Coraggio Consulting
Prince William Board of County Supervisors Meeting, Tuesday, December 19, 2023

Date: Tuesday, December 19, 2023
Place: Prince William County Board of County Supervisors, Virginia
Length: 5h 49m (video)
Official meeting video (Prince William County, Granicus): https://pwcgov.granicus.com/player/clip/3412
Official Board of County Supervisors page (Prince William County): https://www.pwcva.gov/department/board-county-supervisors

Machine transcript (speech-to-text) produced by Coraggio Consulting. Not an official county record. Names and numbers may be misspelled; check the video at the timestamp before quoting.
Speech-to-text: whisper.cpp, model large-v3-turbo. Produced 2026-11-02. Timestamps are [HH:MM:SS] into the meeting video.

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[00:30:33] afternoon it's 203 on tuesday december 19th for those who wish please join me in a moment of silence thank you if we could all rise for the reciting of the pledge of allegiance republic for which it stands one nation under god indivisible with liberty and justice for all

[00:31:08] thank you we are now on to agenda item three the approval of the minute the meeting minutes from november 28th december 4th and december 5th the chair will entertain a motion to approve agenda items 3a 3b and 3c move for approval manager second madam chair motion made by supervisor bailey seconded by vice chair bode any discussion chair wheeler i don't think your ipads have joined so i'm going to do a voice roll call on the minutes okay madam chair supervisor lawson can

[00:31:47] we separate these so i don't have to abstain from all because i was not there on the fourth oh okay um someone want to do a substitute motion for 3a and 3c so move madam chair second okay substitute motion on 3a and 3c by supervisor bailey and seconded by vice chair bode any discussion on 3a 3c okay we're ready to vote ms madden if you want to take a roll thank you i'm sorry supervisor bailey aye supervisor bode aye one second okay sorry we're running slow today supervisor angry

[00:32:24] aye supervisor franklin supervisor lawson oh that's okay i'm sorry thank you supervisor vega aye supervisor we're chair wheeler aye vote unanimous and that was for this november 28th and december 5th so if i could get a motion on 3b second motion made by supervisor

[00:32:58] bailey seconded by vice chair bode any discussion uh ms madden can you call the roll yes they are yes but yeah but i'm i'm kind of confused because mine says request to speak and mine never usually says that so i'm a little freaked out but that's all right so why don't you see if you can yeah won't you see if we can vote no boxes no it's not the right system yeah okay they're not working yet so we've got supervisor Bailey aye supervisor boat aye supervisor angry aye supervisor Franklin aye supervisor Lawson abstain

[00:33:37] ma'am supervisor Vega yes supervisor we're all right chair Wheeler aye vote unanimous supervisor Lawson abstaining from vote okay okay so that brings us on to our consent agenda item we have 21 items today are there any items anyone wishes to remove from the consent agenda item because they have specific questions or concerns that they haven't been able to have answered before today supervisor where your lights on because I know our request to speak don't work

[00:34:12] oh it doesn't okay um yeah 4j and then 4k through 4o collectively 4k through 4 are those the contracts yes okay 40 okay okay for J and then so J through oh J through oh but K through oh I can collect it deal with handling together okay supervisor Bailey okay okay no that's right so could I get a motion for

[00:34:43] for for a through for I and for P through for you you so movement your second motion made by supervisor Bailey seconded by vice chair Bodie any Any discussion? Seeing none, I don't know. Mine still says request to speak, so I know it's not in the right mode. And I've tried to load it again, just so you know, and it's not working. But if you want to take roll, that'd be great.

[00:35:14] Thank you very much. Supervisor Bailey? Aye. Supervisor Boating? Aye. Supervisor Angry? Aye. Supervisor Franklin? Aye. Supervisor Lawson? Supervisor Vega? Aye. Supervisor Weir? Chair Wheeler? Aye. Vote unanimous?

[00:35:31] Okay. Now I'll turn it back to Supervisor Weir. But isn't Jay part of the same thing? I don't know. You didn't pull that out. Okay. You want to start off with Jay then? Start off with Jay. Thank you, Madam Chair. I would simply note, I don't have an issue with the contract on Jay.

[00:35:51] However, as the town of Occoquan residents are dual taxed and they already pay taxes to the county and they provide other support in terms of school proffers, that sort of thing, I would simply like the $3,200 fee removed.

[00:36:13] I think the citizens have already paid enough in the town of Occoquan. I'll turn this over to Mr. Shorter to either ask staff or have someone come speak to this. Don't put you on the spot. Sure, no, not at all. I wasn't prepared to do this, and I don't know that Chief Newsham is here to answer this.

[00:36:34] I will say, ah, perfect. All right, come on down. Madam Chairman, members of the board, Tom Pulaski, Administrator, Division Chief with the Police Department.

[00:36:50] In regards to the fees, those would all set ongoing and future operating costs to support the facility. Madam Chair, I would simply note that given the tax revenues from the town of Occoquan and the mutual aid agreement we've got with them and the other monies that they forward in terms of fire department grants, proffers, that sort of thing, I think we can forego the $3,200.

[00:37:17] Just my thought. What I'll add, Madam Chair, you know, ultimately this is precedent setting. We are doing these MOUs for the cost, as suggested, of doing business and keeping the facility operational.

[00:37:35] That said, just like we would with FFM or any other agency that essentially charges in-house other partner agencies, we are in this case doing the same. It isn't to say that Occoquan residents aren't, not disagreeing at all that Occoquan residents aren't paying their share, but I am saying that any separate agency distinct from PD that utilizes the facility should be paying some share of the operational cost.

[00:38:12] That is why we are putting the recommendation forward as is. I do have a slight concern if we begin to eliminate costs for some organizations because it might be a question or a request from other organizations to do the same for various reasons. I might add, too, we can anticipate other towns coming forward as well in the future, just to let you know.

[00:38:38] Okay, so I take it you don't want to move 4-J then, Supervisor Weir, as is? No? Okay. Move for item 4-J. Second. Motion made by Supervisor Bailey, seconded by Vice Chair Bodie. Any further discussion?

[00:38:55] Seeing none, please vote. I think they're working now. Motion passes 7-1. Supervisor Weir voting nay. Supervisor Weir, you have 4-K through 4-O now.

[00:39:13] I have one question. I believe probably best addressed by the County Attorney's Office. How does this impact tax-exempt bonds or does it, given that we're not opening it to the public but we are renting it out to non-jurisdiction or non-county jurisdictions?

[00:39:30] Madam Chair, members of the board, we've been working with the finance department on this and our bond council on this. The private use is small enough that it's not impacting our tax-exempt bonds. We're making sure of that, though. So you'll be making sure of that before the MOU is signed?

[00:39:48] Madam Chair, members of the board, we've done the analysis for these, and going forward, we'll continue to do the analysis to make sure that it doesn't tip it over. Thank you, Ms. Robel. Supervisor Weir, would you like to make a motion on 4K through 4O, or would someone else want someone else to do that?

[00:40:07] So moved. Second. Motion made by Supervisor Lawson, seconded by Supervisor Bailey. Any further discussion? Seeing none, please vote. Motion passes unanimously.

[00:40:26] Supervisor Weir abstaining from vote. Thank you to the police department for coming out today for answering questions. okay uh that brings us we are through with our large 21 item consent agenda item which brings us on to public comment time today the board will hear in person and remote public comments we're going to begin with in-person public comment time this afternoon someone's going to give me the list we have a few people signed up to speak i'm going to call speakers five at a time each speaker will have three minutes to share their views and opinions regarding matters before the board we ask that all speakers state their name and magisterial district or generally where

[00:41:03] they reside at the beginning of their remarks and we will close the in-person sign-up list after the first 15 minutes of in-person public comments two more seconds i can thank you ms madden today we have 15 people signed up to speak i will call them five at a time our first five speakers are Marty Noe, John Ashton, Alisa Mergler, Alicia Gloss, and Alan Gloss, Alice Mergler.

[00:41:36] And feel free to line up in the back. Thank you. Thank you. Good afternoon, Madam Chair, members of the board. My name is Martin Noe. I live at 14760 Kogan Drive in the Coles Magisterial District. I'm here this afternoon in part to say happy holidays, Merry Christmas, happy Hanukkah, bountiful Kwanzaa, and a happy new year to all of you.

[00:42:00] And to all of the great staff that you've got, not just the folks who are here in this room but all 4500 or so great county employees who do such a good job of keeping our community great just came from the retirement party of Mr. Tom Smith who was one of my close friends on the staff over the years of the board it's gonna be a little sad to say goodbye to him and I'm also here to say thank you to UA board members for the service you've provided over the last four years but but honestly very much in particular I'm here to say a particularly heartfelt thank you to my longtime friend Janine Lawson who served on the board with me for five years and has served now nine years on the board and to chair wheeler who served the last four years we didn't have the pleasure of serving together we sort of passed each other as i was on my way out the door

[00:42:39] but um i want to acknowledge the two of you because um the two of you have had um it's been hard to name in all my time watching this board 26 years or so two people who have had to work more passionately during their time on the board for the things that were important to them um you've each done things and said things that i've disagreed with and i've done and said things that you've disagreed with, certainly, and you've certainly disagreed with each other, but today, I think, is a celebratory day, because even though it's your last meeting, and that can be very poignant, it can be maybe mixed emotions, maybe some sadness, maybe some anticipation for what's in the future, what I want to say is that I think it's a very exciting day for you. I think back to

[00:43:19] four years ago on my last board meeting day, and I had, again, a tremendous mix of emotions, and I'll share that one of the things I struggled with a little bit was this sinking feeling that maybe there were a whole lot of people out there who were glad to see the back of Marty Noe, who were waiting to applaud as I stepped off the cliff for the very last time or whatever it was.

[00:43:35] It was a little intimidating, a little scary to think about what life was going to be like after you lose an election. And what I'm here to tell you and promise you is this, that what you will find is that your critics will vanish. I haven't been yelled at by a stranger in Home Depot in over four years, and your critics will vanish, but you will discover this amazing group of people who love you and appreciate you and are grateful to you and are thankful to you and wish you nothing but the best.

[00:44:04] And I hope you both know that you can put me at the top of that list for both of you. And what I would say to the other six of you, and I'd say this to Chair-elect Jefferson and Supervisor-elect Gordy as well, if they're watching, is my friend John Jenkins died in office. My friend Hilda Barg had the pleasure of retiring, and I got to lose an election.

[00:44:22] But whether you die, retire, or lose an election, we all leave office someday. And when you do, it could be a very difficult day, But please know that lots of us will be grateful for the work you've done because you've done good work, and you've done it with passion for this community. And as someone who's lived here my entire life and cares deeply about Prince William County government and his organization, again, I just want to say thank you to all of you, especially to you, Chair Wheeler and Supervisor Lawson.

[00:44:45] Thanks so much. Thank you very much. Thank you. Next speaker, please. My name is John Ashton. I've been a resident for 50 years at 12306 Cedarwood Court, 22192.

[00:45:04] The last time I was here was over 40 years ago. Speaking to Chairman Seafelt and Rick Fitzner, thanking them for their help with building the rowing boathouse. I was the one that started the crew team at, I went to Washington Lee, that's where I rowed, and I started the crew team at Woodbridge High School.

[00:45:30] Little did we know at that time that it would be such an incredible success. We first started on the Fairfax side. Daryl Winslow was the chairman of the board of Northern Virginia Park Authority.

[00:45:47] And we finally got the boathouse built, and then my coach, Charlie Butt, said, now it's your turn. So I came very into Woodbridge High School, started the team there, and we used to row across from the Fairfax side to the Prince William side to pick the kids up, then row them back.

[00:46:10] The fact of the matter is, is today on your agenda, you have an opportunity to vote on a feasibility study for an additional boathouse. We want to give every kid in this county the opportunity that they've had at Woodbridge and a few other schools to participate in rowing.

[00:46:33] One of the persons who will follow me is Alice Mergler. Her grandchildren are the ones who have rowed, and that's the reason she's here. I hope that you'll be as kind and caring as Kathy Seafelt and Rick Fitzner were. thank you very much thank you very much our next speaker is alice mergler alice k mergler

[00:47:12] 9132 grant avenue in manassas but most of the things that i i do to volunteer and to help make many lives better happen in the county and i'm kidded about it all the time but uh manassas the county. After 48 years living here, moved with six boys in 1975. I've loved this county. I've loved

[00:47:42] all the ways that we have improved and become so vital to Virginia and to each other and the cities within the county. But today I've come to talk to you about one of the most important things I think that you'll ever accomplish this year and for many years to come. And that's because you're returning after we didn't get it done in April, you're returning to study the need

[00:48:18] of a new boathouse. Our boathouse is wonderful, but it was built in 30 years ago. And then it was improved and then it was improved again and you've been part of that you as supervisors and with a lot of volunteer parents and students but now we have 330 rowers already signed up to row in the spring and where are they coming from eight different high schools we started with

[00:48:57] Woodbridge High School. Many of you, last spring, I gave a copy of this book that John Ashton asked me to write, a 40-year history of crew in Woodbridge County, at Woodbridge High School for Prince William County. And the thing about the crew, when people ask me about it, they say, Alice, that's way down there. I've never even seen that water before. What makes it so wonderful?

[00:49:32] I didn't know about it either until my grandchildren said, Grandma, come and watch us row. And I said, what? And I got there, had to go down through the woods in Fairfax, on the Fairfax side, and bragging about their bigger and better boathouse, and I said, no, no, we're going to have a bigger and better boathouse in Prince William County, and we're not going to have to go over to the Fairfax side to watch the crew races. And so I'm going to read you just very quickly.

[00:50:11] I came down through the woods, and what did I see? But the Aquacuan Reservoir, our treasure of prince william county the best body of water on the east coast ask many colleges who come to use our water thank you and please please thank you for the gift you've given to our rowers this christmas you are a blessing thank you thank you next speaker please good

[00:50:49] Good afternoon. Alicia Gloss-Koles. I want to read a couple of scripture. Psalm 75, verse 4. I said unto the fools, deal not foolishly, and to the wicked lift not up the horn. Lift not up your horn on high. Speak not with a stiff neck. For promotion cometh neither from the east, nor from the west, nor from the south. But God is the judge. He putteth down, and he setteth up another.

[00:51:19] And he certainly did that, since you will not be joining us in January, Chair Wheeler. Stiff Neck, you guys wonder, what does that mean in the Bible? What is he talking about that? He's talking about a haughty spirit. And I'll read another scripture about that.

[00:51:37] Proverbs, pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall. That is probably one of the biggest issues I think that we've had with the chair that is going out, is the way that you spoke to us, the way you ruled, the way you earned the nickname, the Queen. You did not govern with grace, that's for sure. And I know that history will not be too kind on you. But I am happy you have been dethroned. We, the people, have spoken.

[00:52:07] And in the end, our voices couldn't be louder. We spoke, and you'll be exiting. You'll be dethroned. I usually don't like to speak and thank politicians, because I don't think that all of you deserve thanks for doing your job that you were elected to do. I believe that my job as a citizen is just make sure that you're doing your job and to hold you to the fire. But I do want to give honor to Supervisor Lawson. She is leaving. She has served this county for over 20

[00:52:45] years. I believe it's 23 years of service to this county and a great sacrifice of her time and her talent to this county. It is truly a sacrifice for you and your family, and I recognize that, and to all of you. I know that it's a sacrifice to all of you as well. I will recognize that.

[00:53:03] It's very hard to sit up there and listen to us, you know, hold you to the fire, but that is your job. Also, I want to thank you, Supervisor Lawson, for standing up for the people and resisting to continue to go on with the status quo. I wish you and your family much-needed rest and relaxation and giving them the time that they have missed out over this time with the sacrifice that you have done.

[00:53:32] And I want to wish everybody a Merry Christmas. And to all of our first responders, a lot of you are sacrificing your time away from your family to keep us safe, and I don't want that to go on without me acknowledging that. And to all of our men and women, I have a family, I have a son-in-law who's active duty, and a lot of them are missing their time with their family, And I'm very appreciative for their service.

[00:53:55] Thank you. Thank you. Before our next speaker, I'm going to call our next five to line up in the back. Elizabeth Moritana, Allie Stoger, Karen Sheehan, Irene Magnan Kelly, and Neil Kelly.

[00:54:10] Please proceed. Ellen Gloss-Coles, what you're seeing here are the working needy. These people are making too much money to qualify for food assistance, but not making enough to keep food on their tables.

[00:54:29] At St. Thomas Church, these cars line up around the building and down the street past the post office to receive food for their families from the charity. The church can serve 160 families, yet organizers tell me that they regularly have to turn people away hungry. The folks in these lines are still required to pay both real estate and personal property taxes, despite their ability to put food on their own tables.

[00:54:48] Those taxes are put in place by this board. Social service records show a 48% increase in new assistance requests since this board has been seated. The scene in this video is repeated almost every day and in every district in this county. Looking at the costs this board has spent to feed themselves during its Tuesday meetings is shocking.

[00:55:10] In the first 11 months of this year, the board has had only 19 meetings, yet they've blown nearly $13,000 of our money engorging themselves, more than the average American spends on food all year. Even though they don't show up to work before 2 p.m., the board still requires employees to have lunch waiting for them.

[00:55:29] The staff have to order yet another dinner spread four hours later. Never are county staff allowed to order McDonald's or a pizza. Nope, they can only order from bougie restaurants like Carrabas, Los Totecas, Bonefish Grill, Firebirds, Texas Roadhouse, and the Cheesecake Factory.

[00:55:45] Most wasteful. Sometimes our board decides to go out to eat, even though the county already purchased food for them, making us pick up the tab twice. Why are we even purchasing your meals? You just gave yourself a 70% raise. It's not like you can't afford your own meals.

[00:56:00] Why can't you pack a lunch, or it's 2023, why not order yourself some DoorDash? This is a photo at St. Paul's in Woodbridge District with a sign saying Pantry Closed. But there are still folks lining up despite the sign because they are hoping they will be food left over.

[00:56:17] Mr. Shorter and Ms. Roble, two of the top three highest paid employees in the county, are having their meals provided for them by taxpayers. Yet the employees you see down here running the meeting are only allowed to pick from the scraps after the board members have had their fill.

[00:56:33] Mr. Shorter, who hasn't even been here a year and just got two raises of 6% and 3%, his base salary is more than $380,000 a year. He also gets a luxury car allowance and something called deferred compensation of an additional $20,000 a year.

[00:56:49] This makes his salary more than 10 times the salary of the average Virginian. He still eats for free on Tuesdays. Why? Why can't any of you bring or order your own food? If you're too good, why can't you all pay with your own money instead of ours? We pay for our meals at work.

[00:57:06] It's time this board recognizes that you are no better than the rest of us. And with Ann Wheeler's reign of terror over, it's time to end the board's free meals. In January, put a pantry close sign over your excessive meal spending because the people can no longer afford a ruling class. Thank you.

[00:57:22] Next speaker, please. Elizabeth Martirana, Gainesville, Prince William County resident for 47 years. I want to share a story. Over in Fairfax County, a scandal began in 1966 when a U.S. grand jury returned 24 zoning bribery conspiracy indictments against 15 county officials and developers.

[00:57:53] Of the 15, eight were convicted, including Supervisor L, former Supervisors C and P, and five developers. Zoning and land development issues were major political topics during that period as the county board wrestled with proposals for the then Baron Tyson's Corner area.

[00:58:14] A former congressman who had taken office as a supervisor two years previous recalled that county residents were shocked by the zoning scandal. He is quoted as saying, Very few people had any idea it was going on, unquote.

[00:58:31] Those 24 indictments resulted in sweeping reforms in Fairfax County rezoning practices. Two years after his conviction in the corruption probe, Supervisor L. and four others were convicted in 1969 on federal charges of fraudulently obtaining more than $600,000 in loans from a Washington Savings and Loan Association by allegedly submitting forged mortgage applications.

[00:58:59] that conviction resulted from an investigation unrelated to the zoning scandal we are always told to follow the money follow the money trail vpap the virginia public access project helps with that county attorney roble and your staff at this time i do not believe that any judge will find you guilty of dereliction if of duty if you recuse yourselves from this majority board of supervisors as soon as possible. County Executive Shorter, I would suggest you do the same. Supervisor Vega,

[00:59:36] Supervisor Lawson, Supervisor Weir, I thank you for your integrity. It speaks to what it should mean for an elected official to take a seat on that dais. The citizens of this county want and need statesmen, and during this two-year-plus battle, you three have endured pressures that no supervisor should have to endure. We definitely do feel your patriotism and love of country.

[01:00:03] Supervisor Lawson, we all will miss you terribly. I will miss you terribly. But I know in my heart of hearts that bigger and better things are yet to come your way. And I wish you all the happiness in the world. Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. Allie Stoger, Gainesville District. Liz just mentioned very few people knew what was going on, presumably discussing about Tyson's

[01:00:37] corner zoning. Over the last few weeks, I've had the opportunity to speak with literally hundreds of people in Fairfax, in Prince William County, both on the east end and even people in Gainesville and Bristow. Almost none of them, none of them knew the extent of data center zoning that has occurred. Over the last few days, ever since the supervisor meeting, there have been numerous

[01:01:10] articles in all kinds of online sources, newspapers. None of them have the same numbers for how many data centers are in Prince William County or are being zoned or have been zoned or are being built. In fact, one of the key sources said, oh, now Prince William County has as many data centers zoned as Loudoun.

[01:01:36] Well, no, with the Prince William Digital Gateway, it's double Loudoun. So nobody's getting the numbers right. I mean, I had to make my own map. Supervisor Weir had to make a map with pushpins on it trying to show where all of these things are.

[01:01:54] Where is the official county accounting for how many data centers are going to be here and how big they are, how many square feet, how many diesel generators they're going to need, how many HVAC rooftop chillers each campus is going to need?

[01:02:11] The public is being kept in the dark. Very few people know. Even people within Heritage Hunt had no idea. I spoke to someone that I know well in Heritage Hunt, and she actually said to me, I didn't know the Prince William Digital Gateway was going to be the largest data center alley in the world. The public is uninformed. There have been no town halls that go over the holistic impact of what is happening here. Now, Liz was talking about corruption, graft, all kinds of things like that. I don't know about that. I can't say that any of you have done anything improper.

[01:02:50] But what I will say that is completely improper is you have kept your citizens that you represent in the dark, and that is what's going to come back and haunt you. It may not be the illegal things, but as people are watching data centers pop up like mushrooms, there's going to be fury on the west end of the county.

[01:03:12] It's already starting. And you know what? The people on the east end of the county, those that know about all of this, you've promised them money. You've told them there's going to be schools and fire and police and all kinds of other things. Have you told them it's going to take 10 years to get that?

[01:03:30] What kind of havoc are we going to have in this county when the West End feels completely trampled over and the East End isn't getting the money that they've been promised because it's going to take so many years? Those kids are going to be well past high school before that money is there for schools.

[01:03:47] None of that has been told to the public, and nobody has a holistic view on what's been zoned in terms of data centers. I think that's really wrong. I think those of you who are staying on the board should make that a first order of business. Thank you very much. Thank you.

[01:04:03] Next speaker, please.

[01:04:16] Karen Sheehan, Gainesville District. Janine, thank you. Thank you for doing far more than your job.

[01:04:38] One thing I want you to know, Janine, is that Tom couldn't be here because I gave him a whole list of to-dos so that I'm ready for Christmas. But he sends his love and his thanks. Molly couldn't be here because she left us too early, and I know you loved her velvet ears.

[01:04:59] But Clyde is here in the car because he wants to say thank you as well. To all of the rest of you that will be here next year, it's going to be a very busy, very, very, very busy, happy year.

[01:05:27] Next speaker, please.

[01:05:48] Ms. Mann, did you stop the clock because she stepped away from the microphone? Can you please give those flowers to Janine so that she can appreciate them now? I have a vase. I'll bring you a vase. Next speaker, please. Thank you, Janine.

[01:06:07] Our next speaker is Irene Kelly. Hi, everyone. Irene, Carol, Bunye, Magnani, Kelly.

[01:06:23] A lot of life went through this, but one thing my mama taught me was if you have nothing nice to say, don't say it. you know, and then my brother, we do it in a vote. Before I get on to accolades, I have to say this, and I'm trying to say it in a most sincere way, but Supervisor Bodie, you broke my heart. I really thought you were going to live by your words of if the CPA isn't followed, I can't vote for it.

[01:06:56] And then a 0.25 major switch, and I thought, my goodness. I hope that as we start doing the development along the Gainesville, please keep in mind what you really were aiming to do to make it better for people. In the meantime, accolades. Supervisor Vega, Supervisor Weir, boy oh boy,

[01:07:29] am I glad you joined the Pony Show. And Supervisor Lawson, you are three people for whom our area of Gainesville really relied upon, and you did a fight, you fought a fight, and like I said to my husband and anybody else I know. We're going to continue to fight for our community. And why?

[01:07:52] Because when I put my head on the bed, I want to look in the mirror and say, I tried. I tried not just for me. I tried for the children who are going to have to breathe in all those fumes from hundreds of diesel generators, hundreds that have to be run on a regular basis because they have to be tested. And as I said the other night, the winds can take those fumes miles over to the eastern

[01:08:28] side where our supervisors voted to have it done. I hope your families, I hope our families don't suffer for what is being predicted will happen to this area, the pollution. All we can do is keep trying. I hope you all really in your heart are doing what you should be doing for the people of Prince William County. And thank you again. Ms. Lawson, something's coming your way. Definitely.

[01:09:02] And it's going to be good. Thank you. Before our next speaker, I'm going to read the next five. Patrick Harters, Elena Schlossberg, Laurel Harters, Margarita Moylan, and Teresa Minns. Good afternoon, supervisors. My name is Neil Kelly, and I am from the Gainesville District.

[01:09:28] And I, once again, am repeating the same thing over and over again, coming down to speak to you folks. Unfortunately, I get the feeling as a citizen of Prince William County that my voice was not heard. I noticed everybody playing with their tablets and their iPhones and texting or playing solitaire, whatever they were doing for the last two years. So hopefully this one last time I'll be down here trying to say something that everybody will listen to.

[01:09:53] Again, I'd like to echo the voices that everybody has been saying for the last couple of minutes that we want to thank Supervisor Lawson. I'd like to thank Supervisor Weir and Supervisor Vega for being a voice of reason in this whole past two years. Supervisor Lawson, you were a beacon of hope to those of us from the Gainesville District who were left without a voice in our county government for so long when we were under the thumb of somebody who was reclused from discussing this and decided for their own gain to move forward.

[01:10:25] But that shouldn't be a surprise because that seems to be the way some of the other folks here are operating. So thank you for being our beacon of hope and coming through for us and listening to people who are not your direct constituents, but yet your fellow residents of the county. And for Supervisor Weir, thank you for stepping up, and Supervisor Vegas, thank you for stepping up and listening to the people and understanding that we had a voice in this, and at least we feel we tried.

[01:10:50] As my wife said, at the end of the day, when you go to bed, you say, I tried. We realize that sometimes elections, there's always going to be a winner and always going to be a loser, but at least, you know, we feel we had a voice in trying to do something. So thank you again for your effort, and thank your family for sharing us, sharing you with us for all the time that we took away from your personal life.

[01:11:12] Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. I'm Patrick Harters in the Gainesville District. It'd be easy to come in here and talk about what just happened last week. It's funny, I got a text message from someone that said, you're not going to believe this supervisor Bodie just voted no. And I said, no, no, no. I know this guy. He's just itching. He can't wait till he's going to go call him, call him, call him. All of a sudden, he'll come up with some idea. And then we saw what happened. So didn't fool me for a second is what I predicted.

[01:11:46] Didn't fool anybody here. We predicted that would happen. This is a day that is, people have said, bittersweet. It is bitter to see supervisor Lawson Janine no longer serving. We were left when Pete Canlan somehow came up with the idea to expand the study into his own property.

[01:12:07] And none of you objected. You all voted and said, yeah, that's a great idea. Let's vote for it. Give him cover. He can vote no. So corrupt. And that's why I said this is the most corrupt county in Virginia. That was the beginning of it. Then there's deleting messaging and everything else that, you know, Ann, you've been involved in where you delete comments from public forum, your secret meetings you have.

[01:12:27] There's so much that's happened. But there's some people that have really shown character and credibility. Yes, Lee and Bob have been great. Janine's been special because when we were left with a supervisor that was hiding in his basement and nobody to talk to and was hiding from us, if he saw us in the story, take off and run from us, we were told to contact Janine, and she stepped in and really did so much work and was really serving as two chairs, and so we're so proud of that.

[01:12:56] I got you this hat, Janine. I'd love you to wear it. Last two years, or four years, it's just, you know, it's been a shit show up here. And that's what I got you, the supervisor hat that demonstrates it. So I'd love you to have those. I'd bring it up, but I wouldn't want to scare anybody if they started falling over by me walking towards there.

[01:13:15] But on the other side, the celebration comes because it's Supervisor Wheeler's last meeting. And I remember when COVID happened, and my kids were forced to wear a mask, and I said, you know, this doesn't go with science.

[01:13:32] strapping our kids up with their faces covered, sitting all day breathing that terrible air, scare tactics, division, you know, damaging to our children. And I remember when they got out of school and they finally got to take that mask off and breathe fresh air and live a life like people should. And I look at Ann Wheeler as being that mask. There's just false information, divisiveness. Remember chasing that girl around, a pregnant woman on hay market days? You know, things like that, accosting people, the sneers, the unkind words. Janine Lawson did everything that you said you would do. She brought people together, different parties together. She served

[01:14:11] our county. Republicans and Democrats, it didn't matter. She gave them a voice. You did the opposite, Ms. Wheeler. And I'm glad for DeShundra and this new day coming, and we're very excited. So thank you. Next speaker, please. My name is Elena Schlossberg, and I live in the Gainesville district, and I too want to take this opportunity to say thank you. You and I go back quite a while,

[01:14:49] Supervisor Lawson, and it's important to stand by your word. It's really all you have in life, and I don't know if all the supervisors were able to watch any of the video of the prayer vigil, but we all loved the beginning which talked about integrity and I appreciate the integrity that you

[01:15:20] have shown for getting the facts out for willing to step up when Pete clearly had abandoned his community you didn't have to you did not have to take on the Gainesville district when you had so much happening in the Brentsville district. And you don't get enough appreciation for that.

[01:15:48] I appreciate your friendship. I appreciate your just common decency and humanity when so much was happening in my own life. And you showed real compassion and love. And I appreciate you being

[01:16:16] there for Kim. It meant everything to her. She knew she was leaving this earth with people who had integrity and care and love for what was important, and no one can take that from you.

[01:16:42] I don't know what is next for you, except that, like, you may not be on the board, but the rural crescent and the fight to protect Prince William County is not over. It's just Another chapter in the journey, and as Kim would say, onward.

[01:17:06] And Kim is so proud and appreciative of your hard work. She is so proud of Supervisor Bob. She really is. And Supervisor Vega, you didn't know Kim, but she was an amazing woman, and we should all aspire to hold that kind of integrity and goodness.

[01:17:33] And so I just want to say thank you, and I love you. Thank you. Next speaker, please.

[01:17:49] Laura Harders, Gainesville District. I brought these roses for Janine. Supervisor Lawson, thank you so much for your service. I can't tell you how much it's meant to my family and my community, how you have fought and you have been a friend to those who felt they didn't have a voice.

[01:18:06] Thank you so much. I want to say to Supervisor Bodie, I was disappointed with your decision to abstain. You should have just voted to approve it, because in essence, that's what you allowed to happen.

[01:18:26] And Cher Wheeler, I have a song for you. I want you to know I'm happy that you no longer will be chair of this board.

[01:18:59] You tried to limit free speech, accosted citizens in the street, thousands of residents signed your recalls. You gave smirks and eye rolls, built up your stock portfolio. I heard you made a really excellent profit.

[01:19:17] Cause any backdoor deals that you gave and were made enraged Prince William citizens countywide. Oh, and every time someone speaks your name, I hear disdain for Queen Anne's reign. Can you feel it?

[01:19:33] Well, can you feel it? And I'm here to remind you of the mess you're leaving this county in. It's not fair to deny it, of the mess we'll bear for your recklessness.

[01:19:53] Yo, yo, yo, I don't know. Well, I'm here to remind you of the mess you're leaving this county in. It's not fair to deny it of the costs we'll bear from your self-interest.

[01:20:15] Yo, yo, yo, I don't know. Thank you. Next speaker, please.

[01:20:35] Hi, my name is Margarita Moylan from the Gainesville District. Four to three and one abstention, which equates to a yes. After this vote the other night, the political process is over. Now begins the legal process.

[01:20:53] And thank God our system is set up where we have a judicial system that oversees and determines the legality of politicians' actions. Supervisor Weir had it right. Get used to the term arbitrary and capricious.

[01:21:10] I am confident that you all know the term, as I'm sure your lawyer has advised all of you of this. As politicians, there is a system set up that you have to follow.

[01:21:27] After all of the FOIA requests and all has been evaluated leading up to this, the truth will come out, and the courts will ultimately decide. That is when you and all of your actions will be scrutinized.

[01:21:45] You brought us here, cramming things through after staff recommended denial, after planning commission recommended denial, after the chair, Ann Wheeler, lost her seat, after the citizens spoke, Yet you sat here and exposed the county and our money to a legal battle.

[01:22:08] Janine, I have to thank you. And I would never have gotten to know you had it not been for this battle. But you stepped in when the West had nobody there to represent them. When Pete Canlon cowardly didn't even show up to many of the meetings and had to abstain from anything related to the data centers.

[01:22:32] On my way here, I passed six dead animals on the side of the road. Raccoons, possums, deer, all near the data centers that are being built. What you have done to the western end of Prince County will never be forgiven.

[01:22:53] Yesly, I need to thank you as well. You stepped in and also tried to fight against all that was happening right before us. And shame on you, Ann Wheeler. You lived in the Royal Crescent, sold your land, moved to a gated community where you felt you were protected from the rest of the western part of the county.

[01:23:14] Yet you joined in with all of those representatives on the side of the county that has no data centers. You guys have chosen to destroy the western end of the county, and Janine could have stayed in her position and would have been safe in that place.

[01:23:33] But she put herself out there trying to save this county. Thank you, Janine. we will miss you. And thank you, Bob. We really needed you when you came in, and we'll continue to need your help. Thank you. Before our next speaker, we have two more speakers that I'd like to call up. Aileen Johnson, after the next speaker, and then Kathy Kulik. Please proceed.

[01:24:00] Therese Cements, Potomac District, and my supervisor isn't sitting in her chair. Thank you, law enforcement first responders. To you, I wish a Merry Christmas and a Happy New year. Sad John Gray running against Ann Wheeler didn't win the chairman. Since Wheeler's takeover, Prince William County has lived in hell. Honorable citizens, that is, have endured hell. The political elites, Democrat and Republicans, have betrayed Prince William County, Virginia, and American,

[01:24:37] America, sorry. John Gray is and would have been fiscally responsible. John Gray would have protected the citizens of Prince William County. John Gray would not have Prince William County be his money tree like Ann Wheeler and the four. I say four because I have nothing nice to say.

[01:25:00] When 9-11 happened, I emailed Lou Dobbs and wrote, America would go down, but they would go down from within and it would be by our politicians. They are the enemy and it is happening. Anything social justice is George Soros promoted. So when Supervisor Bailey talks about social justice, she promotes George Soros. How many of our residents are taxpayer exempt so they don't

[01:25:37] care how high the taxes go up? And sad I hear whining about low wages, but we bring in outsiders for our highest paying positions i did not know mr shorter that you were getting 380 000 a year that is criminal that is criminal when we have people from within you are a criminal and god help us and save us from you especially your staff the policeman from montgomery county maryland

[01:26:14] he lost his legs but by the grace of god his life was saved you know what's sad is having to stand here and see supervisor no excuse me chairman wheeler grinning she's been grinning this whole time he lost his legs by the grace of god he's alive and that's because it's democrat run and they let their juveniles they let their criminals run amok 70 pay raise can't give a break to

[01:26:45] aqua quan that's sad but i want to say this again how many of our residents are taxpayer exempt so they don't care how high the taxes go up. I question if some of our board members are tax exempt. Bye. Thank you, Ms. Minns. Next speaker, please. Christmas season has got me all over the

[01:27:23] place, so I think I'll be quite focused today, but I'm gonna try my best. Good afternoon. My name is Zyane Johnson, and I am a member of the Woodbridge District. I stand today as a wife, mother, and advocate to foster parents and foster children, specifically a child by the nickname of Bumpy.

[01:27:40] let's not forget about Bumpy. Ms. Wheeler, and I'll say this to you, thank you for the moment. I understand everyone's concerns as it relates to data centers or certain decisions that were made. That's not my stance here to speak to that, but thank you for the moment. Because when we had the opportunity to speak the other week, it was just Ann, and I imagine somebody refers to you as Ann.

[01:28:01] So thank you for that moment. Ms. Lawson, thank you for the moment. Thank you, thank you. I'm not going to cry. Thank you for the moment. You show my husband and my daughter a great deal of kindness. Thank you. And to you, Mr. Shorter, Exodus 8, 9. And Moses said unto Pharaoh, glory over me, and when shall I entreat thee, and for thy servants, and for thy people, to destroy the frogs from thee, and from thy houses, that we may remain in the river only. And Pharaoh, like Christopher Shorter, said tomorrow, you, Mr. Shorter, learn like Pharaoh, you are arrogant.

[01:28:38] Instead of dealing with the matter related to a child, bumpy, you pass the investigation back to county employees to investigate themselves concerning my family. Their best efforts, because we're going to put this on the record too, I love to do that, their best efforts revealed a bogus plot of our family fostering children so we could defraud, this was said in court, DSS of $10,000. You exposed my family's personal information, including social security numbers, my children's personal information, home address, bank statements, as well as many other things, the list goes on. But even with the act of low hanging fruit, that's the best that y'all could

[01:29:17] do. We're not backing down. I'm still here since March 7th. We're not backing down. In the spirit of Christmas, my family has two gifts for you, Mr. Shorter. Number one, a song dedicated to you on our website, www.baconforbumpy.com. You can thank Lord Tennyson for that because after we talked about what happened at court, we got a song for you on the website, www.baconforbumpy.com.

[01:29:43] And number two, our second gift, a preliminary list of the individuals who will be subpoenaed in 2024 to answer why they failed to act in the best interest of a child. That child's nickname is Bumpy. You're at the top of the list.

[01:29:59] Christopher Shorter, Courtney Tierney, Diane Gestrich, Erica Hilton, Nicole Brown, Phyllis Jennings-Holt, Margaret Franklin, Bridget Alston, Elijah Johnson, Cheryl McMullen, Lillian Diaz, Andrea Bailey, Jennifer Yao, Katina Wafer-Graves, Linda Meyer, and I close with this.

[01:30:20] A child in Prince William County did not get his Christmas gift this year. And why is that? Because that is of arrogant Christopher Shorter. Bumpy does not have his gift. Next speaker, please.

[01:30:45] The overhead, please.

[01:31:07] Kathy Kulik, Gainesville, I need the overhead, please.

[01:33:00] Thank you very much, Ms. Kulik.

[01:34:51] Let it go without saying we love you. Thank you. That was great. Was that your last word? Thank you. Thank you. I think this concludes our in-person public comment time for today. for people who have signed up. It was closed at the end of the first 15 minutes.

[01:35:10] We will move on to item number, let's see, we're on to our public hearings. Hey. We do have one online speaker. Oh, okay. Supervisor Bodie, I will turn it over to you.

[01:35:28] Let's go ahead and hear from them. Your speaker is Mike Ketchmarek. Mike Ketchmarek, Heritage Hunt, Gainesville. I'm the former chair of the Gainesville Democratic Committee, member of the Democratic Committee, and I have resigned from both organizations, so I can speak freely. I was totally appalled with the board's vote last week. We totally discarded any principles of good government. You did not continue negotiations until you got the

[01:36:03] best deal. You did not give staff enough time to do its job. You did not make sure you had the regulations in place and that they were enforceable. Once approved, you gave up all your negotiation leverage. Nothing was verified at the last moment. Never negotiate with a deadline. Your sleep deep deprivation was against government interests. Most seriously was rejecting the voters by not allowing the new board to vote on this issue. These are just to name a few things. I do not know if it was the millions in charitable contributions caused by the owners that would

[01:36:41] be selling their land to data centers or the hundreds of thousands of political contributions you receive that convince you to surrender to the developers. But I know it was not the tax revenue estimates which have been shrinking. From the $700 million max fantasy based on allowing county tax rates to the Prince William County Finance Office estimate of $400 million to last week's QTS and office estimate, which is now about $100 million each.

[01:37:06] It's going to occur for 20 years. It appears you were working for the developers and the large landowners and not the residents of Prince William County. You just wanted to surrender, and that's what you did. I will never support your candidacy for public office, and I will do all I can to defeat you in a primary so you will not be the Democratic candidate.

[01:37:27] The five of you cannot be trusted with the public interest. The only hope is that you made enough mistakes and the court will return this issue back to the new board. If that happens, four of you will get a chance to rehabilitate your reputation and political careers by doing the right thing and exhaust all negotiations to get the best deal.

[01:37:50] Supervisor Voting, you're not a profiling jury. Voting against it in a vote you knew would fail. And then abstaining in the vote that your no vote would have been critical in providing more time to confirm all developers' claims. The latest is Chair Wheeler's $40 billion in investments, while Prince William County Finance Office added $25 billion last year.

[01:38:14] Did you give staff a chance to even check this out? This information is critical for tax collection. Another new fact is this complex will use 2 million households' worth of electrical power. At the end, you will need to string power lines in all directions to feed this monster.

[01:38:32] I only hope that you will have another chance to vote on this and everything will be better. So, happy holidays, and thank you. Thank you, Mr. Kashmirik. So, we are now, it's done?

[01:38:51] Okay, thank you. I'm sorry, is that someone's, I'll let you guys leave if you're going to, so. We are now on to our public hearings today.

[01:39:18] Item 6, Supervisor Brody. Thank you. Madam Chair, before the board opens, the public hearings discusses and votes on agenda items 6A and 6C involving a boundary line adjustment, vacation of various easements, and conveyance of real property and other property interests to schools related to Rosemont Lewis Park Elementary School and the new elementary school, the Potomac Shores Community.

[01:39:38] My wife is a school employee. As a school employee, my wife and I are members of a group which is affected by this matter. I will be participating in it because I am able to do so fairly, objectively, and in the public interest. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Vice Chair Bode. Supervisor Angry. Well, sadly, I have to read the exact same statement, so bear with me.

[01:39:58] Madam Chair, before the board opens the public hearings, discusses and votes on Agenda Items 6A and 6C, involving a boundary line adjustment, vacation of various easements and conveyance of real property and other property interests to the schools related to Rosemont Lewis Park Elementary School and the New Elementary School and the Potomac Shores community.

[01:40:21] I need to declare a personal interest in this matter. My wife is a special education instructional aide with the schools. As a school employee, my wife and I are members of a group which is affected by this matter. I will be participating in it because I am able to do so fairly objectively and in the public interest.

[01:40:40] Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Supervisor Angry. We have four public hearings this afternoon. There are no presentations associated with these items, so I will now open the public hearings on items 6A through 6D. Ms. Madden, do we have anyone signed up to speak? Do we have anyone online?

[01:41:01] If anyone wants to speak to items 6A through 6D, please approach the microphone in the back of the room. Seeing no one approach the microphone, this will officially close the public hearings on items 6A, 6B, 6C, and 6D.

[01:41:20] With that, the chair will entertain a motion to approve agenda items 6A through 6D. So moved. Second. Motion made by Supervisor Lawson, seconded by Supervisor Bailey. Any discussion? Supervisor Franklin. Sure. Just want to highlight item 6D, conveyance of ingress, egress, and shared parking easements for Jefferson, basically Jefferson Plaza.

[01:41:42] The developer applied for and received approval to rezone Jefferson Plaza to construct an affordable housing project. As part of the rezoning, the developer agreed to construct shared parking and other improvements on the park parcel, which necessitates a stormwater reservation area and access easements.

[01:42:01] Today, we are authorizing approval of the reservation and deed of easements to meet a deadline of January 18, 2024. Thank you. Seeing no further speakers, please vote. Vote unanimous.

[01:42:23] Okay. Thank you, Ms. Madden. Thank you, Ms. Madden. Thank you, staff, for coming out to answer all those questions. Brings us on to item number seven. Mr. Shorter, the floor is yours. Thank you, Madam Chair and board members. First, I wanted to just acknowledge last week's board meeting and all the work, as you all know, in preparation and planning that had to take place among staff.

[01:42:51] I wanted to just thank all of the staff who had a role to play in helping to make sure that last week's meeting, in terms of logistics, prep, and planning went well. So for all of the team here, certainly for FFM, police, fire, our planning staff, management, and budget, certainly executive management, just want to express my sincere appreciation for all of the preparation and all of the work that needed to be done.

[01:43:28] certainly in advance of the public meeting and hearing, and certainly during. Some staff volunteered, was not a part of their assignment to be here, and they stayed throughout the entire meeting. And just want to acknowledge and, again, appreciate all that they did in preparation.

[01:43:50] We heard it earlier today, and I want to acknowledge it. I believe Tom, I just saw him come in. He may have left out after the public hearing. 39 years of service. Yes. Tom Smith has served this county extremely well.

[01:44:10] Again, 39 years. Friday is his last day here with the county, and he will be missed and certainly celebrated and acknowledged. I want to, as I put in an email to the board, Acting Public Works Director Ms. Dominique Ward will serve for a 60-day period while we continue the recruitment for the replacement for Tom Smith.

[01:44:42] Last but certainly not least, I'd like to turn the floor over to Vice Chair Bodie to provide for a presentation. Sure. Thank you. And Mr. Schroeder, if you could join me at the podium as well.

[01:45:06] A commendation for Brentsville District Supervisor Janine Lawson for her years of service to the community.

[01:45:30] Whereas, Janine M. Lawson was elected as Brentsville District Supervisor in 2014 and was re-elected twice to represent and serve the people of the Brentsville District. And, whereas, in addition to serving on the board as County Supervisor, Supervisor Lawson served on various regional boards and commissions including the Potomac-Rappahannock Transportation Commission, the Virginia Railway Express Operations Board.

[01:45:52] And, whereas, Supervisor Lawson has also served as Chair of the Innovation Owners Association in the Innovation Technology Park. And whereas Supervisor Lawson also served on several community organizations, including the Bridalwood Homeowners Association, Glen Kirk PTO, and she was appointed and then served as the chair of the Prince William Safe Schools Council.

[01:46:13] And whereas for more than 25 years, Supervisor Lawson, her husband Dan, have called Princeville home where they raised two children, Catherine and Luke. and now, therefore, upon the end of her term, Prince William County government hereby commends and recognizes the service of Janine M. Lawson, the Prince William County Committee.

[01:46:30] Congratulations. On a personal note, before I move on to the next one, Suresha Lawson, I know we haven't always agreed on everything, but I wanted to thank you for your years of service to the community, to the county.

[01:46:58] When I took this seat back in 2020, I looked at everyone that was here as a mentor, and you were one of them, so I wanted to thank you for that. Next up, Chair Ann B. Wheeler for her years of service to the community. Whereas Ann B. Wheeler was elected chair-at-large of the Prince William Board of County Supervisors during the 2019 general election and assumed office on January 1 of 2020.

[01:47:22] And whereas Chair Wheeler, her husband John, and her two daughters moved to Prince William County in 2001. Whereas Chair Wheeler has actively served the people of Prince William County for more than 19 years. And, whereas, Chair Wheeler served as a NOVAC board member from 2005 to 2018, and she continued to be an active member of the board of the Hilton Performing Arts Center.

[01:47:44] And, whereas, Chair Wheeler served as a chair of the Prince William Board of Social Services from 2008 to 2011, where she gained invaluable insight into the operations of the county government and budget process. And whereas Chair Wheeler served on various community and civic boards to include Shelter Lakes Homers Association from 2004 to 2007, the Prince William County School Northern Boundary Committee from 2005 to 2006, the Gainesville District Budget Committee from 2005 to 2007, the Board of Social Services from 2006 to 2011, and the Stonewall Middle School Advisory Council from 2010 to 2011.

[01:48:22] And whereas Chair Wheeler is a graduate of Prince William County Community Leadership Institute and served two-year term as president in 2018 and the Prince William Committee of 100, a nonpartisan civic organization that provides a forum to raise awareness of county matters. Now, therefore, upon the end of her term, Prince William County government hereby commends and recognizes the service of Ann B. Wheeler to Prince William County community.

[01:48:46] Thank you so much. And likewise, Chair Wheeler, thank you for your years of service to the community, both before and during your tenure as chair.

[01:49:02] And we wish both of you all the best in your years to come. We want everyone to come down for a picture. Everyone can come down for a picture. Everyone from the dais. Come on down. Surprised you, didn't we? As they make their way down for photos, I just want to just express my sincerest appreciation, Vice Chair Bodie, for providing remarks and for your leadership.

[01:49:33] But to Chair Wheeler, to Supervisor Lawson, thank you for your willingness to serve. It is not a simple matter to take up the mantle to be elected and certainly to have served this county in the way that you do.

[01:49:55] It is late night. It is weekends. It is countless constituent calls. and we appreciate you on behalf of the entire staff here in Prince William. Thank you. Thank you for your service. And text and all of the above.

[01:50:14] Thank you for your service. And thank you to the communications team for framing the commendation for us today. Thank you.

[01:50:23] It was a surprise, but thank you very much.

[01:51:40] I'll have some words later on in the evening, probably at the end of the evening. But, Mr. Shorter, it's still your time on the floor. Yes, thank you, Madam Chair. I'd like to turn it over now for our external auditor, Scott, to provide for a presentation. Thank you very much for having me today.

[01:52:01] Can't tell. You can all see my presentation. Can you speak in the microphone more? If you need to raise the podium, you can do that, too. Thank you very much for having me today. My name is Scott Anderson. I am from Cherry Beckert. I met with the Audit Committee earlier today and provided them the details of the status of the audit.

[01:52:22] I'm here today to present you with a summary of those remarks. I have a presentation, a slide deck, which highlights some of our key or required communications, those communications to those charged with governance that are required by our professional standards.

[01:52:40] We have not completed our audit at this point. Today I am providing you with an update of where we stand. So as I speak, it's not in past tense, it's present tense because we are still working on some things. but I wanted to let you know what it looks like at this point.

[01:52:56] And then when we do complete our audit, which we expect to do in early January, we will issue a letter with the same required communications to update where we landed when we were complete. Now, if you bear with me, we'll skip forward a little bit.

[01:53:15] So we are engaged to perform an audit in accordance with generally accepted auditing standards and government auditing standards. The purpose of our audit is to provide an opinion, express an opinion, as to whether or not your financial statements are fairly stated. As I mentioned, we are still in progress.

[01:53:33] We are shooting for the end of December. We believe it may be closer to sometime the first week or two of January that we will issue that report. As part of our audit, we consider internal controls over financial reporting.

[01:53:50] Our purpose for considering internal controls is not to express an opinion but in order to design our audit procedures. because we aren't designing our audit to test the effectiveness of internal controls we do not express an opinion on the effectiveness of internal controls however if we do identify deficiencies in internal controls we will provide you with that communication and let you know what we found currently at this point in the audit we don't have any control deficiencies to report to you management is responsible for the selection and use of accounting policies those policies when

[01:54:28] when you receive your financial statements are the first note disclosure. Note one lists out all your accounting policies. In our current audit, where we currently are, we have not noted any inappropriate accounting policies of the county.

[01:54:48] As part of our audit, we evaluate the county's identification of and accounting for and disclosure of relationships and transactions with parties as required by professional standards. I won't go through the details of this slide, but just so you know, that is part of our audit, as part of normal audit procedures in accordance with our professional standards.

[01:55:10] At this point, we have noted no transactions entered into by the county during the year for which there is a lack of authoritative consensus or guidance. We have not seen any significant transactions recognized in the financial statements for which there was any lack of that guidance.

[01:55:30] Embedded in all sets of financial statements are estimates. estimates are tested for reasonableness and management bias in order to determine that they are founded and the financial statement amounts are correct.

[01:55:48] We also review the financial statement disclosures to ensure that all are consistent, clear, and concise, which we are still working on as part of our audit. One of the important things to communicate to you is our independence.

[01:56:03] If we are not independent, our financial audit opinion is not as valid. We are in fact independent with the county and the other underlying component units for which we perform audits.

[01:56:22] At this point during our audit, we have not encountered any significant difficulties or disagreements with management. We are not aware of any consultations that management has had with other firms to "opinion shop is what we call it to debate with us on an accounting decision, but by the time we are done with our audit, we will request management to provide us a representation to those facts.

[01:57:01] We have not identified at this point in our audit any fraud or illegal acts or any other issues that we believe that this group should be made aware of. Included in your financial statements are certain parts that we do not express an opinion on there are required supplementary information such as the management discussion analysis and required supplementary information on your pension trends which is not subject to our audit we do review that information to determine that it is consistent with your financial statements we also included in your financial statements are supplementary information schedules on

[01:57:41] non-major funds budget actual schedules we also review those that information and express an opinion in relation to the overall financial statements. And last, within your financial statements are what we call other information, your introductory section, the transmittal letter, which is written by executive management, and the statistical section.

[01:58:04] We also do not include in part of our audit. But again, we do review it to confirm consistency with the rest of the report. With that, there are some reporting changes that are upcoming, which we have communicated with your audit committee as well as work with your finance department to ensure that they are made aware of those and will apply them as they come due.

[01:58:28] And with that, I'm available for any questions that you might have. Thank you very much. Are there any questions on the presentation, Mr. Short, or anything you want to add? Just the appreciation to Terry and Becker for their work and for their partnership, obviously.

[01:58:45] Open it up for the board to provide for any questions if there aren't any madam chair I'll close my portion of the agenda and and we will follow up. Okay Don't you madam chair? Supervisor Bodie. It's not a question. I want to again thank them for their their their meeting this morning with the Joint Audit Committee I did want to give the the county exec a quick second to address an issue that was brought to me in the fact that For the primaries next year, right now it's set so that for LAZO is the early voting location for the eastern end of the county.

[01:59:20] Not the president, just the congressional primary. And because two years ago we were given the authority to change that as opposed to the electoral board. And we have not done so as of yet. And so I've received quite a bit of different feedback from my constituent that they would like to see the DMV change the primary location for the primaries.

[01:59:39] So I wanted to give the county executive time to talk about that if you wanted. Sure, sure. I know that Director Eric Olson has indicated his support for the idea, also indicated that he would be working with our clerk's office and would bring the recommendation back via ordinance to the board in the early part of next year.

[02:00:06] I believe in terms of timeline, if we could get an ordinance to the board for your consideration by February, then we could certainly make the, we will not be able to make the presidential primary, but we will be able to make the congressional primary in June with that change.

[02:00:22] So board look for some recommendation via ordinance sometime in February for your consideration of a change in location. Thank you. Sure. supervisor Franklin sure and I think that's an important discussion I will say that particularly a lot of my constituents in the Woodbridge district appreciate the opportunity to go to the for Lazo building and so I would certainly be supportive of us exploring multiple options instead of

[02:00:58] just having maybe one option so I'd like for maybe I don't know if that's giving a directive or whatever but I would certainly like for Falazo to be a consideration at least as an addition to the DMV no directive necessary we will in the interim prior to bringing an ordinance forward I'll ask for Eric Olson and deputy CXO Quentin Haynes to come to meet with everyone to make sure that we have a sense of every of everyone's perspective

[02:01:31] so that we bring an ordinance that properly represents the ward's perspective on this. Supervisor Vega and then Supervisor Bailey. Thank you, Madam Chair. Just one clarification, and this request came about because why again, Supervisor Bodey?

[02:01:51] Some folks brought it up? Yeah, so historically the DMV has been the main voting location for the primaries for early voting for years, And then what happened was a couple years ago, the General Assembly passed a law shifting the power to change that from the Electoral Board to the Board of Supervisors, whatever governing body there is for the locality.

[02:02:12] And since we have not set an ordinance officially, it went to become for laws, though, for the primaries, as opposed to the DMV. And so a lot of my constituents in particular, but I know a lot of other folks like the Dale City area and Supervisor Ingris District and what have you, have reached out and said, hey, you know, what happened there?

[02:02:28] Could we look into possibly putting it back to the DMV? as it used to be. I just want to caution the board as to going down this road only because there were several changes that were made and I've received a lot of you know questions concerns about voting locations being changed and there was never I guess you can say an interest in moving some of those locations back to where people used to be because they preferred it so I just want to want us to be mindful as to the why because that can open up a door that we're not going to be able to close because in certain folks are going to be like well I was changed and I don't like this

[02:03:04] location can we consider moving me back to my old location I think it's it's it should be a part of the conversation that we have um because I certainly don't want anybody else to feel like their concerns aren't heard and now all of a sudden you know we're trying to change things around to accommodate some folks that are concerned a few of them very much understand so I'm trying to recall the the sort of conversation the sort of in writing from director Olson and I believe that the that the one difference here is that the location for Lazo

[02:03:37] is the primary location is different than the general election location and it is the only scenario where that is the case so that being said we will do around with the board and make sure that before we come in February that there is a need the latest ordinance on this I think was the 2021 ordinance, and so if there's a slight update to that ordinance, we'll make sure that whatever we do, that it properly represents the board's desire.

[02:04:10] Supervisor Bailey. Thank you, Madam Chair. Yes, it was County Exec 2021. That was the year that we did it. But that's not my point. I wanted to thank Terry Beckert for your level of support and how you've supported our staff and made things that could have been quite complicated, very simple, as we govern through this trying time coming out of COVID.

[02:04:37] And so I just wanted to say thank you publicly. Supervisor Weir? Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Schroeder, since we've opened this can of worms with respect to voting locations for the primary, particularly the in-person absentee ones,

[02:04:54] Could you also chuck onto your list looking at what the provisions and limitations are at the early voting locations with respect to campaign literature and signage, as I suspect the library board may have overstepped their bounds with respect to the western location, and if we could just get that squared away once and for all so that I don't have to hear from anybody on both sides of the aisle complaints?

[02:05:25] completely understand that point appreciate it we did talk about the need for us to to reassert it is not a change in policy but just to reassert the policy is associated with signage especially at our government buildings we will do that prior to our presidential camp primary election and certainly by congressional thank you so I'll just add two things um you know know one being you know early voting we've had three locations there's nothing that precludes

[02:06:02] us from having more than three I don't think that we're limited so you could always look at the volumes in different places and have two in one area of the county and just to supervisor Weir's remarks about the western end the piece of land that all the signs were taken down of on the corner of Leitner and 15, I believe, is private property.

[02:06:27] When you look, it's part of the Dominion Valley HOA, and they chose to take those down. So I don't think it was necessarily an overstepping on the library board's part, because that is in county property, when you look at the tax rolls. Supervisor Weir. Thank you, Madam Chair.

[02:06:44] Actually, I was speaking about where people have their tents set up in front of the entrance, Not necessarily the road, but actually a majority of that section of the road is actually VDOT and county easement, not owned by Dominion Valley.

[02:07:02] I beg to differ. I looked it up, and it's owned by Dominion Valley HOA. I also looked it up and looked at the plat lines, and a good chunk of it is in the right-of-way. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. So that moves us on. I guess you're through, Mr. Shorter.

[02:07:17] Okay, thank you. Not supervisor. Ms. Robel, the floor is yours. Thank you, Madam Chair, members of the board. We have no items for a closed session this afternoon. I want to thank the board for their dedication and commitment for this term, and I want to wish everyone a happy holidays, and I want to thank Chair Wheeler and Supervisor Lawson for your dedication and commitment.

[02:07:37] We'll miss you, and I look forward to working with the rest of the board and the new board moving forward. Thank you. Thank you, Ms. Robel. With that, we are on to item number nine, agency time, the section of this agenda. We have two staff presentations.

[02:07:53] Our first, I believe we have David Sinclair from the Budget Office on a resolution to transfer budget and appropriate $14.8 million for various things. Mr. Sinclair, welcome. Good afternoon, Chair Wheeler, members of the board.

[02:08:11] He told me to. Good afternoon, Chair Wheeler, members of the board.

[02:08:30] My name is David Sinclair, Director of the Office of Management and Budget. I'm here today to brief the board very quickly on FY23 agency operating surplus in the general fund, as well as staff's recommended use of that operating surplus.

[02:09:15] Okay, this slide merely summarizes the unrestricted general fund operating surplus from agency operations. It does not include the general revenue surplus that the county's chief financial officer, Michelle Latchreed, will brief you on immediately after this presentation.

[02:09:34] Broken down by functional area, our expenditure savings was $19.1 million, offset by an agency revenue shortfall of $10.8 million for a net operating surplus of $8.3 million.

[02:09:49] However, during FY23, we had a couple atypical transactions that occurred. First is fire and rescue savings, that's primarily salaries and benefits expenditures. That was shifted to CARES Act funding, resulting in $8 million of expenditure savings to the county's general fund.

[02:10:11] Also, when the board approved the FY24 budget on April 25th, the board authorized staff to sweep ADC expenditure savings back to the general fund. That resulted in an additional $6.2 million of expenditure savings. These are not recurring things. Moving forward, these will not be typical transactions that you will see in subsequent fiscal years in fiscal 24 fiscal 25 when you add all of that together we had a expenditure savings of 33.3 million dollars with a net operating

[02:10:50] surplus of 22.5 million dollars that 22.5 million dollars is what i'll be reviewing with the board right now of that 22.5 million dollars we have the following recommendations For projects that are in the adopted CIP, we are funding, uh, following the funding schedule for these projects.

[02:11:15] The first one is 6.3 million for the judicial center renovation project. This is the third and final year of funding, uh, to complete that. And in, uh, with this $6.3 million, we will be renovating courtrooms, replacing the roof and emergency generators at the facility.

[02:11:37] Another $5 million is recommended for the Building and Facilities Capital Program. This is the FY25 component. We are pre-funding it, if you will. Both these projects were originally planned to be funded by the Capital Reserve anyway, and so we are following the funding plans for these projects.

[02:12:02] Staff is recommending $3 million to begin implementing recommended strategies in the Community Energy Sustainability Master Plan that the board approved on October 24th. We have feasibility studies underway for electrification of county buildings, converting the fleet to low or zero emission vehicles, and perhaps solar projects.

[02:12:27] We do not have specific projects at this time. We need to complete these feasibility studies. But this $3 million starts capital funding for that multi-year master plan that the board approved in October. Additionally, we have half a million dollars recommended for facility master plans that the board requested via directives.

[02:12:53] We have the Recreation Center in Woodbridge, Davis Ford Park, Lake Ridge Row and Boathouse Feasibility Study, and some recommended examination of alternatives for the Dale City Neighborhood Library.

[02:13:14] Lastly, the items on these funds are unbudgeted. They are designations. What that means is we would be designated this funding to a reserve or a new fund. It is unbudgeted at this time.

[02:13:30] Staff does not have the authority to spend this funding. Staff would have to come back to the board at a future date. to request that budget appropriation either through the annual budget process or an off cycle agenda item the first one is a new local affordable housing fund in the amount of five million dollars this starts capital funding for that future endeavor we recognize as staff that it is pending the development of a affordable housing ordinance and a housing trust the last 2.4 million

[02:14:10] would be designated to the county's capital reserve in accordance with our principles of sound financial management. The intention of the capital reserve is to provide working capital and a margin of safety to withstand unexpected but necessary project cost overruns without the need of borrowing. And again, this is unbudgeted. In order for staff to use this funding, we would have to come back to the board with a specific use this is the final slide this merely summarizes

[02:14:44] staff's recommendations on the fy23 agency operating surplus and i'll be happy to entertain any questions thank you as always mr sinclair any questions anybody want to hit their button to ask questions okay thank you we have no questions and we have nothing we have to this is just information correct yes okay great which comes to our next agency presentation Ms. Attreet welcome I was gonna say don't we have do we have a motion to

[02:15:23] approve the agenda 9a hold on madam chair I would like to move 9a for approval thank you supervisor Bodie for keeping us on track motion made by vice chair Bodie seconded by supervisor Franklin any discussion chair yes very Very quickly, I want to thank Alice Mergler and the folks from the rowing and crew community for their constant efforts to lobby for an additional or a renovated row house.

[02:15:51] I know that it's been a long time coming. I know there's been a lot of folks that have expressed interest in this for quite some time. I know it's been a little bit slower pacing than folks would want, but I know that this isn't only an asset to the Occoquan district, but also for the entire county. because I know there's folks from all across the county that utilize this.

[02:16:10] And also the Davis-Fort Park, I know that I share constituents with Supervisor Vega that I've been looking forward to this park for a very long time. So I'm happy that we're looking to move forward on that master plan for that as well. Thank you, Madam Chair. Very good, Vice Chair Bodie. Supervisor Franklin. Yes, very quickly just want to highlight, I think we are moving in the right direction in terms of hopefully a recreation center in Woodbridge.

[02:16:37] I've talked about this before. we don't have any facility on the route one corridor the closest is dale city rec center which is about 17 minutes away from the route one corridor you got chin which is even further away and the closest we have is the boys and girls club which is not a county facility at all so i'm hoping in the future to get the support for the building of that then also obviously we've been talking about affordable housing since day one this is the first in my opinion pass issuing a directive the first real step that we're actually taking towards our commitment to affordable housing so i think this is an important step forward but we still have more

[02:17:15] work to do we still need the ordinance i think that's still a very important part of this and that's something that we'll continue to to press staff to make sure that we get that as soon as possible supervisor bailey thank you very much and i couldn't hit my button i just uh i just wanted to ask Dave for the housing trust fund that's just is that the housing fund is that the same as the trust fund or is it well so part of what we are we are

[02:17:53] setting aside the funding as Dave mentioned in anticipation of us bringing an ordinance to the to the board I think we're all set my thing disappeared to vote because I went to speakers. Ah, thank you. Seeing no further discussion, please vote. Motion passes. Seven to one. Supervisor Vega voting nay. Thank you. Ms. Atreid, welcome. Hi. Good afternoon,

[02:18:32] Madam Chair, members of the board. I'm here today to present to you the general revenue and fund balance reserve update. I'm first going to go through the economic update. I'm not going to spend a lot of time on this, but I do want to kind of paint a picture of the economy right now. This first slide is the at-a-glance that you saw in September, taken from our quarterly report.

[02:18:52] Basically, right now, we're sort of in a neutral holding mode. I have a few slides that will kind of go into detail on where economists think the economy might be heading in 2024. But these are all many of the metrics that you're used to seeing. We did add back on now the prior year. For a while, we were just comparing it to the prior quarter during COVID because it was just so unique and rapidly changing.

[02:19:14] But now we have the prior year and the prior quarter both, and really just in that neutral kind of territory right now. We've seen a significant rebound in unemployment since the COVID-19 pandemic. You'll see that peak line right now at Prince William County.

[02:19:30] We're at 2.8% at the end of September, slightly higher than Virginia, but still lower than the nationwide unemployment rate of 3.8%. One of the things I will point out is the national unemployment rate is at its highest level in nearly two years. And so, again, kind of painting that picture of the economy is at a little bit of a slowing right now, but still moving along.

[02:19:53] Nationally, the National Association of Realtors presented to us, and they said, you know, the monthly job gains are softening across the nation, as this graph depicts. You'll see the right end kind of tailing off there a little bit. Again, indicator that the economy is slowing down. And because of that higher unemployment across the nation, some of the wage growth is dampening a bit.

[02:20:13] So you'll see there at the right, it's a little flat. And again, this is nationwide data by the National Association of Realtors. I have provided some economic commentary from the November time frame. I'm not going to read all of these to you, but Vanguard says they're likely to send a U.S. economy into a mild recession in 2024.

[02:20:32] EY Parthenon, while a soft landing, remains our base case. We see the odds of entering a recession, about 50%. The conference board, again, leading to a very short and shallow recession. And a few more, Fannie Mae, they're in the camp of forecasting a mild recession in 2024, nationwide financial recession, same with Charles Schaub.

[02:20:53] So not a deep recession, but most believe that come 2024, first, second quarter, we may see a mild recession. This slide, once a month, I attend a finance network presented by Virginia Tech, and Dr. Bailey talks about the economy.

[02:21:11] This is her, I like to call it a quilt, it's sort of colorful. But of all of the different things that are facing the U.S. economy right now, you can read about any one of these in the newspaper on any given day, but these are all things that we pay close attention to as we monitor the economy. This next slide is another one of our at-a-glance slides from September release, talking about revenues, vehicle sales, and our real estate market.

[02:21:35] Again, all kind of that neutral trend in territory right now. This slide from the National Association of Realtors shows that home prices are up, September 22 to September 23, that's the green line, so slightly up. But if you look at Prince William County, we're up from $498,500 to $540,500.

[02:21:56] And a lot of that is due really to the constrained inventory. Nationwide, there's about 3.4 months of inventory. In Virginia, there's about 2.2 months of inventory of homes. But in Prince William County, 0.8 months, not even a full month of inventory.

[02:22:12] So that's why we're seeing those prices creep up, because there's just not enough homes on the market. Nationwide, when we think back to Great Recession and the housing bubble, that's what that high mark on the Mortgage Credit Availability Index is. Lending standards were much looser than they are now.

[02:22:31] So you'll see the closer they are to 100, the tighter those lending standards are. So there's really no concern of a big housing bubble, if you will. Lending standards have remained under control since the Great Recession. And then nationally, the existing home sales are down about 21% from pre-COVID levels, so just fewer sales nationwide.

[02:22:53] And finally, one of the biggest unknowns is the repayment of student loans. That has now kicked back in, and economists don't know what kind of impact that will have on spending. What we do know is in Virginia, the average debt per borrower is about almost $40,000. About 12.8% of our population are strapped with federal student loans, And about almost a little over 19% of those are in some type of income-driven repayment program.

[02:23:17] We also know that the New York Federal Reserve Bank reported that Americans now owe over $1.8 trillion on their credit cards. And TransUnion has reported that consumer spending on card balances is more than $6,000, the highest in over 10 years.

[02:23:35] During COVID, there was a lot of savings that happened. Those personal savings have now been dipped into, and so the savings are also declining. So all of those could lead to some slowdown, again, in spending and sales tax, food and beverage tax, some of those things where we have enjoyed nice increases.

[02:23:52] You know, we're in kind of a wait-and-see mode, what happens in 2024. So to talk about a little bit about our 23 recap, you adopted a budget of about $1.2 billion of general revenues. These are our general tax revenues that are shared with the schools.

[02:24:09] Real estate is about 64.3%. I can remember when that pie chart showed it about 74, 75%. So we have picked up gains in personal property. A lot of that's driven by appreciation, but some of it is driven by that economic development and the success that we've had with commercial development.

[02:24:26] You'll also see a diversification of that pie chart, food and beverage tax at 1.9%. And then in that all other category, you have cigarette tax. So our preliminary audited surplus is $42.3 million. The biggest driver of that surplus is personal property tax, about $23.3 million is from vehicles, $5.8 million from commercial, primarily computer and peripheral taxes, food and beverage tax, food and beverage, $11 million surplus there, and then investment income, $9.9 million, and that's due to the rising Fed fund rates year over year, allowing us to earn a little more interest income.

[02:25:06] On the real property side, we've talked about this one before. We do maintain a reserve, a real estate reserve, and so that was a reduction that we made to shift funding into a reserve. So what do we do with the surplus now that the year is almost over, or the year is over, but we're almost done with the audit?

[02:25:24] You have principles of sound financial management. We start with the general fund, general fund, unassigned fund balance. That's a reserve. That's 7.5% of general fund revenues. Next, we split that surplus with the schools, and I have a slide on that coming up. We then have a revenue stabilization fund that we fund at 2% of general fund revenue.

[02:25:43] Next, we would put money into the capital reserve at 2% of the required minimum balance, which we do maintain. We then fully fund the economic development opportunity reserve at $3 million. And then finally, any additional funding would flow into the capital reserve for one-time capital spending and to support that cash to capital and to support our AAA bond rating.

[02:26:05] So the split with the school looks like this, $42 million of surplus. They do contribute toward the unassigned fund balance contribution on their pro-rata share. So first we contribute $11.1 million to unassigned. That leaves $31 million to split with the schools, so $17.7 million is their share, and $13.2 million is our share.

[02:26:29] This slide summarizes the $42.2 million surplus, the $10.8 million shortfall that Dave just talked about, and then his expenditure savings of $33.3. So you have total resources of about $64.7 million. Next, we reduced that for an action that we took prior to year-end of fiscal 23, where we funded the public safety adjustments for fire, ADC, and sheriff as of April 1st.

[02:26:55] So $5.3 of that goes to fund that item. We maintained that fund balance at 7.5%, the $11.2 million. we transfer 17.7 to the schools their share we maintain the revenue stabilization reserve that requires three million our economic development fund is fully funded at this point and so there is no replenishment needed and then that brings you to 27.5 million dollar net available for the capital reserve but we also have to factor in a board action that was already taken to fund the residential solar program of 1.2 million and then i think december 5th some magisterial district

[02:27:33] You're saving projects of just about $300,000. And then if you adopt the presentation that just got adopted, $19.8 million. That does not factor in the capital reserve piece. It's part of that 6.2, falls to the bottom line.

[02:27:50] This graph just shows the history of the unassigned fund balance. Again, that increase of 11.2, keeping it at that minimum 7.5% threshold, and towards the end I do have a slide that will show how we compare with our peers, our AAA peers.

[02:28:07] This slide shows the revenue stabilization, funding that at the 2%. That's a $3 million increase to $29.4 million. What I do want to point out on this slide is between 2015 and 2016, you'll see a big drop. That's because under prior policy, we used to put our excess into revenue stabilization.

[02:28:24] Now we keep the revenue stabilization at that minimum. The excess goes to capital reserve for one-time capital. But what I will note, so when we get to the capital reserve slide, you'll see a like increase in between 2015 and 2016. And so this slide rolls forward the capital reserve.

[02:28:44] The last audited balance at the end of fiscal 22 was $99.3 million, bringing in that net surplus of $6.2 million, less interest in a net of interest earnings, marked a market and closed project adjustments of 8.4.

[02:29:00] Your fiscal 24 budget had a adopted fiscal 23 budget had $10 million for the judicial center renovation project, $1.1 million via resolution for property purchase on Linton Hall Road for a library, $1.8 million for public safety, computer-aided dispatch, and then some smaller usages. So the preliminary audited number is $83.6 million at the end of fiscal 2023.

[02:29:27] But rolling that forward, bringing that $83.6 million forward, your fiscal 24 budget has budgeted usages. Another $6.3 million for judicial center renovation, $3 million for the public safety communication at schools, $2 million for 911 call handling equipment, $6 million for the building and facilities capital program, $3 million for the Garfield underground tank replacement, and then finally an action that was just taken to fund $1.2 million for the CRC project. And so the projected balance at the end of next year, not accounting for any surplus that could roll into

[02:30:03] it is $62.1 million. I point that out because you'll see here on this slide 2015 to 2016 that big infusion into capital reserve. That was a shift of funds from one pot to the other. Those are funding sources or funding reserves that our rating agencies consider. And so you'll see we have maintained about that $60 million mark. And so we're now at $62.1 million. So the message we have given to the rating agencies is we build it up and then we plan for drawn expenditures we draw it down we build it back up and so you'll see we're kind of in that drawing it down and so what I would say is you know we're at a point that I think we need to build it back up to plan for

[02:30:43] those next larger expenditures down the road and then jumping ahead just a minute to fiscal 24 because I did just issue recently the first quarter report we obviously we aim to be as accurate as possible. Here's a history of the accuracy. 99% in most years, 98%. You'll see post-COVID, it has been a little more challenging to predict the revenues that will be coming into the county. Some of the things that are difficulty is that the consumer behavior is a little, you know, when you would think people would be drawing back, they're still spending. They were doing

[02:31:22] lots of home renovation projects, for example, during COVID. Vehicles has been particularly challenged, and I'll give you an example. Historically, the net kind of in and out of vehicles over the course of a year is usually between 5,000 and 7,000. It was a trend for a long time. In 21, we lost 4,700 vehicles out of the county. In 22, fiscal 22, we gained 13,000 vehicles. In 23, we lost 3,000. In 24, we've gained 14,000 so far this year. So it really has become a little unpredictable. A lot of that, I think, is availability of vehicles being not

[02:31:56] available. The prices that was happening, selling the vehicles to make a profit perhaps, but it has been challenging to predict because of those change in trends. I've already kind of spoke about diversification with the food and beverage and the cigarette tax, but what I'll show you in fiscal 24 is that that pie is now growing to 2.3 percent. So that diversification is expanding is what we want to see. It makes us less reliant on our main two sources of real estate and personal property tax. You'll see real estate now is 61% of the pie, and personal property is 22%.

[02:32:31] At the end of the first quarter, we have not yet revised our forecast. What I will say is, if you look up in beverage tax, it's adopted at $32 million. It was $40 million at the end of 23. So we will likely be coming back with an $8 million adjustment on that line. But again, because of the slowing economy, we really kind of want to watch and see what happens first and second quarter of 24 before we bring forward an adjustment. Same with personal property. We know there's 14,000 new vehicles that have entered into the county, far above what we estimated. So there'll likely be some type of adjustment made there. So that will happen either second or third

[02:33:10] quarter. I will point out that tax relief continues to grow. 89% growth in five years. Our fastest growing category does remain disabled vets. 144% increase in that quarter category with about 6,200 is the average amount of tax relieved. Our tax relief overall was 44 million in 23 or nearly five cents on the tax rate. The history of computer and peripheral tax, I do want to point out that the value of a nickel is now about 1.6 million dollars and we are now at a rate of 2 dollars and 15 cents. If you recall the county reduced the rate many years ago to try to attract data centers

[02:33:49] and then over the last few years we increased that computer and peripheral tax rate. This is an updated data center tax revenue chart. Again, I call it preliminary unaudited for 2023 because the audit's not done, but we are now at $114 million from data centers or a 1,670% growth since 2012. And finally, we recently had some bond sales to the VPSA and through the IDA, and we get a credit report. And what we heard from the rating agencies is we have a lot of

[02:34:26] positives. So if you look at that left side, you'll see a lot of strengths in the county of why we're triple AAA jurisdictions however I want to point out the two negatives our fund balances continue to remain well below similarly situated AAA counties nationwide and locally and then we have a debt and pension burden that's above average you often see that in a growing community so we are able to explain that somewhat they also give us a negative because of our proximity to the federal government even though we have shown to really be insulated from some of the you know sequestration and budget cuts at the federal level just our proximity alone they will

[02:35:01] continue to rate as negative there so this chart does show and this is a revision from what was dispatched we had the peer median and the AAA county median lines flip-flopped the top one is the AAA county median you'll see well above 45 percent our peer group locally which is Arlington Chesterfield Fairfax Hanover Henrico Loudon Anne Arundel Howard County as well as Wake County North Carolina. They are that red line above 40% in reserves. The AAA target is 35%. And so you'll see we are not at 30% yet. So on that metric, we are AA. And so I do caution on, you know,

[02:35:40] we want to try to build those reserves up and follow our principles of putting the funding source into the capital reserve, building it up, using it for that one-time capital. And then rating agencies also look to really how the board and the county govern. Governance factors our willingness to make proactive policy choices to ensure we have sound financial and strong financial practices going forward, a financial cushion to weather, economic uncertainties.

[02:36:09] And what they say is that entities that attempt to increase expenditures for popular programs and services, but they're unwilling to raise the revenues, cut other programs and services to pay for it, over time will deteriorate your fund balance. And over time, your debt load will grow.

[02:36:25] And so I just want us to keep that in mind as we make a lot of decisions. I know the county has a lot of needs, and we just need to be really smart about how we go about it and making sure that we're adhering to that principles, and we will continue to keep that triple-triple-A. And with that, I will entertain any questions. Thank you, Ms. Atrey.

[02:36:43] Are there any questions? Supervisor Vega. Thank you, Madam Chair. Can we go back to slide 36 since we're the closest to that one right now? In regards to the negatives, you just briefly talked about it. How much over the AAA target are we over for our debt and pension program in terms of, like, real dollars and as a percentage?

[02:37:04] I can get that to you. We have that in our fiscal health report. I don't have that with me today, but I can get that to you. There is a metric. Thank you. And can you point to anything specific that has led us to this point and any corrective measures that we can implement to not be here? So, no.

[02:37:19] If you're a growing community, quite frankly, you're going to be above it, right? You're going to be issuing debt. We're still building schools. We're still building roads. When you look to some of our peer, some of these peer jurisdictions like Alexandria, Arlington, they're pretty well built out, right? There's not a lot of room for growth.

[02:37:35] There's a lot of revitalization going on, but they're not building a lot of new schools like we are. So you do see that some of the younger communities having a higher debt burden. What's important is that we stay within our principles, and we do have definitions within our principles of sound financial management of when our debt burden, you know, can't exceed 3% of our overall assessed value.

[02:37:55] So those principles need to be followed, and we've been well below those. So we're able to explain it to rating agencies, you know, but it's something they look at as negative. We're not AAA there. Fortunately, there's lots of other practices that pull us up. We do have a balanced five-year plan.

[02:38:12] We do have very strong governance practices in place. We do have, you know, reserves in place and reserve policies to fund those reserves, and we adhere to it. We do fully fund our pensions every year, right? So while our pension burden is high, we fund it in full as actuarially, I can never say that word, required.

[02:38:29] And some jurisdictions, you know, in economic downturns have chosen not to do that. This board has stuck with that. Actually, it's incorporated in your principles now. So those are things that help that situation. You know, I think we will always, for a while, be a little higher on that part because we're still a growing community.

[02:38:46] Okay, thank you for that. And then I have a question in regards to slide four, but I don't think you have to go to it. It's just a chart of the significant unemployment rebound since the pandemic. I'm curious, you know, do we know why Prince William County's unemployment rate has inched ahead of Virginia as a whole?

[02:39:02] So the presenter talked about all of northern Virginia has inched ahead a little bit. Some of that is sort of that outward migration, right? People are now working remote, and a lot of people are choosing to move farther south, a little rural, near some lakes. So you're kind of seeing a migration outward of kind of those high, dense population areas.

[02:39:23] Is the way it was described, anything else you would add? That's kind of what we heard, I think. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Supervisor Vega. Supervisor Bailey. Thank you, Madam Chair. Michelle, you know we always do the kabuki dance with this one. So I'm going back to the slide, I think it's slide 37, when you were talking about the fund balance percentage of revenues.

[02:39:45] You said the county's rating is at AA. That's the comparison with other counties, correct? That's not. So that's looking at just our fund balance as a percentage of revenue. That's just one metric, right? There's a lot of metrics the rating agencies look at. That's just one of the metrics.

[02:40:01] And on that particular metric, we are AA. We don't have the target AAA is to have your reserves at 35% of revenues. We are at 26, looks like, on that chart as of the end of fiscal 2022. So we're below that threshold.

[02:40:16] We become AAA because there's other practices we have in place that demonstrate, you know, we're going to pay our debt. so yes okay okay I always ask you that every year because I want to make sure that the the community knows that our AAA bond rating is not has not left as we're still at AAA but that's correct we are still a triple AAA yes so thank you so the other thing that I want to ask was going back to when you were talking about slide number 38 quantitative considerations you were

[02:40:52] explaining in our governance and how we govern and how that affects our practices also can you reiterate that please a little more in layman terms sure so rating agencies um say to government governments that you know boards are generally they have lots of pressures to fund lots of programs and services and if a board i'm not speaking to this board i mean in general they're talking about governments in general if a board um is unwilling to raise the revenues in other raise taxes, a new source of revenue to pay for those new programs and services, over time what will happen? If the board is unwilling to do that, but you take on that additional expenditure,

[02:41:29] which is typically ongoing, over time you will deplete your reserves, right? Because there has to be a way to pay for it. And so that's your reserves, or you'll have to issue debt to pay for it. So they caution organizations, you know, when taking on new programs and services, really think about how are you going to fund it? Is there a revenue-dedicated funding source that can sustain it for the long term just needed clarity thank you thank you supervisor Bailey supervisor Brody thank you madam chair um if you could go back to the the slide that had the positive negatives

[02:42:01] um just a quick question about the ESG part um I know that ESG the environmental part of that talks about not only environmentalism but also emergency preparedness uh mitigations of of uh catastrophes things like that I know that in the last year or so we've been investing more into emergency preparedness you know taking some of the lessons from from from covid but really beginning to grow into our own in that between that and our new adoption the csmp which we funded even more of today do you see that becoming a stronger positive in the future so we asked our our rating agencies um that same question we were actually part of a pilot group i think it was

[02:42:41] moody's when they rolled out esg they selected 38 localities nationwide to assess and separately rate ESG. ESG used to be rated sort of intertwined throughout the rest of the metrics but now they have a separate rating just on ESG and we were one of the jurisdictions selected so we got a preliminary kind of report on it and we did very well but of course I asked okay we're negative in some of these how do we pull it up like we're doing this and the answer was there are some things that no jurisdiction fix like we're just all going to be negative so while we're negative

[02:43:16] were at the top of like everybody if that makes sense supervisor angry thanks manager just a curious question i don't know if it was like 27 there's that one slide that said um um garfield and you were paying for that tank i'm just really curious about that i just it was it was yeah that was on capital reserve i think capital capital reserve uh here we go yeah see that garfield underground tank replacement i'm just curious how was how was sure so we have some underground

[02:43:52] tanks at Garfield substation police station and those need to be replaced and they're pretty expensive to replace okay got I think I know where I see those on the corner there the parkway okay all right just curious about right thanks supervisor Bailey while we're on that slide I forgot to ask my question about the crisis receiving proposed resolution what is so that's now a past resolution okay I think you just passed it okay today when I dispatched it was

[02:44:27] still proposed yes okay well seeing no further questions for ms at treat at this time I will entertain a motion to approve item number 9b so move madam chair oh see okay then I forgot a motion didn't need a motion we're all good okay Well, that brings us to 10, which is supervisor's time.

[02:44:58] We have the resolutions for the appointments 10A through 10F. A motion of approval for items 10A through 10F. So moved. Motion made by Supervisor Angry, seconded by Supervisor Bailey.

[02:45:14] Yeah. Okay. Any discussion? Hold on. Seeing none, please vote. Vote unanimous. Supervisor Lawson abstaining from vote.

[02:45:30] Okay. Thank you. That moves us on to supervisor's time. Today I'm going to start to my left. Is that okay? Are you able to start to my right? No, that's okay. My last time, I'll start to my left. That's okay. Thank you, Madam Chair. Good afternoon, everyone. Just wanted to enlighten everyone.

[02:45:47] December 6th, I thank the Transportation Department for participating in my town hall in the Ashland community. We had a great conversation, and they're looking forward to the new things that are going to happen in Ashland that hasn't happened for a very long time.

[02:46:05] On December 7th, I had the pleasure of attending the press conference for the Special Transportation Extending the Long Branch Road with the Northern Virginia region, and I was there with my colleagues, and it'll be a game-changer for transportation going north and south here in Virginia.

[02:46:26] I attended the wonderful manure lighting ceremony also in Occoquan with Supervisor Bodie. It was very touching. December 8th, I want to thank Colonel Brooks for honoring his chief of staff and a wonderful veteran servant, Sergeant Major Barry, who has just been such a big player as it relates to the IGSA that we've secured here in Prince William County and the partnership that we've established.

[02:46:58] And so, Sergeant Major Barry, I wish you the absolute best in your next endeavors. December 8th, we had a great time with Santa and Mrs. Santa in the Dumfries Christmas Parade. It was so much fun, and I want to thank the Boys and Girls Club mentees for participating and passing out candy with me and Dumfries.

[02:47:18] On December 14th, my staff and I attended Chair Wheeler's open house, and we had a great time. Great food, Madam Chair. And also, in my office, on the same day, we had our appointees' annual holiday luncheon, And it was great food, but it was absolutely great to hear the appointees talk about the things that we've accomplished in the Potomac District.

[02:47:41] And so I thank you for your service, and I look forward to the future in how we're going to serve citizens in the Potomac District. Upcoming, I'm looking forward to attending our orientation and swearing-in service. I'm excited about that. But lastly, I just want to offer true heartfelt and warm condolences for three of our residents in our community.

[02:48:05] One, condolences to Ms. Hildebarg's brother who passed away, Papa Dent. We will miss you, Papa Dent. He owned the Crab Entrepreneurial Business here in our community, and we'll miss him. So our thoughts and prayers go out with former Supervisor Hildebarg and her family.

[02:48:24] And I also would like to offer condolences to the Felder family. Some of you may have heard on the news we lost one of my residents, Lieutenant Colonel Lloyd Felder, unfortunately, to suicide. And so please, please, please keep that family in your prayers.

[02:48:45] He served his country. He served this community. And I had the honor of meeting him last year, or this year, during re-election season. and I will miss his spirit. And so blessings and prayers to the family. And then, let's see, I'd also like to, let's see, please note that, okay.

[02:49:06] So that is all. I'd just like to wish everybody happy holidays and just enjoy your families. And to Madam Chair and to my colleagues, Janine Lawson, I, too, look forward to working with you when I first came to the board. Thank you for your mentorship.

[02:49:21] And Madam Chair, it has been an absolute honor to serve with you. Thank you, Supervisor Bailey. Thank you, Madam Chair. A couple things from me. I was also happy to join many of my colleagues at the Menorah Lighting in the town of Occoquan.

[02:49:40] I really appreciate the folks that came out. I know that especially right now, it was especially meaningful to the Jewish community in our county, and we continue to pray, and our hearts are with folks as we continue to look for peace.

[02:49:57] had also uh the opportunity to attend various events um i know we don't talk about it too much uh here but a lot of us as you know mentioned during the commendation for both chair wheeler and so as are lost a lot of us are on regional boards um so wanted to sort of mention a few that i'm a part of and things that have happened on them recently we had our last nbrc meeting of the year uh last week um being able to say uh farewell to uh supervisor penny gross who has served for a very long time on all sorts of different boards of commissions and as a fairfax supervisor um i said

[02:50:34] during that that time that i uh found myself in a lot of cog committees with her um so those are big shoes to fill and i i count her as a mentor as well um i am also been recently elected chairman of the Metropolitan Washington Air Quality Control Committee for COG, and I will be the vice chair of the Chesapeake Bay Committee for COG as well, looking to hopefully be the chair in 2025.

[02:51:00] Also had the pleasure of going to the ribbon-cutting for the Segment 3 bridge for the Occoquan Greenway about a week or so ago. That bridge is a major landmark and touchpoint in the progress of the Occoquan Greenway, which I know is going to be very well used, it already is, and I know that I really appreciate Chair Wheeler and CXO Shorter and everyone that came to that.

[02:51:27] That's been a labor of love for a very long time, and also wanted to give a shout-out to Seth Handler-Vosk and his staff and the LRPRA board for their collaboration on making sure that we continue forward with the Occoquan Greenway. That all said, Supervisor Lawson, Chair Wheeler, it's been an honor to serve with both of you, And I know that both of you have deep passion for our community, so I hope to work with you in the future in other capacities.

[02:51:50] Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Vice Chair Bodie. Supervisor Lawson. Thank you, Madam Chair. Sure, go ahead. I'm sorry. Just forgive your microphone. Hit the wrong button. I have two things very important to do.

[02:52:08] It's business, so I appreciate it. I won't take a lot of time, I promise. I wanted to do a reappointment for Mr. Juan McPhail as my planning commissioner. his term is ending that was very very key and i also wanted to uh take this opportunity this is business janine i'm almost done i'm almost done um to for the county staff this is a directive county exec if you would for the county staff to look into what is required to create a master plan and study for redevelopment opportunities for fettler park including costs and potential

[02:52:43] funding sources if you would please sir i'm sorry my staff wrote it out for me i forgot i'm sorry no worries supervisor lawson yeah oh now somebody's phone's ringing okay well good afternoon everybody um actually i have so many people that i would like to thank but because of the limited time i'm going to do my best to cover as many as i can in a broad sense but i want to start off by thanking the people of prince william county and specifically the people in the

[02:53:17] Brentsville District for allowing me to serve our community for nine years. It has truly been an honor in my life. I grew up in a small town in northwest Iowa. Actually, the first 10 years of my life, I was in the Jacksonville, St. Augustine area. And then when my mom and dad decided to move all six of us kids to small town Iowa, one of the jobs that my dad had was being our manager of our community, our city manager. And I think it was when I was a young kid that

[02:53:50] it instilled that sense of service when folks would call our home line to talk to my dad. And that's the only thing I can attribute to other than the Lord himself for planting the seeds of wanting to serve in public. And it has truly been a remarkable experience. It's one that I will look back on and treasure in my heart dan and i have raised our kids here in prince william county never did i imagine that that i would call northern virginia my home when i was growing up

[02:54:27] but i have always loved living here i personally think it is such a blessing to live in such a historical area maybe that all started when we lived in st augustine florida as a little girl before we moved to small-town Iowa but for the citizens that I have got to know that I have had the pleasure of working with serving it is truly been an honor I want to thank everybody from the bottom of my heart and I absolutely would not have been able to serve our community without so many residents side by side

[02:55:06] I have learned from you I have learned from County staff I cannot begin to thank everybody that has just so beautifully worked alongside of me you have taught me so many things one of the things that I have learned sitting in this seat is that Supervisor Wally Covington who's now Judge Covington had tougher job than i realized and i respect him and i i know that tom gordy who's going to succeed me

[02:55:39] is going to do a fantastic job serving the people of the brinceville district because of so many great people that are part of this organization known as prince william county government for the county executive office and for the county attorney's office thank you thank you very much for your professionalism mr shorter miss roble i've had the pleasure of working with mr shorter for the last year for several years mr chris martino for one year miss melissa p core

[02:56:13] and and then of course mr elijah johnson as the acting county executive miss roble i've worked with you the longest judge hurran and i worked together for six months i believe before you she became a judge but I just want to thank both of your offices you all are incredible you are always there for the Brentsville district for me and my staff and the responsibility that we all have is great a county of a half a million people there's a lot going on and of course in the Brentsville office we feel

[02:56:49] like it's it's you know the center of the universe so thank you for always being available for us for the texting that that sometimes we have to do to communicate with each other for the emails for the phone calls that are around the clock I just really want to thank you COVID especially has been a very difficult time to serve and I will never forget the nine years and especially the last four years that has taught me so much two last people in my

[02:57:21] life that I cannot go without thanking, and that would be my staff. Michelle Trenum, I don't know if you're watching right now, but you're remarkable. There is nobody like you, and you run circles around me. You run circles around so many people because you just give this your all, and I am personally thankful to you and your family for allowing me to have your service as my right hand.

[02:57:48] Mary Beth, you're incredible, too. You've been with me for nine years, and I can't thank you. You have a heart that is willing to just do whatever needs to get done. Tiffany, you've only been with me for a couple years, but thank you so much. You are the calm in the storm. Thank you.

[02:58:04] I really appreciate it. And for all of those who have served in the Brentsville District, even, you know, not necessarily serving now, but have served with me and for me, thank you all. Last but certainly not least, I could not have done this job without my husband, my husband, Dan.

[02:58:25] My husband and I are going to celebrate 30 years of our marriage in February. And you guys probably don't know this, but Dan is really not that public of a person. I don't even think he's ever been in the board chamber. But I could not have done this role without the support of my husband.

[02:58:43] I can't tell you how many times he has ordered pizza in Chinese. I am the cook of our family. But, honey, I don't even, you've never really watched these board meetings unless I show them to you. So maybe tonight I will show you that I have personally thanked you.

[02:58:59] And certainly to my kids, Catherine and Luke, who really are also not people that want to be known publicly on the front lines. So thank you to my family. And then last, but I know I keep saying last but not least, thank you to all my colleagues. colleagues presently, my colleagues in the past. I really do respect everybody. We're here because the people put us here and I just want you all to know that I cherish this time in my life and thank you all very much. And no struggle here. I am really at peace with this decision and look

[02:59:35] forward to a new chapter in my life and it's going to include rest and recreation. Thank you Supervisor Lawson. Supervisor Weir. Thank you, Madam Chair. I'm actually going to take longer than usual because I usually don't have anything, but I do today. I'll start off with a directive to staff, CXO, at the request of the Parks Department. The Gainesville District has roughly $1.1 million in restricted proffers from the Carter's Mill rezoning that are restricted along Park, and I would ask that the appropriate measures be taken to transfer budget and

[03:00:12] appropriate those funds for the ball field lighting project at Long Park, and I would note that according to the Parks Department, so long as the league agrees to accept direct billing for the light usage, which they already have, there will be no increase to the county's operating budget. Next thing, one of my favorite phrases, I told you so. I'd like to inform the public that the first of what is likely many transmission lines was announced this morning for the western

[03:00:48] districts of Prince William. Actually, I believe this one impacts both Brentsville and Gainesville. It's the first 230 kV transmission line we're going to see. This is prior to it being submitted to the SEC. Dominion is having a meeting Tuesday, January 9th from 530 to 730 at Gainesville high school to discuss the first four routes roughly from wellington and rollins ford to the dave store route or dave store location on the other side of route 29 i would caution everyone

[03:01:22] that's been down this road before just because they have put forward four potential routes does not mean that these are the final routes or even all of the routes that they will consider only time will tell. I have a spate of appointments or notices. Please bear with me. I give my intent to reappoint Frank Washington to the ARB, Bradley Marshall to the CSB, Blaine Pearsall and Kathy Kulik to the Historic Commission, Elizabeth Ward to Sustainability, Dwayne Martin to Trails and Blue Ways, Josh Quill to Veterans, Greg Gorham to the Ag and Forrestal, Sarah Moser to the Board

[03:02:02] of Equalization, Teresa Belcher to the Disabilities Board, and then I would like to give notice to appoint Jennifer Cole to the Animal Advisory Committee, Charlie Grimes to the DCSM, Rick Berry to the Parks and Recs, Dr. John Liver to the Planning Commission, Chrissy Falls to the DSS Advisory, and Chris Burnett to Weapons Control, leaving me with happy not hoppy happy holidays to everybody on the board and everybody out there and i'm looking

[03:02:34] forward to the board opening under new management in january thank you supervisor angry thank you madam chair uh so this is uh the first time uh you know i've been here since 2019 so i got a one year and then i got the four year so i kind of want to go through a recap now that i'm finished and now the full four-year term.

[03:02:59] 2019 was more of a learning period for me. And so Supervisor Lawson, Janine, I want to – well, it was great. It was because I got to really sit back and learn from a board that had been seasoned, and you all were very seasoned in here.

[03:03:14] So I want to thank you for that year in getting me going down the road of understanding politics and how the county operates. So I will start by simply saying thank you for your time. Thank you for your guidance or your leadership. Regardless of the votes and the motions and how they came out, I fully respect you, everyone on this board, and just want to thank you for all the conversations we have.

[03:03:38] And so, as they say, fair winds and following seas, you are going to enjoy this rest of the life, and one day I will join you. So, same to you, Madam Chair. This past four years has been a tour.

[03:03:54] I believe we've truly gotten a lot done in that. Democracy is just that democracy. You're going to have those for and those against. And so I'll just say thank you for your time on this board as well. So just to recap real quick, we have, and I want to jump right into some by-right uses so folks understand what that is.

[03:04:17] So Darbydale Apartments, Princedale Apartments, even the Tractor Supply Store, all of those developments came about because they were approved for the zoning some time ago. In the case of the apartments and the townhomes, that was like 1970. And so the land was sold off for those build-outs, and you're seeing that right now in Neabsco District with the apartments, townhouses, even the attractive supply store.

[03:04:43] Neabsco Commons, we have some mixed-use condos coming up right now in the middle area there. So I would say residentially speaking about the shortages of housing, Neabsco District is clearly doing its part. I'll end on the housing piece with the courts district, which still on the line is the Whole Foods Grocery Store.

[03:05:02] So hopefully that will work itself out. That is going to be a state-of-the-art premier development with fine dining and just an experience with boardwalk and paddle boats. Yes, paddle boats, and they will be there. Also, some major road improvements.

[03:05:17] At that intersection, we have what's called a SPOEY, Single Point Urban Interchange, where the parkway is going to go under Minerville, taking that intersection from an F to a B, C rating, which will greatly improve that intersection. We've been working on that corridor of the parkway.

[03:05:34] So at some point, the old bridge and parkway smart scale improvement will happen, which will improve that entire corridor. So very excited about that. We've done sidewalk extensions. We've done streetlight additions.

[03:05:49] We've done traffic comment improvements. We've done some major park improvements. and I can just run through. Andrew Leach has been pretty much facelift and looking very nice. Birchdale, they're putting the playground in, finishing that up. Cloverdale went through a major improvement, including the bridge that was washed out.

[03:06:07] Beautiful, if you haven't seen, been through there. Sharon Bauckham, I just want to point out Sharon Bauckham because those baseball fields, the batting cage, is going to be a serious piece for me that we're going to be working on in the coming years to get that done. Earl Kennard, I owe those children over there.

[03:06:22] Playground, still working on trying to figure that one out. And so just stopping right there, upcoming projects, more road improvements is probably the biggest. We have a few housing left to deal with. And then my hope is that with the new board, first of all, I want to thank this board and the time that we've had together.

[03:06:43] With the new board coming in, my hope is that we've taken the contentious things off the agenda and that staff will not have the time to reset, rebuild, and clean out old things that they have, you know, left to do.

[03:06:58] So my hope is that it's a smooth four years coming and that it allows you all to clean up your files and take a breather and rebuild your teams out, and then we can go and work on building county staff back the way it should be. So I will simply end by saying it's been a great four years.

[03:07:18] Looking forward to starting a new one and leave everyone with a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year and Happy Holidays. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Supervisor Angry. Supervisor Vega. Thank you, Madam Chair. Just a quick recap. On December 7th, I attended the Menorah Lighting Ceremony in Aquakuan, which kicked off Hanukkah, obviously with the Hamas terrorist attacks and the anti-Semitism that's followed.

[03:07:41] This has been quite an emotional few months for our Jewish community, and I was honored to stand with him to bring in their holiday season. On December 9th, we had our annual Coles District Christmas tree lighting ceremony. Without a doubt, it was or has been our best one yet. It was very well attended, a special shout out and thanks to the Colgan Chamber Ensemble, the Boy Scouts, Lake Jackson Volunteer Fire Department, Parks and Rec, the grounds crew, and everyone who came out to make this event a tremendous success and a great time had by all.

[03:08:09] On December 10th, I attended the ribbon-cutting and opening ceremony for the Salvadorian Consulate in Woodbridge. It's a beautiful new building that our Salvadorian-American community here in Prince William County can be proud of. And here is a fun fact for you. It's the only Salvadorian consulate in the Commonwealth of Virginia, and I think we're very lucky to have it here in Prince William County.

[03:08:27] Last week, I attended the swearing-in ceremony for the school board. Congratulations to all. A special congratulations to my friend Erica Trdenik on getting sworn in. This past Saturday, I attended the VEX Robotics Competition over at Woodbridge High School. I think it's a great honor for Prince William County to have hosted the largest VEX Robotics Competition in the Eastern Seaboard.

[03:08:47] A total of 111 schools participated, and a very special thank you and shout out to Ms. Carol, who I call the woman who runs one band. She literally makes it all happen. Also, a special thank you to all the volunteers that helped her out. I have quite a bit of notices of intent, so I'm going to try to go really fast here.

[03:09:06] Ron Kriger to the Animal Advisory Committee, Stephen Mitchell to the DCSM Zoning Ordinance Advisory Committee, George Dodge to the Historical Commission, John Depew to the Historical Commission, Louise McPherson, Carol Charsky, Rhonda Craighead, and Michael Trentcoast to the Lake Jackson Roads Committee, Barbara Dodge to the Library Board, Edward Feely to the Commission on Aging, Sarah Pitkins to the Persons with Disability Committee, And I think I already said Ron Krieger.

[03:09:38] Yes, I did. And lastly, I would like to submit for consideration Dave Ellis as one of our two representatives to the Stafford Regional Airport Authority. Colonel Ellis was previously the chairman of the authority from 2016 to 2020 and retired with 3,600 flight hours.

[03:09:55] So he's clearly qualified to continue his service on the airport authority, and I will be submitting all of these resumes for consideration. Now for the thank yous, as you all were probably paying attention, we had Dove's Landing now officially be placed under a conservation easement during our consent agenda, so I want to give a special shout out to Kim Hosen, who is no longer with us, but she was instrumental in ensuring that we finally saw this day come, and also to Seth for his tremendous work in ensuring that everything went smoothly.

[03:10:26] Finally, to Janine, it's been a long road. I am what many people call a newbie, green to the world of politics. But I want to thank you for being fierce, for being a great role model, not just to me, but to Nacy and to so many little girls that look up to you and that you inspire to do their best, to be their best, and to fight for what they believe is right.

[03:10:49] You are fierce, and I will certainly miss seeing you on this dais, but I am certain that the Lord has great plans in store for you, for Dan, and for your fur babies. So thank you for all of these years of service to Prince William County. You know, I think that I can give you so many different titles, but the one that I love the most and that I will cherish forever is the fact that I get to call you my sister in Christ and my friend.

[03:11:14] So thank you for your service, and I wish you the very best in all it is that you decide to do with now your free time. So I love you. And Chair Wheeler, I'm going to take a different approach here only because oftentimes what people see is the politician, right?

[03:11:32] They never get to see the person, the human. I will say that you and I probably haven't agreed on very much, and that's okay because I think that that is what makes America the greatest country in the history of the world, that we can agree to disagree, but that we're still Americans and that we're still individuals.

[03:11:48] I will say that I've enjoyed our one-on-one conversations in the back conference room. I know that you are somebody that is extremely proud of your two girls and that you're extremely proud of your family. It's not easy, folks, here in Chambers, watching at home or listening in the atrium, to put yourself out there and to run for public office.

[03:12:07] You're oftentimes attacked, and sometimes fairly, but sometimes unfairly. I think that I've received both ends of those attacks, if you will. But be that as it may, I want to thank you for your service to Prince William County as well. I know that it hasn't been an easy road for you, but, you know, it is what it is, right?

[03:12:27] And I always tell people that life goes on. We love what we do in terms of being able to serve the public, but this is not our reality. At least I know it's not for me. My reality is at home, Renee and my two beautiful kids that the Lord has blessed me with. But I certainly do take a lot of pride and joy in serving the people of the Coles District and Prince William County as a whole.

[03:12:46] So thank you to the both of you. It's going to be a different dynamic and a different board, but certainly from the depths of my heart, thank you for your service to this county. Last but not least, I want to thank my staff for their tremendous work during this year, and not just this year, but the course of the last four years.

[03:13:03] It's been quite the road, and I certainly couldn't have done it with you all. A special thank you to Laura and to Andrea. You guys literally rock. You're rock stars. We could not do this without you all. And I know it's not just the two of you, so I just want to generalize my thanks to the entire staff here in Prince William County for all that they do.

[03:13:23] Thank you very much. for all of your hard work so i just want to wish everyone a very merry christmas and a happy new year thank you madam chair thank you supervisor vega supervisor franklin sure just a couple of things uh on friday december 8th i hosted the annual our woodbridge annual senior luncheon at the woodbridge senior center we had over 150 seniors there who enjoyed an afternoon of food fun and music and i want to thank the organizations and businesses who co-sponsored the event pull and moving and elm street development also want to thank our county staff for attending elijah johnson who was there to help serve food and so thank you to all that came out certainly had a

[03:14:03] great time i'm also just want to remind everyone that this is the last weekend for the holiday walk of light at the neapsco boardwalk it's been a huge success as as we knew it would and so if you haven't been able to stop by please do and then also want to give a special shout out to freedom high school their football team for once again becoming state champions and so looking forward to attending many more games next year so i just want to give a shout out there and then of course i want to i think my colleagues who will be departing the board i have two short stories

[03:14:38] on both of them well two stories total for both of them so i was on the prtc commission before i was an elected official. I was like an at-large citizen member and I remember there was one meeting where I actually had a question or concern and nobody would recognize me because I was just I was this random person on the on the committee and so it was Supervisor Cadigan and Supervisor Lawson that raised their hand to be recognized and then they both yielded to me. So that's my first interaction with Supervisor Lawson and I never forgot that and I really appreciate your

[03:15:14] service particularly on transportation items I mean we've all said we didn't always agree on many things but you know I learned a lot from you and Marty on transportation issues and I really appreciate your service there and also and I'll just say this without going into detail thank you for the opportunity for VRE so she knows what I'm talking about but you know you've kind of elevated me in different ways. And I have not forgotten that. So thank you. And Chair Wheeler, Chair Wheeler. So my story about Chair Wheeler is there was one day a long time ago, I was like,

[03:15:53] Chair Wheeler, we don't have anything in common. And she was so irritated by that. And she would bring it up. And I'm like, well, we didn't really have anything in common. We come from very different backgrounds. We happen to like politics, even politically. I think, you know, now we probably agree on politics but I'm like we don't have really anything in common but what I like to offer is that we've become very close a lot of people know that and I'm proud to say that now we have a lot in common because we've developed that relationship we've spent a lot of time together she's given me different tours of different parts of the county that she was

[03:16:32] familiar with and so I appreciate our relationship and thank you for your leadership and I look forward to continuing this relationship on the unofficial side so thank you thank you supervisor franklin well okay um i'm not going to go over any of the things i attended this week though there were a few few stragglers i want to really spend my time thanking people um and and really begin by actually i want to start with my husband because you reminded me to add my husband thank you supervisor lawson you know my husband and i are celebrating 30 years this this year also um which

[03:17:10] is you know we're trying to figure out where we're going to go and plan a big vacation but you know he never he never watched a board meeting i don't think until last week and i'll just the end of last week's meeting which i think is funny um and i'm not sure he's ever ever been in chambers but i do think he's going to stop by tonight because he has to drop something off for me which i think is funny and rather fitting um so i i thank him for all his support over the last four years you know i want to thank my chief of staff candace holly who has been been wonderful um my principal aide, Gordon Baer, who has worked so much on my constituent issues. Our staff aide, Francisco Cabrera. Every time I needed information, he would go back and find it out. My Wheeler

[03:17:50] Report editor and comms specialist, Terrell Italian. Thank you, Terri. I get more people thanking me for the Wheeler Report than anything else over the last four years. And God bless that woman. It's just, I mean, I can't take credit. It's all Terri. And we have our admin specialist david kennedy who's new in the office who i had a great appointee and and other you know um open house last week and did a lot of work you know and even my former staff members and interns like brianna sewell as my chief of staff and zary tarif who was around with me for a few years and nita nawaz and liam patrick you know all these people were you know worked really hard

[03:18:25] in the office and i'm really grateful you know and county staff you know mr shorter thank you for your leadership over the last year, and it's been wonderful, and Mr. Johnson, thank you for that interim year. It was a big year, and thank you for leading us through, and Chris Martino, who I'm sure isn't watching if he's smart right now, but I am so grateful that when the pandemic came, we were three months into office, and six out of eight of us, I'm sort of lumping supervisor angry, and we knew that we had an excellent county staff who could

[03:19:00] handle emergency operations i have been forever grateful to come into a county that handled that pandemic so well i'm really really grateful for that and i think we got through it um really well and really strongly um ms roble boy we've kept you busy you know thank you we've kept you busy as a county attorney thank you for all your advice you know and there there are people like ms attreed or tom smith um you know wade you dan alexander i see people sitting here you know

[03:19:28] Quentin Haynes, Nikki Brown, Maria Burgos, and Lisa Madron, you know, people who, you know, we have an excellent county staff, and we are really blessed, really blessed to be able to rely on people who know their stuff, and I know that's only going to get better in the future, and so I'm, you know, grateful for, well, Courtney Tierney, you know, after the years I spent on the DSS board with Courtney, and to see her up here, you know, leading social services, and, you know, Sarah Henry, and with the area and agency, and Rick Conazales with our transportation. We have probably the best

[03:20:04] transportation department in all of Virginia. I will stand by that, and we are really, really lucky for that. And of course, Christina Wynn, who is a rock star in Prince William County. You know, I've just been blessed to be able to work with so many wonderful people. And my gosh, our clerk's office. Yes, we kept you busy, Laura and Andrea, and I am so sorry. And I know I played apart in that I am so so sorry um but thank you for all the work you know and and you know our police department our fire department we just we have an excellent county and I I look back on the

[03:20:39] last four years and you know the board meetings seem to be a large part of of but to the public they think this is sort of the main thing but no this is not you know this is once a once a week every couple of weeks um you know there's so much that has gone on that I am so grateful for that I got to work on for the last four years. I love Prince William County. I think in a lot of ways, wow, that is really scary, right? AI. You know, I want to thank my seatmates. It's been a great four years. You know, there are some things, you know, that I won't miss, but there are most things,

[03:21:17] most of the things I will, right? You know, and I am grateful and so blessed to be able to sit with people who want to make and effectuate change for the better for our county i am just so grateful for that you know i have had i still have had such a blessed life um you know i mean i know i'm going to go on and do something different but i you know i i can't complain about anything that has ever happened in my life because i've i've been blessed with so many you know love and light and and learning through especially through this job love and light and learning and so i'm i'm just

[03:21:54] grateful um you know i will miss parts of it and some of it i won't and that's okay and i know prince william county is going to be great we are poised we are poised to be a powerhouse in the region where you know i i'm not so sure we were some at other points in time and uh i know that you know we are great things are coming to prince william county and i know that my seatmates who are staying are all going to be a part of that and uh and i wish you all the best of luck and And, you know, we still have an evening meeting tonight, but that will probably go pretty quickly and pretty standard.

[03:22:26] And I just want to say it's been a joy, and I am grateful. And thank you. Thank you all for the relationships and the learning. It's been wonderful. So with that, it's Supervisor Lawson. Well, I just would like another half a minute if I could because, you know, I forgot somebody as well.

[03:22:47] Sure, and then I'll add on so I can always get the last words. But go on, sure. No problem. And although you, actually it was Yesley who beat me to it and reminded me and it made me remember that there were some times after a political victory that I would, I'd stand in front of a crowd and I'd forget of all people to forget my, I would forget to thank my husband.

[03:23:10] Like sometimes we forget to thank the ones that are closest to us and do the most for us, right? Well, this case, it's the clerks. And so thank you, Yeslee, for acknowledging the clerk's office, because it reminded me, it's you two have done so much for the eight of us, far more than the public knows.

[03:23:31] But the eight of us know, you two spoil us. You two spoil us. You are the ones who make sure that, you know, we have food and caffeine and logistics and sugar. Yeah. And, you know, our office calls you when we're deep diving for something.

[03:23:51] And so I just want Laura and Andrea and Jessica, who's not physically here, to know that I am really grateful for your service. You have spoiled me. So thank you so much. And the IT folks that are behind the wall, communications folks, Steve Carlisle in particular, like, they're probably watching right now.

[03:24:15] Just know on the other side of that wall, we are grateful for you for every little thing that we need. You are always on it. So thank you all and communications and IT. And honestly, to add to that, I mean, the fact that we have come a long way from our very first meeting, right? We had to deal with remote participation, these wonderful things here so I don't have to look at people's lights.

[03:24:35] Thank you. Just the tracking and how the agendas are put together with the new software, the voting tracking. Thank you, Supervisor Canlon. I'm sure he's not watching if he's sane either. Supervisor.

[03:24:53] And, you know, I mean, we've come a long way in four years, and we are much better off. And, you know, and that really was the clerk's office, Ms. Madden and Ms. Passos. You are absolutely wonderful. I know, I know, right? So with that, it is 5 o'clock.

[03:25:10] We have actually time to go to dinner for those who want. And I'm going to suggest just down the street, Los Toltecas, because we were there the other week. I'm looking at Ms. Roble because you always round us up in your, I mean, 5.30, enough time? Okay, so why don't we meet at 5.15, whoever wants to go in the back, and they can drive us over if they want.

[03:25:33] And then we will be back for our 7.30 meeting. Thank you. We'll see you. We are recessed.

[03:26:34] And you ready?

[03:27:56] Okay, I assume they heard me hit. Good evening. It's now, it will be by the time I finish talking, 7.30 on Tuesday, December 19th. We welcome the public back into board chambers for the evening portion of today's meeting. We have three items under our consolidated agenda for the evening.

[03:28:14] There are no presentations associated with these items, and so I'm going to open the public hearings on items 12A, 12B, and 12C, which are rezoning 2021 old carolina overlook uh the route 28 moto member and as well as rezoning 2022-16 park ridge center ms madden do we have anyone to sign up to speak on 12a through 12c we do not okay no one online okay if anyone wishes to speak to 12a 12b or 12c please approach the

[03:28:51] microphone in the back of the room seeing no one approach the microphone in the back of the room this will officially close the public hearings on 12a 12b and 12c with that i will entertain a motion we've got a gainesville and a brentsville magisterial two brentsville's and a gainesville magisterial district manager supervisor lawson thank you i will move the consolidated agenda forward and would like to make a comment but i'll let somebody second it first second okay motion made by supervisor lawson seconded by supervisor weir and we're in discussion and feel free because

[03:29:31] i'm going to make one too thank you so old carolina overlook i'm looking for sherman where are you you're somewhere in here i know you are there you are and your clients this was a project that we think started maybe two three years ago maybe pre-pandemic but thank you for your patience your perseverance i think everybody's so pleased with this that you actually got on the consolidated agenda which is not easy for residential but thank you i've enjoyed working with you

[03:30:06] and for the special use permit moto member billy you are living the american dream you inspire me and this is a project that unfortunately you got caught in the crosshairs of a contract at the Manassas Mall.

[03:30:24] You had everything ready to go at the mall, and then something happened with the timing, which we won't get into the details. But you chose to keep your focus here on Prince William, and for that I'm really grateful. And thank you so much.

[03:30:41] It's been a pleasure working with you to get this SUP here to the board before my term is up. And I look forward to one day, not that I'm going to buy one of your products, but i look forward to walking your showroom and i don't know maybe i'll get a wild hair and buy one of your your products um because they're certainly going to be fun but again thank you for your perseverance working through all the nuances of of land use cases and brian thank you for helping your client okay well um i'll just go jump in and say i want to just say thank you to pucana

[03:31:17] partners and parkridge for working over the last four years to make an excellent product um you know that really is the gateway to western prince william county and this will revitalize that area and do wonderful things and i'm just really grateful that we're able to uh see it for to fruition so with that uh seeing no further comment miss madden please vote vote unanimous okay thank you all for doing business in prince william county well if the those applicants want to leave and we'll go on to our other two cases or feel free to stay if you want to watch the other

[03:31:56] two cases so thank you all okay that we will now on to item 13 our standard public hearing items

[03:32:38] we're going to continue there are two items on the agenda today we'll hear presentations from the applicant and then staff our first item is 13a which is an ordinance for rezoning 2021-00008 uh windsor oaks in the neapsco magisterial district welcome mr stewart turn on the microphone yeah okay well merry christmas board uh good to see you all and um before i began i did want to say i wanted to thank each and every one of you this is i know the last meeting of your

[03:33:16] four years up here um and i'd really want to sincerely if anybody knows what it's like to be up there it's me i spent a lot of time up there probably too much in the opinion of a lot of people but you led this board through some of the most tumultuous and difficult times that this county has ever seen including COVID and the disruptions in 2020 and certainly a lot of land use decisions that had to be decided upon. I just want to thank you for your service. In particular I wanted to thank the service of Ms. Lawson who I had the pleasure to work with for several years

[03:33:56] and Chair Wheeler, and I just have to say, there's probably nobody else on this planet who knows how difficult that job is, and I just want to thank you in particular, and I want to give you a round of applause for your service. A lot of applause today.

[03:34:13] Okay, sounds good. Thank you, thank you. So, this is Windsor Oaks, and it was originally in Mr. Bode's district, and then it was redistricted over uh to supervisor uh angry's district uh it's the current zoning is uh office uh mid-rise you know let me do one more thing i want to introduce the team here um the the contract purchaser is trammell crow and they're with us alissa scheinbaum and and matt hard uh jim madison with lvc is our

[03:34:48] engineer yogi singla is with grove slave the traffic uh study and then um mr ron eskirk who was with the county for over 20 years, and now we work together. We also have Ms. Patrick here with Weber Rector, who is the broker on the project. And we are also very fortunate to have Mr. Cooley here, the owner of the applicant, and his son-in-law, John Adam. So the project is already zoned. It's zoned commercial. It's zoned OM, office mid-rise. It has a by-right use of

[03:35:26] 240,000 square feet of commercial. That would have resulted in a lot, over 700 parking spaces, a lot of traffic. This really should be considered a down zoning from that perspective. It is 9.7 acres. It was a little bit more before part of it was given by Mr. Cooley for the widening of the parkway. The gas station was, there was originally, when it was proposed, there's three acres on the corner that was supposed to be a gas station. And Supervisor Bodie at the time and the community as well said, look, I don't think we need another gas station there. What we really

[03:36:02] should do is consolidate this into a very nice luxury upper style mid-rise market rate luxury multifamily. And so we have, we came in with 243 units. Staff requested that we reduce it to 233, which we did. These are four or five level splits to take advantage of the topography.

[03:36:26] It is on a hillside, so you'll be walking in on the second level. There will be a half level below and then four above. There will be elevators in each of these buildings.

[03:36:42] This is very much a luxury multifamily and very much needed, especially in Eastern Prince William County. It's 33% open space. Here's the site. It's very well, you know, there's not a lot of undeveloped properties, as board knows, left in eastern Prince William County. But what is left, this, there's a lot of it is tucked inside neighborhoods. It's not very strategically located. This is, it's a, it's a perfect site for density. And the reason is it's right on the

[03:37:15] parkway. It's got access to mass transit. And as it so happens, it's directly across the parkway from the new courts district. And we believe that these uses will complement each other as we move forward. I should move back one. That to your right, that's the mobile home park. That's Elm Farm Mobile Home Park. A little bit up from that, along the same side of the street is Elm Farm.

[03:37:43] That's Charlie and Sons, the trash hauling company, but that's been recently purchased by another trash hauler. We're not sure what they're planning to do with it. This is the illustrative plan. One thing I want to point out here is that the original design had even more units than we proposed to put in here.

[03:38:03] But what Mr. Cooley decided to do was, and we like the whole traffic circle, And we think it's important because we're moving in this, we're in this age of increasing, you know, people not instead of owning their own cars and going to get their own food, but, you know, using Uber Eats and also using Uber and Lyft and all the mobile services like that.

[03:38:28] We think it's important to have that circle. Right down there in the kind of the upside-down C-shaped building, that is the courtyard and the pool. You'll see it's heavily landscaped.

[03:38:44] There's a 50-foot buffer along the parkway that complies with the H-Cod. There is also a 50-foot buffer up where Charlie and Sons. Now, we don't think that that's going to stay as a trash hauling use. It's more than likely going to transition to something else, but we're looking for a place to put a dog park. Dog parks have become essential amenities for multifamily. They're expected.

[03:39:10] This is in the aftermath of COVID in particular, so staff didn't want us to put it in the buffer with the parkway, so we moved it up there. It's been carved into that 50-foot buffer where it's 30 feet wide, which means that a portion of that is 20 foot wide. And there we have proffered very heavy for the whole thing, but especially their evergreen plantings and landscaping. And all that area to the right there, that's all preserved in perpetuity. Okay, this is the architectural

[03:39:47] elevations. These are fairly new. We've proffered to the quality, the cementous panel, basically the party board, and other high-end materials. This is just to show where the pool, basically what is going to look, this is actually an existing design for a pool that Trammel Crow has.

[03:40:14] The amenities package is robust. It includes an indoor, the pool, of course, in the courtyard, indoor clubhouse, the dog run, indoor fitness area, office, work from home, electrical vehicle charging stations. The one thing I do want to add on there at the request of the at-large planning commissioner is the indoor bicycle storage, which the chair is very fond of, and I think rightly so. This is, as you'll see in a moment, this is very, very pedestrian-friendly

[03:40:49] and bicycle-friendly development. And getting to that, here's the site access. We originally had three access points on elm farm road uh both vdot and county staff requested that we reduce that to a singular access uh to help with the flow of traffic so right now it comes across from pennington lane um one thing that i i need to point out and i is uh we are adding a 10 foot wide uh shared use path along elm farm road right now it is a road with uh a ditch there's not even a there's not

[03:41:28] even a shoulder and it's dangerous and people do walk it as is especially people from the mobile home park and then as you get to quartz you're going to see more and more pedestrian traffic and bicycle traffic and so we thought it was important so that 10 foot wide trail and the beauty of that is the 10 foot wide trail that the county built all the way along the parkway goes all the way up to Chin Library, Chin Park, and then all the way up here, of course, we are extending that all the way up across the frontage of the property, so all the residents, as well as anyone else who's

[03:42:01] using the road, can use that. We are, in addition to that, we are widening Elm Farm Road by 12 feet. Now, there was room that could have possibly been added to, you know, to make this, to make Elm Farm or four-lane road but both county and the staff said no that's not what we want because the whole one of the whole purposes that this board funded the new interchange at minnieville in the parkway was to avoid the cut through that's currently going on on elm farm road so when that interchange is built uh the the idea is to encourage people rather than going through elm farm road is to use

[03:42:40] the new interchange the the spooey um there will be eastbound and westbound turn lanes and tapers to avoid any impact on the through traffic. There's on-site pedestrian paths. We're putting a new bus shelter on the parkway and building a direct pedestrian pathway to the shelter.

[03:43:03] In addition to that, we're going to be working with VDOT and with the county for additional pedestrian safety measures on the parkway. There's got to be things that we can do, and those things will be worked out at site plan. This is just kind of a closer-in snapshot of Vellum Farm Road in front of the development.

[03:43:25] You'll see those striped areas there. That is basically an emergency pole-off lane. You can see there's a lot of excess space here, but that's good. It's having a wider road here. It improves the road and its safety. The timing, you know, we're looking at, at best, probably 2026, but probably later.

[03:43:49] dispute we understand will be completed right around the same time we went to the planning commission on september 27th they requested that we go and meet with loca pelt which we did and in addition to meeting with loca we did courtesy reviews with midco and with dale city civic association as well we were adding barbecue grills at the request of some of the planning commissioners, the indoor bicycle storage. But the bigger thing was we wanted to add at the request of the planning commissioner, Quinn Brown, for the Neabsco district, more affordable units

[03:44:29] at the lower end of the AMI range, the 60 and 70 percent. So we responded. And on affordable housing, see, this was the breakdown on top before. We had 1 percent at 60 percent AMI, one at 70, one at 80, and three at the workforce housing level.

[03:44:52] Now we have doubled. So it's the same number of units, but we've total workforce slash affordable. But we have doubled the number of units at the lower end of the income range. So there's a total of 10 at the 60 and 70 percent levels.

[03:45:09] And the other four units will be workforce. The planning commission recommended approval in a six to one vote. They asked us to explore the density and or the unit type mix, not because they were concerned about the overall density, but they didn't know for sure whether or not we had enough parking.

[03:45:36] Now, to be clear, we meet the DCSM standard, but we are asking for a 4% reduction. That doesn't mean it has to be used. But what Trammell Crowe can testify today to is that, you know, the number of vehicle, the ownership of private automobiles is now on its decline.

[03:45:57] You know, it was one vehicle per family in the 50s and 60s. A lot of things were passed during that period of time. And then you hit the 80s and 90s and families are buying more and more vehicles. And so you started to have not enough parking situations with a lot of these legacy apartment developments in Prince William County and across the country.

[03:46:20] And so the DCSM responded to that. The county responded to higher vehicle ownership. So we meet that standard. However, what we're seeing now is that that has peaked. Private ownership of vehicles is now on the decline.

[03:46:35] You have a lot more ride-sharing going on, and we are pretty confident that we're not going to need all of that parking space. So we did respond, though, to the planning commissions, and we looked at the unit types, and what we did is we converted six of the two-bedroom units to one-bedroom units.

[03:46:56] It's the same 233 units, but we've converted six of the two-bedrooms to one-bedrooms. That reduces the need for the parking, as much parking. The waiver request is for a 4% reduction or 360 spaces total.

[03:47:13] Staff is recommending approval. Planning commissions did not recommend approval, but staff is. The parking utilization at comparable properties, if you'd like to go into this, this is kind of a survey that Trammell Crow did with similar situated properties.

[03:47:34] uh miss shine bomb can come up and and discuss that if you'd like staff recommends approval uh it's a it's a great location you don't have a lot of properties left you need density and that's one thing that came across very very clear is there's not enough of your multi-family uh markets uh market rate higher end luxury uh units especially in eastern prince coon county you have a lot of older stuff, but you don't have a lot of the newer, nice stuff. And when people are moving out

[03:48:08] of their homes in Dale City or Montclair or Lake Ridge, and they're looking for a place to stay in Prince William County, they want to stay here because their families are here. There are very, very, very limited choices if you want to go to a nice place. And so it fills that. But also, as Trammell Crow can say, they think you're going to get a lot of military officers who are stationed at Quantico here who will be using these units as well. The density, it is roughly double what is called for in the comprehensive plan, but if we had stayed with the original

[03:48:45] density, this would not have been multifamily. These would have been two over twos or townhouses, and the real need in the market is for the luxury multifamily, especially in this location being so close to quartz the two developments complement each other uh and um and it does have access to the parkway all the amenities uh as well um it is a 40 reduction from the by right use in terms of traffic just want to emphasize that uh and uh the other thing is that the density is what

[03:49:19] justifies the amenities you have to have the density that's how you can afford those things And that's how you can justify having a full-time maintenance staff, the full-time administrative staff, and support staff at the development.

[03:49:36] It meets every comprehensive, it's consistent with every chapter of the comp plan, and the staff is recommending approval, as does the Planning Commission, and that's it. Thank you, Mr. Stewart. I thought we could go on to staff presentations, and if there are any questions, do that afterwards.

[03:49:54] Is that okay with you, Supervisor? Okay. Mr. Meyer, welcome. Good evening, Chair Wheeler, members of the board.

[03:50:11] Scott Meyer in the planning office. Nice to see you again for the last meeting of the year. So Mr. Stewart went into a lot of detail here. I'm just going to go over some of the additional things. You've already been oriented where the site is. Again, this is just shy of 10 acres.

[03:50:28] It's at the corner of the Parkway and Elm Farm. Road staff is recommending approval. So this is in the Dale City small area plan. It's also in the Dale City Parkway node. So with that, I know there were concerns about density.

[03:50:44] And we acknowledge that the density is over double what the comprehensive plan says. But you have to look at the area context. We look at where when we're in these node areas and when we're in the small area plan, it allows for kind of a sliding scale for what type of density is appropriate.

[03:51:02] We feel that this is over double of what the comprehensive plan says. But there's also guidance where if you're providing affordability, it allows the density to be higher, which the applicant is doing. We also have the realization that this is going to be, you know, right next to the Courts District, which is going to be coming online.

[03:51:23] It has access to transit. It's also in a major thoroughfare area. And also, just looking at, you know, the general land-use planning, I mean, I want to point out also that RN5, Transect 5, is not too far to the south of the project, across the parkway, and this is at a very high-profile intersection.

[03:51:41] So I know there were concerns about density, but we feel that with the amenities and with overall what's being provided, that we're able to get there overall. Highlight of some of the changes since this went to Planning Commission, as Mr. Stewart pointed out. There was a lot more focus on, I guess you can say, accommodating a lower income level for the affordability component. There's now 14 dwelling units that have affordability and workforce, you know, parameters. In terms of the planning commission, you know, as Corey had

[03:52:18] mentioned, we have the addition of outdoor grills, indoor bicycle storage. There were some minor changes to reduce impacts on the resource protection area. And also now that the contract purchaser has changed, Trumbull Crow, we have revised design guidelines, which also give rise to the change that building elevations. There was some minor formatting and administrative changes to the proffers. This is in the staff report, but the main thing to point out is that since Planning Commission, they're still asking for a 4% parking reduction. Staff is able to support that

[03:52:53] four percent parking reduction by shifting the the unit type to one bedroom it reduced the overall parking by five from when this went to planning commission but we feel that this has been approved before and i want to point out staff is recommending approval with the proffers and also with the four percent parking reduction that's an important thing to point out you've already seen the plan here again three buildings height limit of 68 feet which we feel is comparable to the context of the area we have the intact highway corridor overlay vegetation along the parkway as Corey had mentioned this project is also

[03:53:33] allowing for an aligned full access across from Pennington Lane we also have the interchange coming online too which is going to alleviate a lot of the you know backup of traffic and peak hours along Elm Farm this is the conceptual plan which you've already seen we have the environmental constraints analysis we feel that the applicants been responsive to one thing to point out is you know they are essentially you know clearing a lot of the trees on the site but where they can preserve the resources we feel they have done that and also there's a on-site pedestrian connectivity and so forth revised design

[03:54:12] guidelines. These are the new elevations. And so planning commission recommended approval. This went back at the end of actually, so it was subject to the proffers at the time of planning commission. And there were revised proffers that do now include the 4% parking reduction. In addition to that, we feel that it meets the intent overall, the comprehensive plan. It's in line with the Dale City small area plan and this is also infill development so we feel that it kind of serves the purpose of providing for rooftops which we need we're at a crucial point in the county where we

[03:54:52] really need additional residential and staff is recommending approval with the latest rendition and I'm here to answer any questions we also have transportation staff here too if you should have any questions in that regard thank you thank you very much Mr. Meyer you're welcome so don't know excellent project anybody have any questions supervisor angry I know you okay supervisor weird thank you madam sure I've got a couple of comments let's start with staff mr. Meyer as I've expressed to the applicant my real

[03:55:29] heartburn with this and my heartburn with the with the staff report regards the long-range land use you list the land use and zoning compatibility as a strength but then you say that there's excessive density for it we're getting essentially double the density for a parcel that was just replanned a year ago, and it doesn't seem like there is much to offset it, mitigate it.

[03:55:58] Could you kind of explain that? Because I would assume that at a double density, we'd be getting significantly more than just 6% ADUs, particularly since I'm holding people to 10%, and how we arrived at a 6% in this particular application given the expansive increase in density?

[03:56:18] Sure. So when we look at the analysis, it's always on balance. I know you may not prefer that word, but we prioritize. I know how I feel about that word. Well, yes, I understand. But we prioritize the issues that are germane to the application.

[03:56:33] So we look at lane use compatibility. We also look at this is an infill piece. It is, we feel, at an area where a higher level of density is appropriate. If this was not in the small area planted, it was not in the parkway node, and it was not at an area near a project like Quartz, we would have a very different picture.

[03:56:54] But we feel that the applicant has provided a level of affordability, which we feel is appropriate. We're always looking for more, but we have to look at, you know, a balance of where it makes sense in certain areas of the county.

[03:57:11] The applicant could address that more. But that is a point where that's why when it was initially 243 units, I had asked that they reduce it to the higher level of a transect four instead of the beginning of a five.

[03:57:26] A 5 is getting way off course, we felt like, but we feel that, you know, with how the application has evolved, point well taken, it is double the density, but it isn't an area where we could forgive that, I guess, shortcoming, if you will.

[03:57:42] And we look at the context, we look at the design, and we look at the quality commitment, and that's one of the main things, you know, that we had issue with. But we also look at, you know, where it makes sense, the area, the context, and we feel that overall we can support it.

[03:57:59] So that kind of tells the story of how we looked at it with land use. To that end, Mr. Stewart, could you please address the same question, particularly given the context of our conversation with respect to the percentage of ADUs? I think I expressed my unhappiness with that when you came in.

[03:58:15] How did we get here? Yeah, and I think when we had our conversation, this is before we doubled the number of units at the lower end of it. So if you take a look at what the board has recently approved in this part of the county, you're going to find about 3% of units being for ADUs at the 60, 70, or 80% income range, and then another 3% for workforce housing.

[03:58:43] And we came in with something very similar to that. The Planning Commission asked us to go one step further than that, closer to this ultimate goal and understand why you want to get there. And the county certainly needs, well, I mean, the county needs housing of all types, but especially the affordable.

[03:59:02] So what we did is we doubled the number of units at the 60 and 70 percent. Now, you've got to understand when you do that, there's an impact, a financial impact to the applicant, to the contract purchaser.

[03:59:19] Building those units actually costs you more than the revenue that you're going to obtain from them. If you want to maintain this with a very high level of amenities, if you want to maintain this as a luxury-style upper-end development, You have to have the revenue stream coming in, and you can only sacrifice so much before that starts to get impacted.

[03:59:45] The one thing I want to point out is that, and I've had a lot of these discussions with a lot of you, is that the eastern end of Prince William County, where I live as well, there's a lot of legacy multifamily. And a lot of it's older, and it's dated, and it's not so nice.

[04:00:06] And so you have kind of a disproportionate share already of your affordable units in the eastern Prince William County, and that's good. But you have to have that mix, and you have to have some luxury, and you have to have some upper scale, because you don't want to chase people out of the county because they don't have any multifamily options when they're moving out of their single-family home.

[04:00:30] So we feel this is the right fit for this site. Mr. DeWitt, I would simply note that there are similar projects in other parts of the county. In fact, we just adopted one half an hour ago. And although I appreciate you increasing the number of units at the lower end, your total still is too low for me, but that's just for me.

[04:00:49] Thank you. Thank you, Supervisor Weir. Supervisor Brody. Thank you, Madam Chair. Supervisor Weir, I echo you. My staff and I met with the applicant a few days ago, and we had some heartburn about the number of affordability units as well, considering we've been seeing closer to 10 on everything we've been looking at over the past year or so but that taken uh mr meyer i had a question for you because there's a lot to be talked about in terms of density but something that mr stewart talked about he just finished saying is this this um idea of not looking at each type of housing stock as the same right so we talk about density and if this was less dense we were looking at two or twos which we have a lot

[04:01:26] of so from a a planning perspective how do you all look at having a mix of units vis-a-vis this because we know over in courts we're going to have single families and townhomes versus this is going to be multifamily. Sure. Uh, we, we look at again, the area context. Um, so if you had more of a single family, you know, context, you would have, again, you wouldn't have the density, you wouldn't have the, um, you know, that massing at that corner that we are looking for. Um, we also look at a more of a compact design. I mean, that's, that's what we're looking for in

[04:02:03] this type of area so early in the project there was also a commercial component too there was actually a gas station component which was kind of a non-starter for us but we look at where the project has evolved from i mean the way it's done right now english gardens i believe i mean it could have this is a 40 reduction you know in the overall trips for what is there but we feel like that all residential makes sense in this area and with that you know again there's a It's more the applicant's thing, but looking at what makes sense from a density end and providing those services and kind of the caring capacity for that.

[04:02:40] We feel that it's appropriate for multifamily. Appreciate that. To that end, I know there were some folks, and we'll probably hear from some of them tonight, about the traffic considerations and knowing that this isn't being built in a bubble or in isolation.

[04:02:56] As you said, courts is being developed almost concurrently across the street. What did transportation have to say about any concerns about traffic congestion as a result of this? Transportation's here, and they can address that. Madam Chair, members of the board, Paolo Belito with the Department of Transportation.

[04:03:20] So we did look at a traffic impact analysis that was submitted by the applicant. The main issue at the area, the underlying issue, is Elm Farm Road. What the Parkway-Mainville interchange does improves throughput on the Parkway and gets rid of a lot of the cut-through that's occurring on Elm Farm Road.

[04:03:36] So we believe, and the TIA shows that, once the interchange is completed, you're going to see a lot less cut-through traffic on Elm Farm, and you're going to keep a lot of the traveling public on the parkway. Thank you for that. And one last follow-up question, Madam Chair. Mr. Belita, don't go too far, sorry, because it's still transportation-related.

[04:03:54] We also talked about that new bus shelter that's going in there and the walking path that I know discussed with the applicant fairly early on, even back when there was a gas station. Can you talk about the impacts of having that transit there and also the fact that I know with the approval of Quartz, there's also going to be not a transit hub there anymore, but there's going to be a lot more transit options in Quartz.

[04:04:17] So how does that synergy work? Sure. In terms of Quartz, they do show a transit hub. This location has three major routes that go through it as part of Honor Ride's bus route. You have your Dale City Lake Ridge local bus route that goes through the parkway adjacent to Elm Farm. You also have your east to west omni-ride that connects to stops in Manassas as well as the On-Ride Transit Center. So this location is strategically located in an area with high traffic, excuse me, bus routes and transit routes as well. Thank you so much. Supervisor Lawson.

[04:04:54] Okay, Scott, regarding the school analysis, ports, which was across the street, everybody's referred two, are these the same schools that are targeted for courts, which would be Jenkins, Bevel, and Garfield?

[04:05:14] Let me verify that. Excuse me. Maybe the same. Oh, yes. Yeah. Same? Yeah, Garfield High School, Jenkins. Are all three the same? Yes. Okay. So my question and concern is, are we planning in silos?

[04:05:32] You have excess capacity at all three of those schools right now, but I'd like to know what did courts eat eat up with those excess capacity i i don't know off the top of my head unfortunately you should i mean this is a case that's gonna feed into those schools and we should we should know how many seats how many students were sent into these schools with capacity we should look at this in a comprehensive manner don't you think uh we we do need to look at in a comprehensive

[04:06:05] We look at, and that's, we're going to look at, I guess, holistically about how we analyze schools because we look at the impacts, the current impacts based on what's being proposed with what is in the system. Can we assume, I don't want to assume, but for the sake of this conversation, can we assume that you've got, for the Jenkins Elementary, you've got 177 seats open for students right now, 38 of which would be coming from this project.

[04:06:40] So we'll say roughly 137 are remaining for courts and any other developments in that area? Or are we, are we, sure. Yes, and we have the same, Supervisor Lawson, good to see you.

[04:06:56] So we have the same question. So we, the Municap did the, did the proffer study. They updated their figures. So the excess capacity, the projected excess capacity before Quartz, you know, you've got to remember, of course, the school system is building those schools all the time, planned schools, but was 177 excess for Jenkins, 161 for Beville, and 409 for Garfield.

[04:07:26] Courts did have an impact, but now the excess capacity for Jenkins is 173, for Bevel it's 110, for Garfield it's 403, which does bring the excess down a little bit, but certainly well within the capacity for what we're adding, because we're adding 42 to Jenkins, 18 to Bevel, and 24 to Garfield.

[04:07:53] Okay, thank you, Mr. Stewart. Those numbers that you just stated are a little different than what I'm looking at on page 34? Right, because this is something we just requested. Oh, so it's updated? It's updated. Okay, so from what I understand, you're telling me that there's capacity at these three schools for both court students and your students?

[04:08:19] No, because you've got to remember, when courts was approved, the courts of schools had to adapt. they have and so their their plans are changing but based upon the muni-cap analysis looking at the school's plans after you you all pass courts this is we expect they expect at least for now that these students will be going to those same schools now that doesn't mean that that that that they're always going to go to the same school but you have the capacity within that area right yeah okay

[04:08:55] so we're not exceeding capacity that's correct okay that's what i wanted to hear okay thank you um all right i had uh scott would you please share well first of all you told me that the planning commission approved this in november with a seven to one vote or six to one whatever that it was a split vote with just one commissioner that voted against yes i just want to make who was commissioner all right well you're on top of it okay it was so it wasn't miss

[04:09:33] brown it was Commissioner Barry okay and then if I recall correctly they I read that they wanted the applicant to reduce density and so I know your applicant has changed the units that are one-bedroom and two-bedroom was that as a result of the Planning Commission request and they wanted a reduction in density or can you can you walk me through what the Planning Commission wants specifically with density units and how it relates to bedroom sure sure

[04:10:12] so I wanted to better so this one to the Planning Commission initially back in late September and they asked them to look at the affordability more outreach and so forth yeah then went back to the Planning Commission again on November 15th and specifically the Planning Commission asked the applicant to review the density and the mix of units so they looked at the density the applicant you know came back with how they feel the density is appropriate for the area what

[04:10:46] changed was the unit type next so what was two bedroom six of those were now shifted to one bedroom. So, okay. So that changed the overall part. So did the commission approve it at 233 units? Yes. Yes. Yeah. With the stipulation to look at. Right. So they, so they changed the makeup of the unit types, but not reduced the density. That is correct. Yes. Is there a reason? I'm not saying I agree or disagree. I'm just asking, was there a reason?

[04:11:19] Well, they had asked to look at the mix and the density. And in looking at that, um the density did not change i guess cory can probably explain why the density did not change mr stewart can yes yes okay well i can i'm not sure i'm going to make you happy i'm going to give it a shot uh the focus uh there was um and i don't want to put words in the mouth of the planning commission but the focus there was um the community there was some concern in the community that there was not going to be enough parking it wasn't the overall density and the impact of the

[04:11:57] the density it was they were concerned that we were going to have not enough parking it was going to overflow on the elm farm road potentially into the neighborhoods um and so the idea was when you look at the the number of units if we were to reduce the number of units uh that's one way to reduce the number of parking spaces that's needed but the other way to do that is to change the the mix of the unit types so when you go from when you go from two uh bedroom units to one bedroom units you're reducing and we reduced it uh under the dcsm standard we reduced it by about

[04:12:34] five uh parking spaces now even with that we we don't think we're going to need anywhere near that those those spaces and um you know trammel crow i mean at the end of the day you know is this a A deal breaker? No.

[04:12:51] But Tremel Crow, based upon their experience and what we're seeing in the area, is that it's important to futurize these developments, give them the flexibility so that as, say, EV charging station mandates come down from the state or federal governments, or we just say, look, we're going to end up with a sea of empty parking here.

[04:13:17] It would be better to use it for another amenity, open space, more, you know, greenery, et cetera. They want to have the flexibility to do that. Okay. All right. I guess I don't understand the rationale and the flexibility.

[04:13:36] Well, it makes sense of Minnesota, by the way. Maybe not Iowa. I'm just kidding. I know you are. Okay. So they want flexibility in the, not the type of units, but the number of units.

[04:13:52] No, not the number of units, but the number of parking spaces. Okay. Yeah, and it's just everybody's seeing the trends, and it's not just Trammel Crow. It's other developers that are seeing less need for as much parking as being required.

[04:14:10] And I see your point, especially at commercial centers with all the empty spaces. I get that, but residential is another discussion. I do recognize that you're off of, you know, a major roadway with a lot of public transit on OmniRide in particular, which is obviously an advantage.

[04:14:35] Okay, I just wanted to noodle that over. Okay. Thank you. And then I guess the last question I have is more for Scott again. Sorry, you guys are like tag teaming up there. Scott, to be honest with you, I'm hung up on the comp plan as well.

[04:14:54] And it's a T3, but the density request is really T4. Yes. How do you justify that without a comp plan amendment? By looking at where it's located.

[04:15:10] It's in the small area plan. It's in the parkway node. We look at the affordability. We look at the design. The housing chapter, if you provide affordability, it gives more of those parameters, which we translate policy-wise to a little more flexibility.

[04:15:26] So the Dale City small area plan had this density in it? Why wouldn't the comp plan and the Dale City small area plan match for density? Well, this is MU3, which, you know, allows up to, you know, 12 dwelling units per acre.

[04:15:43] Right, but the application for the rezoning is up to about 23 units per acre. Oh, yes. Yeah, that is correct. So my question is, if the Dale City small area plan, which was passed prior to the comp plan, shouldn't those match? They go in combination.

[04:16:02] So that is still intact with the policy, but I guess Alex, do you want to? Supervisor Lawson, Alex Venegas from the planning office. So with the mixed-use three, we also provided language. I think Supervisor Bode asked us to put language in there that those numbers could increase, the density can increase if there's an affordable unit component associated with the project.

[04:16:28] And it didn't have to be 10%? I don't think we put specific guidelines. That's what we're recommending is 10%. But again, with this application, they did come in with different tiers of affordable because some people just come in with affordable and workforce, and they're at 80% to 100%.

[04:16:49] This has both, which is good. This has both. That's correct. Well, as much as this board has emphasized affordable housing, affordable housing, I mean, we've heard it for four years. I'd like to think Supervisor Weir and I aren't the only two up here advocating that this project falls short of it.

[04:17:12] Supervisor Angry. Thank you, Madam Chair. I'm going to jump right in. No questions. Just I'm going to chat a little bit about this because you're right. That affordability gets lost in everything that we do now. Make no mistake, Neapso District is one of the oldest districts. Probably every single family home in that district meets the new definition of affordable housing because you can buy one of those, use home for probably $350,000.

[04:17:37] You're not going to find that anywhere in Prince William County. The goal here for me is truly to what Mr. Stewart just said, is we don't have anything of luxury, and we're talking an apartment building here. And I like the one-bedroom idea because if we're ever going to get into the mindset of what our youth are doing now with Uber Eats and Uber and the bus system, and really when we talk live, work, and play, and walkability, then this is what we're transitioning to and probably should have been transitioned to some time ago.

[04:18:11] So the fact that you have elevators in these buildings, many of these apartments buildings don't even have elevators, the fact that it's going to be luxurious and the fact that you turn the majority of them into one bedroom, these aren't long-term living in places.

[04:18:27] Folks aren't going to move in there and stay in there for the rest of their lives. These are literally transition apartments for our youth, our middle America, our up-into-the-market coming-up folks to be a part of something, and we want them to stay here in Prince William County.

[04:18:42] So we want to do something like this, and the location is ideal because of the courts district, and it creates this walkability that we're talking about. So I know there's many concerns with that. I want us to not get so lost in the road of affordability, And we do need to create some units where folks can have the option to stay there as well.

[04:19:02] But make no mistake, in designing this, when it was presented to me, Mr. Cooley, Mr. Stewart, I looked at that. I like that term luxury because you're not going to find many apartment buildings in the Neasco District. Mind you, I've got a couple of by-rights coming up now that we didn't have any say in.

[04:19:20] I'm really hoping they're holding to a model such as this that we had a lot of say in. And so I think what we've done to create this opportunity for Neapstable District is pretty cool, pretty incredible. And I love the project. And thank you all for working on this to get it to where it is, especially the Planning Commission.

[04:19:37] I really want to thank Commissioner Brown and her team for really sending it back, coming back, everybody sitting down, Dr. Jack getting involved with it. And what we have, I think, is a great product. Thank you, Supervisor Angry. Supervisor Bailey.

[04:19:53] Thank you, Madam Chair. I believe that, and this is a joke, Mr. Stewart, this is the high end of our Chipotle lane. But I wanted to, I agree with what my colleague has said about it being a luxury item as well, because I think the opportunity that we have is to define again and again affordability.

[04:20:22] I think that's an opportunity as we go along, and our finance expert, bless whoever that was, said today, you know, we need housing. And so this is just another variation of the type of housing I think that we need. I think this is an excellent project.

[04:20:39] I'd like to say in compliment of the project, when you introduced about the bicycles and the EVs, that's the next level of what we need to be offering to our constituents because they're asking us for that.

[04:20:57] As we sit on these boards and we talk about what we're lacking, that is a part of it because people want to live, work, and play and walk and ride in the area where they live. And so I think that's essential. And then the other thing is I think that this is a template for a certain demographic that lives here in the county that we're not addressing.

[04:21:23] And I'll use myself as an example. I don't really want the house that I have now because I'm working all the time. I want a luxury apartment, and I don't have in my district an opportunity to do that, but I know you're going to fix that too. But I'm saying that this is an offering that is essential and necessary for that demographic.

[04:21:46] And so it's very important that we address that as we define affordability. And then lastly, I'm really pleased with the AMI that you're providing.

[04:22:06] It's not enough, but it's something in a luxury project like this. So, yeah, I think that when it's all said and done, the way you've crafted this for that demographic and for that area as well, I can see that this is a compliment to the Quartz District, you know.

[04:22:27] And I can also see that we kind of need this across the county, these kinds of offerings across the county. So I just wanted to say that it's a progressive way of looking at affordability, but we still need to define it even more.

[04:22:42] It gives us an opportunity to define it even more. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Supervisor Bailey. Supervisor Franklin. Yeah, I just want to highlight the discussion around affordability just to kind of put a highlight on what we're really talking about.

[04:23:00] So obviously I support affordable housing, and I support doing as much affordable housing in projects as we possibly can. I think what we have to understand, which I think, you know, Supervisor Weir did mention this, is that when you do affordable housing, you have to do more density, because the density pays for the discounted units, which are the affordable units.

[04:23:19] So oftentimes on this board, when we talk about residential projects, the discussion is around reducing density. Okay, so it sounds like in this discussion, from what I'm hearing, we're saying, well, increase the density more and more. The challenge I have with that is, and people have heard me say this before, we already have overdevelopment in many parts of the eastern end of the county.

[04:23:42] So I'm not sure how we continue to increase the density knowing this. I mean, Mr. Stewart just pointed out how there's not a lot of land left over to do new developments. This is one of the few on the eastern end of the county. So I'm all about increasing the number of affordable units generally in projects, but we have to also understand that comes with additional density.

[04:24:07] So in this particular project, I'm comfortable with where the affordable units are right now because that means that the density doesn't have to increase anymore. And so I just want us to be clear on how we're talking about affordable housing. It's not that, at least for my part, that I don't care to seek as much affordable housing as possible, But I also have to make sure that we're managing the number of density that we're increasing in these projects.

[04:24:34] Thank you. And I'm going to go to Supervisor Vega because everybody else has already spoken once. And so just I know that Supervisor Bode, I've been just realized I'm just trying to get everybody at least once. Supervisor Vega. Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Stewart, talk to me about the build-out timeline for this project.

[04:24:52] And we have Tremel Crow here. And so let's hear from them directly. Ms. Sheinbaum, if you wouldn't mind coming forward. Good evening. Right now, we expect to break ground probably mid-2025 and deliver probably late 2026.

[04:25:17] That is, of course, assuming everything goes to plan. So there's some buffer in there, but expect to deliver kind of late 2026. Okay, thank you. Now I'm going to switch over to Paolo. Where does that put us in terms of the transportation improvements that we have for this area to mitigate some of the concerns in terms of traffic?

[04:25:39] So Vegas, as always, we have an aggressive schedule when we have our transportation projects. Last I was told by the project team, it's looking to be 26, 27 timeframe. We're starting construction as early as 2025. We want to move quick just because there's a lot of maintenance of traffic that will occur.

[04:25:56] We're actually going to build MOT roads, is what we call it, temporary roads to deal with some of the construction that's going on as part of our project. Okay, thank you. And then I have to ask, because I am very familiar with issues with mobile home communities, and so I see it here on the presentation.

[04:26:16] What impacts, if any, this is to county staff, do we have? Because we talk a lot about the luxury that this project is going to bring to the area, but we cannot negate the surrounding and existing homes, specifically the mobile park community. Supervisor Vega let me just go back to okay yeah so we obviously you know the mobile home park is an existing use but we also but in terms of the planning that's also planned is MU3 mixed use so

[04:26:53] in the future we look at you know what the trends are with the existing land use where where you have the density it's it's slowly migrating to the east but um we uh staff hasn't noted any uh specific objection from the mobile home i heard from somebody that actually uh was in favor of the project um i received a phone call from the citizen um gentleman who lives there um but we look at um you know where the trend the trending uses are and what the long-range vision

[04:27:31] of the area. So in time, we feel that that will likely change, and we will have more of a mixed use type of, so you could have a similar use adjacent to this subject site. Okay. Yeah. Over time. Yeah. Thank you. You're welcome. And one more time, Mr. Stewart, want to know about community outreach. They just mentioned that there was a letter of support. Can you talk to me about community outreach what you guys have heard support or opposition yeah actually I know that Dr. Jack is here and and he can he can speak to Loka Pelt we were required under the proffers to

[04:28:10] meet with Loka which we did but on top of that we weren't required to but we met with Midco as well and also with the Dale City Civic Association and I know that Midco is not in support but But when we presented it to Dale City Civic Association, we got a lot of positive feedback and really no objections.

[04:28:30] It was just, I think, really, you know, Mr. Angry hit the nail on the head when people in the Dale City area were saying, look, we need more of a mix. We need more higher-end stuff. We have a lot of legacy apartment units and condominiums and so forth.

[04:28:46] But, you know, if we want to move out, and I heard this a couple of times, is if we want to move out of our homes, there's not a lot of options out there for us so a lot of them are supportive thank you and before we start going on our second round I'll just say you know in terms of the mobile home park I think putting in the road and the walkway down to Prince William Parkway and and the bus the bus terminals as well as access to courts is going to be useful for that community right because there's nothing there right now there's nothing there which actually makes it kind of danger so I think that's a benefit to the mobile home park I'll also point out you know we do talk a lot about

[04:29:24] affordable housing and there's a we we did affordable housing right down the street uh in supervisor bodies which was a light tech the over 55 you know we've been putting in affordable housing i think it's okay when you have other um you know middle income housing around the area to put in a luxury unit that helps the entire the entire area you know it's not like i mean like you said you know the neapsco district has a lot more of the affordable component for our county than other areas do, which is where we try to tend to focus on affordable housing in certain areas that don't have any.

[04:29:58] You know, and last but not least, I just think it's, you know, it may be dense, but I think we all know now that Quartz is going to be driving this area in terms of density, and it really sort of fits in and starts building it out. So, Supervisor Bodie. Thank you, Madam Chair.

[04:30:14] I'm going to start with Mr. Stewart again. You talked about parking a little bit, but can you talk about some of the other developments you looked at in terms of how you guys settled on your parking number sure again and we have a slide if you

[04:30:29] wouldn't mind bringing that up scott that would be great so before i jump into this i just want to say we have every incentive to get parking correct here um you know a a project that is under parked is not going to be successful so it's something that we take very seriously

[04:31:08] so for the last couple of months we've spent times um touring comps in the area talking with property managers so just to summarize a few of the findings the first property we toured the preserve at caton's crossing they're parked at a 1.45 ratio from talking with their property manager their parking is utilized around 90 to 95 percent which tells us that they are pretty much spot on with 1.45 lake point that's obviously recently approved recently broke ground they received a waiver to go to 1.54 that's right about what we're asking for full transparency

[04:31:44] we see them as being our biggest competition once we open it's a really similar product in a really similar area um bell stonebridge obviously this is a little bit different just being in a in a mixed-use district they're parked at a 1.7 um but from talking with their property manager about 65 to 70 percent of the of the time the spaces are being utilized or sorry 65 to 70 percent of the parking spaces get utilized that would bring their ratio closer to a 1.1 that is not what we would advise here at all but i just want to show you some of the efficiencies that

[04:32:20] you get being within a mixed-use district we're obviously going to eventually be very close to quartz and expect to see some efficiencies from that the last one brandywine green this is a project that we delivered in brandywine maryland last year it's a very similar project it's very suburban they actually have little to no transit options there when we delivered the project it was parked at a 1.6 we found that it was actually being utilized at around a 1.4 and just to note we expect to have more one bedrooms here which would actually bring the ratio down a little bit

[04:32:55] so again we are very comfortable with a 1.55 ratio and hope that this helps you all get comfortable as well thank you and i just add to that just very quickly i appreciate this because i know a lot of Folks, again, had concerns about overflow parking to Elm's Farm Road to the point on, you know, the surrounding neighborhoods.

[04:33:14] And I know that we're at this tipping point, especially in this part of the county, where we're trying to, I'll just use the term, urbanize it in a responsible way. And to me, that means making sure that we provide for a level of parking that's going to be adequate for the residents that live there, not over parks that we have, you know, to that point, mass amounts of empty concrete that's sitting there.

[04:33:37] But also realize that as trends change and as something like courts comes up, you're going to have less people jumping in their cars and more people walking across the street, more people biking across the street, more people taking that bus right to the corner where they live and walking up the street there. So I think that it's an important conversation to have that we're not fully urbanized, we're not fully suburban in this part of the county anymore, and we won't be considering courts.

[04:33:59] So we have to do it in response to when I think you guys did a really good job looking at like a residential that's already existing. Preserve at Catons Crossing has been there for years. This isn't a new one. They've had years to see how well their parking does, especially in light of COVID and existing trends.

[04:34:14] And that's actually Preserve at Catons Crossing is what Lake Point looked at when they came to us. So there's a lot of good data here that I think is important for the residents. Now, to shift gears completely, actually, before I go there, staff, did you all have anything you wanted to talk about in terms of parking?

[04:34:31] I know you guys were okay with the waiver. Was there anything else you wanted to add to it? Supervisor Bodhi, I didn't have anything specifically to add, just to point out that with Lake Point, just historically, there was a 12% parking waiver that was approved.

[04:34:49] We only wanted it to be 8%, but the board changed that. So staff is able to support the parking waiver as proposed. So with our recommendations, the proffers with that 4% parking reduction. I appreciate that. Paul, if there's anything else you'd like to add?

[04:35:05] Okay. And then last one, schools was talked about. I think it's important context in terms of the schools that we not only have the existing schools that were talked about, but also Quartz has a dedicated school site that's being conveyed as part of the rezoning. We also have the 14th high school that's being built.

[04:35:22] I just talked to Chair Lateef about this this morning, and they're pushing that back a little bit but it looks like that new high schools will be coming online 26 27 versus 25 which is about when this would come up to speed and you have that elementary school site at court so there are other opportunities here for us to deal and adapt as was said to the the school needs here so i just wanted to make sure folks were aware and wanted to see if staff had any other comments i do want to point out i probably should have mentioned this before that uh the latest school memo that we have was the end of 2021 but the applicant they have done their other analysis their proper impact

[04:36:02] analysis which has more up-to-date numbers than what is in the school's memo so point well taken with you know looking at other things coming online appreciate it thank you so much so we have left supervisor angry lawson and supervisor bailey and then we'll go on to hopefully the public hearing supervisor angry thank you manager i'll be real quick just on three points one is uh two points that I love about this project and the courts is they are building out that sidewalk on Elm Farm. So you heard Winslow Oaks talk about they're going to take that first portion. Well, that's a huge step because it was a missing piece that we didn't have a connection for. And I don't know, Paula, if you know

[04:36:41] how much a sidewalk costs that goes on the parkway all the way up to what is that, Smoketown? What's on the other end up there? Minerville? Like, that's a long stretch of road. I don't know what that costs. When we looked at it, it was almost $15 million just for that loan stretch.

[04:36:58] Okay, so right there alone, $15 million. $15 million for the entirety of Elm Farm Road when we did an estimate. Yeah, so that's a loan. It's just thank you for that piece. Second piece, and it's not really for you. Maybe just for this board to entertain.

[04:37:14] If the trash company has sold and there's a new owner and we don't think it may be, I'm curious what that would be because that does change a lot for that area. So I'm curious what that is. So not a question, just a comment. I want to keep an eye on that.

[04:37:30] And then third, I will just ask, based on what happens in approval of this, approval or not approval, the fact of if you get notified of my office when that first tree comes down so I can let folks know, okay, that we're going to be clearing that because that's always a big thing that people want to know.

[04:37:47] So it's always nice to get ahead of it. So that would be a good thing to know. Thank you, Supervisor Inc. Supervisor Lawson. Thank you. I just want to make it very clear. I'm not advocating for higher density. I just was trying to see, you know, rectify why the comp plan said one density and the application said another.

[04:38:09] Supervisor Franklin's not in here, but I was really responding to her. I'm not advocating for higher density. I'm just trying to make them match and was trying to understand the analysis of staff, that there was no need for a comp plan amendment.

[04:38:27] That's it. I mean, look, tonight's my last hoorah. So I'm definitely not going to be changing any minds or anything. I was just trying to have a mental exercise with the planning staff. That's it. Very good, Supervisor. Supervisor Bailey. A mental exercise.

[04:38:45] I love it. I just had two things, really. I think also one of the benefits, oftentimes when we're doing either road constructions in a very dense area and we've got to either expand or make some kind of adjustments either for transportation, no pun intended, or housing, is that we've got to displace homeowners.

[04:39:10] And I think this is a great thing that with a project like this, it is so condensed that we don't have to do that because that's really very nerve-wracking. We're trying to build houses rather than displace people from homes, and I think that's a good thing.

[04:39:27] That's a very good thing. So I just wanted to point that out in this condensed area. And then the other thing is with Mr. Chairman for the PRTC board, my colleague who this project is in, one of the things that we've come up with, it's a lot of us that's on the board, is for the transportation piece are the electrical buses and also the OmniRide, Uber, I can't think of the official name.

[04:39:53] Microtransit, yes. So I see that as another opportunity for us to institute something like that in this area because when you look at, again, the demographics of who's going to live here, you don't really want to drive a lot. They want to get to where to get, you know, that kind of thing.

[04:40:09] So the microtransit opportunity I could see fitting very well with courts and the trailer park area and this project. It could fit very well in that. So I just wanted to bring that to your attention, along with the bicycles. Thank you, Supervisor Bailey.

[04:40:26] Well, seeing no further questions, why don't we move on to the public hearing. This will officially open the public hearing for Agenda Item 13A, Rezoning 2021-00008, Windsor Oaks. We have two people signed up at the moment to speak. If you want to go in the back of the room, you will have three minutes.

[04:40:43] And please state your name and generally where you live in the county. We have Dr. Jack Kuyumjin, who I love pronouncing his name correctly, and Kathleen Harding. Welcome, Dr. Jack.

[04:40:58] Good evening, Madam Chairman, members of the board. Jack Kuyumchian, president of LOCA. I'd like five minutes, if I could, as president of the organization. Yes, sure. Ms. Madden, five minutes.

[04:41:14] Yes, thank you. I have a lot of files here. I'm not projecting anything, but could we show the schematic of the Elm Farm Road on there as a display, just as I refer to some items?

[04:41:32] We did have an early heads-up on this project by Mr. Stewart back in January of 2021, I think. Came in and said, hello, guys. Just wanted to let you know we're looking at this, and what do you think?

[04:41:51] So he flashed the idea to us, and we had some discussion on that. And, of course, we talked about the current condition of Elm Farm Road. And, of course, it needs shoulders, it needs improvement, and the applicant actually is putting in the shoulders and putting in the walking, biking, pedestrian connectivity here, which is very important.

[04:42:24] But one would ask is, how do we end up with one entrance? And that was a discussion we had at the September 27th Planning Commission hearing. So let me just give just a quick overview of that.

[04:42:41] We had the Planning Commission hearing September 22nd, 7th, and we engaged. We had a lot of dialogue, lots of back and forth. The affordable housing mix got changed. A lot of things happened.

[04:42:58] Then we had the November 15th Planning Commission hearing, and we were here also to comment. And then here we are tonight at the Board of County Supervisors. When I spoke as a local rep, we were speaking in favor of the project, but we did have some concerns, and one being the parking, how to handle overflow parking.

[04:43:25] I would say the last three messages I got before coming to the hearing were all on parking from the Pell Committee members. We said, gee, if somebody wants to hold a party here and invite guests, where do they park?

[04:43:40] Where does that overflow parking go? When we talked with Paolo Belita and our Prince William County Transportation folks, who we very much respect, we said, gee, if there's an opportunity to have overflow parking on public roads in the area, So it's not on all the back of the developer, but we have a shared responsibility here.

[04:44:07] As more projects come on board like this, this is a good project, but we need to have the opportunity for overflow parking. This is going to hit us in the face with the Toll Brothers thing, with the landing at Prince William. Right next to the 14th High School, on and on, you know, that's another topic.

[04:44:27] But we should be looking toward the road system, and any opportunity we have for overflow parking, we should try to get that and provide that to the community so that they don't have the angst to say, gee, I want to have a party.

[04:44:45] What if three people in this development want to have a party on the same night? You know, where do we go with this? So I just wanted to say, we looked at it, when we looked at Suit Spire, for instance, at the county complex, we said, gee, maybe under the building parking is the answer.

[04:45:06] And they said, oh, that changes our construction mode. We mentioned that to Corey, too, and then we got a similar answer. But we do need to address parking. It's overflow is really important. The flexibility is really important.

[04:45:21] As Corey said, when you're looking to have, well, we could put in an amenity or we could do a parking. The developer needs some flexibility, too, but we really need the overflow. And the other thing that smacks us in the face is we have the potential for cut-through into Woodmont.

[04:45:45] You know, Pennington Lane, Russell Road, those roads are substandard. They don't have shoulders. There's no mercy for traffic going in there for pedestrians, no walkways, nothing.

[04:46:02] And so those substandard roads need to be recognized as, you know, we need to discourage cut-through as much as possible. Again, we raise that with our colleagues in Prince William DOT. We're getting the speed table and such, but we still need to be cognizant of this.

[04:46:23] This is really, really important to us. And the answer we got from Paolo and his staff was, well, when we get the Miniville Road and Parkway interchange in, that will discourage the cut-through traffic. Yet we still need, it might be that we need to have signage in there to discourage cut-through traffic into the Woodmont community.

[04:46:50] We've got the church there. We've got, it's all substandard roads. It's a big infrastructure issue. And for those residents, it's the quality of life in there. And I did want to say on the courtesy review, we have it on number eight for LOCAPELP.

[04:47:07] I don't have the latest version, but MIDCO and DECA might also want to be involved with that in the courtesy review. Thank you very much, Dr. Kijimjin. Thank you very much.

[04:47:22] Next speaker, please. I wish you all the best for the holidays, the year ahead, and thank you for your service. Hi, I'm Kathleen Harding. I'm also Secretary of Local Health, but I'm not going to take five minutes. My concern is Pennington. It is a substandard road. In that report, it said it had 1,400 cars going down that road, and that's true. Everybody uses it as a cut-through.

[04:47:48] Everybody's talking about Quartz is going to solve all these problems, but Quartz hasn't even started yet, and I don't think it's going to be all built out in the next couple of years. In the meantime we are having a terrible problem with traffic on russell road and on pennington which is everybody uses a cut through and these people are going to do the same thing they're going to look at the entrance to this project it's opposite pennington they're going to use pennington russell road to get to lake ridge to get to smoketown all the traffic does the same thing they come with smoketown they cut through russell and go off to the parkway we have speeding all the time

[04:48:25] And we don't have sidewalks either, and people walk with their dogs, with their children. It's very dangerous. We've asked for us to have some sort of traffic calming measures, but it's almost impossible to get anything done. In the meantime, we're living with a lot of traffic, with a lot of problems with traffic, and we ask you to help us to do something to immediate the problems that we're having on Pennington and on Russell.

[04:48:50] And I have been a resident here for 57 years, so I have seen all the changes. I know what the changes are, and I know that we're growing in leaps and bounds. But for those of us who have been around for a while, we'd like not to have so many leaps and so many bounds and so much traffic.

[04:49:05] Thank you very much. Thank you. Next speaker, please. I know you're not signed up, but you're approaching the microphone, so I can assume you're coming to comment. Mr. Jeter, please just let us your name and generally where you live. Good evening, Chair Wheeler, members of the board.

[04:49:22] My name is Martin Jeter. I live in the Aquan District, and I'm here tonight representing the Mid-County Civic Association, And I'd like the extended time, if I could, please. Sure. Thank you. I'm going to do my best rendition of Don Quixote here tonight. I think I'm kind of tilting at mid windmills after the discussion we just heard.

[04:49:41] But regarding Windsor Oaks, Midco reviewed the project after the Planning Commission deferred it for that purpose, for Midco and Locappelt and DECA to review it. And I just want to report to you what we found at our meeting on the project. There are some issues with the project.

[04:49:59] The overarching issue is the density. you've been talking about and there's a number of other things that kind of come out of that that basic issue as you already discussed the comp plan was just passed less than one year ago this area is MU3 this project is at the top of the MU4 density and and we don't really understand why there wasn't a CPA we you know that's kind of been discussed but if you're going to change the density like that on a brand new comp plan it's only been in place for less than a year year it kind of undermines the process I mean people put a lot of time and effort into this

[04:50:36] a lot of stakeholders were at meetings for a couple three years and now we're just going to double the density and that that's somewhat of a precedent because as you saw there are other parcels that will be developed in the near future quartz is going to be also on the elm farm side of the parkway in the future it's not approved yet the trailer park will will be developed at one point or another the the the fair property of the trash haulers there that probably be developed and they're all going to want similar density to this when those when those parcels are developed

[04:51:09] it also affects other issues this was meant as a transition from the more extreme density on the other side of the parkway the quartz project to transition down to the kind of quarter acre lots you have on the other side of elm farm road and elsewhere in the area and this kind of just continues that intense density across across the street there. You're talking about affordable housing. I just ask that you take a good close look at the affordable housing issue here because there was a discussion about getting having to have extra density for affordable

[04:51:45] housing. Well you have that extra density. This applicant's asking for double the extra density already. So it's not like you would add more density. They're already asking for that double density. And in return for that, you're getting less than 5% truly affordable units. So you're getting about a little less than 5% affordable units and then five additional units that are from 80, actually from 100 to 120% of AMI. And I think, I don't know of anybody that's going to agree that 100 to 120% of AMI is what we would call affordable. So it's going to be hard to make

[04:52:23] a dent in affordable housing in this county if we continue to do this kind of thing where we get less than five percent and of course you know more density residential density generally doesn't pay for itself in terms of services so when you add more density to projects the county has to keep raising the tax rate to pay for that i know data centers are probably going to offset some of that but they keep having to raise that rate that affects lower income people the most when they have to pay their property tax so we need to keep that in mind the traffic volume increase is important here this project is one piece of that but the courts project alone will increase traffic volume on the parkway right here by 33 percent and then you have

[04:53:03] the other areas the part the courts on the other side of the parkway on the Elm Farm side that'll be built you have the trailer park that'll be developed and so forth and so on it wouldn't be you know it wouldn't be out of the realm of possibility to see a 40 to 50 percent increase in parkway traffic right in this one location and you do have you do have some improvements coming Minerville Road and so forth and so on but those intersections also have issues that I don't have time to talk about here but the parking you spent a lot of time talking about the parking the planning commission spent a lot of time talking about parking the planning commission recommended

[04:53:39] density decreases not for just the parking issue but I don't have time to get into that either but in our meetings when people come to our meetings that live in these kind of communities with this type of parking 1.6 units per household inevitably they're telling us about problems they're having in their community because of the parking so just just to let you know that in some ways we're trying to do a social engineering job here where we kind of limit people's parking to try to push them into transit and I don't think that's that's kind of happening across the country I don't think that's really working I mean people like their cars transit

[04:54:15] use is down trending down and it's not come back after COVID so we need to keep all that in mind to so we're asking that you that project isn't approved unless these issues are addressed and i'll just say thank you all and happy holidays and we'll see you next year thank you very much good evening could i get the extended time and pardon me could i get the extended time um are you representing an hoa or civic organization or a 501c3 i'm a resident at home farm over home park okay yes and if you could just state your name and generally where you live please yeah my name

[04:54:53] is jason beer i'm a resident at elm farm over home park are you just a resident or are you representing elm farm park no i'm just a resident i'm sorry i will have to keep you to three minutes it's for representatives of the organizations okay before you start my time scott myers can you bring up a slide with the biggest part of elm farm that you have it's my show yeah yeah that's that's not

[04:55:32] all of elm farm but that's fine okay so my main point here is the safety safety of my neighborhood When you're leaving Elm Farm, you have four different roads that you can leave onto to get on the Elm Farm road.

[04:55:48] Right now, there's a blind curve to the right of Elm Farm. So when you're leaving Elm Farm, cars are coming down there, one out of the other flying. So when you pull out, you just take a chance. So putting this project there is going to increase that safety situation.

[04:56:08] So that kind of concerns me. Also, the school thing was brought up. Right now, when the school buses come on Elf Farm Road to pick up the kids, it takes two buses for all the children on that road.

[04:56:25] So you can imagine being behind two buses waiting for them to dump all the kids off on Elf Farm. There's a lot of kids in Elf Farm. So adding this project might even push that to three buses that it's going to take for all the kids on Elf Farm Road. and pretty much that's that's all i want to say is that safety is an issue with all the cars going to be on the road now and the schools with all the kids it's going to need to be picked up thank you thank you very much is there anyone else who wishes to speak on 13a please approach the

[04:57:04] microphone in the back ms madden do we even online no okay seeing no one approach the microphone and having no one online this will officially close the public hearing on item 13a windsor oaks and neabsco district do you have a question yes okay because then i was going to turn it over to supervisor angry but supervisor buddy yeah if either the applicant or staff can come in and dress especially the last uh person who spoke because i know that there are some concerns about the traffic and how the flow there but i know that part of this project will be interesting

[04:57:39] tapers and some other things can you talk about that vis-a-vis the curb and how traffic currently flows. Sure. Supervisibility. So it was mentioned earlier there's multiple entrances. Yeah, go ahead. Originally there were multiple entrances proposed. What staff recommended in coordination with VDOT was to consolidate that number of entrances to one, so that minimizes the number of conflict points.

[04:58:03] In addition to the TIA that was conducted, it showed the need for turn lanes. The proposed improvement includes a right turn lane and a left turn lane. So you're getting the traffic off of the travel way for those that need to access the site and the last thing madam chairs oh actually i just want to say too they will have to meet the site distance uh standards as well and um that'll be addressed at site plan but there's minimum site distance requirements based on the speed element so i just wanted to leave that for the gentleman that spoke because i know part of this is they are widening the road not to add another lane but to add the sight lines and also the tapers to

[04:58:41] allow people to pull off um my second question is actually sort of for the applicant but just thought he did mention the school buses which is a concern i get it um i i would i guess my my sort of request is that should the board approve this that make sure that to work with schools to make sure there is a safe place for a bus to pull off to stop to pick up kids that's off of main alfar road so we don't have folks that have to sort of they and obviously we have to stop when the bus stops because the stop signs come out but not so people won't be able to see because of the blind

[04:59:14] sight lines of that yes supervisor bode absolutely and you know all that has to be addressed at site plan and safety is number one concern especially with school buses appreciate it thank you we have supervisor franklin and supervisor bailey nothing more i was going to ask for the applicant and staff to address that gentleman's concern thank you supervisor bailey thank you madam chair um paulo is is this potentially um as we're widening the road and as the um the uh hoa representatives as we're speaking about the speeding.

[04:59:49] Is this a potential opportunity for that new program that we have? Yes, Supervisor Bailey. We have our Safe Streets for All program. We're looking at safety countywide, looking at corridors that have high speeds and high crashes, so that is something we're looking at.

[05:00:05] I did want to add that we do have active traffic calming projects on Russell Road. It was mentioned earlier. We have implemented a speed table on Pennington Lane. The constituents are correct. There is cut-through traffic. The interchange will help reduce some of that.

[05:00:20] It's always going to be an issue, but it's something we're looking at currently now with Richard and our traffic safety team. Thank you. Supervisor Lawson. Thank you, Madam Chair. Scott, page 36 of your staff report, because we heard from both civic organizations about the concern of parking waivers.

[05:00:42] Do I understand your staff report to say that the applicant does not have dedicated, or maybe dedicated isn't the right word, but parking spaces to accommodate even the clubhouse and swimming pool? That was going to the Planning Commission, but I think I'll let Mr. Stewart address that.

[05:01:01] I know that came up, and staff is able to support the 4% reduction with the caveat that they look at adding employee parking and also a loading space as well. So is that written in the proffers?

[05:01:17] It is not, but I'll let Mr. Stewart come up and address that. Will you talk about that? And I'm going to have Mr. Madison, our engineer with LVC, address your question. Good evening. That's part of the overall parking calculations.

[05:01:34] It's built into the parking for the community because it's not intended to be a public use and invite a lot of... Can you raise your microphone a little bit? It's not intended to be a public use and invite a lot of non-residents. But shouldn't residents be allowed to have, like, as people said, guest over, whether it's to the swimming pool and pay a guest fee or to have a gathering?

[05:02:06] I mean, I'm sensitive to parking shortages because they at times are a constituent service call of ours in the Brentsville District, specifically in townhouse communities. So my planning commissioner and I have learned to get tough on parking waivers.

[05:02:25] But do you have calculations that accommodate the times when people are going to host guest over? We just calculated the parking based on the standard DCSM calculations for the use.

[05:02:47] But you're asking for a waiver. So, yeah, help me out, Mr. Stewart. It's my understanding that the DCSM builds in various components of the use when it specifies the parking for the use.

[05:03:14] So that would include the amenities, the management office, and things like that. Okay. It also doesn't – I'm sorry. No, you go ahead. It doesn't specify separate visitor parking spaces.

[05:03:30] Okay. So it's all part of the calculations, what you're saying. including the swimming pool and the clubhouse yes so then in that case thank you so much in that case then scott do we not need it specifically proffered in or help help me out with the disconnect yeah it would be uh addressed the site plan um sorry paulo did you want to clarify as much earlier it is included as part of the overall tabulation we have different requirements for different bedrooms and unit types and it is built into the calculation as part of site plan

[05:04:07] And as final site plan, it's we'll review these spaces and what's shown in the actual plan itself. I hate to put you guys on the spot and certainly conflicting. So should I dismiss the comments in the staff report and be assured that there's adequate parking for the amenities, for the residents, for the – Look, I know this isn't going to be a staff of, you know, 30 at the rental office, but I just want to – it's specifically spelled out, so I want to make sure that it's legitimately addressed.

[05:04:46] Supervisor Lawson, yeah, this, again, it would be addressed as site plan, but I'm sorry, you just want to make sure, you want to reassurance that. Well, you made it a point to put it in your staff report on page 36 that, you know, the 4% waiver, and then with the condition that at least one loading space and employee parking spaces, including ADA parking, be provided.

[05:05:12] i i know ada parking is a factor because that's a federal law but uh and then you have be provided for the clubhouse and swimming pool that caught my attention so i just want to make sure that we the board aren't overlooking something and then supervisor angry's office gets lit up you know two years from now on a hot summer day yeah i don't want kelly easterly chewing me out right after she chews him out I'm sorry the applicant could proffer that but

[05:05:50] if I can clarify we did mention it it is a condition that we would approve the up to four percent parking reduction and it's typically and I know that our site plan engineers will review it when they get the site plan the exact parking location the type the ADA parking will be shown I don't believe it's shown in the current mvp but it is something that we look at uh our proffers that are either approved uh or recommended approval are included in the site plan itself as well so it is something that our engineers will look at okay is the current mvp proffered it is isn't it yes substantially

[05:06:30] correct too substantial so okay am i i don't mean to be able supervisor angry thank you madam chair Let me just make some quick comments to our public hearing speakers.

[05:07:10] So, Juan, Paolo, I know we had approved speed bumps on Pennington Lane. What's the status of those? We do have speed tables already in place on Pennington Lane. And, I mean, I haven't been down that road in a while. Are they there or are they coming? They're currently there. It's by the church.

[05:07:26] Oh, it's not all throughout. It's not throughout. There are spacing requirements for our traffic calling program. That is something we can revisit with our traffic safety team. But we do have a couple of measures in place currently. Richard has looked at cut-through restrictions, and we're continuing to work with VDOT on possible measures in the future.

[05:07:43] And because, again, I know how folks feel when there's change and we're building a project such as this because it's going to bring, true enough, more cars, more people, more concerns, more safety. Can we do anything like, and I know it's just a sign because most people don't even pay those anyway, but if Pennington Lane is a no-cut-through road, Like, I don't know the authorization of how you go about that, but I would like to help you all as much as I can to put visual things and start doing things to try to get people to curve that appetite of using that road as a cut through, which I know folks do all the time.

[05:08:18] And to the gentleman that spoke about that blind curve coming down Elm, thank you, Supervisor Bodie. I'm hoping that that lane reduction cut back in there helps that line of sight visibility because these are concerns that we want to address anyway minus a development.

[05:08:35] But I do know that developments really put everybody in a place of, you know, a concern. But we also have concerns because we have a shortage of housing, and you've heard this term about affordable. I just want people to be clear about what that really means because, you know, everything is not going to be a HUD or a Section 8 or LIHTC or some type of a government-assisted program of living.

[05:09:04] And I think what we need is just a variety of homes, and we need more in the county so that those prices can come down. You see the real estate market right now. There aren't any homes in inventory, and those that are truly highly overpriced, they really are.

[05:09:20] Even my $350,000, I said, for Neopsco is still overpriced for the age of these homes. They're not really that price. But anyway, getting to it, you know, I'm hearing these concerns. I think this is a great project.

[05:09:35] I know it has a lot that we talk about in site, a plan that's going to be taken care of. But what has been done to date, and listening to, you know, my planning staff, my planning office, everyone is joining together to do this, I absolutely think this is a great project for that location, for this time.

[05:09:52] And so with that, Madam Chair, I'm going to motion for approval of this. And then, you know, I'll just say my comment. Seconded by Supervisor Anger, seconded by Vice Chair Bodie, and we are now in discussion. Okay, and thank you, Madam Chair. So, again, just finishing up my point, safety is always going to be a paramount concern, and I really, truly want you to understand that that has always been number one for me in this county.

[05:10:16] So I want to look and see what we can do, even outside of this, for Pendleton Lane, for Elm Farm Road. I know that sidewalk is going to be a big addition to helping even our school buses come down there. and folks actually have a sidewalk they can walk on safely.

[05:10:33] So I want to really work with you, Paula, with our transportation office. And if you can keep me updated of when, well, you said the hump is in, but I really think that needs to be more. I don't know, you said there's some spacing requirements, but if there's something we can do to increase that, because I would like Penitent Lane to be a lot more of a nuisance for people to cut through than it is right now, because folks clearly are still cutting through that road.

[05:10:56] So nothing for you to comment on. just want us to work together to really help these citizens there because I know I've heard this since 2019 about that road and really the other one on the back end, what is that? Russell, Russell Road.

[05:11:11] And true enough, that's a beautiful road. It's a hidden road, and it is not a up-to-standard road. And I know people love it back there, so I want to leave that alone. So I want to help with that. And then the last thing I'll say is, you know, we're doing our share of low-income homes in the district.

[05:11:29] We have a few LIHTC projects coming up right now that are in discussion as well, and they're not the over 55 communities. They're actually four residents. So we're working on all of that. And I think, true enough, Neabsco District has done its fair share of building new homes, especially in places where no one thought they'd see them.

[05:11:48] So, you know, it's going to be a challenging few next five to ten years, especially with the courts coming online. But I will just say if you could just, you know, really work with us, call my office if you have concerns really about safety traffic. Let us see what we can do to mitigate those as best we can now so we can get to a place where we really see if that interchange is the answer, if we really see if the improvements along M Farm Road really do make you all satisfied or okay with what that is.

[05:12:18] but it's going to take us a little time to get there. So I'll stop there and just say thank you all for coming out to be a part of this. Thank you, Supervisor Angry. Supervisor Brody. Thank you, Madam Chair. And I appreciate everyone that came out tonight, and I appreciate the concerns and comments about everything that's been said tonight, the density, the parking, the traffic, what have you.

[05:12:37] And I felt it was important for me to second this because in some ways, I'm going to use this term, I co-parented this project with Supervisor Angry. When it came to me, it was in my district, And we had very tough conversations about that gas station. And I know that it wasn't what folks wanted to hear at first because we know gas stations are good anchors, especially with the gas station that folks had in mind.

[05:12:56] But to the point, it just didn't fit with what I think either of us sort of had in terms of the vision for this area. And I think that we came out with a much better product. And I told Mr. Stewart as such before. As someone who lives on the northern part of the Smoketown Corridor, I understand completely what you all are talking about in terms of the cut-through traffic.

[05:13:16] Once Smoketown southbound backs up to a point, everyone's ways and Google Maps then has them go down Russell, to Pennington, to Elm Farm. And either you go left towards Elm Farm down to Miniville or you go right on Elm Farm to the parkway, either go down or some other direction.

[05:13:33] So I know that those, I know Dr. Jack referred to them as substandard. They're rural roads. They have no shoulders, as people said, no sidewalks. Usually there are ditch or culverts on the side, right up to people's property lines. So I know that area is sort of this very semi-rural enclave, surrounded on all sides.

[05:13:53] You have this part, and you have Smoketown as these much more suburban, built-out corridors. And we've had to grapple with that fact for a long time. In the end, though, in terms of transportation improvements, I see this as improving it. We talked about the fact that this current part of Elfar Road right now, especially as it gets too closer to the mobile home park, has no shoulder, no sidewalk.

[05:14:15] People are basically playing Frogger, taking their lives in their own hands if they want to walk down to even the parkway at this point. This is going to help improve that. I know we don't like to do things piecemeal, but as was said, this is a large multi-project way for us to address that sidewalk connectivity on Elm Farm Room.

[05:14:32] And this is a really good start to that because you're putting in sidewalks or multi-use path. You're also putting in lighting to help improve safety there. you're widening the road, you're putting in shoulders and larger lanes to allow people to see those blind curves better. Ultimately, we're in a situation, like I said before, where this is an area that's going to change quite quickly, but unlike other areas of the county where there wasn't a lot of forethought into what's coming next in terms of schools and transportation improvements, what have you, we actually have a lot of that stuff going on already that this board has already approved, vis-a-vis the SPUI, vis-a-vis some of the connectivity

[05:15:08] of the omni ride system. As Supervisor Bailey said before, we're really looking at being very innovative when it comes to microtransit, first mile, last mile. And this is a perfect place to have that conversation because you have a transit hub we're putting in right across the street.

[05:15:24] You have a major intersection that has several bus stops right there. So you can go to basically anywhere in the county, anywhere in this part of the region from an area like this. So you look at target demographic of this as well younger professionals dod adjacent folks what have you and this is something that this area of the county sorely needs in terms of what kind of housing are going to be able to attract these kinds of folks to be their starter apartment and they can eventually migrate up to what might be in courts what might be at lake point what might be in in the landing at prince william there's a lot of to be said about establishing an apartment complex

[05:16:00] like this that is a little bit upscale it has a luxury offering but it's still an apartment that is obtainable to folks. And the last thing I'll say is I hear folks in terms of density, and I hear that folks are concerned about what this says into the precedent on the comp plan. Ultimately, like I think it was Mr. Venegas said, we program flexibility, especially into our activity centers and our small area plans for projects like this, where, yes, it's a reach from a density standpoint uh from from what the comp plan but it also speaks to the fact that when we're looking at

[05:16:35] long-term uh goals for housing and long-term multi-use true walkable communities where again we have courts right across the street we should be able to have that flexibility where we're not just having more two over twos or normal townhouses we have a real new uh type of housing in this area which currently doesn't exist to allow people to migrate to other parts that are going to be coming up in the county. That's why I support this. Thank you so much Madam Chair. Thank you Supervisor Bodie. Supervisor Weir. Thank you Madam Chair. I'll try and keep this brief and I don't think it's going to surprise anybody. As I said the other night I'm big on process and procedure and getting

[05:17:15] getting to the right place and I think the most the briefest word I can I can reference this application is inconsistent. It's not consistent with the comp plan. You just adopted a comp plan a year ago. Now we're getting twice the density. Twice the density called for in that new comp plan. I understand the flexibilities and all of that, but I would also suggest that whereas in almost every other circumstance where we grant this type of density increase, you're getting something in exchange for it, generally in the form of ADU or workforce housing units, and we're not getting it here. And the problem that I have with that is this is ideally located for that from

[05:17:54] a transit standpoint. You have the transit options available at this site that you don't and many others in the county. So I've got a problem with that. I love the fact that we're using two of my favorite phrases, on balance and at final site plan.

[05:18:11] That's not the way to deal with parking. And I agree with Midco, both on the parking aspect and on the precedent this sets. You've got a lot of surrounding adjacent properties that will, in all likelihood, be reprogrammed, replanned upscaled sometime in the near future and you are now raising the bar with respect to density in terms of what they can expect and with that will bring more parking more traffic the same issues and then suddenly you have something that is dramatically different than what was planned

[05:18:48] in the comp plan so at this density and with these issues I'm afraid I can't support it I kind of like the project but uh the downsides are just too much for me thank you thank you uh seeing no further discussion ms madden motion passes six to two supervisors lawson and we're voting nay thank you very much congratulations and thank you for doing business in prince william county

[05:19:25] with that i don't know if the applicants want to leave but we will move on to 13b which is the rezoning of 2022-00027 oakmont in the gainesville magisterial district i believe mr is mr pratter here mr pratter is here to give us a presentation from the applicant followed by a presentation from

[05:19:52] staff good evening chair wheeler members i'll give them a minute turn it over all right good

[05:20:31] evening chair wheeler members of the board brian prater with walsh collucci lublin walsh here tonight on behalf of the applicant and first of all Merry Christmas and happy holidays. Here with me tonight is the applicant MMSW LLC and Mike Miller is in the audience as well as the civil engineer David Jordan and I will try to be brief on this presentation. This slide shows the property in the context of the Gainesville District. The property is outlined in blue. It's a little under three acres. It's along Route 15, the west side of Route 15 at the intersection of Old Carolina

[05:21:08] and stepping stone drive and dominion valley is up here this slide shows you a closer aerial of the property it like i said it's about 2.9 acres of undeveloped land it used to have a single family house that has been abandoned and vacant for quite some time and it is adjacent to simmons grove neighborhood here and one thing to observe is this is actually doesn't have frontage on stepping stone this is owned by the west market hoa this property right here property is currently zoned a1 and is comprehensively planned rnt2 which recommends a residential density of one to four

[05:21:48] dwelling units an acre the applicant seeking a rezoning to r4 to allow for four single family lots that's about a 1.3 dwelling unit per acre so that's in line with the comp plan and the recommended densities really represents an infill project as you can see a lot of the areas surrounding this property are predominantly residential so it's putting in a final piece to that this slide shows the general development plan as i mentioned four lots there three of the lots lots one two and four will be accessing off of wishing rockaway and then lot three here will be

[05:22:26] accessing off of an existing driveway and easement across that hoa property one tidbit about the application is this applicant is intending to live in lot three in the uh house he's building there The applicant worked well with staff as far as the limits of clearing and grading and preservation of existing trees.

[05:22:46] There are two specimen trees here that you can see, and the applicant worked the limits of clearing and grading that you can see in this dashed gray line to preserve those. There is also a proffer to provide a tree preservation plan at the time of site plan to make sure that those trees are preserved adequately.

[05:23:04] Also, the applicant adjusted the limits of clearing and grading to save this stand of pine trees in this location. And then one of the aspects of this application that's garnered the most attention at the Planning Commission and from some of the citizens is the connection of existing Wishing Rock Way to Stepping Stone.

[05:23:24] So as you can see on this slide, there is an existing temporary cul-de-sac at the end of Wishing Rock Way when the Simmons Grove neighborhood, the neighborhood to the north, was developed. It's actually, if I go back, bear with me, a little easier to see on this.

[05:23:45] So you can see the existing temporary cul-de-sac, and then you can also see on County Mapper the right-of-way that was dedicated here to the county. There was always intent to make that connection. It's a sound transportation planning exercise. There's also a sign there that many of you are familiar with.

[05:24:03] When the county intends to extend future right-of-way, they will put up a sign indicating as much. So that sign is there to put homeowners on notice. One of the reasons that this connection is supported by VDOT and county transportation and requested by them is because it improves overall circulation.

[05:24:23] Right now, the residents that live in Simmons Grove, if they are going to come from south on 15, so if they're headed northbound on 15, or old carolina to get to their neighborhood since this is a right in right out with the median they have to go about a half mile north to lightener road to do a u-turn and then come back down and do the right into simmons grove similarly if they want to head northbound to loudon county these residents will have to cross this is about three lanes here and then with the dedicated turn lanes you have five lanes they have to weave through those lanes of traffic to get into this

[05:25:00] to do a u-turn to go north those are both unsafe movements and it's not just the residents that are required to do those movements it's also your first responders police school buses and fire trucks so from a transportation planning perspective this is a supported connection to improve the circulation in the area so some of the citizens express concern about that connection because of the loss of the cul-de-sac as well as perception that there would be cut through traffic There are also a lot of residents within the neighborhood that would like to see that connection made because of the improvements to the overall circulation in the area.

[05:25:40] And then one of the things that came out of the Planning Commission recommendation of approval was for the applicant to explore the possibility of a playground area on the property. Some of this might have stemmed from the residents saying that their children currently play in the cul-de-sac and that would be loss of a play area.

[05:26:02] The applicant did look into that prior to coming before you all tonight, and that response is in your staff report. To summarize it, there are a few issues with that. One being, it's a really small area over here where the cursor is. This would be the only plausible area to provide a playground amenity, and it would not have much space for many amenities.

[05:26:25] Additionally, because of the topography, it would be very costly to provide that. And then since this is a stormwater management facility, you would have a playground very close to a stormwater facility, which isn't the safest idea. Additionally, and probably most importantly, is that if this four-lot neighborhood is not part of the Simmons Grove HOA, there are significant liability insurance and maintenance concerns for having a play area that's implicitly for other kids in the area.

[05:26:58] So those are the reasons that the applicant was unable to provide that play amenity, and I believe staff concurs with that reasoning. Going back, so these houses will face forward on Route 15 to provide a better aesthetic so you're not looking at the rear of the house, as well as have the backyards not along Route 15.

[05:27:24] So because of the way these houses are facing, the code doesn't actually require a buffer in that area, But the applicant, if I don't keep clicking too quickly, has proffered this landscape area. And one of the things in the proffer is because this is the journey through hallowed ground, the applicant's willing to include some plantings for the journey through hallowed ground, like the American chestnut and redbud.

[05:27:46] And then this is an example of the type of single-family homes that would be provided in this neighborhood. With a recommendation of approval from staff and the Planning Commission, we respectfully request an approval for you all tonight, and I can answer any questions. Why don't we hear from staff, and then we'll do some questions that will go faster.

[05:28:07] Mr. Meyer, is it you again? Welcome. Okay, Scott Meyer again. Nothing has changed in that regard.

[05:28:22] I'm back. So this is Oakmont. As Mr. Prater pointed out, it's a rezoning request for four dwelling units at a density of 1.36 dwelling units per acre. So one thing to remember is this is a planned RN2, residential neighborhood, where we look for a density from one to four dwelling units.

[05:28:44] So this is on the lower end of the density range, four dwelling units. Again, the intent is to basically continue what has started in Simmons Grove. So think of it as, you know, where the site is here. You know, it's basically going to continue the single-family detached development trend from what we already have to the north.

[05:29:05] west market is down here to the south which is more of excuse me more of the kind of the medium density so this is a planned uh rn2 residential neighborhood r4 directly implements with our new comp plan um and again one to four dwelling units per acre this is 1.4 you could say dwelling units per acre so it's uh completely consistent in that regard um the r6 more of the that's more of the townhouses more attached single family so little more dense down here

[05:29:44] but this is the area that we're focusing on and we have again the lot cover it's meeting the r4 standards and again we're looking at a four new residential dwelling units as mr prater pointed out there was considerable a concern about the extension of the cul-de-sac but we have to look out in the planning office what makes sense sound planning and uh proper circulation and when there's a road that is intended to be extended we look at all the options first of all but you know we feel

[05:30:19] this will kind of complete the loop i know there were concerns about cut through traffic but right now i want to point out that to go with this median uh dividing um you know right divided highway right here you have to go up to lightener make a u-turner you're looking at over a mile to basically make that movement.

[05:30:39] And I have a slide, you know, which will, you know, explain that more. This is the sign right now about at the end of Wishing Rock. Again, looking, you know, to the south, says to be extended. So we look for, you know, what makes sense given the planning in the area.

[05:30:58] As Brian had mentioned before, along 15, we have the landscaping enhancements planned, showing there's some specimen trees on the site, and the applicants have worked with us to limit the extent of clearing and grading. Again, it's not a very large site.

[05:31:15] It's under three acres, so we feel the applicant's done what they can in that regard. Tree preservation plan is being proffered. I want to show this as well. This is done in conjunction with transportation, where right now this is just showing the current situation.

[05:31:34] So the proffers for Simmons Grove show a planned interparcel connection. And the DCSM requires that all interparcel connections be constructed. So we have to look at the policy. We have to balance all these factors at play.

[05:31:52] And this is going real quick. Excuse me. And this is showing right now to get into the development, one has to go northward all the way up to Leitner. We had another rezoning where, you know, there were concerns utter back over a year ago.

[05:32:07] So this is basically eliminating the 1.2-mile-out-of-the-way movement to connect where we feel makes sense to the south. And the Planning Commission was recommending approval.

[05:32:24] They did ask, the commission did ask the applicant to look at the feasibility of a playground. The applicant has done that. In my staff report on page three and four, the applicants provided a response in terms of why that was not feasible.

[05:32:41] Again, limited area, there's safety considerations, topography, there's liability issues. Staff concurs with that. Again, we have to report out they did look at that consideration. Unfortunately, they were not able to accommodate that. But staff does feel this meets the intent of the comprehensive plan.

[05:32:58] it's in fill it meets it meets the intent of the surrounding uh area and with that i'll be happy to answer any questions the staff is recommending approval with the proffers dated august 7th 2023 without the playground area as is so uh thank you thank you very much mr meyer with that do we have any questions supervisor weir sorry mr prater you know my feelings on that ingress egress from lot three but i'm assuming that hasn't changed at all it has not okay um do you have any sense of

[05:33:35] where these four homes will stand with respect to hoa membership whether it's going to be west market or stepping stone or is that still up that is still a little up in the air um the the way the proffers read is that this applicant will have to create an hoa if it's not annexed into simmons Grove or West Market, and as part of that, the covenants associated with the four-lot HOA, there would have to be specific language in there to allow for Simmons Grove or West Market to assume those lots, should they agree to do so.

[05:34:13] All right. Thank you. Okay. Seeing no further questions at this time, I will officially open the public hearing on item 13B, the rezoning 2022-00027 Oakmont.

[05:34:29] we have three people signed up currently to speak um those if please give us your name and generally where you live at the beginning of your marks we have dan hutchinson muhammad tayyab and umar tayyab hello chair wheeler and uh members of the board my name is dan hutchinson i'm in the simmons grove uh community right next to the place for the oakmont uh development is going and I've come over here to express my support for the project, all of it.

[05:35:08] I've got no reservations at all about it. My biggest concern or my biggest personal point of view is the elimination of those U-turns that we were just talking about. By extending that road through there, it eliminates those U-turns that I have to take on every single trip from my house, not just me, everybody who lives there.

[05:35:31] And it's not just some theoretically dangerous thing. Just a few weeks ago, my son's girlfriend got in an accident right there at one of those U-turns and wound up in the hospital.

[05:35:48] It's genuinely dangerous. We've been scared of it for a long time. I taught two teenagers how to drive in that condition. It was not good. So that's my primary concern is the safety side. And I very much support that.

[05:36:05] Additionally, it's been referred to as a fill-in project or an infill project. And it really does complete that section of road, turns it into more of a community. That little three-acre piece has been an eyesore for years.

[05:36:21] I've been there for 15 years. And it's been just recently they've started to keep it mowed in preparation for this. So that's been a real relief already. So that's my opinion, is that I'm very much in support and would really like to see this project go through just as it's shown.

[05:36:40] Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please.

[05:36:56] My name is Muhammad Ayyub. I'm a resident of Simmons Grove.

[05:37:12] I live on that cul-de-sac, which we are affected by. And we are affected in a very negative way by the developer's plan. We are not against the construction of the four houses. we are against the proposed connection of the wishing rock way to the stepping stone drive in late 2021 we had a conversation with the builder that we were told that the cul-de-sac may be extended a little bit just to accommodate the four additional houses and that's what the sign is there for and in 2022 we saw the plans that connected wishing rock way with the stepping

[05:37:47] stone drive earlier on that was another plan this cul-de-sac's been there for 20 years for the past 20 years that cul-de-sac has been there. People in that community are used to it. That's their livelihood. Sign was posted at some point that the street may be extended. It did not say that it will be extended. It must be extended. No, it may be extended and it definitely did not say that it will be connected to the Stepping Stone Drive. It may be extended to accommodate this parcel that we're talking about that is going to be developed. It makes sense. You know, they need access that's fine you can extend it you have access to those four houses no

[05:38:26] problem with that do not connect it to the stepping stone neither did it say that it must be extended the reason for the sign must have been to accommodate the you know that the lot we spoke with the VDOT and they said that you know we make recommendations to connect point A with point B it's it's not their call whether or not county will move forward with the plan or not it's up to it's It's their discretion if they want to move forward.

[05:38:52] It's their roads. So please put yourselves in our shoes and see if, you know, we have made some recommendations. Our view was that, you know, there should be another cul-de-sac from the south side for the three houses.

[05:39:13] The fourth house is already connected to the stepping stone. So we recommended that there should be a cul-de-sac for the other three houses. It's a win-win for both sides. Again, we are not against the project, we are just against connecting the road across because there's going to be a lot of people who are going to be coming down from north and they're going to be cutting through.

[05:39:34] There's 150 houses right in the mess over here, 150 houses. And when the road backs up, everybody's going to find that shortcut they're going to make through the Simmons Grove Drive, through Wishing Rockway, and on to the West Market area.

[05:39:54] We're trying to avoid that. Our kids play over here. It's a private area for us. So this is an alternative, and we really would like you guys to consider that. We are simply asking that the current cul-de-sac stay as is. The additional three houses be connected from the south side.

[05:40:15] And, yeah, we were talking about the stormwater and emergency vehicle. There is another stormwater right area. There's two stormwater areas. Ms. Madden, is his time up? I'm sorry, your time is up.

[05:40:30] within 100 feet, maybe. Next speaker, please. Good afternoon, supervisors.

[05:40:49] My name is Omar Muhammad Dayab. We represent the neighborhood kids from Simmons Grove Drive community. We live at Wishing Rock Way, and we understand that the lot next to our homes is planned to be turned into houses.

[05:41:06] That hopefully means more kids in the neighborhood that we can play with which is a good thing but we've also been told that as a result of building these houses our lifestyle would need to change as well but not in a very good way today as we have this cul-de-sac at wishing rock way which is a dead end no traffic comes this way all of us i mean the kids sometimes even the grown-ups play our games over here basketball soccer and lots of other games too. Most of us learned how to bike and how to drive in this cul-de-sac as well. If

[05:41:43] nothing else, we just sit and talk and gather around this cul-de-sac. We feel safe around this area and so do our parents. They can keep an eye on us whenever we want and it's closest to our homes. We can run back home whenever we want to when we're playing outside. We don't have to keep asking our parents to take us to some park just every day to have our game time. This cul-de-sac is our backyard. Today, it's separated from all the noise and traffic. We don't want to lose it.

[05:42:14] We would like to keep it that way. We understand that the builder would like to turn this cul-de-sac into a through-way street, turning this into a high-volume traffic area. That means we would lose this playground that's nearest to our homes. Removing this cul-de-sac may create some convenience for some neighbors who don't live on this street, but it would certainly take a lot away from our lives. We're directly affected by this. Please do consider these concerns as well.

[05:42:43] Before you say yes to the project, please imagine that you lived here. Your kids played at this cul-de-sac. Your livelihood revolved around this area. Would your kids want to lose the playground that they play with every single day? Would you want to lose the area? We're not grown-ups yet, but we still do understand that this is affected to us, and this could mean a lot to us.

[05:43:09] And please pay attention to our voices as well. We urge you to please consider the alternative connection proposed for this project. Our request is not an unreasonable request. Please do not link Wishing Rockaway with Stepping Stone drives.

[05:43:24] Thank you very much. Thank you very much. Is there anyone, Ms. Manda, do we have anyone online? Is anyone in chambers who would like to speak during public hearing 13B? Okay, seeing no one approach the microphone, this will officially close.

[05:43:46] The hearing on rezoning 2022-0002713B. Supervisor Weir. Question for Mr. Prater and for Mr. Meyer.

[05:44:07] Either one of you or both can address it, I guess. Where does the application stand with respect to crossing the West Market HOA property for access? So the applicant met with the West Market HOA board to inform them of the project and then since had subsequent discussions and have gotten a letter of intent or an agreement in principle for a price point to acquire that roughly 2,000 square feet.

[05:44:35] So they've worked out the access issue? They're waiting to final dot the I's and cross the T's until after the rezoning was approved. And from the applicants, I don't know whose responsibility this would be, but what is the intent with respect to the existing paved cul-de-sac if the punch-through is done?

[05:45:00] So the existing paid cul-de-sac, as I understand it, that would be... Remain paved? No, that would be, I believe, returned to grass. And that would be... At whose expense? That would be as part of the applicant's expense when they do those improvements.

[05:45:16] Okay. Thank you. Is that proffered? The improvement? Yeah. The return to grass. No, that is not specifically in the proffers, but that's how I understand that.

[05:45:31] It's required. It's required. It's required? Okay. I don't have a question, but I will just make a comment in that. I understand living on a cul-de-sac and having a change is a massive change. But I also know, you know, I live north of here, and I've lived north of here for 20-plus years, and I was horrified when they built Simmons Grove with no way out and having to make a U-turn at 15 and Stepping Stone slash Old Carolina, which is so many things going on at that intersection.

[05:46:03] I can't imagine having to make a U-turn there because the people are coming from the right anyway. It's because you have an arrow coming from the right when you're coming off of Old Carolina, which means that the people who are making U-turn will also have an arrow, and I can just see why that wouldn't work out very well. For me, this is really, well, and given that we approved another development down Lightner Road, the Utterback development, which means the Lightner intersection is going to be improved, but we'll have heavier egress that people have to make a U-turn at Leitner.

[05:46:34] This, to me, is just a safety issue, you know, in terms of improving it for the Simmons Grove people and everybody who's pulling out. And so I support the connection just from a safety standpoint for the community that I live in, and I just wanted to make that note. So, Supervisor Weir, there are no questions or further discussions.

[05:46:52] Would you like to make a motion? Thank you, Madam Chair. And it's just funny that at this last meeting, I'm actually going to agree wholeheartedly with you. I don't believe I just said that. That'll be my going away gift. Thank you. That being said, before I make the motion, I can empathize with the people in the cul-de-sac.

[05:47:15] But this is a function of requiring interpersonal connections that might not come to fruition for decades. And I don't like it. In an ideal world, I wouldn't move this, but for a variety of concerns, mostly traffic-related, I'll move adoption.

[05:47:38] Second. Motion made by Supervisor Weir, seconded by Supervisor Bailey. Any further discussion? Seeing none, Chair. Supervisor Lawson. I'm sorry. Young man, thank you for coming down and being a part of this civic process.

[05:47:59] I don't think the vote is going to go the way you want it to. But please know that we, all eight of us, appreciate that you got down here with your dad tonight and participated in this process. We do have safety concerns, and I understand your concerns regarding the cul-de-sac.

[05:48:21] We're going to rely on the transportation folks to make sure that we do everything to mitigate those concerns. But I just wanted to thank you because it's not very often we get to have children come down and address us. And I'm ending my term talking to somebody that I really appreciate.

[05:48:39] So thank you so much. Supervisor Bailey. I'm impressed with you. Thank you. Seeing no further discussion, please vote.

[05:48:55] Vote unanimous. Motion to adjourn. Second. Vice Chair Bodie has made a motion to adjourn, seconded by Supervisor Bailey. Any further discussion?

[05:49:11] supervisor bode supervisor franklin sure i just want to say one last thank you to my colleagues who will be departing supervisor lawson thank you to your service and chair wheeler thank you as well thank you thank you and with that please vote vote unanimous we're adjourned

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