilized which and i think you make a great point there um yeah i rarely get my car washed but i'm certainly not getting it washed at 7 30 in the morning right okay supervisor bode Thank you, Madam Chair. [05:04:03] So to that point, it looks like really the only real avenues, pun intended, of mitigation that we can look at here are that Luther Allen Place, which is that access where everyone keeps calling, and then sort of a little bit that goes up, because you can't see it on the map you have up right now, but I have county mapper up, And the right-of-way for the VDOT maintained goes all the way up to basically where the – actually, no, yeah, go move your arrow up a little bit more, Alex. [05:04:36] Right there. It stops basically right there. So the VDOT right-of-way stops essentially where your arrow is right now. So those are really the avenues that we have. So I guess it sounds to me like we have a consensus forming of – so your point, Alex, we go back to transportation and have them and Richard Wyman, those folks with their minds together and see what we can do to look at those two thoroughfares to see what can be done from a traffic perspective because if it is speed tables if it is signage if it is that whole menu of options that we may have based on what is happening there from a traffic [05:05:11] perspective especially projecting out that there's yeah that there is going to be another pads that is on their business uh use then we need to at least be having those conversations now to see where we're going. Supervisor Franklin next and then would you have something to add Ms. Cameron or are they still working on it? Which was okay what they brought up during the Planning Commission. [05:05:40] So Supervisor Lawson you asked a question about whether or not these comments were brought up during Planning Commission. There were comments specifically about the intersection but this community and these specific comments were not brought up so this is the first time we're hearing it as well. I wanted you to be aware of that because we met with you yesterday and I know I was going to hear an earful so i wanted you to know it was just the intersection the specific bel-air concerns this is the first time we're hearing them with you thank you of course supervisor [05:06:12] franklin supervisor franklin yeah i do just want to be very clear that um the mitigation efforts that you guys well not even mitigate mitigation efforts but what we're discussing is actually handling the current challenges um that has nothing to do with with the proposal now supervisor lawson's point obviously we don't want to exasperate it but um again looking at the proposal that they have all the stacking is done um on the actual site um and i can only go by kind of what's up here and the experience of the current one that's in dumfries and like i said [05:06:51] i haven't noticed any traffic and i go by there pretty much every day um so we do need to just make sure that that level of detail and structure with the Dumfrey site is almost replicated as much as possible with this site to make sure that we don't see any additional transit issues on those roads. Because again, I never see it spilling out onto Route 1. And we certainly want to make sure that the same doesn't happen for Spriggs and Miniville. I do think the difference is there multiple access points for this site, as opposed to on Route 1, you have one access site? [05:07:28] I think multiple access points are actually better for car washes because it allows for you to have multiple ingress and egress out of the site. So you're not contained to one area waiting to be able to get out. But I do understand the community's concern. Supervisor Vega is talking to them, So they'll be better able to explain it. [05:07:50] But what I just learned is there's a median here, so you can't make a left turn. So if you're in this neighborhood and you want to make a left, you either have to make a right and make a U-turn or they come out of this intersection in here in order to make the left. [05:08:11] So, yeah, so if I am coming back towards Miniville and I live in this neighborhood, I either make a U-turn or I use this side street and make a left here. Correct. [05:08:28] That's sort of a design thing. I am waiting for Supervisor Vega to come back in. She is talking to the community members. I don't see how this project, though, would exacerbate that issue. And there are other uses. [05:08:45] I'm just saying. And I think I've said it. It is a vacant pad site, and there are other uses that could be constructed here by Wright that have additional trips and don't have all of the mitigation commitments. We are absolutely committed to working with county transportation at-site plan to add additional signage in the shopping center. [05:09:04] We've talked to the shopping center owners to make sure that they're aware of that. I don't... Madam Chair. Well, yeah, I was going to say something. But you're saying you don't understand how the car wash could make that worse? [05:09:20] is attracting more vehicles to that shopping center. Well, so they're either going to go out there and make a left where the neighborhood's making a left, or they're going to go out there and make a right from the car wash. Why would they drive down that inner street? [05:09:38] They're doing it a lot right now. Did you listen to what she said? She said the people in the neighborhood can't make a left-hand turn because of the raised median at the first entrance, So they're going down and cutting across there and making a left. [05:09:55] So why would a car wash increase that? Yeah, I don't think – I think it's whatever is there. Tonight it's the car wash, but – I think what she's saying – Clearly – Sorry, Supervisor Lawson. I think what she's saying is the people in these homes, that is their current situation with or without the car wash today. [05:10:16] So it's the people in the homes that are making that left turn movement, not necessarily the car wash users. Okay, so you're saying it's all of their neighbors that are not here tonight that are creating all these headaches. I just don't understand how the car wash coming from that, like the car wash, the people will come out and make a right at that, or they'll make a left, but they don't have to go through that little cut-through street. [05:10:43] Look, I'm not an engineer, but, you know, I think it's fair to say we're all familiar with human behaviors and how we get around town. I think if you live west of Minnieville, you're not going to want to go up through the shopping center, get on Minnieville and come down to Spriggs. I think you're going to look for the path of least resistance. And now that I know that that, that intersection right there, you said is curbed. No, the other one. This one? Yes, that's curbed where they, or the median, I mean. This, [05:11:22] there's a median here. So they can, you're saying they can only make a right out of that community. okay and we just learned that in the last five minutes but what does that have to do with the the site that we're discussing i'm trying to understand why they have all these problems and i want to make sure that i'm not going to make it worse that's why i'm trying to understand i'm not being flippant about it i'm trying i'm trying to understand so you're saying that this intersection the one closer to the center but yep right there that is full access Correct, full access. [05:12:02] Okay. And this intersection here. Okay. I mean, this is better. Sorry, Supervisor Lawson. So full access here, full access here. Okay. And now what I'm hearing you say is you believe that a lot of their current frustrations are internal within their own community. [05:12:22] Correct. And what they said was if somebody doesn't want to wait, so if I'm at Food Lion and I don't want to wait to make a right turn, then I might make a right turn at Luther to come out here and then make a right turn okay now do you see well that yeah but no I do see that I guess Mike yeah I guess I struggle with if this is a really I consider sort of low use for that corner compared to something else that could go in [05:12:56] right but I also I mean if you go back to the the picture of the intersection I know as as someone who was coming from the western end of the county like that's a full-on intersection that is a intersection that has turn lanes and it's really nice i know that sounds you know i mean that you know that is like a cool intersection and it's compared to other things that we have other places in the county and you know if this intersection can't handle it what can you know i i you know it's it's a big intersection that's designed for a lot of yeah right i mean that's a great [05:13:35] intersect i guess we can it was so we can yeah sure um can we vote on the consolidated a through f without 12 is it only c yes it's only 12c pardon me 12 a and b is also in supervisor vegas district [05:14:12] but it's the same applicant so you can just not keep all of the other applicants if you want to put 12 a and b aside too okay d e and f did you well hold on did you okay okay so who's going to move 12D through F? I move. Oh, is he moving? I don't know. Did he turn his light on? You can't just say that you got to turn your light on. You have to. Second. Second. Motion made by [05:14:49] Supervisor Weir. Seconded by Supervisor Bailey. Any discussion? Supervisor Bailey. Thank you so much. Oh, thank you. Turn your light on. Thank you so much, Madam Chair. And item 12D, I want to, I don't know if anyone's here for 12-D, but I just want to thank the company. [05:15:10] I think it's Miller's. I can't think of it because I can't read my thing. But anyway, it's Miller's, isn't it? Milestone. Milestone, yes. Thank you, Milestone. Just thank you to Milestone. You've got car washes on your head. Yeah, I do, I do. [05:15:26] Thank you so much to Milestones for your collaboration with not only my office, but also with the community in reference to the cell tower. I really do need additional coverage in that area between Dumfries and Triangle, and you are really footing the bill. [05:15:42] And for protecting our little baseball park back in there, we really appreciate that as well. So this will extend our ban in that area, and I'm really appreciative. It's something we've been working on since 2020, so just wanted to say that. [05:15:58] Thank you, Supervisor Bailey. Any further discussion? Seeing none, please. if i if i request to speak then my screen goes so i okay i just supervisor lawson yeah that's okay that's all right it's no big deal and we got time i just want to thank the applicant um qts actually i believe is it 12 d yeah e dc4 e p-r-e-s-d-e as in that word see i can [05:16:31] be fair i want to thank you for your proffer on the trail we pushed hard for it and innovation owners association and myself really appreciate that you proffered it that's all i wanted to say okay seeing no further discussion please vote okay and we will wait on the rest of the applicants thank you for doing business in prince william county for those who just got through [05:17:09] madam chair if i can while we're talking while we're waiting um that little cut through road are those i don't even see a driveway do you guys see i'm just those five houses right there i believe those are their front yards yeah okay yeah okay um i'm just extra sensitive to it because transportation if they're in here memory lane in noakesville right off of 28 very similar [05:17:49] situation and we've had v-dot and prince william transportation out there there's a lot of cut through traffic and there's residents right there yeah there they are and so just don't don't want to repeat the experience so madam chair we're going to meet with supervisor vega and the transportation department i think we've got a potential solution to this so we'll and we've spoken to all the residents out there so we need a couple of minutes to resolve that okay a couple [05:18:20] minutes and then then we can and then can we vote on it so we will pick a b and c 12 a b and c back up after public comment time we'll start public comment time now um to be more efficient with our [05:18:54] use of time and i'm sure ms madden will give me a list of people signed up to speak for those who are new the board will now hear in person and remote public comments we'll begin with in perfect in person each speaker will have three minutes to share their views and opinions regarding matters before the board. We ask that all speakers state their name and generally where they live or magisterial district before they speak and there will be a timer and you will be able to see it [05:19:22] with three minutes. This evening we have seven people signed up to speak. I will just call all seven to make it easier. The seven people are Alicia Gloss, Alan Gloss, Ryan Bartruff, Ruthann Pizzaretz, Bill Billard, Teresa Minns, and Ms. Aine Johnson. So our first, Alicia Gloss, Alan Gloss, [05:19:59] Ryan Bartruff, Ruthann Pizzaretz, Bill Billard, Teresa Minns, Aine Johnson. Please begin. Alicia Gloss-Coles, over the past four years, how have our lives in Prince William County improved with this Democrat Majority Board? Every year our taxes have increased. Our recent personal property tax bill has skyrocketed because they voted to go from 80 to 100 percent of assessed value and then only after public backlash during an election year voted to prolong the due date to january thanks but we can't afford it in january either voted for the largest budget in prince [05:20:36] william county history this past year in a 70 pay raise for themselves funded by us the taxpayers voted in the mills tax devastating businesses in prince william county but refused to increase the tax rate on data centers but vote to approve data centers outside the overlaid district where they don't belong next to residential and school areas did you forget supervisor bailey's hot mic moment from the dais with the chair threatening my husband and then sending the police to the home of her constituent because he questioned why a supervisor would threaten a citizen of prince william county how about at the ruling against the board of the against the board by the virginia supreme court for conducting an illegal meeting violating the open meetings law and having the [05:21:16] taxpayers for the defense pay for their defense without bringing it to a board vote a bill approximately $150,000 now or overseeing the hiring of many employees outside of Prince William County like our own county executive Mr. Shorter. We had a highly qualified candidate Mr. Elijah Cummings who applied for the position and filled it during the vacancy but was passed over for someone outside of Prince William County not even from Virginia. Recently Mr. Shorter has hired several high-paying positions and gave them to people outside of our county. Why are we not promoting and hiring within our county the dim majority voted to increase the tipping fee art [05:21:55] for our trash businesses and now our trash bills have increased voted to approve more staff for the commonwealth attorney's office this office's largest staff increase in prince william county history and what do we get as taxpayers in return a murder rate that has doubled a crime rate that has exploded and a commonwealth attorney amy ashworth that refuses to take responsibility but instead blames our police department, which this board refuses to fully fund. [05:22:21] How do you increase staff but not prosecute and put away more criminals? This is failed leadership and failure of this board for not calling it out. If nothing is done, crime will continue to rise because criminal first, citizen last policies by this board and Commonwealth Attorney Amy Ashwork. [05:22:37] If nothing is done, taxes will continue to rise because spending first, taxpayers last. If nothing is done, our beautiful rural Crescent areas will be destroyed because developers first, taxpayers last. If nothing is done, data centers will continue to be forced throughout against the will of the people because data centers first, taxpayers last. [05:22:57] Have you guys figured it out yet? We, the taxpayers, are last. We are losing out. Do something and vote them out now during early voting or on November 7th. Next speaker, please. Ellen Gloss-Coles. [05:23:15] Election days and 14 short days. All but two of the seats on this board are being contested. No one is perfect, and a candidate is no different. So while we can't expect perfection, they have to at least not be evil. The folks before you talk rosily about their accomplishments, but I'll tell you that the majority of what I've heard is churched up, if not outright evil lies. [05:23:36] No one has bigger rose-colored glasses than Tyron Ann Wheeler. Despite being the richest person in county government, she still saddles up to the county trough to feast on taxpayer money. While she's off this board, she isn't done mooching off the taxpayers. Just wait. Remember when Kenny Bode led protests to defund our police? [05:23:54] He now talks about how he's always supported the police. Fittingly, he's been called Pinocchio for lying about his support of the Rural Crescent to get elected and then advocating for sprawl after the developers dangled cash in front of him. Andrea Bailey has time after time used public funds to help her friends or boost her ego. [05:24:15] During COVID, when many of us weren't getting paid and couldn't afford Christmas, She used public funds on customized Christmas ornaments for her friends, then falsified government documents when asked to reveal who received them. Or how she snookered Chief Newsham into sending armed government agents to constituent Bob Hand's house because he had the audacity to question why she threatened me from the dais. [05:24:39] We're all lucky that didn't go extremely bad. Ms. Franklin won't tell you that five of our officers were injured because she was barking orders from the safety of her couch at our police officers on the front lines of the 2020 riots. A feckless police colonel followed her orders blindly, thinking that she'd sway the board to promote him. [05:25:00] Ha! Jokes on that guy. He should be fired. She also won't tell you how hard she worked to try to shut down a small business by getting her buddies at a state board to pull its license. Shockingly, the very policies she's advocated over the last four years don't seem to be working in her favor. [05:25:20] Let's all remember how the majority killed a cooperative agreement between the county and the feds where an immigration court would decide whether an arrested criminal was allowed to stay. That program got some of the worst criminals off of our streets permanently. But now they released them right back to our streets. [05:25:35] We're not safer. Don't forget how the majority snuck and held a secret meeting with the rioters when they solidified that rioters were to be allowed to burn and loot without consequence. Hiding behind closed doors doesn't make me think they have our best interests in mind. Even though the June primary was a referendum on data centers in Sprawl, they defied those voters that spoke unequivocally and decided that they'll approve major land usage in a few weeks. [05:26:02] Have you seen your tax bill lately? Every year, they take more of our money, and if the discussions about publicly funded housing or the energy sustainability stuff we talked about today is any indication, they are not planning to give you a tax break anytime soon. And they voted themselves a massive raise, too. [05:26:18] I can go on and on, but the truth is that this majority, we don't matter. Thank you. Mr. Gloss, thank you. Next speaker, please. Good evening. [05:26:34] My name is Ryan Bartroff, and I'm a resident of the Gainesville District. I'm here this evening to speak about the upcoming public hearings and votes regarding the Prince William Digital Gateway applications, both for the Planning Commission and for this board. I'm here in person because it appears that this type of public comment is given more weight than emails, voicemails, or online comments. [05:26:54] Why else would the planning committee be considering holding public hearings for the three different zoning applications for the digital gateway separately? One reason is because of the high number of anticipated speakers. And yeah, if the 11-hour comprehensive plan amendment meeting was any indication, turnout's going to be massive. [05:27:11] But does anyone here really believe that a citizen's opinion about the digital gateway varies from one zoning application to the other? Have we heard any public comment yet that truly differentiates between them? We haven't, and that's probably for the best, because a watered-down version of this proposal benefits nobody. [05:27:27] It weakens the economic benefit to the county, and it is a deterrent to future industries looking to invest in Prince William County. So, if nobody thinks of these applications as separate issues, why do we need to rigidly insist that they are separated when the time comes for public comment? [05:27:44] You're just going to get the same three-minute speeches delivered three times. There are options that would help to mitigate the overwhelming logistics of these upcoming hearings. Residents can indicate if they're speaking about a single application or all of them as a group. Since there's likely to be a ton of participants, you can equally shorten the length of time given to all. [05:28:04] At this point, I don't think everyone needs three minutes to get their positions across. You have a responsibility to your staffers, building personnel, county police, and residents to manage this event as efficiently as possible. Ensuring that all the necessary staff are present for the entire meeting is going to cost a lot of overtime. [05:28:22] Residents are going to have to take time off work if they feel they have to be here in person. The idea of doing this on three different evenings instead of one is disrespectful to everyone's time and the taxpayers' money. The planning committee also said that guaranteeing equal commentary opportunities for everyone for each separate application is ensuring democracy. [05:28:42] But that's not what democracy is. Our vote is the democratic process. Communicating with our elected officials so that their vote is informed is democracy. You have the ability and the responsibility to make this process as streamlined and sensible as possible in order to encourage participation, avoid excessive county expenditure, and respect everyone's time, both the public's and your own. [05:29:04] I will save my position on the Digital Gateway for a different meeting, because in this case, I think these concerns are something we can all agree on. Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. Good evening. [05:29:22] Ruth Ann Pazares, Gainesville District. And I've come tonight to say thank you for the overwhelmingly adequate signage for the rezoning hearing for the Prince William Digital Gateway. I'm very much in favor of this project. And thank you again for your vision and foresight in planning for Prince William County for now and in the future. [05:29:44] Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. Bill Billard, Manassas Cole, Madam Chair, members of the board. Well, this is the last evening meeting before Election Day. And it's probably a good time to do a good board and review for the past three years and some change. [05:30:06] Remember, when y'all sworn in on your seats, I wanted to congratulate each and every one of y'all individually so that we can have a wonderful nonpartisan or bipartisan agenda for constitutional issues. But I was wrong. Very wrong. I was slandered. [05:30:25] I was accused of staring somebody down with the intent to intimidate. But my intent was to congratulate, to be polite. Well, I'm staring everybody down now to let you know that the government should always be intimidated by the people you represent, because the people have the power, not the government. [05:30:46] But we've seen some interesting things. I remember when the first board came back in January 2020, Madam Chair, you said we got to find common ground. Well, the common ground is the Bill of Rights. Always has been, should always will be. [05:31:05] And we shouldn't take partisan issues on constitutional issues or take any side. And the Republicans aren't always right on that. Remember when I alluded to what happened after 9-11, the Republicans led the way for unconstitutional practices under the guise of the Patriot Act and violated a lot of people's First and Fourth Amendment rights. [05:31:28] But now we've got Democrats who want to violate people's Second Amendment rights and First Amendment rights, to be exact. You want to go after your political opposition. My colleague Bob Han had the cops called on him just for voicing or challenging authority here. [05:31:47] That shows we are moving ever closer to a totalitarian regime on all levels of government. Now, these calls for local gun control and public parks, I know that's going to be agenda for some people here. You're probably going to introduce that during the lame duck session. [05:32:05] We're not stupid, but it will do nothing. crime has increased in this county since this board took control, if that's the right word, back in January 2020. And it got worse when everybody lost their minds during the summer of love in 2020. It was a terrible tragedy, but the way people reacted was out of emotion and fear, not facts. Now, I'm encouraging every one of you here to please stand up for constitutional rights. [05:32:42] And even though we failed, we failed to make constitutional issues a nonpartisan thing for every members on this board. But hopefully, we will find out that the failure will happen this November during election time. [05:32:59] Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. [05:33:19] Threesome ends, Potomac District. I want to thank our law enforcement and first responders for all they do. And it is a fact that Supervisor Bode stood behind Black Lives Matter, which is a Marxist group doing this and wanting to get rid of the police, defund the police. [05:33:39] And that was the majority of the Democrat board. And for Supervisor Franklin acting like, oh, these Republicans, they just don't get along. They just don't do things right. Why don't you talk about the illegal meeting that you guys had right in the beginning of your takeover? [05:33:59] And it was illegal. Whenever you have a meeting, the Republicans are supposed to be included. Where was our attorney? Where was our county exec? And that wasn't you, Mr. Shorter. That was the guy prior to you. Okay, where were all these people? They were nowhere to be found. [05:34:15] Fortunately, the Republicans learned about the lie and the corruption from the Democrats. Yes. And remember, I voted for Obama the first time. After Obama, three months, I was done with the Democrat Party, and I had never been that way. Okay, you people that are here, start paying attention to the meetings. [05:34:38] Start paying attention. You'll know what's going on. And then when you guys have these work sessions and you have them in a building where we can't, there's not enough room for us and we don't have citizens' time, that is corruption at its best. [05:34:54] Because the citizens that can't make it here should be able to hear those work sessions. And you, Supervisor Franklin, are notorious for taking away our rights and are notorious for saying, oh, oh, I'm so wonderful. [05:35:09] I did a great job. When you do not, you're so smooth. You're real smooth, but you're dishonest. In fact, the five Democrats are dishonest. And that's another thing. We never had a Republican board. Never. They were a bunch of rhinos that, thank goodness, aren't around. They were Democrats in disguise. So when I hear this one citizen say, oh, the Republican board, they did this, they did that. No, they were Democrats in disguise that called themselves Republicans. [05:35:49] they're not here on this board now so thank god i don't know what to say and it costs the taxpayers to represent this dishonest meeting that went on our taxpayers i hope you listen to all the people that were before me and start going back and listening to citizens time that's online you people are just getting a taste of how they take you got the gang of five they vote together and they don't vote for the citizens so it's sad it's sad you you're so sweet and you're so innocent [05:36:25] but you're not next speaker please all right okay it's my turn now my name is Aine Johnson and I am from the Woodbridge District good evening madam chair county attorney county supervisors county executive and ladies and gentlemen here virtually and in the chambers don't worry Mr. Shorty I have time for you tonight. I got you. I'm ready for you. I stand today as a wife, a mother, an advocate to foster parents and foster children. Mr. Shorter, I have not. I told you I wouldn't. I have not missed [05:37:04] our three-minute Tuesday power chat, and I continue to speak to you publicly on behalf of my family. On June 4th, you sent me an email, which I loved. I felt excited. I had to tell my husband. Mr. Shorter sent me an email. Good afternoon, Ms. Johnson. I am not sure I understand the purpose of your email. Hmm. And I also made sure I redacted that one paragraph for you, Mr. Shorter, because I've learned that from the county. They like to redact a lot of documents when people ask for it. My office will be in touch with you once Deputy County Executive Johnson has completed his investigation and had an opportunity to finalize recommendations. Sincerely, Christopher [05:37:42] J. Shorter, County Executive. Mr. Shorter, I apologize for not responding to you, and I will now respond to you publicly. My purpose is simple. I fight, I empower, I advocate. I fight for our family. Our family is currently following the necessary legal steps to reunify our family with our foster son through the Virginia courts. We publicly ask, and even if I go over my time, I'll just stop talking, but we publicly ask, I want to make sure you hear this, for individuals working within Prince William County Department of Social Services to cease from coming to my husband's job or sharing information related to the court cases. [05:38:21] We asked this because on June 6th, during public comment time and as well as your time, Mr. Shorter, you stated you would investigate and allow our family to address things in a separate manner in the court system. For cases that aren't on a public docket, Mr. Shorter, our family continues to have interference right before we go to court. [05:38:41] How interesting. I empower. Foster parents will learn the definition of fictive kin, pro se litigants, VMATs, CASA workers, GAL. Lots of acronyms, but there's Google. And our IT team is working on ensuring that the website is updated in a timely manner so that foster parents have that information. [05:39:01] And lastly, I advocate for legislation. Legislation is not just a concept exclusive for Richmond. I care here locally in Prince William County. Esther 4 14 for if thou altogether holdest thy peace at this time then shall their enlargement and deliverance arise to the Jews from another place but thou and thy father's house shall be destroyed and who knoweth whether thou art come to the kingdom and I say am I here for Prince William County for such a time as this our contact information is www.bakingforbumpy.com [05:39:35] 571-991-2827. Dear foster parents, we love you. We see you. We support you. We cry for you. Thank you. That will conclude our in-person public comment time. Ms. Madden, do we have anyone online? With that, I will turn it over to Vice Chair Bodie. Thank you, Madam Chair. Like with in-person public comment time, you have three minutes to speak. Please identify who you are and whereabouts you live. Ms. Madden, shall we begin? Your first speaker is Ken Nahr. Good evening, [05:40:12] Kennard, Gainesville District. Quick reflection. Obviously, investment per student isn't the only metric to measure community's emphasis on education or the quality of the education that community has. However, it is recognized nationally, almost globally, as one of the key metrics for both. Prince William County continues to have the lowest per student investment data in the entire Nova region. The speaker, a speaker a couple of weeks ago listed off the top 20 schools in the [05:40:46] nation. We heard Fairfax, Loudoun, Arlington, and Alexandria all cited. We heard Loudoun cited several times. What we did not hear was a single school from Prince William County. Is this a coincidence? Is it a coincidence we have the lowest paid educators in the region? Is it a coincidence we have the most educator vacancies. In every case, I think not. This board is responsible for providing adequate resources to our schools. It truly is an investment. I respectfully request [05:41:24] your support for the three Prince William Digital Gateway rezoning applications as they come before this board in the coming months. They are an investment in our community's kids and future. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Nahr. Next speaker, please. Your next speaker is Mally White. [05:41:47] Thank you. This is Mally White in the Gainesville District, and I want to thank you for everything you've done to bring a full few years of comments and discussion, investigations, and accurate models, digital frequency of communication. [05:42:18] It's been very excellent, so thank you, and I want you to know that I fully support the Prince William Digital Gateway, along with so many people in and outside of Prince William County, so your decisions for the next three applications to approve it will be greatly appreciated by so many, and thank you so much for your excellent decision-making. [05:42:42] Thank you, Ms. White. Next speaker, please. Your next speaker is Robert White. Hello, my name is Robert White, Gainesville District. [05:43:08] I also support the Digital Gateway and ask that you not put off any longer the voting to bring this before and that it would move forward very quickly. We have been held for two years now in negotiating and all the planning and everything that's come forth, and I believe it's time that it moves on to be able to be voted on. [05:43:31] Thank you very much. Thank you, Mr. White. Any more speakers, Ms. Mann? There are no more speakers at this time. Thank you, Ian, always for your assistance. Back to you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Vice Chair Bodie. [05:43:46] thank you Ms. Mann as always that brings us back to 12a b and c does Mr. Venegas do you want to maybe address where we are can someone tell us where we are Madam Chair I'll take over thank you Alex okay sorry just yeah sorry about that first off I want to thank my colleagues for your patience and also for those here in attendance and those watching at home typically we have it all figured out and I'm squared away when it comes to any issues in the Coles District but today was a little bit of a surprise as I learned that a lot of the folks from the community that attended here tonight did not make it to the PC and or just recently found out about it because they saw [05:44:23] the public hearing notice posted on the property. I want to thank those folks for coming out and for sharing your concerns with me. For the sake of transparency, we had various conversations out in the atrium and I want to thank Ms. Cameron also and her team for accommodating the time for discussion and working with me to try to find a solution to make everybody happy. One of the things that I did share with my constituents out there is is that I'm not dismissing any of their concerns as I do believe that they're valid. Traffic concerns are valid. I will say that car washes are not destinations. Typically when we go to the car wash we're going to the car wash on our way [05:45:01] home or if you're going to be shopping at the Food Lion and you have a little bit more time you're probably going to swing by and get your car washed and so I will say that a lot of the other things that were shared with me um stem from ongoing issues a lot of other culprits I would say play a role in the traffic woes that folks have been experiencing for a very very long time and I also told them that I would find it very unfair to penalize the car wash for a lot of those traffic woes that have been ongoing um without uh having community input and a community meeting not just with you know county staff but also with VDOT. So with that madam chair I also [05:45:41] want to say that we talked a little bit about the buy right issue. The car wash is what's being proposed right now but I also shared with folks that for example if a convenience store wanted to open up shop there tomorrow and be open 24-7 they could do that and they would not have to come before this governing body and so we do the very best that we can to try to mitigate concerns and find solutions to the problems that have been raised and I feel very confident moving this project forward one because at the PC hearing the Coles District Planning Commissioner Joe Fontanella did a stellar job at addressing some of the concerns that were made and I know that [05:46:17] the applicant also agreed to some of the mitigations that we were able to agree upon and so with that being said I'm going to go ahead and move this forward but it's going to be a package deal. I want to go ahead, Madam Chair, without objection, direct staff to look at and work with VDOT, looking into mitigations to address the community's concerns regarding traffic and cut-through traffic related to the Staples Mills Plaza. In addition, I spoke to some of the folks that have already left that a community meeting in coordination with staff in my office is going to take place to further listen to the concerns that were [05:46:55] raised to me out in the atrium tonight and identify again available mitigations to address their concerns. Again a lot of these issues are long overdue in my opinion in terms of finding a solution and I'm very confident that with the help with staff with VDOT and with my office along with the community input we're going to achieve finding solutions to those concerns. [05:47:18] So with that Madam Chair I would like to move these three items forward. Second. Motion made by Vice-Supervisor Vega, seconded by Vice-Chair Brody. Any discussion? Madam Chair. Supervisor Brody. Just very quickly. I know most of them left, but to the folks that are still here, appreciate you coming out. [05:47:35] As Supervisor Vega said, a lot of these seem like they're ongoing issues that predate anything going on with this car wash. But again, back to something that was said before, we don't want our decision necessarily to exacerbate existing conditions. That said, it's not the onus isn't on the applicant to fix issues that you already have with some of your neighbors and other folks that seem to be contributing to your traffic issues in this area. [05:47:56] But I appreciate Sierra Zorvega going and working with staff and talking through some of what we've talked about from the dais because part and parcel to what we're doing now is we're hearing for the first time that you're having these issues. Not all of us represent you, and even those that do didn't necessarily know this was going on. [05:48:14] So I wanted to thank you for coming and bringing your concerns to us because if we don't know, we can't work with staff to help you work through these issues so i wanted to leave that with you um i appreciate where we got to as a board on this i know it was sort of bumpy but uh appreciate the applicant being willing to work with the community and have those conversations i know that having audibles out in the atrium aren't completely uncommon but i know they can get chaotic so i appreciate the applicant being willing to have that flexibility as well um and i also just want to say thank you for wanting to start up a business in the county that sounds like it's sort of is going to be a model [05:48:53] in how other folks should do their car washes. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you. Supervisor Lawson. Thank you, Madam Chair. A couple points. I appreciate the comments. It's called a public hearing because we want to hear from you. [05:49:11] And I appreciate the applicant and Supervisor Vega going out in the atrium to try and resolve it. We learned some things while you all were out there about some of the challenges, if you will, and it sounds like a lot of them exist and they're somewhat internal to your community. [05:49:30] So we just want to make sure that we're doing everything we can to serve you in the best of our ability. But I will tell, I will kind of echo Supervisor Vega. I have a community in my district off of Lenton Hall Road in Sudley Manor, and it's a triangle. It was part of a master rezoning a long time ago, and for a long time McDonald's wanted to go there, and all the neighborhoods, Braemar, Victory Lakes, this is in Bristow, they did not want it. It was zoned commercial, but because of the drive-thru for [05:50:07] McDonald's, they had to come through the board, and I warned the community over and over, be careful because if we drive everything away, we may get something by right that doesn't require a board action. There's an auto zone that is now being constructed. Thankfully, the auto zone looks decent. It looks decent, but I guarantee it's not probably what their first choice would have been. [05:50:35] I appreciate the applicant willing to work, you know, with Supervisor Vega and the residents. These are difficult for us, and that's why we just want to make sure that we're doing everything. I would just like to add, and I know, Mr. Shorter, we've had these conversations before about transportation. [05:50:57] I would like to add that to the directive that when staff, can we relook at when staff doesn't, you know, or I don't know what you call it when they don't have to do a TIA, a waiver request. i just think that's really important for the supervisors to know in advance as as we're working through these projects um i just think thank you i appreciate it um not that that was like the entire monkey wrench in this but just thought i'd throw that out there as well supervisor [05:51:31] bailing and supervisor angry thank you mayor mr chair madam chair thank you so much um mr murray thank you so much for your flexibility uh it seems like deja vu all over again uh and and just when you came to my office in 2020 we had similar conversations you were from i thought north carolina but maybe florida now and uh as supervisor lawson just says we're different here you know i know car wash is theirs popular here not so much so just thank you for your flexibility and to my [05:52:07] My colleague, Supervisor Vega, thank you so much for just your negotiation and hearing the people. Thank you. Thank you. Supervisor Angry. Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to get, I think this is a real good education moment. The gentleman that said we should stop developing, and to further help Supervisor Lawson and Supervisor Vega, buy rights are real. [05:52:31] And so the tractor supply store that many of you are talking about is a buy right use. So that went there without this board knowing, without me knowing, because they had that opportunity to do that. So there's going to be a lot more land decisions that are going to happen because they're buy-right. [05:52:50] This at least is an opportunity to do something before it's something that we probably don't want to see there. Not saying the tractor supply store won't do well. I just think that location was a little odd. But, again, this is what you get when you have buy-right usage. Thank you for clarifying that. [05:53:09] I know people have seen it going up thinking, oh, we rezoned it. So thank you. Okay. Seeing no further discussion, we're in the middle of a vote. Before we adjourn, I just want to, this concludes our October 24th, 2023 meeting of the County Board of Supervisors. [05:53:32] I do want to point out that our next meeting is not for five weeks, and that's November 28th. With that, I will entertain a motion to adjourn. So moved. Second. Motion made by Vice Chair Bodie, seconded by Supervisor Bailey. Any discussion? Seeing none, please vote. [05:53:52] We are adjourned. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Coraggio Consulting · aguyonx.com