Coraggio Consulting
Prince William Board of County Supervisors Meeting, Tuesday, November 19, 2024

Date: Tuesday, November 19, 2024
Place: Prince William County Board of County Supervisors, Virginia
Length: 7h 33m (video)
Official meeting video (Prince William County, Granicus): https://pwcgov.granicus.com/player/clip/3576
Official Board of County Supervisors page (Prince William County): https://www.pwcva.gov/department/board-county-supervisors

Machine transcript (speech-to-text) produced by Coraggio Consulting. Not an official county record. Names and numbers may be misspelled; check the video at the timestamp before quoting.
Speech-to-text: whisper.cpp, model large-v3-turbo. Produced 2026-10-31. Timestamps are [HH:MM:SS] into the meeting video.

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[00:42:13] All right. Good afternoon, everyone. It is 2 o'clock. Our meeting is now in session, and we are going to begin with a moment of silence.

[00:42:36] Thank you. Please stand, if you are able, for the Pledge of Allegiance.

[00:43:04] All right. Thank you, everyone. We are now going to move on to approval minutes. I would like to get a motion for 3A, 3B, and 3C. So moved, Madam Chair. Second. Any discussion?

[00:43:21] All right. Let's go ahead and vote.

[00:43:34] Unanimous. All right. Thank you so very much. We are going to go to accommodations and proclamations. I am going to hold one by request for A until the end. I'd like to get a motion for 4B through 4D.

[00:43:53] So moved, Madam Chair. Second. Any discussion? All right. Let's vote on those. Unanimous. All right.

[00:44:08] Let's move back to 4A. I'd like to get a motion for 4A. So moved, Madam Chair. Second. All right. Discussion? All right. Discussion. Hold on.

[00:44:24] I see Supervisor Franklin and Bailey. Sure. Just very quickly, I want to thank Supervisor Booty for bringing this item. I had the opportunity to attend the retirement ceremony, I think Supervisor Bailey I saw there, for Congresswoman Wexton, and she has been critically important over the past several years.

[00:44:47] To our delegation, I reside in the 7th, and she represents the 10th, but I can tell you she was always very helpful in making sure that both districts had what they needed and work very carefully and closely with the 7th Congressional. So, you know, an early ending to a wonderful career.

[00:45:07] But I just want to thank her and her staff for the work that they've done, particularly for Prince William County. If you have not met Congresswoman Wexton, she is quite, quite a genuine, true leader and really, really the epitome of public service. So thank you, Supervisor Bode, for bringing this forward.

[00:45:25] Supervisor Bailey. Thank you, Madam Chair, and welcome back, Madam Chair. I just wanted to thank my colleague, Supervisor Bode, also. Great minds think alike. And kudos and congratulations and much success in the future for our own Congressional District Congresswoman Wexton.

[00:45:44] I, too, as Supervisor Franklin said, attended her retirement ceremony on Sunday, and it was wonderful. I mean, from even Maryland people came because of the great collaboration and the great work that she's done, not just for the state of Virginia, but just being in that audience, that congressional audience, how she has collaborated and worked in a bipartisan way for the nation.

[00:46:09] And so I wish her well, and I wish her well in her advocacy for the unfortunate concern that she has with her health. She's going to move forward in advocating for those in the future so they might have the services and the medical services and the advocacy that they need to live a better quality of life.

[00:46:30] So we thank you if you're watching. We thank you for your service. We thank you for your collaboration, and Godspeed. Supervisor Angry. Thank you, Madam Chair. I didn't intend to speak, but I wanted to second that because I have had the fortunate opportunity of watching Jennifer Wexson grow in her career in politics.

[00:46:55] I was in the Army as a SARB major and we met at a, it was a, it's a retreat for horses that they compared with civilians, if you will, and into a merry of rehabilitating processes.

[00:47:14] And so she was a senator then. And so it was impressive as I met her, every time I went around, I'd see her at other events and then I became a politician too. And so I watched her grow to a congresswoman, and she watched me grow into this political position. And so I'm just very grateful that I've got to be a part of her career and her journey.

[00:47:36] You know, I am crushed with everything going on with her, and she's such a great human being. And I love you, Jennifer Wexson. And I know this is recorded, so download it, because I just want you to know how much your career and your life, And every time I've seen you has impressed me to continue on in this path of politics that I am now on.

[00:48:00] So thank you for everything you've done for me, the mentorship and the guidance. And I love you. Thank you. Thank you, guys, for your kind words. All right, let's go ahead and take a vote. Vote unanimous.

[00:48:18] Supervisors Vega and Gordy abstaining from vote. All right, thank you so very much. So for the first one, Supervisor Bodie, if you can join me at the podium for that one. and Supervisor Bailey, if you can join me for 4-D.

[00:48:35] Certainly. 4-D this evening. I forgot. That's okay. I believe we have a representative from Congresswoman Wexton's office.

[00:49:16] Good afternoon. 4-A, commend Honorable Jennifer Lynn Wexton, decades of service. The Honorable Jennifer Wexton has served the Commonwealth for over two decades as a prosecutor, attorney, advocate for abuse children, Senator of Virginia, and United States Congresswoman.

[00:49:36] In her five years in the General Assembly, She passed more than 40 bills and found bipartisan support for legislation that made children safer online, fought the heroin and opioid epidemics, and increased access to affordable health care. Congresswoman Wexton has represented Virginia's 10th congressional district of the United States House of Representatives since 2019, where she has been a leader on many issues, including supporting survivors of abuse and domestic violence, enhancing research for childhood cancer, and protecting the integrity of the federal workforce.

[00:50:10] Congresswoman Wexton passed bipartisan legislative initiatives to further expand for opioid addiction research, safeguard Americans' retirement savings during the COVID-19 crisis. Her team has also successfully helped more than 11,000 constituents receive assistance from federal agencies, returning more than $20,000 to taxpayers.

[00:50:30] The Prince William County Board of Supervisors hereby commends the Honorable Jennifer Wexton for her long years of service as a prosecutor, attorney, advocate for abused children, Senator Virginia, United States Congresswoman, and her many contributions to the public good during that time. Thank you so much to the board for this opportunity.

[00:50:53] My name is Anthony Barnes. I'm the Deputy District Director for Congresswoman Wexton. Congresswoman Wexton, her responsibility can't be here. Her responsibility is on the Hill. Keep her occupied at this time. But it's been an absolute honor for the congresswoman as well as our staff to represent the people of the 10th Congressional District, and we look forward to continuing the legacy of the congresswoman as we move forward.

[00:51:14] Thank you.

[00:51:40] Next is Adoption, National Adoption Day. We can have social services.

[00:52:06] William County recognizes the importance of giving children permanent, safe, and loving families through adoption. There are more than 700 children in the Virginia foster care system who are waiting to be adopted including 15 here in prince william county to help these children find permanent nurturing families the local courts of the 31st judicial district opened their doors to celebrate national adoption day on saturday november 16th 2024 to finalize and recognize the adoptions of local kids and join other organizations to help celebrate all adoptions prince william

[00:52:40] county is proud to proclaim november 23rd 2024 as national adoption day and urges all citizens to join in a national effort to raise awareness about the importance of adoption you have a few words for us yes thank you madam chair and members of the board my name is phyllis jenise hold and i'm director of social services today i have with me my acting deputy director holly Handy and the Acting Assistant Director, Jessica McCauley, for Family Support and Services Division.

[00:53:14] Prince William County Department of Social Services is proud of the work we do to promote permanency and safety for children for whom we serve and protect. Adoption is an alternative that provides family life for children who cannot live with their biological parents and provides an opportunity for those to find a forever home. We are emotional beings and we all desire to be connected to someone and family is the foundation that keeps us rooted i'm proud to accept this proclamation on behalf of the department and we thank you for your continued

[00:53:46] support in this recognition next we have item 4c and that is to proclaim saturday november 3rd

[00:54:43] i'm 30th i'm sorry small business saturday and who do we have join us economic development small business saturday is celebrated annually between black friday one of the best shopping days of the year, and Cyber Monday.

[00:55:05] This day is dedicated to supporting the local small businesses that help create jobs, boost our economy, and keep communities thriving nationwide. Small Business Saturday has illustrated the significance of supporting small, independently owned businesses across the county or country for 15 years.

[00:55:24] Prince William County is joining local governments throughout the country to acknowledge and celebrate Small Business Saturday and to promote the shop small message. The Prince William Board of County Supervisors proclaim Saturday, November 30th, 2024, a Small Business Saturday and encourage our community to support our small businesses on Small Business Saturday and throughout the year.

[00:55:51] Would you like to say something? Thank you, Chair Jefferson. Hello, everyone. I'm Christina Wynn. I am the Executive Director of Economic Development and Tourism, And I'm so excited to be joined today by two of our representatives from our Small Business Advisory Council and small business owners themselves.

[00:56:09] We have Sarah Berzio, who is with Hitchcock Creative and helps to lead Visit Aquacon. And then Janae Monroe, who is owner of Professionals by Design and is very active in our Chamber of Commerce.

[00:56:25] One very important person that is missing here today is Clarice Grove. All of you know her. She is our small business development manager who has been recently promoted to our business and retention manager. Very excited. But she is out of the state today and couldn't be here.

[00:56:43] But any opportunity to promote small business, she would love to be here. But you don't want to hear from me. You are going to hear from Sarah, one of our small business owners. Thank you. Hello. My name is Sarah Berzio and I'm the owner of Hitchcock Paper Company, Tiny Supply Co. in Occoquan and Executive Director of our tourism non-profit, Visit Occoquan.

[00:57:09] Before I begin, I would like to thank Christina Wynn and Clarice Grove for inviting me to speak here today. I would also like to extend my thanks to the board and Chair Jefferson for their continued support of small businesses in Prince William County and for proclaiming November 30th Small Business Saturday.

[00:57:26] Through the work of the Small Business Advisory Council at the Department of Economic Development and Tourism, we've been able to access support, education, and networks of fellow business owners helping us to expand and succeed. I moved to Prince William County in 2008 with a graphic design company in my spare bedroom.

[00:57:45] Just me and a laptop and no experience running a business. 16 years later, this spare room hobby grew into an award-winning design firm, two successful retail shops in historic Occoquan, employing more than a dozen people. Through the support of this community, I was able to grow and thrive my business, despite not having a business degree and battling rising costs of supplies, global pandemics, and economic uncertainty. Owning a small business is hard, but some more support from our community leaders and members make it possible.

[00:58:18] People like Occoquan Supervisor Kenny Bode, Town of Occoquan Mayor Ernie Porta, and the staff at Occoquan Town Hall who are always there to support new business openings and continue to shop and dine with us throughout the year. And my fellow Occoquan business owners who take community over competition to heart and support each other as colleagues and friends instead of rivals. So thank you for proclaiming Small Business Saturday on November 30th and I invite the entire board and our county to shop small this holiday season and throughout the year in historic Occoquan and

[00:58:53] throughout prince william county thank you all right the next portion is the consent agenda but

[01:00:08] before we get into that i just want to know a couple of um we have about three items for both meetings that have been pulled um i want to or that we will not be discussing today and i just want to quickly note that 8m um public hearing for 8m um that has been withdrawn from staff And for our evening meeting, we have two items, 14B and 14C.

[01:00:34] The applicant has requested deferral to a date uncertain. So I just wanted to note that before we get in to the next section. So consent agenda, I wanted to see if there was anyone on the board who had something that they wanted to pull for further discussion.

[01:00:57] All right, Supervisor Weird and Vega. Could you pull 5F, please? all right 5f supervisor vega i had 5f uh 5g as well please 5g madam madam chair i misspoke it was 5g not 5f i'm sorry 5f is fine with me 5f only 5g 5f for me that was mine 5f so i'm sorry 5f for supervisor vega 5g for supervisor right thank you so then i'd like to get a motion um for 5A through 5E and 5H and 5I.

[01:01:38] So moved, Madam Chair. Second. All right. Any discussion on those? Madam Chair. Well, you called out, but Franklin hit the... So I'm going to give it to Franklin, Gordy, then Bodie. All right. Thank you.

[01:01:55] There are two consent items for the Whitbridge District, items 5C and I believe 5D. The first one is issuing a quick claim to parcels of land on Neabsco Road to the county, and the second is to endorse the location and design of the Marina Way Extension Project, which is going to go along with our kind of revitalization efforts for Route 1.

[01:02:22] So hoping that my colleagues can be supportive, and thank you. Supervisor Gordy. Madam Chair, I'll defer for just a second because I believe Supervisor Bode had a COIA issue. Ah, oh, oh, all right.

[01:02:38] So before we go any further, Bodie and Angry. Thank you, Madam Chair. Sorry I jumped in there. I forgot for a second, but then I felt eyes upon me from Madam Counsel, and I remembered. Madam Chair, before the board considers and votes on the consent agenda, I need to declare a personal interest in item 5E to authorize a public hearing on the school crossing zone posted speed limit.

[01:03:02] My wife is a school's employee. As a school's employee, my wife and I are members of a group which is affected by this matter. I will be participating in it because I am able to do so fairly objectively in the public interest. Madam Chair, before the board considers and votes on the consent agenda, I need to declare a personal interest in item 5E to authorize a public hearing on the school crossing zone posted speed limit.

[01:03:28] My wife is a special educational aide with the schools. As a school's employee, my wife and I are members of a group which is affected by this matter. I will be participating in it because I am able to do so fairly, objectively, and in the public interest.

[01:03:44] Thank you, Madam Chair. All right, thank you, and thank you, Madam County Attorney. All right, Supervisor Bode. We'll go back to Gordy. You're going to go because he went back okay. Well, I just want to, speaking of the school, I really appreciate all the work of our transportation team working with Linton Hall School.

[01:04:04] The intersection right there in front of the school is, it's interesting, there's a guardrail that's there that seems to be always damaged because of the number of accidents that take place in this. So reducing the speed limit in front of the school and then having the 25-mile-an-hour speed limit during the school time is going to hopefully result in a much safer passage and easier for families to get in and out of the Linton Hall School.

[01:04:32] So I really appreciate the transportation folks for working on this and cooperating with Linton Hall School. Thank you. Supervisor Bode. Thank you, Madam Chair. Just wanted to highlight 5B. It's a transfer of funds for us to begin the groundwater study work.

[01:04:52] I want to thank Director Chamut and his team, as well as the county executive and his team for putting together the scope of work for the groundwater study. I know a lot of folks have been requesting this and looking for this for quite some time. Really also wanted to highlight the fact that I issued that directive back in July and just a few months later, we have an actual resolution to begin work on that.

[01:05:13] So wanted to highlight that as well and thank the director again and the county exec for their work on this. All right. Thank you. And we have a couple open seats down here if you're looking for a place to sit. All right. We don't look like we have anyone else in queue.

[01:05:33] All right. So let's go ahead and take our vote. Vote unanimous. All right. Let's go on to 5F. Can I get a motion for 5F?

[01:05:51] So moved, Madam Chair. Second. All right. Discussion. I'm actually going to, you know, and I'm going to say something real quick because I did speak to Supervisor Vega and I want to speak on this one. During the budget cycle, we had moved back the due date for personal property taxes because a number of people got their bill and, you know, there was a little bit of surprise there. And we had talked at that time about coming up with a better solution, you know, so we don't always have to, you know, keep pushing

[01:06:29] back the date, and it is quite costly. We're losing money in interest, you know, and obviously this charge should do a second billing. For this budget season, or the next year's budget season, I just want to say we need to have a conversation about the personal property tax rate, and if there is something that we can do, so people don't feel surprised when they get their car tax. We have made it an effort to lower the property tax rate.

[01:06:56] And so I think we're going to need to look at other ways of providing a relief to residents. So I just wanted to note that when we talk about the budget next year, I want to have a conversation around that. I see Supervisor Franklin in queue.

[01:07:12] Did you tap? Because I didn't see you. I see. Okay. All right. I'll go Vegas and then Franklin. Thank you, Madam Chair. Michelle, I have a quick question for you. little bit of background for folks that are here and watching at home. So what the board is being asked for is we're being asked for $110,000 for fiscal year 2025 to support a second billing of unpaid vehicle classification of tangible personal property taxes. Michelle, this is not the first time that we extend the date, correct? That's correct. Okay. In previous years, because it's

[01:07:48] my second time on the board, did you come to the board asking for additional funds to re-advertise or remind folks so we did not and we did not do our second billing last time and it created a lot of confusion for many of our taxpayers they were confused as when the when their tax was due because it you know it had been moved in a couple months ago last time it was moved to january so much further time went away so this time we felt like it really was the best customer service for us to send revised bills out we didn't send them to everybody as of october 18th about 57 percent of people had already paid their taxes in full so we sent it to about half of our our base those that were unpaid we sent revised bills with the revised due date out and that way they know

[01:08:27] specifically when it's due and why that helps them is is because the way the code is written is if they miss that due date the penalty and interest goes back to the original due date and so it can become very costly for our taxpayers um if they're not aware of that new due date so that's why so thank you for that for answering my initial question which was we've done it before and you guys have never come to the board asking for additional funds to remind folks that was my first question. Now, the resolution that was presented to the board, it doesn't really go into details how we're going to do it. Are we sticking to the original? We're going to go ahead and send out a reminder. And is the 110,000 that you're requesting going to cover everybody in

[01:09:05] terms of being reminded of the extension? Sure. So the last time we did not send the second billing out. So there wasn't a need to come to the board. We didn't incur the additional postage, the printing, the mailing service. This time we will. And it's about half of what an entire building would cost and yes we will be sending it out actually we've already printed printed them they are ready to go i think some of them have actually already gone out we have sufficient budget capacity we're early in the year what i don't know is by end of year will i have enough to cover that and because this is out of contingency reserve what we can do and i've talked to the budget office about this is we won't make that transfer until much later in the year if we don't need it we won't we won't take it out of there but i do want to make sure we're covered

[01:09:44] should we need it our budget does not each year we come to the board for our annual budget there's not an annual budget increased building for postage for example we've had to absorb that over the years so the budget's much tighter i think last year the finance department i think we maybe spent almost all of our budget on all of the things that we do so that's why we're coming to the board this time this wasn't added cost it's the right thing to do for the customer and to the extent we can absorb it we will but if not we know that we have a carved out piece of contingency reserve to make sure we can cover that expenditure thank you that's all i have manager all right supervisor franklin sure yeah thank you for that clarification i think it's

[01:10:23] important that we do send out reminders so that people know that a don't forget that it's coming up and b you know to remind them that obviously we have to make the payment in regards to the overall issue and we can talk about this obviously during budget season but the way we go about it We've talked about this a million times before.

[01:10:45] We've got to look at, you know, the mechanisms in which we do our property tax assessments. I think, Michelle, there are only about four in the country, four or five in the country, that every single locality uses. So we don't have a lot of options.

[01:11:00] But then, too, I think that we have to always consider economic factors. I think there was an expectation that the assessment of particularly used vehicles would decline, and they did decline, I guess just not at the rate that we thought that they would.

[01:11:18] Can you just talk a little bit about that? Sure. So overall, almost all vehicle types declined. There are always outliers in any given year. There's outliers, and particularly where you sometimes see outliers is vehicle models, newer models that aren't yet in the NADA's books.

[01:11:35] So then we have to estimate it based on data we can gather. And typically then those are caught up in the next year when they end up in NADA's book. So that is the only source all localities in Virginia use is the J.D. Powers NADA. There are some other options out there.

[01:11:54] Of course, the board can always, you know, you control the tax rate. The assessment has to be based off of a nationally recognized service. That's a Virginia code. We do have right now one due date. the board has an option to demand the ordinance and have more than one due date with that comes additional administrative cost it spreads the cost out over the years though so there's lots of different options we can talk through there are no options though for tax relief per se other than our programs that we have in place our tax relief for elderly and disabled program that that grants some exemptions and the personal property tax relief act from the commonwealth where we get

[01:12:31] reimbursed a set amount each year it's fixed six for duration and it gets spread against all the vehicles in the county valued under a certain amount and so as our population and number of vehicles grows the amount of that relief that goes to the residents declines so those we other than that we don't have any provisioning code to provide any relief without a general assembly amendment yeah sounds like a legislative agenda item so the last two things i'll say is with regards to um the directive i issued i don't know if it was a year ago or two at this point chris it may be worth re-upping the response to that because i think that will help us kind of

[01:13:08] prepare for the discussion that the chair um wants to have during budget season with which i think is important um and then two um i think it is important that we kind of i don't want to call for a work session but if we have any type of budget work sessions that we're anticipating this may be something good to add so that we all understand kind of how the process works very good thank you for that supervisor and we will have budget work sessions we'll take notes here and make sure that we include vehicle tax in the way that we rate vehicles as part of that

[01:13:44] that work session all right we don't have any other speakers so i want to go ahead let's call for the vote vote unanimous supervisor we're abstaining from vote all right thank you we're now going to move on to 5g if i can get a motion so move madam chair second all right discussion

[01:14:19] supervisor we're thank you madam chair um i for a multitude of reasons personal and otherwise i'm not going to support this um i've been preaching for years both while behind this and from the other side that this was coming, you know, part of the whole golden goose of the data centers coming back to roost and not being quite the golden goose. We've lost tens of

[01:14:55] millions of dollars in revenues from reduced assessments over the last, at least the last six years, either through BOE action or otherwise in terms of the reduction of their, reduction of the real estate assessments. And now there would appear that the data center industry is living up the threats that they levied several years ago that if we didn't correct our assessment process or at least address their concerns with our assessment process, they would stop going through BOE and would go to the courts, and that would appear to be what's happened here.

[01:15:30] I have a couple of other issues with it. I mean, these are warning signs. We've had multiple reassessments this year and in previous years. Now we're hiring outside counsel at a relatively expensive rate for something that, quite frankly, I think we should be doing in-house.

[01:15:53] I would suggest that one of the principal functions the county should have without having to hire outside counsel is being able to take care of its own tax house. And then last but not least, just because I've always been opposed to it, I'm not in favor of adding FTE mid-year.

[01:16:10] that's been this county's mo for years uh a budget is passed ftes get added mid-year or earlier uh inflates the budget inflates the next year's budget costs without any sort of discussion this should have been discussed um previously i am not opposed to giving assessments uh additional fte in fact i think it's probably likely um well overdue but this should have been something that was done at a different time and not waited until until now to do but this this is just a typical way things are done and I'm just not going to support doing things business as

[01:16:50] usual because the one excuse that I hate to hear is well because we've always done it that way that doesn't wash with me so for that a variety of other reasons which I'm not going to bother to go into I will not be supporting this motion all right supervisor Gordy thank you madam chair I I just want to echo the sentiments of Supervisor Weir.

[01:17:12] I mean, if you look into the documents, we've got four lawsuits. We're being sued by Microsoft Corporation from 2019 and 2020 from two different parcels, Amazon Data Services, and then also from the Digital Gateway property owners who fought to have their properties rezoned and now don't want to pay the taxes on that rezoning.

[01:17:37] So the challenge, you know, once again, it's, you know, almost it feels like a bait and switch. You know, these data centers come in, they advertise and they promote the value of data centers to our community is in the amount of taxes that we'll gain.

[01:17:54] And then they sit there and they fight the amount of money that they're supposed to pay in taxes. And then they fight our assessments team tooth and nail so that we can get an accurate figure as to what's actually within those facilities. And then they also play different games in how they manage their servers on the C&P tax and extending the life of the servers from five to ten years, which ensures that we don't get the tax revenue for a longer period of time when it was originally set up that there would be a five-year refresh.

[01:18:27] So once again, um, now we're having to spend $400,000, almost $500,000 of our general revenue funds. But I would remind everyone, because we have a revenue sharing agreement with the schools that this is actually costing the taxpayer over a million dollars because it's a 57% revenue share with the schools. So for us to get this $500,000 means we have to generate over a million in taxes. And so once again, it's very frustrating. Again, we saw what this was going to

[01:19:04] come. All you have to do is read any data center trade publications and you'll see how they fight and how they do everything that they can to reduce their tax obligations. They're very open about this. And yet here we are having to fight multi-billion dollar corporations just to be able to collect the taxes from them that they promised that they would offer us when they brought their applications before this board that's all I have to say madam chair thank you all right supervisor Vega then angry thank you madam chair I obviously agree with what supervisor we are and supervisor Gordy have mentioned I want to take it in a different direction though and this

[01:19:40] is for the county executive and for my colleagues on the dais I do think that a conversation needs to be had or held in regards to how much money we're spending on outsourcing consultants. I requested this information from our procurement office on October 11th, Mr. Shorter.

[01:19:59] We've been going back and forth. You know, they keep asking for extensions. It shouldn't be that complicated to be able to answer how much money we've spent outsourcing, you know, for whatever it is. It happens all the time. And so I'll give you a quick timeline. my initial request was made on october 11th and then i got a response back where i was asked if you know two weeks could be given the two weeks came and went we followed up again on november 14th and then we were asked if we could give them until november 15th november 15th came and went it's tuesday and i still don't have information that i asked for over a month ago i think for me

[01:20:38] personally it's incredibly frustrating i know that we have a very talent team here in the county They're subject matter experts. That's why they were hired to perform their duties and their job. But the constant ask for this board to continue to spend taxpayer dollars on outsourcing help has got to stop.

[01:20:57] We keep talking about the cost of living being high. We keep talking about how our constituents constantly reach out to us because things are tight. I think that as we navigate this budget process, we need to have these figures. We need to know how much money has been spent in outsourcing help, and we've got to figure things out.

[01:21:16] Either restructure the way we operate in terms of staffing, but at some point we have to put an end to all of this money that's being spent. And so I bring this publicly because it makes sense. We can tie it to this situation where we're being asked again for almost half a million dollars to bring in additional help from outside.

[01:21:34] I'm not going to go into my concerns with the Digital Gateway because that's a done deal. it came and went and this is the aftermath these are the consequences of decisions that are made but at the end of the day the people that uh end up um paying for those decisions are the taxpayers and we have to do better by them definitely appreciate that supervisor i was not aware of the request uh i'm going to assume that this is a request for professional services contracts county-wide uh and i'll work with the procurement team to make sure that we get that information to you, in terms of FTEs, believe me, an ask is coming in February, for sure.

[01:22:14] I'm sorry, say that again? An ask will be coming in February as part of the budget process. I'm expecting that, but I also expect the data to justify the ask. Absolutely, absolutely. All right, Supervisor Andrew. Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you, Supervisor Vega, because there lies the issue, which is these FTEs.

[01:22:31] So I just want to be very clear about data centers and this request here. this whole resident this assessment has been an issue ongoing since i was on this board in 2019 long before this board in place was here and so it's always been a discussion so i think my issue would be the fact that if we don't have the talent and we know we're dealing with data centers in this county that we are we need to hire that talent and put it in place and lock it in and not just continue to consult because we've been down this consulting road too many times so i want to just be clear on the fact of a peripheral the peripheral tax or the the residential or the

[01:23:11] assessment tax of the real estate two different taxes they've always had an issue with the real estate assessment and this has always been something that we've been dealing with in the county am i correct miss michelle okay let me so oh yes so so my only point there is i don't want to confuse thinking like data centers are the big bad boogeyman in the room when we when we And what we're dealing with now has been something that's been discussed from Prince William County to localities across the nation and how they're assessing their real estate.

[01:23:42] So it is something that we need to figure out and lock in. And I'm surprised that we're here again because we were here three years ago and we're back. And so I just want to separate in the room the discussion and make sure that we understand what this item of discussion we're here talking about now.

[01:24:01] And to Supervisor Vega's point, I think when it comes to how we hire consultants, I think when it comes to data centers, we should probably bring out someone that's an expert in the field all the way around and bring them into the team so they can deal with these situations.

[01:24:17] Very much appreciate that, Supervisor. Let me say, so this is, there are two things happening here. One is exactly what you all are referencing. We are hiring staff to help us with real estate assessments. So this is, these are actual staff that will be with us permanently.

[01:24:38] Well, I want to allow for the county attorney to speak to the legal piece of this and what is needed in terms of the surge support for legal support. but I wanted to make sure I made the point that for finance, this is our ask for two full-time FTEs that will be with us in perpetuity.

[01:25:04] Madam Chair, members of the board, with regards to actions by the Board of County Supervisors and data centers, for the comp plan amendment, for rezonings, and then for the real estate assessments, there are at least 11 different lawsuits that have been filed against the board.

[01:25:20] our office is defending the board's action in these lawsuits our office is handling eight of those 11 in-house we do need assistance we will be this 300,000 that we are asking for for the litigation support also includes experts if you're familiar with lawsuits especially on real estate assessments you're going to have to have an expert to sit on the witness stand to defend the assessment done by the finance department.

[01:25:47] As Ms. Atreid said on the other item, I'm hoping that we will be able to, we have been pretty successful, knock on wood, on getting several of these lawsuits kicked out, which now we get the reward to defend the board's action and the court's action in the court of appeals. And they will probably be going up to the Virginia Supreme Court.

[01:26:04] I'm hoping that we will be able to file defensive pleadings on behalf of the board and get these cases narrowed. But litigation is expensive. the cost of litigation for the experts for the court reporters etc and so that is why we are asking for the assistance and with regards to this item the council fees are only for the digital gateway the other ones that by the real estate assessments we're handling in-house and manager michelle thank you for that and because it was a lot going on here so i just it's cleared up and and your piece makes the difference on that and i i appreciate that because i know your team

[01:26:42] has been working around the clock on a lot of this stuff. And so thank you for that. Thank you for that clarification. All right, Supervisor Franklin. Sure, I just want to take this in a different direction. I've said this before, but I would like for our finance department to look at assessments altogether in terms of when we do rezonings for certain entities, we tax them immediately for the cost of what the rezoning, the land would be under the new rezoning, regardless of whether construction has been done or not.

[01:27:18] I've had some projects almost completely fall apart because of that. And I appreciate the discussion specifically around data centers, but I think we have a larger issue with the way we do assessments on the commercial side. So I've said that before, and I would like for someone to look into that.

[01:27:35] And maybe we have, and maybe statute says that we have to do it this way. And, okay, the attorney is saying yes, so bring up the legislative agenda. Which is what we're arguing in court right now, Madam Chair, members of the board, with regards to the statutes that must guide what the finance department, what the director of finance must do.

[01:27:53] So we'll see what the courts have to say with regards to that, and then we can discuss general assembly action if that's what the board's prerogative. Do a good job. Thank you, ma'am. I don't know. I want to say, Supervisor Franklin, we might send you down to Richmond to, you know, lobby for us. I mean, you ready. All right.

[01:28:09] Supervisor Weir. Just one more thing, Madam Chair. I think one of the things that we have to understand is that in this particular dynamic, unlike when you're dealing with, let's say, a commercial property, a strip mall, Potomac Mills, whatever that is, the expert testimony that we're going to have to get, the type of consultant that we're going to have to bring in, we're going to have a difficult time getting.

[01:28:40] And we're either going to get, I suspect, those that are of the least value on a bang-for-buck basis or those that are the most expensive. Because I think we're going to have a hard time finding one who's not conflicted by the data center industry. And I suspect that they have already hired or have connections with most of them.

[01:29:00] And if they don't, they'll be making every opportunity to take those bullets out of our guns, so to speak. So this is going to be a long, bumpy, expensive road. Supervisor Fekha. Thank you, Madam Chair.

[01:29:16] Just real quick for the county attorney. So, Ms. Robel, once these lawsuits are done and over with, what happens to these FTEs? If the argument is that we're hiring them for these lawsuits, what happens when the lawsuits are over? Madam Chair, I'll let Ms. Atreid or Mr. Shorter respond to this.

[01:29:32] We're not hiring these FTEs for the finance department for the lawsuit. She can address the FTEs. That's a separate issue. It's for assessments. The other is for litigation support for us in defending the board's action against the lawsuits that have been brought attacking your decisions.

[01:29:50] for that. I want to be clear. The board's decision. Thank you. The board's decision. So the digital gateway is what you're referring to. But the last one that's on page two of the report. Thank you. Yeah, so that county attorney is exactly right. These positions are needed due to the growing numbers of data centers that we have. We originally did plan to bring them through the FY26 budget process, as you suggested. But as these lawsuits did come about, our staff is being pulled to work and assist the county attorney's office. And it also brings bringing these in as half year positions allows us to get them ready for the next january one assessment um so it you know we'll be able to get them kind of a that year of

[01:30:30] training for that next january versus bringing them in half year coming in so these positions will not go away at the end you know less data centers are going to stop building in prince william county right now there's a number of parcels to get be built out so we know that there's going to be more buildings here in the county and we're going to need the staff to adequately assess visit them keep up with the trends as it's a just the research alone on the the data center industry right it evolves and so we have to keep up with all that trend that's happening i'm making sure that we're you know assessing them then accordingly all right thank you so very much to staff it doesn't look like we have anyone else in the queue to speak so let's

[01:31:07] go ahead and take a vote motion passes six to two supervisors vega and we're voting nay all right thank you now we are moving on to um public hearings for budget amendments um madam chair Yep.

[01:31:33] Go, Kenny. Thank you, Madam Chair. Before the board holds the public hearings and votes on these items, I need to declare a personal interest in item 6A to budget and appropriate funds to the schools. My wife is a school's employee. As a school's employee, my wife and I are members of a group which is affected by this matter.

[01:31:50] I will be participating in it because I am able to do so fairly, objectively, and in the public interest. Thank you. God, I wish we could just do this as one, you know. Madam Chair, before the board holds the public hearing and votes on these items, I need to declare a personal interest in item 6A, to budget and appropriate funds to the schools.

[01:32:10] My wife is a special education instructional aide with the schools. As a school's employee, my wife and I are members of a group which is affected by this matter. I will be participating in it because I am able to do so fairly, objectively, and in the public interest. Thank you, Madam Chair.

[01:32:27] All right. Thank you all for your statements. So for this portion for budget amendments, is there anything anyone would like to say for the end?

[01:32:44] I'll clarify. Just like with the consent agenda, if there's anything that someone has any questions on or wants to have further discussion on, I'm going to allow you to pull it, and we'll take it at the end, just like we've done with the consent agenda. Supervisor Bailey?

[01:33:01] Thank you, Madam Chair. I'd like to pull item 6E. All right, 6E and then 6A, I believe. Yes, Madam Chair, 6A. 6A? 6A, 6E, is there anything else?

[01:33:20] All right, so I would like to entertain a motion for item 6B through 6D. So move, Madam Chair. And then, wait, hold on, I got more, thank you. 6B through 6D, and then 6F through 6K. As stated, so move, Madam Chair.

[01:33:37] All right, thank you. Any discussion? All right, we'll take a vote on those. Vote unanimous. I love these easy votes.

[01:33:54] All right, we're going to go on to 6A. Can I get a motion for 6A? So move, Madam Chair. Second. I will give the second to Supervisor Vega. All right. Supervisor Vega. Thank you, Madam Chair. I believe somebody from... We have Mr. Youssef Shaquille.

[01:34:15] I apologize for mispronouncing any names. If you could... Thank you so very much, sir. If you could come to the front. We appreciate you coming, sir. Hi, Mr. Youssef.

[01:34:34] If you want to turn on the mic. Just a quick question. I was wondering if you know the amount that has already been appropriated and how much is not already earmarked for expenditures. So good afternoon, Ms. Vega. In terms of what your question, we're asking that we carry over FY24 to FY25 to clarify that the budget for FY24 for the construction fund or the capital projects where the majority

[01:35:07] of this carryover is, was approximately $500 million, and that included a high school and three elementary schools. If you may recollect, when we were here in April of this year, our FY25 budget was $8 million, and at that point, we said that we will have carryover requirements.

[01:35:33] So the part of what has caused this large amount of carryover is that we postponed the 14th high school for a year, and so that has created this. On the operating fund side, we have approximately $32 million that came in February of last year for the governor's all-in plan, and we're ratcheting that up for the next two years to spend.

[01:35:59] Thank you. That answered my question, Madam Chair. All right. Thank you so much. I'm so sorry. I'm trying to go through a few things. Thank you, sir. I just want to say, before we get started, we did not publicly, I didn't publicly open, I didn't publicly open the, or I didn't open properly the public hearings.

[01:36:20] So I just want to declare that the public hearings are open. Is that, all right. And, okay. All right. And we didn't have anyone in person. All right. Supervisor Weir.

[01:36:36] I understand the explanation with respect to the capital funds and the additional state funding, but that still leaves a $200 million roughly overage, I'm assuming, that came from your operating expenses? So the overall increase from year to year is about $400 million. $368 was capital projects and $32 million in aggregate was the all-in plan. But we're transferring $725 million. In aggregate for all. In aggregate. Yes. So could you break that down? $500 million from

[01:37:12] So, it's about $88 million. I have it here.

[01:37:28] Give me one second, sir. So, for the operating fund, we have encumbrances. For all funds, encumbrances were $194 million.

[01:37:46] And what we call balance carryover was $88 million, $247, $744, 66 cents. And the construction fund was $442,779,925, which is what we call unencumbered.

[01:38:03] And we have some monies in the governor's school fund. So overall, unencumbered was $531 million. Unencumbered? Unencumbered. And encumbered was $194 million with $368,784.

[01:38:21] And what was the growth in your budget from FY23 to FY24? Can you repeat that question? What was your growth in the budget from FY23 to FY24, budget allocation? Okay. So in terms of what we carried over in 23 to 24, we carried over $320 million.

[01:38:50] But what was the delta between the FY23 allocation and the FY24 allocation? Do you have that handy? No, I don't have that. I'd have to look that up. If you could get the opportunity to send me those numbers, I'd be curious. Okay. Thank you. All right.

[01:39:10] Are there any other questions? if not thank you so very much for your time we appreciate it and i don't believe we don't also have anyone signed up to speak on any of these so all right let's go ahead and take our vote all right no close i'll close public hearing is now closed and for 6a so let us take a vote vote

[01:39:43] unanimous supervisor we're abstaining from vote all right moving on to 6e um i'm sorry um i would like to whatever so i didn't do the motion and then open the public hearing i'll just hear them All right, I'm going to open the public hearing for 6E.

[01:40:05] There is no one here to speak, in person or remote. I guess now I closed the public hearing. Now I'm closed the public hearing for 6E, and I'd like to entertain a motion on 6E. So moved, Madam Chair. Second. All right.

[01:40:21] Any discussion? Yes, Madam Chair. I'm sorry. Brother Bailey. Thank you so much. Seth, if you would, please, or whoever's going to hear. I just wanted to make sure, because this is something that we've been working on for several years, but I wanted to make sure in terms of the title of what we're doing and in terms of the grant match.

[01:40:43] The grant match should be what, around 30%, 31, 30? It's a third. A third of it, it's about, yeah, 30%. Okay, and then this specific project has to do with what we're trying to achieve in the Williams Ordinary and upgrading.

[01:41:06] Could you give us just a synopsis quickly of that? Because the title of it is Revolutionary War Memorial, but it encompasses other things. Could you enlighten us, please? Yes, ma'am. Thank you, Supervisor Bailey. Seth Henler-Boss, Director of Parks and Recreation. I have Bill Baucus, our preservationist from the Office of Historic Preservation, with us as well.

[01:41:24] And I'm going to give him the ability to speak to that. He's managing the project and has a great grasp on all the work going on down there. Thank you so much, Seth. Good afternoon. Again, my name is Bill Bax with the Preservationist with the Office of Historic Preservation. This particular project is part of a larger project to transform Williams Ordinary into a more publicly facing historic site.

[01:41:45] This particular project is to create an outdoor memorial space for the American Revolutionary War experience in Prince William County, highlighting the roles of both men and women, free and enslaved, white and black residents and non-residents of Prince William County who created the United States with their actions between 1776 and 1783.

[01:42:06] And what I want you to say also, we spent a lot of time in encompassing the history down in the Potomac District, down in the Dunfrey's areas. This will also include the Bates Town community as well, the history of that, will it not?

[01:42:23] Yes, so this will also include part of a larger project within the building itself to highlight some of the communities in that part of Prince William County, including the historic African-American community of Batestown, Virginia. Thank you so much. Thank you, Madam Chair. Is there anyone else?

[01:42:40] If not, let's go ahead and take a vote. Vote unanimous. Thank you so very much. All right.

[01:42:58] We are now on to Agenda Item 7, that is public comment time. We will take public comments in person and remote. We always start with in person. So when I call your name, if you can go to speak at the microphone, individuals are limited to three minutes.

[01:43:16] And we ask that you state your name and where you generally reside. And I have right now, I have two people who are signed up to speak.

[01:43:32] I have Mr. J. Hurt and Mr. Sam Hill. Two non-residents. Oh, and then this is for, okay, public. And then I have two non-residents. have Jill Norcross and Seth Okuyaboa. All right, sir. You may begin. Thank you. My name is Sam Hill.

[01:43:58] I'm sorry. Stand and come closer. Make sure you speak into that microphone. Otherwise, we can't hear. Is it not on? It's on? It's on. Can you hear me now? Yes. Can you hear me now? I don't think it's coming through the microphone. I don't either. I'm sorry. Can someone double check the It's on?

[01:44:21] It's the volume. Yes.

[01:44:36] October 22nd meeting.

[01:45:00] Thank you. I'm pleased that he included the Trashy Raccoon campaign in his presentation. Your appreciation for this public awareness campaign was heartwarming. Trashy Raccoon has been in the making for two years.

[01:45:17] Thanks to the work of Elijah Johnson, Nicole Brown, Deborah Campbell, Shane Sear, and Mina Habibi, As was explained, the purpose of the Trashy Raccoon campaign is to take a proactive approach to minimize litter in the county.

[01:45:37] I also want to thank Mr. Chris Shorter. He took time from his busy schedule early in his tenure as county executive to hear my concern about litter. It's obvious he shares his concern. Two years ago when he was interim county executive, I met with Elijah Johnson to discuss our growing litter problem.

[01:45:59] He shared this concern and arranged a meeting with members of his team to develop a strategy to build public awareness of the need to reduce litter. Trashy Raccoon is one of the outcomes of that endeavor. It's important that you address our litter problem before it tarnishes the good image and reputation of our county.

[01:46:21] If you're familiar with Michael Levine's Broken Window, Broken Business book, he speaks to the need to address problems early to prevent them from becoming major issues. Levine cites the example of how an ignored window in a building can lead to more broken windows and subsequently the gradual degradation of the building and eventually the neighborhood.

[01:46:49] We don't want that to have a similar impact on our county. We don't want litter to have a similar impact on our county. The goal of Trashy Raccoon Campaign is to prevent this from happening to us. For this campaign to be successful, it's critical that Trashy Raccoon Campaign is shared widely and repeatedly.

[01:47:12] I'm committed to doing my part to help get the Trashy Raccoon message out to as many audiences as possible. I encourage each of you to do the same by including it in your newsletter and any other means you use to communicate with your constituents.

[01:47:30] In closing, thanks again for your collective support and enthusiasm for the Trashy Raccoon Liter Awareness Campaign. By addressing this issue now, we preserve the image, reputation, and quality of life of Prince of our County.

[01:47:46] Let's not be an example of the broken window concept. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Hill. Always good to see you. Next is Jay Hurt. Jay Hurt, is he here by chance?

[01:48:26] Hi there. My name is Jay Hurt. I'm from the Penn State District. I'm here today to talk to you about the personal property tax registration process.

[01:49:02] I just spoke to Syeda Islam across the hall. She's great. Great customer service representative. Do not lose her. When I came in here, I'm furious because for the personal property tax for every vehicle that you have, there's a $33 registration fee.

[01:49:20] I consider that outrageous. My personal property tax was $445 for two cars. Total amount was $511. Registration fee, $66. That's 12.92% of the total of my fees for this year.

[01:49:37] If your car value is lower, that fee gets higher, as higher as the car value goes down. It took her approximately one minute and 35 seconds to process my form. That was from me handing it to her, handing her cash, and her physically handing back a receipt.

[01:49:55] That's for two cars. took her 47.5 seconds per car to register it in an hour's time of 3,600 hours at 47.5 seconds per car, she can do approximately 76 vehicles an hour, okay? For discussion sakes, I figure she's going to round down a little bit, Chad. So I figure she can do 75 cars an hour. 75 cars at $33 per registration fee is two thousand four hundred and seventy five dollars per hour that she's

[01:50:34] making for the county i consider that outrageous it should be that registration fees only recover the cost for the county to process the fee to process the form if it took her 47 seconds how come it per car how come i had to pay the county 33 i addressed this last year to you guys and you said you'd look at it and you did you doubled down on it last year it was $30 per car now it's 33 that's a 10 increase in a year are you going to do 10 next year 10 the year after that when do

[01:51:12] county residents start getting quality service for reasonable fees thank you very much thank you sir i have miss jill norclass good afternoon thank you board of supervisors for the opportunity to speak during this public comment time my name is jill norcross i am the executive director of the northern virginia affordable housing alliance um really appreciate the opportunity to talk a little bit today about the draft adu ordinance that you're going to be reviewing later today at this

[01:51:50] meeting so i know you all and your staff and county staff members have been wrestling with this for a while an affordable housing dwelling unit ordinance as you know is an inclusionary zoning policy that is to create dedicated affordable housing by requiring or encouraging developers to include a specified share of below-market units as part of a market-rate rental or a homeownership development. These policies leverage the private market, generally allowing new affordable units to be created with little or no public subsidy. These policies can be an effective way to ensure that affordable units are integrated throughout the community.

[01:52:28] Broadly speaking, as you know, ADU ordinances in Virginia can be mandatory or voluntary. And while it seems that many of us have a preference for a mandatory ordinance, given the likelihood that we could actually get legislative authority from the Commonwealth in this upcoming General Assembly session, the reality is that a voluntary ordinance is really our best option before us today, an opportunity to build a foundation to kind of work on it to make sure we get it right.

[01:52:54] In addition, it appears the county has tied the ADU ordinance to the creation of the housing trust fund so it's important not to delay further the trust fund which is the most important tool that the county has to address housing affordability needs. It's also important to note that the voluntary ordinance should include benefits that incentivize our residential developers to take advantage of this ordinance. If you incentivize home builders to do this through options like expedited processes or fee waivers they will participate. I also want to take a moment to introduce you to Wesley Housing and their CEO Camilla McAfee who will be making a presentation to you later today about Wesley's experiences as a non-profit affordable housing

[01:53:34] developer who has benefited from ADU ordinance programs in Arlington, Alexandria, and Fairfax County. Wesley is an incredible partner building quality affordable housing usually financed by the low-income housing tax credit in addition to local housing trust funds combined with top-notch resident service programs that keep individuals and families stably housed. Wesley has been serving the Northern Virginia community for 50 years and I think you'll learn a lot from Camilla's presentation and maybe see a different way in which ADU ordinances can gain additional affordable homes in Prince William to meet the housing gaps that we've all identified. Thank you. Thank you

[01:54:14] Thank you so very much, and next we're going to have Seth Opoku Yeboah, and I do apologize. I know Seth quite well, and I always just say Seth, so I apologize. Yeah, it's all good. Thank you.

[01:54:30] My name is Seth Opoku Yeboah, and I'm a development manager with Wellington Development Partners. We're an affordable housing developer active in the suburbs of Virginia and Maryland. Thank you for the opportunity to speak, and I wanted to speak towards the AFDU ordinance. The ordinance builds upon the efforts in the 2022 housing chapter and focuses on expanding housing supply to address the current imbalance between demand and availability of affordable options.

[01:54:54] The primary goal is to increase supply, especially for those at or below 80 percent of the area median income. Spending 30 percent or less on rent or mortgage is considered affordable. Anyone in Prince William County making at or below 60 percent of the area median income would need to spend more than 30 percent of their income on rent.

[01:55:11] and those at 30 percent of the area median income would be pushing 60 to 70 percent of their income on rent. Incentives in the AFDU ordinance can play a key role in making the program more attractive for developers, such as flexibility on development standards, eliminating fees, fast tracking rezoning for projects with a certain percentage of affordable units, and making housing a targeted industry to expedite the site plan approval. These incentives are already being implemented by localities like the City of Manassas, Loudoun, and Charlottesville. While some of the aspects of the ordinance are still being refined, there is still potential in its approach. This ordinance also serves as the implementing language for a housing trust fund, which can be leveraged to

[01:55:50] create new supply, like in neighboring localities and other jurisdictions in Virginia and nationally. The housing trust fund is particularly important in addressing the needs of those below 60% of the area median income, and making more income-restricted developments, pencil, and mid-high cost.

[01:56:06] I know that the biggest barrier to a lot of more affordable housing developers coming to the county is the presence of a housing trust fund. Thank you for your time and your advocacy on the issue. Thank you so very much. Do we have anyone for remote?

[01:56:23] So I will be turning it over to Supervisor Bodie. Thank you, Madam Chair. Ms. Madden, Ms. Van, shall we begin?

[01:56:50] Back to you, Madam Chair. All right. Thank you so very much. So this ends our public comment time. Thank you for everyone who comes out and speak. It's important to hear voices from across our community and those who have an interest at stake in Prince William County. We are going to move on to item eight, and these are public hearings, including consolidated land use public hearings, and I am going to begin by opening the public hearing. Do we have anyone? Looks like we have some folks.

[01:57:24] And Madam Chair, very quickly, would it be possible for us to do a quick presentation on 8G for St. Elizabeth and Seton Church?

[01:57:57] 8G, yes. Hold on. Because as I understand it, there were quite a few folks that showed up for that Planning Commission hearing and didn't get a chance to see a presentation or anything else before the Planning Commission took action, so I wanted to give folks a chance to see the presentation. All right, that is fine.

[01:58:15] I just, real quickly, I also just want to remind people that 8M has been withdrawn. I just wanted to give that second reminder. So I am going to, we have quite a few people, and we also have quite a few people from the church.

[01:58:30] So I'm going to start calling people up, five at a time. I ask that you state your name and where you are from. And, again, speakers, unless they are with an official organization, speakers, individuals get three minutes, organizations get five.

[01:58:47] Please let me know at the beginning when you're stated to speak. I'm going to start. I have Mr. David Garner, Steve Amato, Kathleen Harden, Jack Kamugin, and John Waymayer.

[01:59:24] And I just want to say I know we have a lot of people here who are speaking for the church.

[01:59:48] i don't know if there's one person who is going to be speaking on behalf but i was going to say you know um after we hear from you know if everyone is in agreement actually if i can have everyone who's here in support of the church stand up wow okay so that's what we we kind of figured we're like we haven't seen a lot of these so first of all commend all you guys who are taking time to come out thank you so very much for coming to speak on behalf of your of your church on behalf of your congregation um you guys may sit i'm just letting you know that because i know you

[02:00:25] do have quite a few speakers. It's up to you if you want to have people speak. But I think this is a pretty impressive show. And as that saying goes, you know, a picture's worth a thousand words. Having all of you guys stand up shows how much support the church really has. So I just want to say that is a show of support. If you, you know, if that is sufficient, if, you know, you do not have to speak. So go on. Good afternoon. I'm David Garner. I've been an active parishioner at St.

[02:00:56] Elizabeth Ann Seton for over 40 years serving in many different capacities and maybe most notably for today's meeting having served as finance chairman for several years and as a member of our parish council to through two different periods. Regarding the requested special use permit over the years the church parking lot has often been used by many residents of the adjoining neighborhoods to exercise walk their dogs or to just take a shorter route through the neighborhood.

[02:01:27] Havana Court, which abuts our property on the rear, does not have sidewalks, so often folks felt better about their kids walking or playing in the church parking lot. Over the years, the parking lot has fallen into disarray. Cracks, rusted poles, grass growing through the asphalt, so we're very excited for the church to be renewing and improving the outside grounds, especially the parking lot.

[02:01:53] We believe it will reflect well on the whole neighborhood, provide a safer environment, and hopefully discourage unwanted behavior. The police have been called frequently to check out questionable parking lot activity several times over the years, and so some of our neighbors have reached out to Father Beshista asking for more lighting in the parking lot for better security.

[02:02:14] In response, Father Beshista has installed two large motion sensor light posts. The addition of the columbarium will give an added dimension to the sacred, to the grounds, and encourage positive, respectful activity. Earlier comments by the neighbors have resulted in revisions to the original plan, moving the proposed columbarium further to the east on the property.

[02:02:37] The columbarium will result in more security lighting and possible surveillance cameras for additional security for the area. Having improved and well-kept grounds will help both the people of St. Elizabeth Ann Seton Parish and the surrounding neighborhoods as the church will continue to strive to be a good neighbor.

[02:02:57] Therefore, I respectfully ask for your approval of the requested special use permit. Thank you.

[02:03:12] You may begin. Good afternoon, Board of County Supervisors and Madam Chair. I'm Steve Amato, an Occoquan District Resident.

[02:03:30] I'm a retired Air Force officer and a retiree from the federal government Civil Service employee. For a total of 40 years in both my careers, I've defended the United States Constitution. The First Amendment of the United States Constitution protects religious freedom.

[02:03:53] The Declaration of Independence mentions religion, specifically referring to God or Creator. In 1620, the Pilgrims sailed from England, and 66 days later, they landed in New England in search of religious freedom.

[02:04:14] The leadership of St. Elizabeth Ann Seton Catholic Church has followed the Prince William County process for approval for special use permit. St. Elizabeth Ann Seton Church has 2,662 households, registered households in that parish.

[02:04:43] As one of those 2,662 households, I wholeheartedly support the approval of this special use permit in pursuit of my family's religious freedom.

[02:04:59] I am advocating to all board members of the County Board of Supervisors to support the religious freedom of these 2,662 households by voting in favor to pass the special use permit, By not supporting the St. Elizabeth Ann Seton's special use permit is a prohibition against our religious freedom.

[02:05:33] The religious freedom of those 2,662 families. So I have supported this Constitution, the First Amendment, the religious freedom, both in peacetime and in combat.

[02:05:59] I took an oath eight times to defend this Constitution. Please don't allow my 40 years of defending our Constitution, our First Amendment, our religious freedom, by not voting yes in support of St. Elizabeth Ann Seton's special use permit.

[02:06:20] I hope you all can support this. Religious freedom is important. Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker, please. My name is Kathleen Harding, and I'm a member of Loca Pelt, and I'm speaking on behalf of Loca Pelt, so I will be using the five minutes that's allowed for.

[02:06:52] organizations. I'm speaking on behalf of Elizabeth Ann Seaton and I am not a member of Elizabeth Ann Seaton. Official local comments made at the Prince William Planning Commission September 11th. We did this once before we're going to do it again. As Secretary of LOCA, I would like to have the five minutes for comments, sorry. LOCA, its PELT committee supports the amended SUP application. We have worked with the church from the very beginning, including the original SUP in

[02:07:25] 1988. The church held a courtesy community informational meeting at the church hall in October of 27, 2021. Additionally, Loka Peltz Committee has met three times with the church over the years. None of these meetings were required by the SUP process, but were done to inform the community. Among the facility improvements being proposed is a long-term commitment to replace the existing parish hall with a new parish hall with an expanded building footprint, updated building amenities, and providing improved architecture. Additionally,

[02:08:02] the applicant proposes a columbarium, an adult daycare center and preschool, and a parish outreach center. The adult daycare and preschool will have a combined maximum capacity of 125 patrons. Among the improvements is a proposed new monument electronic message signage, parking lot, pedestrian trail, and buffer improvements, improved stormwater management, and curb and gutter improvements focused on Valleywood street parking.

[02:08:33] Based on early comments from the neighbors on the pipe stem on Rivanna Court, the church accommodated their request and shifted the location away from the Ravana pipe stem on the columbarium. The proposed columbarium location was adjusted and aligned with the entrance closer toward the parish hall. We appreciate that the county planning staff has recommended additional plantings to further visually buffer the columbarium from the residence on the Ravana court pipe stem. A plaza area is proposed between the church and the main

[02:09:10] Hall. The applicant also proposes an outdoor plaza area located between the main hall and the parish hall to connect the two buildings with an open area gathering space and walkway and deal with erosion issues. Proposed picnic area is deleted. The church proposed a picnic area and was intended to open it to the community. However, the church received negative comments from the neighbors and has deleted the proposed picnic area. Specifically, with regard to landscaping facing Valleywood Drive at the May 30, 2024 Loka Pelt Committee meeting, a discussion took place on the proposed

[02:09:47] SUP landscaping improvements requested by Prince William County arborists on the frontage facing Valleywood Drive. Loka Pelt's committee recognized that the church has already spent considerable funds to upgrade the landscaping frontage, manicure and highlight the mature tree island area, and install professional architectural accent lighting of the main church building and chapel the tune of many thousands of dollars. We recommend that the frontage improvements already made on the Valleywood frontage portion of the property be accepted by the Prince William County in this SUP.

[02:10:23] It is our position that the church does not need to hide the improvements they already made with additional frontage plantings. The current improvements already blend in nicely and complement the neighborhood. Pedestrian Path Connector: LOCA supports walkable communities and pedestrian connectivity. We recommend that the SUP include and require a new path connector to Rivana Court to be established from the church. We recognize that the existing path connector is currently on a private pipe stem on Rivana Court, which has liabilities for the owners of

[02:10:58] the private pipe stem. A better solution is to place the pedestrian path connector from the church site directly to the public right away on Rivana Court. Local Pelt Courtesy Review. The church has agreed to a courtesy review process with Local Pelt's committee prior to final site plan approval, and we look forward to this dialogue.

[02:11:20] In conclusion, we recommend that you approve the SUP amendment with the following exceptions, accepting the changes of the church already made to the Valleywood landscaping and to identify and relocate a new pedestrian path connector somewhere on Rivanna Court.

[02:11:36] Thank you for your time. We look forward to the upcoming courtesy review. Thank you. thank you next speaker good evening madam chair members of the board jack kuyam jim president of loka i'd like to request five minutes but i don't know that i will use it i can do the three minutes if i would give you the three minutes okay that's good because we have someone else from your organization can i should i comment on aj separately at another time or while i'm standing here i will give you so you want to i believe that you want to comment on two so the one minutes for hold on

[02:12:15] the five if i need it okay yes for the one for the church yes i'll start that so um as president of loka i just want to say i am a member of the church with my family we we claim uh that we're uh patrons of saint rockledge when the church was being built we sat in those little chairs Yeah, we did that with our families, and we were with great joy worshiping and raising money, and we built the fellowship hall first.

[02:12:52] And I will say, as president of LOCA and as a member of the church, I tried to stay quiet as Dr. Bennett, the chairman of the health committee, convened the meeting, and they discussed anything that was contentious. I remained silent. So I heard the discussion about the columbarium. I thought, oh, gee, you know, there's a creep factor involved, but residents maybe would be concerned. But the Pelt Committee jumped right in and said, hey, when the developers created the RPC, by the way, Loca Pelt, the LRCCA

[02:13:28] that was chaired by Jim Cadigan in 1970, Maureen Cadigan's husband. When they came in, they forced the developer, Ridge Development, to create the RPC with the Prince William County Board, and the planning office agreed at the time, a small planning office.

[02:13:49] So we got the Lake Ridge, Montclair, Dale City RPCs in place to show where our churches would be, where shopping centers would be, but nobody thought about end-of-life situations. The builders were making profit in the RPC thing, but we have the church coming forward in its stewardship role to provide this, and I think they've done a great job. So I listened quietly as the Pelt Committee discussed that. I will say from the very beginning, we worked with the first parish priest, Father

[02:14:27] Micah on calculating stormwater. We worked with Father Hamilton. When we were eliminating a storm pond, it would take out the woods there. And we came up with a connector to Ravenna Court. And then we're working with Father Beshister on these expansion plans. And we're blessed with his background as an architect. He's an amazing guy. And he's throwing his whole self into this with great passion and great dedication, and we all appreciate that. So the Pell Committee was very comfortable with the entire process that we've been going through on this. And so with that,

[02:15:06] we do support it, and Mrs. Harding's comments are 100% supportable from the Civic Association. And with that, I'd like to turn to the, oh, by the way, please, the one, yeah, that's it. And then I'd like to do AJ, if I could while him up here, and that is, it's Lawson, a telegraph, and is that okay to do that, or should I do it at another time?

[02:15:36] I'm so sorry, sir. Are you ready? You're ready to go into your second item? Yes. Should I do the second item another time? We have the public hearing for all the items open, so I'm sorry. So I could do it, yeah. Well, I gave you a letter dated August 10th, and LocaPelt reviewed Lawson and Telegraph, which is 100% affordable housing and workforce housing, and we reviewed that at a July 25th

[02:16:08] LocaPelt meeting, and we sent a letter to the attorney representing the client, Janelle Cameron. And that letter was for ideas on how to, we did a deep dive on the small area plan design guidelines from 2019 for the landing at Prince William. Our group got very engaged on trying to get a buffer improvement by moving the two buildings. But, you know, we had at the planning

[02:16:42] commission hearing a gentleman that spoke who owns a sign company and works right in that that parcel had recommended that the buildings would be better in the proposed location as recommended by the applicant and it is a public forum in the planning commission our group looked at it and said well we would like to push it back further but we supported the project and going forward we had a lot of ideas in here how to improve compliance with the

[02:17:16] smaller airplane design guidelines and we were suggested we were providing that to their council as ideas we will have a courtesy view with them once this is approved and we will have a dialogue with them on a lot of the details. So we support the project, and it appears that locating it where the applicant prefers it is a preferred option, so that we're not ruffled. Our feathers are not ruffled over that. We like the project, and we'd like to see it go forward. Thank you very

[02:17:55] much. Thank you, sir. Next speaker. Good afternoon. My name is John Wehmeyer. I'm a 36-year resident of Ravonna Court, which borders St. Elizabeth Ann Seton Catholic Church, and I'm here in support of the special use permit that SEAS is seeking. I'm one of seven original owners out of 28 that still call Ravonna home, and I'm also a parishioner of SEAS. And the entire time I've lived on Ravonna,

[02:18:29] there has been a path from Ravana connecting to the church parking lot. These paths were created by people walking their pets out for exercise and those going to church. They chose the location of the paths. There are currently two paths connecting Ravana to the parking lot. There's a third path which one of the original owners who has since moved put in place with steps and pavers but this path is located on a pipe stem, which is private property. They did this so that they could have

[02:19:05] easy access to going to church. Now, it's understandable that the current owners would not want people on their private property and would want this to be taken out. The church is willing to pay for the installation of a hard surface path with handrails that would connect the parking lot to Ravonna, which would improve safety for those people who do use this path.

[02:19:32] But regardless of whether the path is approved by this board as part of the special use permit, walkers will continue to forge a path on their own through the woods to connect the Ravonna and the church parking lot. Thank you for your time. Thank you. And before I have you speak, I'm going to call up the next group of speakers. And I apologize if there are any names that I i'm not sure if this is dean lo here john okay sorry it's all french um

[02:20:08] thank you member wait hold on before no i would like to call up the next five before i have you sorry um then i have um tom morota tom and diane sullivan i just want to know if you're a couple you still get three minutes um mike may and then george clark all right and then john you can speak no you go now thank you member of the boards as you can tell i didn't come prepare because i want

[02:20:46] to speak from the heart because as a member of seas and also the ministry head or shares and i've been with the church since 2003 so let me start by saying my name is john lawyer and i'm a defense contractor and a small business owner also so i do own business in the county i will say this. I'm sorry. I'm going to have to make sure I'm enforcing this. Say your name and where you generally reside. That's what we really need for the rest of it. So Jean Loyer and I own a house walking distance from the church at 12827 Greenhall Drive. You don't have to give your exact address

[02:21:24] but we'll come visit. All right. Perfect. So I'm here to support Father and I've been members of the facility committees as well as the pastoral council, and I was part of the members deciding on that plan, and we believe that the best plan for the church, not only for the church, but for the community at large. The reason we said that, there are many people who come around the church and walk their dogs and play in the parking lot, and some members already mentioned sometime at

[02:22:00] now it's very dark and you know the parking lot need to be repaved and all those things so by really approving the special permit and i i'm kindly requesting that you unanimously approve that and that the expectation as you can see with all the members here we are really be high father but also we believe that will bring a much needed revamping of that that place to the community Therefore, I just request kindly that you do that.

[02:22:32] I'm not going to repeat everybody else because they already provide all the feedback, and I think you have enough to approve it. Thank you for your time. Thank you, sir. Next speaker. Good afternoon.

[02:22:48] You ready? I'm ready. You ready? I'm ready. All right, let's go. Let's do it. My name is Tom Murata. I live in the Westridge area of the Aquacon District. I'm a parishioner, and I'm speaking in favor of this proposal. Unlike John, I need notes to speak.

[02:23:06] So I moved to Prince William in 2017. I've started a business here. I go to church here, and I'm raising my family here. I also hold a master's degree in urban planning, although I'm not actively a city planner.

[02:23:22] But as a person educated in city planning, I'm going to speak to the planning aspects of this. I've come to learn that the county overlooked end-of-life care when it was planned a few decades ago. What that means is there are not enough cemeteries and other final resting places, especially on the eastern side of the county.

[02:23:42] This requires folks to drive long distances to visit their loved ones who have passed on, which causes more traffic. So this board has an opportunity to address that deficiency by approving columbariums like the ones that's proposed here today.

[02:23:59] Columbarium is kind of a clever solution. By allowing final resting places closer to houses of worship, traffic will actually be reduced for both funerals and visits to loved ones, and it will improve the mental health of residents by allowing them to visit their deceased relatives more frequently and with less hassle.

[02:24:22] So in conclusion, I ask you to please approve this proposal. Thank you for your attention. Thank you. Next speaker. Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.

[02:24:37] My name is Mike May, and I reside in the Occoquan District. Having served on this board for about 10 years, I do speak fluent Board of County Supervisors, and I'm interpreting the chair as saying keep it short and sweet. So I'm going to defer to the chair's advice and just say thank you for everything you do.

[02:24:54] I know how hard you work. I know these decisions are not always easy, but what you're ultimately looking for in these kind of things is a lot of community engagement. And I'm proud to say that as a member of this church and as a member of this community, we have been fully engaged. Those efforts were already outlined by the presentations at Local Pellet. We've done everything we can to work with the community.

[02:25:11] We have a history in this community of almost 50 years of being a good neighbor, and we want to continue to do that. And approving this amendment will allow us to continue to do that. So thank you for what you do, and please support this project. Thank you. Before we have the next speaker, I'm just going to call up a couple more people. I have Mr. George Clark, Miguel Cepidas, and Harry DeMantis.

[02:25:34] You may speak, sir. Thank you. My name is George Clark. I am a parishioner of St. Elizabeth Ann Seton Church, and I reside in the Occoquan District.

[02:25:50] I've been a resident for about 35 years. And anyway, I think most of what I would have to say has already been said, so I'm not going to bore you with it. One thing that's been mentioned several times is a parking lot.

[02:26:08] One of the big problems with the parking lot is that there's a spring that comes up right on the edge of it right now. And part of this project is to go ahead and make arrangements so that the spring doesn't cause the parking lot to get all disturbed.

[02:26:32] And for a while there, it was a big mud puddle on one end of it. And, you know, it's something that needs to be done because it's causing erosion. And the father has figured out a way around that, I assume.

[02:26:50] But anyway, I just wanted to get up and say I do support this project. I think a lot of good thought has gone into it and a lot of consulting with the parishioners and with the neighbors.

[02:27:09] So I recommend that the board approve it so that we can get on with the final stages of this project. This is actually one section of the changes that have already been made, but please approve this.

[02:27:28] Thank you. Thank you, and I just want to go over again who I have left. I have Tom and Diane Sullivan. I don't think either have spoken. I have Michael Cepidas and Harry DeMantis. Everyone else, please have a seat. You can either sit in here or you can sit in the atrium, but if you've already spoken, please have a seat.

[02:27:48] All right, so next speaker, please. My name is Miguel Cespedes, and this is my sister Maria Cespedes.

[02:28:04] I'm sorry, can I hear it come up? My name is Miguel Cespedes, and this is my sister, Maria Cespedes. She's going to speak briefly first. Okay. Good afternoon. My name is Maria Cespedes, and I live on Ravana Court, and I'm also a parishioner, Elizabeth M. Seton.

[02:28:24] My 24-year-old son committed suicide November 16th, 2021. His ashes are still with me. When this happened, Father Basista and the church came to my aid, talked for me to talk.

[02:28:43] That's why my brother's here with me. I ask you to please think about your children and how you wouldn't want to see your child every day in a jar like I see my son in his urn.

[02:29:01] I need this church to build this colibarium so my son can rest in peace. It's been three years this week, and I mourn my son every day. Once this is built, he will finally rest in peace, and I will have some peace in my heart.

[02:29:20] I thank you for giving me the time to speak today. You have a blessed day. St. Elizabeth has long served a source of peace, comfort, and joy, touching all of its parishioners broadly within this community.

[02:29:39] In 2017, our family was blessed to purchase our home on Ravonna Court right across from the church. St. Elizabeth has been the central part of our lives. My wife and I exchanged vows there. My son and wife both had the Holy Sacrament of Confirmation within its walls.

[02:29:55] Then towards the end of 2021, our family said farewell to our nephew at his funeral service. Watching my sister battle with depression and coping with loss is incredibly painful. I humbly ask for your support in approving the proposal for the Columbarium at our beloved church, providing a sacred space for reflection and healing for families like ours.

[02:30:17] Your decision to approve this project will truly help bring comfort and solace, allowing her to be close to her son's forever home and ours. Thank you. Thank you both for coming in and speaking. Madam Chair, if I could just very quickly. Ma'am, sir, as someone who has currently still has the ashes of my son and my mother, I see you.

[02:30:40] Thank you. And thank you for being brave to share such a personal story. Good, sir. Good afternoon. I'm making my public comment regarding item 8B. It's not related to the church.

[02:30:55] Is this the appropriate time? Yes, this is the time, yes. Okay, thank you. Thank you all for your time this afternoon. My name is Harry Demetatis. I represent Princeton Woods Land II, LLC.

[02:31:13] We are the target of a condemnation related to the Potomac Shores Development Project. Unfortunately, the condemnation will have a severe impact on access to our shopping center. As you may recall, the center includes Food Lion, Exxon, Lux Laundry Mac, Classy Nails, Princeton Woods Dry Cleaners, Divine Styles, China One, Beauty Town, Self-Storage Zone, Virginia Commerce Bank, and Chick-fil-A. We attempted for some time to come to an agreement

[02:31:50] with staff regarding replacement access, which will help minimize damages. Unfortunately, we were not able to come to an agreement. We believe that this condemnation case could be avoided if staff were instructed to work with us on providing replacement access and to discuss just compensation. It is in no one's interest for the shopping center to have an adequate access and to wither away on the vine. Certainly, it's not in the county's interest to have

[02:32:29] a successful taxpaying shopping center greatly diminish in value. We hope that whether or not the board proceeds with condemnation at this time, the board should instruct its staff to work with us and to try to maintain access to this significant asset. I thank you for your time today. Thank you so very much. And with this, I am going to close the public hearings for eight, agenda item eight. I would like to say that there was some technical difficulties earlier

[02:33:06] during public comment time, and we had two remote speakers who were not able to speak. So I believe that we are back up and running. So I apologize. We are going to go back and we're going to listen. we're going to hear from those two individuals and then we're going to go back to um the items under agenda um agenda item eight so mr supervisor bode yes ma'am miss madam miss van have we been able to pull those folks up hi supervisor bode this is steve uh we do um your first speaker

[02:33:42] will be rachel ellis thank you steve miss ellis please proceed you have three minutes like always if you can unmute um rachel ellis gainesville district i wanted to speak on the affordable dwelling unit ordinance um we do need affordable housing in prince william county i can absolutely agree with that but i worry that we're giving all the power and control to developers um i kind of want to take the board back to when we were doing the strategic planning and the focus groups within

[02:34:21] across the county and some of the future opportunities that were noted through these focus groups were smart and diversified development sustainability slow down development transportation and traffic housing developer accountability and contribution some of the future challenges that were noted through these focus groups are transportation housing and over development and so with that i also want to highlight um with the 2025-2028 strategic plan

[02:34:57] two goals goal number five quality of life and goal number eight smart growth prince william county residents are seeking a quality of life and want to experience the benefits of a resilient and healthy community and that happens when a board of county supervisors has the ability to put residents needs over developers drive for profit strategic and intentional community oriented growth strengthens the sustainability of the county but that only happens if this board can tell a developer no to additional units that will add negative stress to infrastructure for me

[02:35:35] what i'm hearing is this feels like it's a little bit of like the data center overlay where with the overlay you guys know that schools like data centers next to schools and next to housing should be a no should be a hard no but you guys your hands are tied because it's in the overlay and so you have to vote yes and with these when a developer decides to bump up density because they're giving affordable housing, even though you know it's going to stress out the infrastructure of roads or of schools, your hands might be tied at telling them no. So I'm asking

[02:36:11] you guys to move forward with caution with this and to really examine. Don't discount residents and their desires and their needs. And then I emailed you guys on Friday, and something I want to touch on real quick is HOA dues we're gonna hear about Smith Crossing tonight and it's a this community has a little pool and you know there's affordable housing in it but how do the HOA dues impact those with affordable housing and I say that because you can't have these amenities of pools a little rec house like little whatever meeting rooms and stuff and not have HOA dues

[02:36:50] associated with that they're not gonna be nominal I have a friend who lives in in Haymarket in a townhouse. She bought her townhouse in 2021 for $320,000. That's affordable, right? Single mom, her mortgage is $1,800. Her HOA dues per month are $600. $600. And that only includes water, trash, and snow removal. $600. Like, it's killing her. It is killing her.

[02:37:17] So, Ms. Ellis, I'm sorry to interrupt you. Your time is up, so if you could wrap up, please. Thank you. That's all I got for you guys. Thank you. thank you miss ellis next speaker please your next speaker is jessica grove good afternoon chair jefferson and board members um i would also like to address a couple concerns i have with the affordable housing ordinance that will be discussed today um i recently went to an open house that was to address the ordinance and i agree that we do need affordable housing but not

[02:37:52] at the cost of the quality of life of current residents i'm not saying that i have any expertise on this but i would like you to ask ask you to use caution when making a final decision on the ordinance specifically when allowing developers extra density bonuses without proper oversight please make sure that you pay careful attention to the wording of this ordinance to make sure that the board has oversight and has the ability to say no to developers who seem to think they get to make the decisions please make sure the board has the ability to look at development in a holistic manner and can make sure the developers cannot overdevelop without oversight the wording

[02:38:31] with this ordinance allows the developer too much leeway to put as much as they can in wherever they want as long as they have a certain number a certain percentage and there is no way to say no if it's like with rachel was saying if it's in a buy right or if you've already approved a development and then they say well we have 10 housing so we get an extra 40 houses here and it's just not always going to work but if in this ordinance it doesn't give you the power to

[02:39:08] say no we only allow x amount of houses and this percentage needs to be affordable so i just would like you to make sure that you have the control to say no when needed thank you thank you miss grove and to confirm that was our last remote speaker right now thank you so much thanks steve Thank you, and I appreciate everyone's patience, but I want to make sure that people who sign up for public comment time were heard.

[02:39:38] So now we are going to return to the agenda items under number eight. Before I proceed, I just want to see if anyone on the board had any items that they want to pull. And generally, we only pull items that may be contentious.

[02:39:56] But did anyone have any? Supervisor Franklin. Sure, yes, thank you. I just wanted to see if Mr. Canizales can discuss items 8B in terms of kind of what the discussions have been had up until this point and what we've, we, the county.

[02:40:15] Well, before we bring him up, I just wanted to get an idea of what items. I'm sorry that we're going to, so we're 8B. Anything else, Supervisor Vega? We can ask questions, but I just want to get the whole list first. Supervisor Vega, did you have anything? 8B.

[02:40:31] Anyone else? Supervisor Bailey. All right, then. We will bring Mr. Canizales up. Thank you. You're a young guy. You can get up and down. Sure. Yeah, Rick, if you can just kind of go over, I guess provide an overview for those of us not familiar, and particularly, is there an agreement or not?

[02:40:57] Madam Chair, members of the board, Rick Canizales, your Director of Transportation. There is not an agreement, and that's why we are here today, ma'am. We are doing this as a certificate of take per the proffers for Potomac Shores. This is not a project to the counties, but this is part of the county's PIP plan or public improvement plan that the developer is putting together.

[02:41:19] As a public improvement plan, as part of the proffers, it was identified that the county would help to get the land needed for the public improvement plan to be completed. This is one of the last sections of the public improvement plan that needs the right-of-way.

[02:41:36] We have sent out an offer to the gentleman that's company came up here earlier today, and we have had some time to discuss this with them, informing them of how their access will be changed as to the way it exists today.

[02:41:57] They're currently not in agreement with the way that that access is laid out, but again, the access that they will be receiving for this is similar to the access they have now. Some of the movements may not exist in the same way, but can still be done through the improvement that's being provided.

[02:42:14] Yeah, and I guess my concern is, because usually we do a pretty good job with kind of reaching some type of agreement. Let me go back before I say that. How much time do we have before we have to make a decision? And I guess my real question is, can you guys continue to have the discussion?

[02:42:31] The discussion can be had after you make your decision today. You make your decision today, we cannot go right to the courts and file. We have 45 days before we can even do that. And even after that 45 days, we continue to negotiate these items. We continue as a county to negotiate these items past the COT moment, and we usually get to a negotiation before that.

[02:42:51] Or if not, we go to the next step, which may be mediation, before we even get the court. But not all items are settled, and that's the reason I come to you a lot of times to ask for these certificates of take because we haven't been able to reach agreement at that point in time, but we do ultimately reach agreement.

[02:43:07] Sure, I'm sorry, and maybe I wasn't clear. For this, how much time do we have where we have to make a decision for this project to move forward for us to make a decision? Ma'am, I would suggest that you, the time is up to you, but the project is moving now and any delay on it is just delaying the project from being put on the ground.

[02:43:25] Yeah, I mean, I just wasn't aware of this, so it's, you know, I'm not sure what to say about that. Did you want to speak? Supervisor Bailey? I think I can offer some comfort in this.

[02:43:42] Thank you, Rick, for having us in the office and discussing this item. And I want to just check with the county attorney. I think we have, do we have 45 days? Is that the amount of time to answer Supervisor Franklin's question? We have 45 days to really bring this to a resolution.

[02:43:59] Am I correct about that? Madam Chair, members of the board, the General Assembly has given localities an additional tool with regards to eminent domain and that's called a quick take and what it means is we come before the board with a public hearing and the board authorizes this and this allows the project to continue to move forward but it does not to stop the discussions and it does not stop our requirement from paying fair market value for the property that we take it just allows the projects to continue to proceed versus what is often called a slow take where we couldn't even get onto the property without an agreement. As Mr. Canizala says, this is normal in the process. The project

[02:44:39] continues to need to move forward so that we don't lose money and have to pay more for it, but we will continue to negotiate with the property owners. If transportation is not able to come to an agreement, it will probably in all likelihood go to mediation, and it can go to court. We will ultimately pay what we are required to pay by law, but this allows us to continue to proceed with our project and not continue to pay additional costs for delay etc so the 45 days we still have time after that to come to an agreement thank you so much and and so rick again thank you for uh spending time to explain this to me and my staff and i also wanted to offer um in respect of

[02:45:19] what the um the owner had gotten up and said we have just made uh an agreement to talk after this meeting today this is not a contention at all it's just a matter of him expressing how he felt and i appreciate that sir but we are going to talk about this after it within the 45 days so i just wanted to share that all right thank you for the clarification we have supervisor vega than frank would you mind yielding okay supervisor franklin sure and um just so that i can get in a more

[02:45:55] comfortable place supervisor bailey i would like to maybe work with you but i'm wondering if we can do a motion to defer so that you and I can maybe chat in a little bit more information all right we haven't even all right um supervisor big well madam chair there's a motion on the floor with a second so we have to take action all right there's a motion with a second but I believe we still have discussion right yeah so madam chair if I may is the motion to defer to a date certain or a date

[02:46:34] uncertain because that will require us to whether we have to hold another public hearing and I I believe Mr. Conizales would like to talk to the impact of the project if it's deferred at all. I'm happy to do a date certain. Okay, so we have a motion on the floor to defer to a date certain.

[02:46:55] We have a second. Madam Chair, if we can. So, Rick, if you could just speak to the impact of the deferral and if there is a date certain, what we'll need to do by way of re-advertising and preparing the public hearing.

[02:47:17] Yep. Correct. Right now we have authorized this public hearing. This item had come before the board to authorize the public hearing. We are now in the public hearing stage. Deferring it again would have to have us again advertise it and meet the advertisement requirements of the public hearing.

[02:47:35] Not sure if we can get to that by the next meeting. May have to wait until next year. I just want to make clear this is not a county project that we are doing this action for. This is a developer project that's going on right now. A private company is the one that's going to be delayed and doing the work out there now.

[02:47:54] This has nothing to do with a public project that is being done by me or our department. Understood. So what's the earliest that we can bring it back? With the advertising requirements, I would have to ask the clerk. Okay.

[02:48:11] And how many meetings do we have in December? We can't bring it back before those? Yeah, I don't understand why we can't bring it back on the 17th. I defer again to the clerk. I'm not sure what I would think that would be more than enough time yeah so to a date certain to December 17th we still um I'm sorry I believe Ms. Madden said you have to check to see if we can

[02:48:44] advertise and be in compliance so that means that's like a whole month from now right so so let me let me make sure that I'm clear so what Ms. Madden is referencing is not just the requirements around advertising but it's also the requirements around dispatch so we are dispatching 10 days in advance of the board meeting and then uh there's a requirement that we are advertising two weeks prior so we are what we need to investigate is using i mean incorporating all that time

[02:49:20] if we can make it for the 17th yeah december 17th is almost a month out yeah so that's that's my motion we will we will do our best maybe we Today, listed as the 17th, date certain, if we cannot make it, then we will come back to the board to let the board know that we cannot.

[02:49:48] Ms. Madden, does that work? I'm sorry. Madam County Attorney. Madam Chair, members of the board, I know that we've had changes with regards to the Code of Virginia on the notices, but as of July 1, it's my understanding that because we held the public hearing and closed it, and if we're deferring it to a date certain, we would not need to re-advertise again.

[02:50:17] Thank you ma'am. That saves a lot of stress. Thank you. So we have a motion. We have a second. Do we? And I see a couple other speakers because we can still have discussion. So Bailey, we are then Vega. Thank you very much, Madam Chair. Appreciating what my colleague is referring to, I think, and knowing that we both are responsible for this project, I just want to assure the board that this is not a contention at all.

[02:50:49] This is something that we've worked out already in discussion with the gentleman that was in the back, you know, in terms of resolving this. We do have 45 days to resolve this. This is a by-right, am I saying that right, Rick, a by-right in terms of Potomac Shores?

[02:51:07] It's a PIP plan, a public improvement plan. Yes, yes. And this is something that's been on the books probably about 10 to 15 years to move forward. And so that's why we did our homework initially before coming to the board with it. So I would just like to have reconsideration, if we could, just to update Supervisor Franklin to give her a level of comfort with the project so that we can move forward and assist the gentleman that spoke earlier and that he is expecting to meet and have resolution with it.

[02:51:42] Thank you. Did you have anything else to add to that now? No, ma'am. All right. Thank you. Supervisor Weir. Thank you, Madam Chair. First, I'd like to thank the county attorney for saving me the trouble of addressing the whole publication and public hearing notice. It saved about 10 minutes.

[02:52:01] In a case like this, I will generally defer to the district supervisor, but I have a lot of circumstances like this in the Gainesville District, where we grant rezonings, SUPs, that sort of thing, where we have in the past, as part of the proffer agreement, agreed to do the condemnation for the applicant party against another third party's properties. I will never be

[02:52:37] in favor of this process, not when you're taking someone else's property. I've seen it harm too many people too many times with unintended consequences on their properties. I will defer to the Potomac supervisor on this one, but when it comes to the Gainesville properties, you know, Sudley Road comes to mind with a certain large rezoning application and comp plan amendment.

[02:53:03] I will not look kindly on these types of actions. Thank you. Supervisor, I'm going to actually go to, I'm so sorry, Vega. I'm just going to go to Supervisor Bailey, and then I'll go to you. Thank you so much, Supervisor Weir, for your comments, and I do respect your comments.

[02:53:25] Just to give, again, a sense of comfort for the board, conversations were held in advance to today to make sure that the client or the gentleman was abreast of this process, and we are at a point within the 45 days, again, I'll say, where we're coming to a sense of comfort to move this project forward for everyone, not just for Potomac Shores, and so I appreciate your comments and keeping us within the guidelines and appreciate your deferral to me.

[02:53:58] Supervisor Vega. Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to go on the record that anytime that we talk about quick takes, I'm in a domain that's always unsettling, especially when we get to the day of the meeting, and we still haven't figured that out. And I'm not saying that that's anything that has to do with you, Rick. It's just a personal thing for me that the government can come and acquire private property and simply say, well, we're paying people fairly.

[02:54:18] I do think that before we have to take a decision on this, it's my preference that we have found a resolution. I appreciate the work that has been done. Again, considering how long this has been in the works, you would think, right, that we would be in some sort of agreement. And so I will certainly be supporting the deferral.

[02:54:38] And, you know, I guess, Rick, I just kind of want a little bit of clarity. It's a private project, yes? Yes, ma'am. And so we're pushing hard. Why? Because of deadlines? It's a public improvement plan. It's a public facility. It's Wayside Drive and the intersection of Route 1 and 234, which is in the comprehensive plan.

[02:54:58] With that in mind, this was a project that was going to be done by the public, some kind of intersection improvements there, but because of the development, it was done by the developer, and because it is part of a comp plan road and part of the public system, that's the reason we were allowed to be able to move forward with the condemnation for them.

[02:55:16] And just, ma'am, for some clarity for your sake, if we had the manor settled or if we had the matter resolved, we would not be coming to you. It would be resolved, and the reason we come to you is when we can't resolve you. And that's for everything because, I mean, it's happened a few times already this year where we haven't reached an agreement, and in the middle of a meeting, we're trying to figure things out, and so that's for everything.

[02:55:38] When you come to us for a similar situation, it's because you haven't reached an agreement. That is correct. Every time I come to you on this situation, it's because we have not reached an agreement, and we must take the action to go through a certificate of take. So every time you see me up here, every time you see a board item that has property that needs to be taken, the reason it's on your agenda is because we have not been able to reach an agreement up to that point in time and we need to because of the timing of whatever the project is. Thank you. Thank you ma'am. All right everyone has I know for those who have spoken we've asked people I think we've heard from sufficient. Thank you so much Mr. Canizales for

[02:56:15] this. The motion on the floor is that we are going to defer this to December 17th 2024. So let's go ahead and vote on that all right thank you so very much so what we're gonna do now I don't believe anything anyone else has anything that they want to pull

[02:56:48] from this agenda so I'd like to have a motion for 8a 8c through 8l all right for discussion I have supervisor we're Bailey Bodie Vega supervisor oh oh these are coming back up I'm sorry um there's anyone I'm sorry it looks like these might be populating

[02:57:22] from previous supervisor Bailey did you want to speak to this this one everything else oh no okay my light just came all right um Bo did you want to speak to everything else did thank you um first wanted to shift back to the church because that's what most people are here for um thank you to everyone who came out today to speak um again a special acknowledgement to one of my predecessors Mike May. Thank you. Good to see you. Also wanted to commend the applicant, Father Bahista, and the folks that represent him on working with the community. I know that there are quite a few folks that we didn't hear from today that live along Ravana who had some concerns and issues,

[02:58:01] but we've been able to work through these. I would say that this is one of the longest projects I've worked on since being a supervisor. They came in right before COVID hit back in 2020. I remember meeting in my conference room so we've been at this for almost a half decade at this point but wanted to hit some highlights of things that people have brought up in the past that I believe it's been sufficiently uh addressed by the applicant uh you know trees I know there's been a lot of talk about the perimeter about trees being taken down what have you what we know that there's being supplemental plannings being done along the the perimeter of the of the property so we're taking care of the trees I know some folks have requested a fence but we talked through

[02:58:41] that and unfortunately if we want to put a fence in here and take down trees put up the fence so those things are in conflict with each other but we understand that we're working with the applicant to make trees and we're planning to put up to make sure there is some physical barrier there between uh the the property and the homes we also know that there will be no military salutes so you're not going to hear any uh firing squads anything like that doing during gunshots so i have had some folks reach out concerned well you know the the gun salutes that they do at at funeral so honor guard we're not going to be having that so folks can be rest assured that that's not going

[02:59:15] to happen um all right parking lights um we've worked with the applicant to make sure that when the new parking lights go in they will be facing downward we're not going to see any light pollution going on to the adjourning properties um we've talked about the calumbarium wanted to thank the applicant again at a large expense of themselves moving that calumbarium away from some of the houses it's going to be as monitoring low lit at night it's not going to be at the same level of light is during the day. So we're going to address some light pollution from that perspective.

[02:59:48] We've also been talking about traffic. Well, unlike some other religious institutions who are expanding through SUPs in the county, other ones who are trying to establish themselves, this SUP, as said by one of our constituents earlier, actually bring down the traffic to and from the site. Because since having a columbarium there versus having folks get into a procession leave the site come back for a reception all those festivities those celebrations those those memories will be taken apart on site with the columbarium and at the church so you're actually going to see a reduction of traffic which frankly we don't see that very often so I wanted

[03:00:25] to address that as well finally some folks talked about the security side of it more lighting will take care of that we also have already talked to our folks at community safety about how to work with that. We also talked to the father about resetting up the neighborhood watch the church had in the past. So there'll be folks there and constantly having alongside the cameras that already exist and some new ones, the security around the site. So I know a lot of folks have had some grievances who live along Ravana and some of the remote residents who live on the periphery, but we've done a lot of great work with the applicant to address this. We've heard

[03:01:02] all the great things that this will bring to the community. I'm not going to rehash those here, But, again, I wanted to thank the community for their involvement on this one. Thank Father Behista and his representatives for working through this over the last five years. And I'll be proud to support this today. Thank you so much. Thank you so very much, Supervisor Bodie.

[03:01:20] And I think at this time we're ready to take a vote. Vote unanimous. And thank you so very much for coming out and joining us.

[03:01:43] I know this was kind of a long meeting. You guys patiently sat through it. You know, I didn't see anyone falling asleep, so I think that's a good thing. You guys are free to depart. if you want to hang out with us the rest of the evening we'll take that too this is like the largest audience we've had in a long time good seeing all of you we're give everyone some time

[03:02:06] to clear out good seeing all of you thank you so much for me coming by all right guys i'm going to give us a five minute recess while they clear out we're going to do just a quick five minute

[03:02:40] recess all right everyone we're back from recess thank you um so now we are moving on to agenda

[03:03:53] item number nine that is county executive time. Mr. Shorter the floor is now yours. All right good evening madam chair members of the board. I want to go over a few things and then I'm going to turn it over to Nikki Brown our director of communications and engagement for presentation.

[03:04:14] Really quickly the board issued four directives the last time we were together. One directive incentivizing revitalization in the county which was assigned to economic development and tourism another directive to update the board on the trap neuter vaccinate and release program which was assigned to our police department we also received a directive to strengthen the towing ordinance which was assigned to the police department and our county attorney's office and then finally a request to for background information and analysis regarding the designation of private property

[03:04:53] which was assigned to our planning office. Since the last meeting we were together, I'll also say that there were several memos sent to the board, three of which were sent to close out directives, one with the comparison of the hours of allowable construction activity in the county with neighboring jurisdictions, another a letter sent to our federal and state delegation, noting the county's concerns and recommendations as it pertains to the Drug Supply Chain Security Act.

[03:05:30] And then finally, a memo regarding the feasibility of establishing an employee home ownership incentive program. All those memos were sent and several others. I also want to acknowledge the really great partnership between Economic Development Tourism and our library system.

[03:05:52] I sent this note out to the board, the Collaborate Business Resource Center, Collaborate at Chin Initiative, which was launched really as a reaction to and a product of the Barriers to Business report that was published by Economic Development and Tourism.

[03:06:13] This will serve really as a small business hub here in the county, and I just really want to acknowledge economic development and tourism and the library system for just the creativity in making this initiative possible. Also want to highlight, and you all received an email on this, and just want to really refer to the PwC Works engagement page, but the Solar App Plus work that the development services team completed. Just really want to acknowledge them

[03:06:49] and all of the work to really streamline the residential solar program in the county. It's just phenomenal, phenomenal work, and I want to just acknowledge the team for that. I also want to acknowledge the criminal justice services team.

[03:07:07] I attended, as many of you did as well, the Veterans Treatment Docket. It is a phenomenal opportunity to engage our veterans, support our veterans, And I just really want to appreciate the Criminal Justice Services team for all that they do to make that docket a success.

[03:07:27] And I imagine that some of you will probably speak to your experiences with the docket as well. I will tell you, just from being there and being present and knowing what we do for veterans when they need us most means so very much. And finally, I want to just give a big shout-out to communications and engagement and really all the agencies that played a part in the GovFest program, 500 participating attendees and over 95 tables for the GovFest event a few weeks ago.

[03:08:03] Really an opportunity for our employees to exchange ideas, get to know each other, And I just really want to give a big acknowledgement to the team for the great work there. With that, Madam Chair, I want to turn it over to Nikki Brown, who's going to lead us through the first presentation under County Exec Time, really to highlight our community survey.

[03:08:30] And with that, Nikki, take it away. Thank you, Madam Chair, members of the board, Nikki Brown with Communications and Engagement. We're excited today to present to you the results of the 2024 community survey. I am actually going to turn it over to Polko, which is the gentleman on the screen.

[03:08:48] Polko is our vendor that administered the survey. They've been a great community partner in terms of just helping, or a great partner, I should say, in terms of helping us through the process and providing really great feedback and experience and helping us administer this. So I'd like to introduce Jason Neumeier.

[03:09:06] Jason has been with Polco and the National Research Center for nearly three years. He specializes in custom survey administration and analysis, and he will lead us through today's presentation. He's going to share his screen and drive, and I will also be here to answer any questions.

[03:09:22] So I will turn it over to Jason. Excellent. Thank you, Nikki. Good afternoon, everyone. As was said, my name is Jason Neumeier. I'm a survey research associate here with Polco and the National Research Center, And I'm pleased to be here to present the results of the 2024 Prince William County Community Survey to you all.

[03:09:42] But before I begin, on behalf of myself and my other PULCO co-workers, I would like to extend a thank you to Nikki Brown and Shane Sears, who were our primary contacts throughout the survey development and implementation process. They both provided thoughtful, detailed feedback across this entire effort.

[03:10:01] And I'd also like to mention my colleague, Nicholas Solare, who was the primary Polco project manager over the last few months. Before we dive in then to the results here, I would like to just give a brief introduction to who we are.

[03:10:17] So Polco's online community engagement polling platform provides the information tools that local governments and other public sector leaders need. Today, hundreds of organizations nationwide use Polko for strategic planning, for budgeting, for empowering resident voices.

[03:10:35] Ultimately, our goal is to make civil, verified community engagement online not only possible, but accessible to all. The National Research Center at Polko gives local governments the data that they need to make more informed decisions. Since 1994, the National Research Center has worked with hundreds of jurisdictions nationwide, and we are best known for our national benchmarking surveys, including the National Community Survey, the National Employee Survey, and the Community Assessment Survey for Older Adults, among others.

[03:11:06] Our benchmark database is the largest of its kind in the United States, and in 2019, Polko and NRC merged to more effectively serve local governments and to help project resident voices. You can also see on the slide here that we are exclusive partners with ICMA and the National League of cities. And we also work closely with the engaged local government leaders, the Alliance for Innovation, and many, many, many academic partners, including the American Association for Public Opinion Research, the University of Wisconsin-Madison, the Hoover Institute at Stanford University, and the Harvard Kennedy School of Government. All right, so with that, I'd like to

[03:11:45] turn to this most recent effort here in Prince William County. All households within Prince William County were eligible to participate in this survey. A list of all households within the zip code serving the county was purchased based on the most up-to-date lists from the United States Postal Service. And then using the GIS boundary files that were provided by the county, addresses located outside of those boundaries were removed from the list of potential households to serve.

[03:12:12] In other words, all respondents here were residents of the county. From that list, 6,000 addresses were randomly selected to receive the survey with an oversampling of multifamily dwellings and areas with demographics that tend to have lower response rates. The 6,000 randomly selected households received mailings beginning on May 10th, and the survey was open for 10 weeks. The first mailing was a postcard inviting the household to participate in the survey. The next mailing contained a cover letter with instructions, the survey questionnaire, and a postage paid return envelope. Both the postcard and the cover letter included a web link to give residents the

[03:12:51] opportunity to respond to the survey online, and an online Spanish survey was available to these selected households. All follow-up mailings had asked those who had not yet completed the survey to do so, and those who had already done so to not respond twice. A total of 511 completed surveys were received from these efforts, providing a response rate of around 10% and a marginal error of plus or minus 4%. We then compared the demographic profile of survey respondents to that of adults in Prince William County using the most recent census and American community survey

[03:13:26] data, and we weighted the final results. Weighting is a survey research best practice and helps to improve the representativeness of those finals. You can also see here on the slide that in addition to the randomly selected probability sample of households, a link to an online community-wide Open Participation Survey was also publicized by the county. The Open Participation Survey was open to all county residents and became available toward the end of the data collection period.

[03:13:55] This effort received 1,758 responses. The presentation here today and the report are based on the responses from the random sample mail-based survey. The responses to the Open Participation Survey are provided separately in the full report, including comparisons between these two same. Now, I do want to point out that there were a few differences in the methodology here compared to previous iterations of this survey, which you may have noticed. This effort included a majority mailed outreach as opposed to the phone-based surveys done in the past.

[03:14:29] There was also a move to change all questions to the industry standard five-point scale as opposed to the 11-point scale that was used in the past. When year-over-year comparisons between these different scales occurred, you'll see that results were adjusted to a 100-point scale to make those comparisons more readable and more actionable. And then finally, some questions were maintained, most questions were maintained for trend purposes, some were tweaked to update language, and some others were adjusted to align with the quadrants of art. So with that, I do want

[03:15:05] to move into some key findings. But before that, I want to point out that there is a lot of additional data in the report that we won't cover today, but the presentation today will focus on a few areas that the survey research team found to be most noteworthy within these results. So first, residents feel positively about Prince William County's quality of life. So Prince William County residents were pleased with the quality of life in their community. About eight in 10 respondents said that it was excellent or good. Meanwhile, about seven in 10 residents praised the

[03:15:40] overall quality of services that were provided by the county. These ratings have remained stable over the last eight years. And lastly, you can see here that half of residents rated the value of services for taxes paid to the county as excellent or good. Now, each of the addresses which were selected in that random process were also identified as being within one of the seven geographic areas that you see on the slide here. These seven areas were built using zip code boundaries to align with previous survey efforts. And when looking across these seven areas, we can

[03:16:16] actually see that there are no statistically significant differences in those ratings for quality of life or in most of the ratings for services provided by Prince William County. However, the full report will include comparisons by area, just like you see on the slide here, for every evaluative question that was included in the survey. These tables are also included, These tables also include the countywide overall score there in the farm rate.

[03:16:42] Now, those who rated quality of life in Prince William County as poor or fair were asked to provide the most important reason which made them feel that way. You can see those results on the slide.

[03:17:00] Crime, taxes, and the proliferation of data centers were among the main reasons why residents were less satisfied with Prince William County's quality. Those who rated the quality of services in Prince William County as poor or fair were also asked to provide which reason made them feel that way.

[03:17:21] And in this regard, deficiencies in community and customer service, taxes, and traffic were the primary reasons why respondents were dissatisfied with the overall quality of services. And then finally, in an open-ended question in which residents could write in their own words the most important thing that the county should do to make Prince William County a better place to live, 17% of respondents made some comment related to safety or security.

[03:17:48] Transportation and the limiting of data centers were also frequently cited at 9% each. Now, many of those quality of life items that we just went through actually related directly to government operations, performance, and innovation.

[03:18:06] The survey asked residents to rate their level of satisfaction with five characteristics related to government operations within Prince William County. At least three quarters of all respondents gave favorable marks to each one of the five characteristics. Virtually all residents reported to be very or somewhat satisfied with the voting experience in the county. About eight in ten respondents said they were very or somewhat satisfied with the overall customer service of Prince William County, how easily they could access information about county programs and services, and how the county values residents from diverse backgrounds. And finally, three-quarters of the

[03:18:46] respondents expressed satisfaction with how the county makes all residents feel welcome. Some additional quality of life questions were also added to the survey and asked residents to rate their satisfaction with growth, mobility, and economic resiliency. So about six in ten respondents reported satisfaction with new developments providing attractive and high quality places to live, work, shop, and play in Prince William County, while about half praised the ability to voice their opinion while new developments were in the planning and public review stages. Finally, about four in ten residents were very or somewhat satisfied with knowing how to get involved in the planning

[03:19:25] development process and how easy it is to know what new developments are currently being reviewed. About 6 in 10 respondents also reported being very or somewhat satisfied with how the transportation network supports the needs of commuters, the community as a whole, and the growth and safety of the community.

[03:19:48] You can see those trends over time here on the slide. The second major takeaway here, residents are satisfied with recreational opportunities throughout the county. Survey respondents rated their satisfaction with 14 health and well-being services provided by Prince William County.

[03:20:06] Library services ranked the highest with about 9 in 10 respondents reporting that they were very or somewhat satisfied. About 8 in 10 residents also praised the quality of the athletic fields, the quality of recreational opportunities such as trails, boating, fishing, and picnicking, and how parks and recreation services meet the needs of the local.

[03:20:26] Three-quarters of the respondents also praised the quality of indoor recreational facilities, as well as county pools and water parks. Satisfaction levels ranged between 60% and 70% for several other health, well-being, and environmental items, as services provided for people with disabilities and children at risk of neglect or abuse, the county's environmental and sustainability efforts, and services for individuals aged over 60.

[03:20:56] Lower satisfaction levels were noted for services provided to people who are economically disadvantaged, to those with addiction, and to those with mental illnesses. Inter-year comparisons here show that most 2024 health, well-being, and environmental sustainability ratings were on par with previous survey efforts, except for services that the county provides for people over the age of 60, which showed a slight decline from 2020.

[03:21:25] All right, then our third key takeaway here, feelings of safety have slightly decreased across the county, but satisfaction with police and fire departments remained high. About three quarters of respondents were satisfied with neighborhood safety, while seven in 10 felt the same about safety in commercial areas around the county. You can see both of these ratings here show moderate decreases when compared to 20. However, satisfaction with police services was extremely high. About eight in ten respondents praised the professionalism of police officers, their prompt response, and the

[03:22:04] high quality of service that they provide. Additionally, 80% were satisfied with the department's overall performance, 79% felt that all individuals were treated fairly, and 77% appreciated the information that crime prevention programs provide. Similarly, virtually all Prince William County residents reported being very or somewhat satisfied with the county's fire and emergency medical services. This included satisfaction with the professionalism of responders, their overall performance, the promptness of their response, service quality,

[03:22:40] and fire prevention programs. Regarding animal control there at the bottom, about 4 in 10 respondents indicated that they did not know enough to rate this service, but of those who voiced an opinion, roughly 8 in 10 were satisfied with animal control's effectiveness in protecting both residents and and then finally key finding number four engagement and satisfaction with county departments are high so survey respondents were asked which county government departments or

[03:23:14] services they had contacted directly in the past 12 months either in person or by phone the most frequently contacted departments were the library with 46 percent of respondents visiting or contacting it in the last year this was followed by election or voter registration locations 44 percent, Parks and Recreation 42%, the Police Department at 39%, Public Works 36%, and Finance 35%. Now, survey respondents were also asked about their level of satisfaction with those departments that they had contacted within the last 12 months. The Library and Parks and Recreation

[03:23:53] Departments led the list here with nearly all respondents reporting being very or somewhat satisfied with that service. Other departments that received an overall satisfaction rating above 80% include the fire department and emergency medical services, elections and voter registration, public works, and housing and development. And then fifth, finally, safety and education top the list of most important strategic planning areas. So when asked about the importance of the 19 strategic planning areas for the overall quality of life in Prince William County,

[03:24:30] virtually all residents considered that ensuring safety was essential or very important. Additionally, 9 in 10 residents highlighted the importance of providing quality K-12 education and higher education opportunities, including workforce development. When asked to prioritize the most important planning area to the overall quality of life in Prince William County, about 1 in 4 residents mentioned safety, while about 1 in 6 selected educational opportunity. And you can see here other frequently mentioned areas were transportation and mobility at 8%, affordable

[03:25:07] housing and sustainable growth at 7% each. And then here we thought we would just like to highlight that there are a number of survey responses that do align directly with the draft strategic planning goals of the county. And you can see just a few examples here of those questions that end up relating to goals 1, 4, 5, 6, and 8. And additionally, we do have some responses here as well that relate to the remaining goals, including smart growth, the environment, and service. And so

[03:25:43] to conclude here, an overall broad summary of these conclusions. First, residents feel positively about Prince William County and the quality of life. Residents are satisfied with overall recreational opportunities. Feelings of safety have declined slightly, but satisfaction with the police and fire departments remain high. Engagement and satisfaction with county departments continue to stay high. And safety and education top the list of the most important strategic planning.

[03:26:13] So with that, I'd be happy to answer any questions that the board might have on the methodology, on the results, on that lengthy report that we shared with you all. I'll catch my breath here and hand it back to Nikki or to whoever would like to leave out those questions.

[03:26:30] Thank you so much for your time. All right. Thank you so very much. I don't. Does anyone have any questions for Nikki? Okay. I guess that break took everyone's mojo. All right.

[03:26:49] we know we got a long meeting ahead of us all right mr shorter thank you very much madam chair members of the board first let me before i move on to the next presentation just want to thank nikki really in the entire team of polko and all that they did uh to uh to do and make the survey possible this year we did a number of new things this year with this survey that we have not done before, and that is to make the survey available not just by phone, but available by mail to the

[03:27:25] thousands of residents that were sent the mailer, and also open to residents to just come to our website to fill out the same questionnaire that those who received by mail the survey. So just want to acknowledge that work and thank the team for it. That's it. Moving on to the next presentation. I want to, again, turn it over to Nikki Brown, who will introduce Glenn to walk us through the legislative agenda. We have had the opportunity to meet with each of you in your

[03:27:58] offices to walk and, as I say, to put this agenda together and look forward to your collective review and feedback as we are getting the slide deck up. I will turn it over to Nikki. Nikki?

[03:28:13] Thank you. Once again, Nikki Brown, communications and engagement. I really wanted to say thank you all for the conversations we've had leading up to the draft legislative agenda. I'm really good about handing it over to experts. So I am going to hand it over to Glenn Loop, who is our legislative liaison. We are going to walk through the draft legislative agenda. And then at the end, we'll go through some key dates that are coming up as well. And of course, as always, happy to answer questions. So I will hand it to Glenn.

[03:28:45] madam chairman members of the board it's good to be back with you it's that time of year where we are preparing for our 2025 session of the general assembly we can anticipate with the bill limits that have been set by the joint rules committee that there will be a little over 2 000 pieces of legislation which is interesting for this session because it is a short session of the general assembly it'll go in on january the 8th and it'll be conclude on february 22nd so 2 000 pieces of

[03:29:22] legislation. Predictably, right now I'm willing to wager about 275 of them will pertain to Virginia local governments if the last four years are any indicator whatsoever. So with that, there are six overarching policy areas that we want to highlight in this version of the agenda. Transportation and mobility. Within that, roadway safety, funding, truck-to-trailer parking, health and well-being, the CRC, the crisis receiving center, regulatory matter, and we'll delve into each of these in greater depth as we get into the agenda the safety and security of the community the

[03:29:59] reallocation of resources for the police department reclassification of telecommunicators employment funding for the offices of our constitutional officers and the drug supply chain security transition matter that is well attuned to this board the resilient economy affordable housing policy authority expanding the use of workforce training funds and the recent jlark report that's about to be released regarding data centers and we'll discuss again each of these in greater depth education funding is addressed by the jlark study and we will expound upon that and the prince william county school system is requested to include in our legislative agenda

[03:30:37] the repeal of the support cap ratio and we can chat about that and overarching issues in the administration of government including tax policy and environmental sustainability next slide Transportation. Examples of projects that are local priorities for traffic safety improvements but do not qualify under current standards. This is a carryover piece from past sessions of the legislative agenda except for the addition of roadways with high levels of industrial traffic which is an item that Supervisor Gordy brought to our attention and

[03:31:17] also brought to our attention depending on what happens with the congressional funding proposition that's impending. Approximately $200 million is in the current budget for truck-to-trailer parking projects nationally, but it's not a lot of money nationally, but it does bring a great deal of attention to this issue. Acceleration by VDOT of the manual and uniform traffic control devices, and we echo VACO's position on enhanced authority for counties to deploy and administer photo speed monitoring devices within their jurisdictions. So this language is also included in the most recent VACO legislative agenda that was adopted last weekend.

[03:31:59] So we asked for a specific resolution to address the tractor-trailer parking issue on the 95 and 66 corridors, and we have a draft of that legislation being developed as we speak. So we appreciate you bringing that to our attention. We are also closely monitoring the Northern Virginia growing needs of Public Transit Joint Subcommittee, and that's actually the name of the subcommittee. This is a two-year study set up by the General Assembly specifically to examine Northern Virginia Transportation needs. Specifically, in the second year of this study, it's going to delve into funding. Traditionally, this agenda has included language, as it does this

[03:32:38] year, to reinstate the funding from the Northern Virginia Transportation Authority. This study will examine all funding necessary for the Northern Virginia Transportation Commission, the Transportation Authority, VRE, OmniRide, every major transportation organization covering Northern Virginia.

[03:32:57] So we look forward to the outcome of that study in the coming year. Health and well-being of the community. You are intimately familiar with the Institution for Mental Disease designation that could impact the Medicaid funding for the Crisis Receiving Center.

[03:33:16] This board sent a letter to the state and federal delegation on this issue. They've all been galvanized on this issue. Congresswoman Wexton's office, Congresswoman Spanberger, Senators Warner and Cain are each engaged. Senator Cain's office specifically is setting up a meeting for the county staff with the Corporation for Medicaid and Medicare Services to address it.

[03:33:40] Meanwhile, the Department of Medical Assistance Services and the Department of Behavioral Health and Disability Services has also been galvanized on this issue. There will be at least two pieces of legislation asking for regulatory reform, and I met with Delegate Sickles last week on his willingness to sponsor such legislation.

[03:33:59] There's the TDO reimbursement rate that could come into play with regard to the Crisis Receiving Center. All in all, I think all the pieces of the puzzle are falling into place, but it's just a matter of hurry up and wait and wait for the waiver process to play through, as well as getting the General Assembly engaged on the issue in January.

[03:34:20] Enhanced access to utilization of telehealth services. It seems like every session since the pandemic, the use of telehealth services and telehealth legislation is introduced in the General Assembly, and this year will be no different, and we will be supportive of that language. The safety and security of the community.

[03:34:39] The reclassification of public safety telecommunicators. That's the 911 staff to a protected service category. This is consistent with a recent JARC study on that issue. And requesting that the Commonwealth fully fund its constitutional officers. That's an expensive one. Doesn't hurt to ask, but it's a discussion worth having with the Chairman and Delegate Sewell as members of the Appropriations Committee and Senator McPike as a member of the Senate Finance Committee.

[03:35:05] We request that a work group be established to look at the damage threshold amount for reporting of accidents by our law enforcement officers. Delegate Maldonado has agreed to have this bill drafted. This LANG was drafted as a study to evaluate standards that have not changed since 2007 and amend the Virginia Retirement System to allow for the rehiring of law enforcement officers that are fully retired without adversely impacting their VRS.

[03:35:35] We've briefed the staff of Delegatorian on this issue. We're awaiting some evaluation of what this would mean financially, but it's in the agenda at the request of the police department, and we think there will be some takers on it when the bill drafting is initiated.

[03:35:52] Further, and this is another issue that you've had a great deal of discussion about, and that's the drug supply chain security matter. Each of these items that you see in front of you are consistent with the letter that the chair wrote to the state and federal delegation at the behest of the board.

[03:36:11] Again, this is one of those where all the pieces of the puzzle are in play, and it's a matter of it working out. Specifically, our agenda directs the Board of Pharmacy to update its regulations to create a category for fire and rescue stations to address security regulations. Direct the Virginia Office of Emergency Medical Services to change its regulations, allowing for volunteer companies to keep their names on their respective apparatus.

[03:36:34] Direct the Board of Pharmacy to include a representative from fire and rescue on their advisory board. Request a statewide budget amendment to assist with transition to this new system because you obviously know the fiscal impact it's had on Prince William County.

[03:36:50] It's had a similar impact on Loudoun County, and it's affecting every single local government in the Commonwealth. So such a fund would be a way to help local governments with that transition and to extend the implementation date. And this is a subject that both Warner, Cain, Spanberger, and Wexton have also written the FDA and the DEA regarding.

[03:37:11] So this is all, again, consistent with the letter. It's sort of like the CRC as a model that all the pieces of the puzzle are in place. Now it's a matter of getting the chips to fall down where they need to fall. And given that this specific item is included in virtually every legislative agenda that I've reviewed, it's going to be a big team effort.

[03:37:31] And I think it's going to work itself out. And monitor, the Senate Finance Committee is going to have language regarding the use of non-sworn personnel and cadets. This is another item to help the police department with staffing level needs, but we await that language coming out of the Senate Finance Committee.

[03:37:51] Regarding the economy, support our military communities partnership. I'm really impressed with the Northern Virginia Regional Commission's Military Communities Partnership Group. It is an outstanding group to monitor. The General Assembly has also got a fund to help fund joint infrastructure projects between military bases and counties, water, sewer, workforce development, family support services, all those items that are covered.

[03:38:18] Supervisor Angry co-chairs that group, I do believe. But the General Assembly always has legislation that helps to support this type of endeavor, and we should support that as well. requesting language to authorize the county to provide for affordable housing dwelling unit programs as a component to its comprehensive plan. This is otherwise what could be known as Senator McPike's Senate Bill 597. This is revisiting General Assembly authority to grant you the same authority that Fairfax County has got. I think we've got some takers for introduction of the legislation. It seems that this is an item that's got bipartisan support.

[03:38:56] I think it's also worthy to note under housing policy in terms of a timely matter, and this is something I need to discuss, but it will bring to the attention of Elijah and his team, is that this week the governor announced a $75 million workforce housing fund. It's going to be orchestrated, I believe, and managed by the Virginia Housing Development Authority, now known as Virginia Housing.

[03:39:18] Looking at the program criteria, it looked like there could be some unique opportunities from Prince William County under the governor's proposal, and I'm not sure how that filters into the appropriations process. We'll find out more about that when the governor unveils his budget on December the 16th.

[03:39:34] And monitor the data center studies and proposed legislation. December the 9th is a date that will be ingrained in the history books. Approximately at 10.07 that morning, JLARC will issue its data center study.

[03:39:53] A lot of us will be on hand for when JLARC does that. I think the crystal ball says that we can anticipate the reintroduction of almost probably identically the 17 pieces of legislation we monitored last session impacting every facet of the data center industry.

[03:40:11] I know the coalition and industry will be watching it carefully. Every sector of anybody that's got an interest in it will be glued to their computer screens on December the 9th, and we will be no different. We will immediately bring to your attention the outcome of that study and copies of that study.

[03:40:28] and see what the board's wishes are after that. But there's a lot of legislation that's either planned, that there are placeholder positions being taken. In other words, legislators are holding their bill limits to see what comes out of that study. So I put all that out there as just sort of a crystal ball as to what to anticipate that morning.

[03:40:53] Education. We refer in here to the JLARC report that was recently issued regarding K-12 funding. This was one of those paradigm-shifting kinds of reports that documented that the Commonwealth was underfunding its K-12 by students to the tune of $1,900 per student.

[03:41:15] We were funding on a per-student basis a rate lower than Mississippi, Alabama, and West Virginia. This report was taken very seriously by the Assembly. They set up a study committee specifically to address the funding demands that this study is going to take to resolve.

[03:41:39] As a report was issued last weekend, this was about a $3.5 billion ongoing, not one time, ongoing funding issue for the Commonwealth. And there's a joint study committee that's established by both the House and the Senate that's chaired by Senator Locke to specifically address the means to address this.

[03:42:04] It's going to mean overhauling the composite index. I know that Delegatorian and Senator Lucas have already got their eye on use of surplus funds, but this is what specifically this item is referring to. And we joined with the school board in repeal of the support cap ratio.

[03:42:22] This was a measure put in place when Governor Kaine was in office that to address budget-cutting needs during that given recession, the state would no longer fund support positions in the school systems.

[03:42:38] And this is about a $50 million question. It's an expensive one for Prince William County, and we think there could be an opportunity to reverse that policy in the coming session. And under administration of government, meet the goals identified in the county's community energy and sustainability master plan, the comprehensive plan, and strategic plan, and allow tax policy adjustments and exemptions for certain and specific industries.

[03:43:11] I want to bring to your attention that there are two major tax policy studies underway by the General Assembly. One chaired by Delegate Watts on tax policy preferences and one that's very comprehensive, chaired by Senator Lucas, on tax policy overall.

[03:43:30] And I mean, they're looking under every rock. And it's interesting to note that during the VACO presentation on the state budget this past session, that the number one tax relief measure in the Commonwealth is that of data centers and it's to the tune of about $1 billion.

[03:43:48] So if you're looking for $3 billion, I bring that up purely to highlight that they're looking under every rock for every source of tax reform, and there's over 80 different categories that receive some type of tax relief in the Commonwealth, 80 different funding categories.

[03:44:08] So I would expect major tax overall legislation, not this session, but they're going to wait for another governor and another assembly and really check their figures closely and knowing that Senator Lucas and Delegatorian, this is going to be a major, major policy shift and it's going to probably restructure the funding relationship between state governments and local governments for a long time to come.

[03:44:38] And environmental sustainability, legislation affecting environmental stewardship, including those issues contained in the Virginia Association of Counties Environment, Energy and Land Use Platform. And I think VACA has put together a sound legislative agenda for this session of the General Assembly.

[03:44:53] And all of you should have received copies of it from VACA, but if not, we can provide that to you. And then we've got an added component to this because there's just been a growth in the number of issues that our federal government is taking on or has an interest in that Prince William County has a vested interest in.

[03:45:20] So we included these in light of a new presidential administration transition and in light of a new Congress coming in, in light of the fact that Prince William County is going to have two new members of the House of Representatives, we thought it was worthy to add these items on the federal agenda side for you to consider the Drug Supply Chain Security Act, which isn't going to go away, the IMD designation, congressionally directed spending projects that you're all familiar with the u.s budget process which is going to take on an entirely new light with a new congress and a new president the safer communities act has been a source of

[03:45:58] funding for for public safety projects throughout the country the legislative interests that link the marine basic quantico to the county the funding of federal parks the general services administration and i'm while i'm not sure if the new administration is going to carry it over there is a new White House Task Force on Artificial Intelligence and Data Center Infrastructure, and we'll be looking to see if the Trump administration continues that study group that was just most recently established in the current administration.

[03:46:31] So with that, we think that this is a sound body of nine different items that we have a federal interest in to include in the agenda. And we hear the significant dates. We're already down to where you need to be putting on your calendar, December 2nd, for the joint presentation of these legislative agendas, agendas plural, with our delegation with the school system, 9 o'clock that morning.

[03:46:57] The session begins January the 8th. Virginia Association of Counties Local Government Day is January 23rd, and they wrap up the 22nd. The only other significant dates that I would highlight is, one, the JLARC study on December the 9th, and also noting that the governor releases his version of the budget on December the 16th. And ironically enough, it is also December 16th that the State Corporation Commission will having their technical conference on the impact of large grid users, including data centers, which is almost unparalleled as far as my history is concerned. The State Corporation Commission

[03:47:34] having such a conference on a specific item, including the impact on the grid, which is going to be a major item, I think, with the JLARC study. Stacked. So with that, glad to take any questions you may have regarding the agenda or items that you would like to discuss. Thank you so very much for your presentation. The first person is Supervisor Weir. Understanding JLARC study is

[03:48:10] impending or coming soon. I think one of the things that we need to address, we sort of kind of hit on this topic earlier in this meeting, is the ambiguous language with respect to the state code on principally data center real property valuations.

[03:48:35] So I think we should, there's no objection. I would like to add to the legislative agenda, monitoring or trying to address that ambiguous language as part of your tax policy discussions.

[03:48:54] So I think as it stands right now, we're sort of have our hands tied by the ambiguous language, and quite frankly, I think the data centers are taking advantage of it to a large degree. So if we could tighten up the language or have the General Assembly tighten up that language, I think that would behoove not only us but every other jurisdiction that has to deal with them.

[03:49:14] Do we have any, I'm sorry, do we have anyone who has any objection to that? No. That's all I got. Supervisor Franklin? Yeah, just a couple of things. And I just want to highlight, and you've already done this, but just want to say publicly the JLARC study on K-12 education funding was VACO's number one legislative priority.

[03:49:42] And quite frankly, it should be ours. And I'm hoping that we're encouraging our school board also to make sure that that's one of their top priorities, if not number one priority as well. And this is something that has received support from Democrats, Republicans, particularly those in the smaller counties who, similar to us, also fund parts of their education system.

[03:50:08] So I just want to make sure that we're paying close attention to that, as that's going to be one of the top priorities. And then what I didn't see, and this may be in the specifics of our legislative agenda, but it may be just not in the highlights, but making sure that we're still advocating for more flexibility for local authorities to mitigate against traffic issues, transportation issues generally.

[03:50:34] So if you can just address that. That may be in the specifics. It's more elaborate in terms of highway safety issues. Gotcha. And so just making sure that it's clear for our members of the General Assembly that that's important and sticking CTB somewhere in there. there's almost a parallel universe of ctb issues that we need to isolate for a commonwealth transportation board agenda sure sure we can talk more about that including funding for each and every one of them yep yep and then the last thing under the federal um priorities without objection i actually like to add for us to follow like surface transportation reauthorization which is

[03:51:13] going to come up uh well hopefully it's going to come up uh in 2025 i know it's expiring and obviously that's where most states get a lot of their federal transportation uh funding from so i would like for us to make sure that um we're paying close attention to that and that um we you know obviously view that as being very important surface transportation reauthorization and i don't see there are no objections correct thank you are you have you completed Supervisor Frank, all right.

[03:51:52] Supervisor Bode. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Nikki and Glenn, as always, for your work on this, in collaboration with obviously all the other agencies that you've worked on, and especially appreciate how you're reaching out to not only our delegation, but the broader delegation of folks in Northern Virginia to help overcome the fact that there are such constrained bill limits.

[03:52:13] Just wanted to uplift and highlight some of the things my colleagues have already mentioned, K-12 funding, transit and transportation. We know that that transit piece is going to be at least a two-year process, so we won't get help with that this coming session. But keeping the eye on the prize, so as Franklin mentioned earlier, that traffic safety component giving us more flexibility vis-a-vis the cameras, but also those kind of very constrained VDOT guidelines as it pertains to non-residential but really residential roads that we can't do certain things on, what have you.

[03:52:44] But another thing I wanted to add in and hopefully get some support on is we have an environmental section right now in the legislative agenda, but it doesn't speak directly to water quality issues per se. So without objection, I would like us to be a little more specific and say that we will continue to monitor and support issues around water quality, especially as it pertains to PFAS, microplastics, and salinity.

[03:53:09] I certainly support that because I had that in my notes. So go, Supervisor Bode. Any objection to that? All right, on to Supervisor Bailey. Thank you, Madam Chair. Glenn, thank you so much for just being in concert with VACO as well.

[03:53:27] I think what our legislative agenda is really partners with that. And one of the pieces that I'm glad you mentioned that will certainly marry with the CRC was the telehealth piece. That's critical, and that's one of the things that was focused on in VACO and the Health and Human Services Board.

[03:53:45] So thank you for including that in our agenda. And then also the Marine Corps base, being that they're one of our strongest partners from an economic development standpoint, contributor to, what does, can you kind of expand that a little bit?

[03:54:00] What does that look like? Because they are a big collaborative partner for us. Well, again, and I was specifically asked by Bob at the Regional Commission to bring this up with the governor's office in that making sure that the governor's budget has funding for the Joint Military Communities Partnership Fund that allows us to partner with them and get financial assistance from the Commonwealth for joint infrastructure projects that span the military base and the county.

[03:54:29] And I think that's probably the number one thing we could ask for with regard to that partnership. There's a very, very active military caucus within the General Assembly that has weekly meetings that most members of our delegation participate in at one time or another.

[03:54:46] And they consistently evaluate every piece of legislation that impacts the veteran and military communities throughout the Commonwealth, spanning really from Chesapeake to here. So staying on top of the bills that are introduced in that regard is an important part of the mission. Okay.

[03:55:01] And then the other thing is the speed cameras was another in our transportation. And, Nikki, you know what I'm talking about. That was critical. We passed that in the Transportation Committee at VACO as well, but it was directly akin to us talking about Cardinal Drive and all of that.

[03:55:19] And so we appreciate that. That's going to be a strong legislative arm or item as we go forward to get those here and protecting our society. but also it was a VACO brain thrust as well, so we appreciate that.

[03:55:35] I want to temper your expectations for that just a little bit. Don't do that. There is a little resistance within the Assembly on that. It is? Well, yeah, and most of it revolves around wanting consistent regulation statewide, but we can chat more about it to see what bills are introduced in that regard, and it does help that VACO is partnering on this type of language.

[03:55:56] We're not the only local government asking for that type of authority, But there is a hair of resistance in Richmond. Okay. Just want to temper the expectation. Just temper the expectation, I know. Thank you. All right, I have a quick question.

[03:56:11] I'm going to turn around to Supervisor Vega since we're talking about military. One of the big concerns I've heard in meeting with leadership from Quantico is the REPE program, or that's basically the land around Quantico making sure that it stays rule.

[03:56:29] Rule. Rule, because they're doing sophisticated war games, and there's a lot of noise. And building housing communities right up to the base impairs their ability to carry out certain tactical exercises. So when you were talking about working with getting funding, you know, for Quantico, I just wanted to see if that included the REPE program or if that can include the REPE program.

[03:56:53] I don't see why not. All right. Do you want to make sure? Doesn't hurt to ask. Doesn't hurt to ask. Thank you so very much. I don't think there's any objections. Now I'm going to go over to Supervisor Vega, then Gordy. Thank you, Madam Chair. I just, without objection, of course, would like for us to make an emphasis on the Trails and Blue Ways Council resolution that they sent to us.

[03:57:14] There seems to be any mention of this in our legislative priorities. And so I do know that what's being requested based on the resolution that they sent to us, I don't know how many of you have read it, this has to do with changes to the proffer rules by the State Assembly and Northern Virginia Trail support from the congressional team.

[03:57:35] And so if nobody objects, I would like for us to also include that in there. It doesn't seem like there are any objections. Do you have anything else? All right, Supervisor Gordy. Thank you, Madam Chair. And just to piggyback on the REPI program, you know, there's the defense bill and defense appropriations that we can monitor.

[03:58:00] We also monitor the farm bill because they have significant conservation programs. And so, you know, in order to protect military bases, we can put some of this land in conservation and we can look at those opportunities through the farm bill, which I know has been struggling to get passed.

[03:58:21] But I think without objection, I'd like to add that to our list as well. Thank you, Madam Chair. Don't have any objections? Madam Chair, I just want to specify real quick. My request is in terms of funding for trails is what they're seeking. So I just want to be specific.

[03:58:37] Thank you for the clarification. And Supervisor Gordy, I don't know how far out of the barn, metaphorically speaking, the farm bill is, but it's a good ways into the drafting stage under the current Congress.

[03:58:55] So there's a long and distinguished list of things they're going to try to do before, like, December the 20th. Farm bill, given the expiration of a lot of the programs in that bill, is on the emergency list. So I'm not sure how much influence we could have on that process now.

[03:59:13] But if by some weird chance gets carried over, that's a chance to revisit the whole thing. Oh, yeah. We should have put the farm bill in. Easy way. All right.

[03:59:29] We have one more. Supervisor Ingrid? Thank you, Madam Chair. I just felt compelled to chime in on the installation portion of this with the housing, such as Quantico. And I don't know, I'm going to say it out, and then you can kind of help me in crafting what needs to happen.

[03:59:48] Because I think this is a legislative issue for Richmond. You know, that land outside around Quantico is private property land of folks that can do what they want to do with it, sell it. This happened literally at Fort Belvoir with Davidson Army Airfare, where they built that entire community right at the end of the flight line.

[04:00:08] only to complain about the flight line. But you built a community that you could, outside the base, outside the airfield, on that flight line. So it still is an ongoing problem 20 years later. I don't know if there's something Richmond could look at that looks at that type of land to understand.

[04:00:27] Building a community there next to, such as Quantico, that trains, and I've been in those out there training where you would see Marines walking up against the end of the road from doing land map things. And so they could end up in your backyard if that's the case.

[04:00:43] My point is I don't know if there's something that if we're going to talk about these installations, these military facilities, you've got to understand what you're getting into when you decide to build a community, I'm going to say, because this is generally what happens next to these installations.

[04:00:59] So I don't know what kind of weight we have on that because the fact of the matter is it happens and it can happen, and then it just becomes a military's problem when folks don't like what they hear. And Quantico does have a lot of, you know, boom, boom, I would say, because you can feel the vibrations in Dell City.

[04:01:20] I don't know anything could be done to try to craft that better than simply saying don't build a house next to Quantico training because that probably is not going to happen. Well, regarding Quantico, it sounds like we've got about a half a dozen issues that we might not have to let a little study group on.

[04:01:36] Yeah, and I think because I don't want that word to be lost and it remaining rural, but the reality is no one should be really building around that because that's literally what they do. And so if you don't, you know, some people call it the sounds of freedom. If you like the sounds of freedom, then you're okay with it.

[04:01:52] But if you don't like the sounds of freedom, then we probably shouldn't build communities literally next to these installations where we know that is occurring. Thank you. Supervisor Cordy? On that, so the state does have programs, and it initiated coming out of the 2005 BRAC, and we were fighting to preserve Oceana Naval Air Station because guess what?

[04:02:20] They were building developments right around the base. I was the chief of staff for the member of Congress at the time, working with Senator Warner's office at the time, and we had a development, a high-rise 10-story condo in the flight path coming into the base by right development.

[04:02:40] And so, literally, it's the Purchase of Development Rights Program. That's why that's so essential for us as a county. And so, in partnering with state, federal, and, you know, the local governments coming out of 2005, they recognized that there was a true threat to our military bases and our training.

[04:03:05] And as a result, there were resources provided in order to help communities purchase those development rights to protect these bases. So I agree with Glenn. We should probably put together a working group, take a look at this holistically. This might be one of our ad hoc committees that we've talked about, you know, in prior meetings.

[04:03:26] But to see, you know, what the strategy is working with Quantico to ensure that we are protecting that tremendous asset for this county. I think it's a $7 billion asset for our community, and we certainly want to protect that. Thank you. Here's the virtue of just having Quantico listed in the federal agenda section.

[04:03:45] It kind of gives us a license to delve into all these issues. Supervisor Bailey.

[04:04:07] Supervisor Bailey. I thought it was on. That it was one of the only towns that's surrounded by a base, and that's been an issue for a very long time. And the question that I have, is it only a federal issue?

[04:04:25] that's something that we can address in addition to federally, something we can address from a state perspective in terms of having access in and off for them, for the town, in and off of the base. Interesting question.

[04:04:42] Yeah, credentialing, whatever that looks like. Let's put it on the Quantico Christmas list. Yes, I would like that. It's growing. If I stay in here another hour, we're going to have a Quantico study commission. Yes. Well, no.

[04:04:58] I'm careful with that. Certainly. you know certainly we appreciate this I mean there's a lot for us to discuss I don't know if anyone else has anything but thank you so very much for your time Nikki I guess you want to put a bow before we move forward with a vote yeah sorry real quick I just want to make sure that we have everything that we want to include so and as a reminder what we went over today is only new items the whole legislative package was part of the the path of the agenda and

[04:05:35] the package for today so just to make sure we have this rate we want a monitor and address the ambiguous language related to data center real property we want to add to our federal agenda the surface transportation transportation reauthorization and the farm bill that we want to monitor and support issues around water quality particular PFAS and I will say we do have a copy of the Prince William water agenda which includes language around this and then

[04:06:10] to add the funding based on and we'll look at the resolution from the trails and blue ways council and we'll talk about see about protecting the land around installations we got more supervisor Vega had something yeah Nikki I'm things for looking at that there are two items that they sent to the board one had to do with funding and also protection from developers apparently based on the resolution that they sent developers are coming up with their own calculations as to what the contributions need to be and they want something that's more accurate and fair across the board instead of giving the

[04:06:47] developers the leeway to come up with their own calculations for contributions okay we'll take a look at their what they sent over then quickly supervisor Bodie and just to clarify for the water quality one PFAS microplastics and Salinity. Micropropics and what? Salinity.

[04:07:02] Salinity. Thank you. I think I got it. All right. Thank you. We appreciate all your work, both of you, on this legislative agenda. So now I would like to entertain a motion for 9B.

[04:07:21] So moved. Second. I'll give the second to Tom Gordy. All right. Any further discussion? All right. Supervisor Ingrid. Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to say real quick, for those who may not know VAGO, Virginia Association of counties that is a very um powerful organization when it comes to the voice of the many so we have 95 counties and the issues that much of the issues that we raise here as our priorities um to the point of what glenn just mentioned is a vaco priority and particularly when we start talking

[04:07:57] about this whole drug uh box program and what's happening inside the commonwealth and i will say and I'll give the entire system their credit or their relief, which is the fact that this has been going on for so long and we're kind of late to the game.

[04:08:14] It's just very frustrating how we had to pull this together at the last minute. But we did get an extension to April, even though we're in place. I'm just looking out for those other localities that aren't able to do what we were able to do in such a fast time with the funding that we have that they don't have.

[04:08:30] There's going to be some big changes there. So I just want to mention how important VACO is to not just Prince William County, but why Prince William County must continue to play well in the sandbox, if you will, with other localities and the counties and the situations that we find ourselves facing that they face because our voice is louder when we're together.

[04:08:52] and the last thing i'll just mention is the survey it does frustrate me on the survey that even the number that we got to do that survey uh this is half a million people in the county and i just don't know how we can reach them i just feel like we need to really find a way and thank you uh chris for mentioning how we got that out and all the ways we did it but it's just you know those numbers i you gotta figure out how to get get that higher and get a better feeling of what the county I mean that's great data I just want to get more people involved and see what you know what really is going on so that's all thank you Madam Chair. Thank you so

[04:09:31] very much looks like that's looks like we're ready to take a vote. Vote unanimous Supervisor Vega abstaining from vote and Supervisor Franklin absent from vote. All right thank you so very much I wanted to I don't know if anyone I know we've been moving so fast through this if anyone had

[04:10:06] any questions for county for the county executive you know when he was speaking earlier if not i think you're good right you don't have any other updates all right i don't see anything so we're going to move on to the county attorney um time miss robo the floor is now yours thank you madam chair members of the board we have one item for discussion in closed session this afternoon it will be a personnel discussion relating to the appointments and officers of the potomac and rappahannock transportation commission and this item is appropriate for closed session pursuant to 2.2-3711A1 of the Code of Virginia. Motion to authorize Madam Chair. Second. All right.

[04:10:44] Thank you so very much. Any discussion? All right. Let's take a vote.

[04:10:57] Vote unanimous. Supervisor Franklin absent from vote. All right. Thank you very much. And I'm going to turn it over to Mr. Shorter again for agency time. Thank you, Madam Chair, members of the board. I would like to turn it over to Director Tanya Washington to lead us through the next presentation around affordable housing in the ordinance along with the trust Joni Duckett is going to join her on this presentation

[04:11:32] as a reference as well good afternoon madam chair members of the board Tanya Washington director of planning with the planning office we are here today to do the second work session on the draft affordable dwelling unit ordinance I just want to give a quick overview of how we would like to proceed first we will start with a presentation from Wesley housing by Camilla McAfee she is the president and CEO and we invited Wesley

[04:12:08] housing to come and to present to provide some information from a nonprofit affordable housing developer that has used a bonus density as part of their toolbox to produce affordable units as a way to inform the board of how these types of projects have occurred in other parts of Northern Virginia from earlier work sessions you know we have relayed information that we have heard from the development industry with regards to affordable housing and so we thought this will be a great opportunity to bring a direct provider to share their experience the second piece will then turn to the staff presentation on

[04:12:46] the draft of the revised draft affordable dwelling unit ordinance mark mccaskill on our team will be reading that presentation and then i will return at the end i would also would like to say up front that following the presentation we will be ending with a request for board direction collective board direction on how you would like to proceed with the draft ordinance as you all know from the previous work session in june and in other conversations staff have heard a variety of perspectives and viewpoints on a variety of issues with regards to the draft affordable

[04:13:24] dwelling unit ordinance and at this time staff is asking for consensus direction from the board on how you would like to proceed with regards to any changes in other matters related to the draft ordinance so that we have some clear direction on how what you would like to do moving forward so with that i would like to invite camilla mcafee to give her presentation and then the staff will return thank you miss washington hi good evening chair jefferson vice chair bodie and other members

[04:14:00] of the board i appreciate you welcoming me here to give uh some information about my organization wesley housing and some of the projects that we've done in the past that have used affordable housing bonus density how am i advancing slides here is it this button here just first a little bit background and i appreciate miss norcross of of the northern virginia housing affordable housing developers of northern virginia giving some overview of wesley housing we are 50 year old non-profit affordable housing developer based in alexandria virginia but we have over 2300 units

[04:14:37] throughout northern virginia as well as the district of columbia we are not only developers and owners of these affordable housing communities but we also do property management as well as provide robust wraparound services for our residents which really is intended to help them thrive and sustain their housing we are virginia housing certified property manager which is key for us to be able to access those resources and provide those services as well as as a non-profit we are uniquely positioned to be able to fundraise either through federal local grant writing and

[04:15:15] other philanthropic opportunities to be able to provide the supportive services that we provide our residents some of that includes for all of our residents it varies by community for all of our residents we provide housing stability services which during the pandemic and after has become key because we're doing a lot of linkage and referral with emergency rental assistance, helping with food insecurity and other material assistance, especially during the holidays.

[04:15:42] Where we have additional funding to be able to provide full services to our residents, we may have after-school programming. We call it out-of-school time programming during the summer and after school, As well as adult education opportunities, financial planning, credit support, and programs to be able to help folks build their credit.

[04:16:05] I want to just highlight that while in the D.C. metro region, the area median income for a family of four is $155,000, and 60% of that is at $65,000 for individuals.

[04:16:21] our average income of our residents is well below that it's at it's under $37,000 which means in a lot of our communities they're also getting additional rental supports to be able to help them live and thrive there. So some of the communities I wanted to highlight are ones that we've developed over the last five years and we're integral in being able to have Wesley recognized as a top 50 affordable housing developer in the country which is a rare designation for a nonprofit organization. There are many larger for-profit organizations who are doing this work

[04:16:57] as well, so we're really proud of that. The first one is the Cadence in Arlington. This one was developed on the former site of the Arlington chapter of the American Red Cross. Wesley Housing had an existing community adjacent to this property, and through a land assemblage and a re-subdivision, we were able to create a mixed tenure and a mixed income community, whereby we had our existing preservation project of 68 units, which we used historic tax credits and low-income

[04:17:32] housing tax credits to support. And then we also sold a piece of the land to a market rate townhome developer so that we could use some of those proceeds to help support the new construction building that you see here it's 97 units the existing under the existing or permitted zoning with the rezoning that we were going through we would have been able to construct 64 units but with additional bonus density for affordable housing and also for green building we were

[04:18:04] able to achieve the full 97 with the applicable unit increases this one is particularly special for us because we also were able to incorporate a very large community center that serves not only the 97 households that live here in this building, but also the adjacent communities that total up to 200 units. The next one is in the city of Alexandria. This one was done in partnership with the faith community there. The Arlington Presbyterian Church had a heart for

[04:18:37] being able to build affordable housing on some underutilized parking lot land that they no longer had parishioners to support. And so they saw it best fit to be able to build the housing there. So they did an RFP. Wesley was selected and we were able to construct 81 units of affordable housing. They are utilizing a 30% FAR increase for an affordable housing bonus in the city of alexandria the city has since added additional tools for for affordable housing development

[04:19:13] and we've been able to accomplish that approvals with that in other communities as well i wanted to just highlight for this one it was our commitment to be able to build adaptable units and so this is 100 universally designed so these units are particularly large and have turnaround space throughout the entire community, regardless of who is living there.

[04:19:45] The last properties I was going to highlight is in Fairfax County. These two were developed utilizing both the independent senior facility designation that Fairfax County has as a bonus multiplier, as well as their affordable housing bonus.

[04:20:04] So these communities are all 100% dedicated for housing for older adults. There's 82 units at the Falstead that was also built in a public-private partnership with Fairfax County on land where adjacent they have a senior center.

[04:20:22] Obviously very complementary uses, so our residents are able to access services at the county senior center. The other one, Kindred Crossing, is not yet built but approved, and we're hoping to start construction on that next year.

[04:20:41] This one is 95 units. It's another faith partner, the First Christian Church of Falls Church, and again, on these sites, able to access the increased density allowable under the affordable housing bonus density.

[04:21:00] And I just wanted to also just mention that, of course, for all of these projects, in addition to the zoning tools, I know that you all are looking at opportunities and other things in your toolkit to address housing production and preservation, the co-location with public land is one that has been successful for us and for other nonprofits and for-profits that are doing affordable housing work.

[04:21:24] We co-located with a community center. There have been others built on land with libraries, as well as even firehouses in the city of Alexandria, for instance. The faith-land partnerships have been quite successful. But if we could find ways to expedite and get ahead of any comp plan inconsistencies with the faith-based public lands, that would be key.

[04:21:48] Because a lot of them are, in a lot of cases, we're finding that the zoning, underlying zoning, might be a little bit erroneously designated as public instead of this privately controlled property, as well as other developer incentives, of course.

[04:22:06] The Housing Trust Fund is key. All of our projects here that were funded through 9 percent competitive tax credits at the state level really require that Housing Trust Fund investment, local support and investment to be able to be competitive across the other jurisdictions in the pools that they compete in, as well as just to be able to fill the proverbial gap in any project, 4 percent or 9 percent.

[04:22:35] Other tools that I know folks are looking at are kind of expedited processing, reduced fees, and, of course, anything we can do around tax abatements. I know it's very challenging in the Commonwealth, but we've seen that be very successful in the District of Columbia, for instance.

[04:22:53] And I welcome any questions. Madam Chair, if I may also add, just wanted to note that all of the projects that Wesley Housing has discussed were done under the State Enabling Authority. That's under 15.2-2304, which, as you all may recall, was just discussed as part of the legislative agenda for the county.

[04:23:17] The one that we want. Anyone have any questions for our speaker? I don't see any. Thank you so very much for coming down to present to us today. Thank you.

[04:23:28] Thank you, Madam Chair and members of the board.

[04:24:08] So the overview of today's presentation, state and labeling authority, the draft ADU ordinance 101, the housing fund, types of development that are likely to result, trends in Prince William County since we adopted the conference of plan with regard to rezonings, a series of density ranges in the table, a series of scenarios for 10-acre and 100-acre hypothetical developments, major themes that we heard on June 11th, and the

[04:24:45] next steps that we're asking for, the board guidance. So the state labeling authorities these are the two that we're eligible for right now so the major differences are 2305 the locality gets to define what is affordable and 23 or 5.1 it's at 80 or two types 80 and 50 percent under 2305 there's a 17 affordable offered and for a 30 bonus density

[04:25:17] it's a it's a fixed ratio 23 or 5.1 has tables that you're all familiar with under 2305 there's no requirement to grant specific waivers and under 23 or 5.1 they may request waivers certain certain waivers so what is this this is to incentivize more affordable housing and to expand the supply of affordable housing. The current draft ordinance, who is the 50% and the

[04:25:50] 80% area median income, and how voluntary bonus densities in exchange for affordable units, and also this is a mechanism to enable the housing fund to support gap financing. So the housing fund, the big takeaways here are that it's primarily used for gap financing. That's what it's anticipated for. You have already allocated funding streams and different fiscal years for the housing fund, but the fund will actually be distributed to projects by competitive

[04:26:26] application based on a scoring matrix that's in an entirely different document. So these are the types of development. This is kind of a visual representation because of the types of development at different densities because we talk about these different densities, but this kind of shows the intensity of development at the different density ranges. So these are trends since the composite plan was actually adopted in December of 2022. So of the rezonings starting then,

[04:27:06] only 33% have requested a bonus density above the top of the range for the long-range land use, 67% came under the top of the range and didn't need a bonus density. Specifically, we've seen in transect 3 and transect 4 where the bonus densities have come in and been requested through the rezoning and then been approved by the board.

[04:27:34] And those are showing the gap between the conference hemp plan range of the density and what was granted with the rezoning and the bonus density. So the draft Affordable Dwelling Unit Ordinance only starts at one dwelling unit acre or above and only applies to residential areas.

[04:28:01] So this is a map based on the long-range land use transects that shows where the Affordable Dwelling Unit Ordinance would apply within the county. So here are the density ranges by the transects.

[04:28:20] So the base density column, that's what the long-range land use would say they'd be able to get rezone into based on the guidance from the long-range land use. So from the minimum at the 80% level goes from the minimum to the maximum in each of the long-range land uses.

[04:28:41] But you have this in front of you, so I won't read out all of these numbers. This is a table for the same thing for the 50% ranges. Same base density for each of them, actually the same minimum density for each of them 'cause it starts at 20% regardless if it's 50% or 80%.

[04:29:05] And then the only difference is in the maximum of the range. This is, those ranges calculated out with a hypothetical 10-acre development, similar to the ranges the number these are total number of units these aren't densities anymore so the total number of units at the long range land use and the comprehensive plan is in the leftmost column to compare with if bonus density came into play compare that to the minimum and

[04:29:44] the maximum at each of the transects to get to get an idea of the total number of units difference in a 10 acre development this is for 80 percent area median income table and this is the same for the 50 percent area median income table so it shows you the the range of the possible totals this graph is the same thing but instead of 10 acres it's 100 acres if it was a much bigger development so the the left column is what the rezoning according to conference plan guidance

[04:30:21] would yield, and then the two columns are, you know, comparing that to the mental, the range at 80% AMI of what you'd get at 100 acres compared to the base density. And this is the same one for the 50% AMI as well. So, and then we've mentioned this before, the themes we heard, The major themes we heard on June 11th were concerns about approval of the bonus density

[04:31:01] through the administrative process. We also heard a lot of discussion about buy-write projects and being eligible through the site plan and subdivision process. And we also discussed that whether the approved rezonings pursue bonus density or not, development may depend on other factors is the case already constructed is the construction cost and the

[04:31:34] and the different areas of risk of changing a plan that a developer has put in at what at what point and when they've gotten their financing and when they're able to make chances changes or not and what the risks are with that we also heard about school capacity and other infrastructure So when the 2040 comprehensive plan was processed, was finished and adopted, the infrastructure impacts up to the maximum of the range of the long-range land use density were already taken into account.

[04:32:12] So these bonus densities here would be incremental increases or marginal increases on that infrastructure demand from the top of the range that was already taken into account during the comprehensive plan. There are some considerations with bonus density.

[04:32:35] Even though maximum bonus density levels in the 50% and 80% AMI tables provide a zoning maximum, what we would see on the ground is likely has other factors such as financial pressures and construction costs a lot of developers like to keep construction costs to wood frame around three stories they like to use surface parking and avoid going underground and building parking structures low-income housing tax credit program projects they have a whole

[04:33:13] different set of state level requirements and metrics and measures so a more expensive construction type sometimes creates a disadvantage within that program and and the feedback we got from stakeholders was is that they would rather have it'd be more appealing to try to find a property within a transect four than to try to find in a lower transect say a two or a three and then try to ramp up with density bonuses okay so next steps with board

[04:33:52] guidance thank you so in terms of wrapping up our staff presentation again you know we we are staff is requesting that the board provide consensus direction and guidance with regards to the various elements of the draft ordinance and we have highlighted some particular topics that have come up in discussions during the previous work session as well and there's an additional one i will add so first the use of administrative process for bonus density approval we know there's been a

[04:34:30] lot of discussion and various board perspectives on that so the question is should the county adopt an affordable dwelling unit ordinance just to note both 2305 and 2305.1 the state enabling authority options that the county is under now both include administrative approvals for a bonus density another question is relates to future rezonings you may recall in the revised draft that came out in may based off of feedback that we heard from affordable housing advocates which

[04:35:05] who recommended that we include rezonings that have not been approved yet to also be eligible for this program under the ordinance so that's another question should future rezoning applications that have not been approved be eligible to use the aftu ordinance as bonus density guidance for their project currently there is bonus density guidance under the comprehensive plan but that is only for projects at 80 ami and it's only up to 20 bonus density and then there's also the question which supervisor weir has raised which is which of the two versions of the state enabling

[04:35:42] authority the board supports moving forward with 2305 or 2305.1 staff has noted in previous board sessions going back to last year a recommendation to use the enabling legislation in 2305.1 for the ordinance so a question for the board is uh which which of the two would you prefer if you wish to move forward with uh with this ordinance and then lastly i also wanted to know with regards to the housing trust fund the establishment provision in a draft ordinance

[04:36:15] is tied to 2305.1 or 2305 and so if the board decides not to move forward with creating or establishing an afdu ordinance under either of those two sections of the state code then the staff will need to look at other options for establishing the housing trust fund but just again to note that establishment of that trust fund is tied to this draft ordinance currently so with that that concludes our presentation we're happy to answer any questions and look forward to hearing the board's guidance thank you so very much um i just wanted to have a couple administrative

[04:36:52] things before we start the discussion because we're at 607 this print is very small we have a have a seven o'clock meeting I would like to move if there's no objection our closed meeting to the end until after our seven o'clock public hearing so that we have more time and we may have to move supervisors time as well and I ask board members please when you speak if you can address the topics also on the slide so that the planning department has sufficient guidance moving forward so with that first person in my queue is supervisor Bodie thank you madam chair

[04:37:28] and thank you everyone for the presentation that got us to this um so i have a question before i get to the questions i will address the questions you asked miss washington but um can you go back to the slide that was shown that has uh the map of the county and the transects and the the acreage that would apply to thank you so what one want to just highlight this because i think there's some concern from the public that this would somehow be able to be used everywhere in the county including places that are very far from transit and transportation corridors, what have you.

[04:38:03] This has a much different picture because, frankly, a lot of the transacts, a lot of the areas that are in this area are in areas that have, in most cases, large established transit corridors and transportation. So I wanted to switch that. My question goes to the next couple slides that had sort of where folks were using them.

[04:38:26] not this one three more or so after that one more actually one more one more sorry no go backwards go backward actually yes that one sorry that that one um so those are transect numbers on the bottom um and then you have the ranges and okay so essentially if i'm understanding this correctly we have had some folks utilize it on the higher end of transect three and the higher end of

[04:39:06] transect four but not the lower end of either one of those other transects correct that's correct and also uh three transects three and four are pretty much in the middle because we also have transects five and six but this and these are um rezonings that used the bonus density available through the comprehensive plan and again as you noted um they were at the transect three and transects four so appreciate that clarity so then go back to your questions at the very end yes i believe we should be adopting an affordable dwelling ordinance which does it which does include administrative process for approval however based on what you've presented and even

[04:39:43] in this presentation again it's not like this is going to be able to be done everywhere in the county it's certain areas based on what's in the long-range land use and frankly based on the size and the the acreage there so yes to number one future rezonings absolutely i think they should be able to apply to future rezons that have not been approved yet by this board and I think we should be continuing to go under 2305.1 and I don't think since I said that I don't think we need to address the last one because the last one you just added Ms. Washington deals with we if I don't believe we should adopt either one so yeah so yes to one yes to two and let's stay under 2305.1

[04:40:23] that's my 1A thank you Madam Chair. Supervisor Gordy. Just for clear I mean you've given us a question to proceed under one of those two enabling pieces of legislation, but we're also seeking to be added under 2304. So if we're seeking to be added under 2304, I certainly would like to wait for that. Given my conversations with affordable housing advocates, with developers, that seems to be the preferred route as to what would be most effective for us as a county,

[04:40:59] is to wait to get under 2304 and then adopt an ordinance under 2304. I mean, I would assume that's why we're trying to pursue being added under that. And then in terms of the, I mean, yes, we should adopt an affordable dwelling unit orders.

[04:41:20] I don't think that's a question, but it's about getting it right and making sure that we have the greatest level of flexibility to meet the needs of our community here in Prince William County. And I think 2304 gives us that greatest flexibility to be able to accomplish that.

[04:41:40] The one question I would add, you did make the statement that the housing, the trust fund is tied to the enabling legislation. Are you saying that they cannot be decoupled? we could not go ahead and pursue working an affordable housing trust fund and get that enacted without having the AFDU.

[04:42:01] I just want to get clarity on that. Thank you. I'm going to ask Housing Director Joan Duckett to answer that question. Okay, thank you. I do believe, Joanie Duckett, Office of Housing, sorry. I do believe that under the ordinance of 2304, we can move forward with the housing trust fund.

[04:42:19] If we don't go with the 2305.1 or 2305, then we have to go back to the drawing board. Okay. And Ms. Duckett, real fast while I got you there, we have some affordable unit houses that are currently for sale.

[04:42:35] They've been for sale for a year. They're not moving. And it's been brought to my attention. And just one thing I just want to put on your radar is how we as a county, as part of all this, provide awareness to those looking for housing of what's for sale in Prince William County, for those who are looking for that housing in those areas.

[04:42:59] Because the developers are sitting on houses, they're paying a lot of money, they're paying taxes, warranties are going out on appliances, and so when the house eventually gets occupied, they're not going to have those things. So whatever we can do as a county to help promote what's available, I'd love to have more of a conversation with you about how we can effectively do that and pursue that if it requires resources in order to support that.

[04:43:26] Thank you. All right, Supervisor Weir. Let me start off with a couple of questions for staff.

[04:43:43] Is the staff's position that the AFDU under 2305.1 could be only used in certain portions of the county, certain transects, or is it eligible to be used across the county in any transect, any zoning district, or any residentially zoned or comp planned area?

[04:44:03] So as noted earlier in the current draft ordinance, if you look at the eligibility section, which um again the the majority of the draft ordinance is actually reflecting the state enabling authority under 2305.1 that's what i'm looking at right the minimum requirement is a minimum of one acre and so there are parts of the county um uh certain um certain parts of the county that would not be eligible because of that so that for example the rural areas would be open to it yes okay um what do you do in a certain what would what would you what would happen in the case of let's say

[04:44:42] a rural area that has no current sewer sorry we'd just like to make a correction that rural areas would not be eligible because the minimum is more than one acre what is more minimum of what is more than one acre so the in the this is Dave McGettigan from the planning office the the requirement to participate in the affordable dwelling unit ordinance has to have a density of one dwelling unit per acre or greater so so the rural area is not um that is one unit per 10 acres absent

[04:45:20] of rezoning well the rezoning would um we see rezonings all the time not be um consistent with the comprehensive plan to rezone in the agricultural forestry areas to cr1 there's cr there's a whole bunch of cr reason are there areas in the rural area or what was previously the rural area or the or outside of that map that could accommodate the AFDU ordinance provisions.

[04:45:49] So this map reflects what the current zoning that exists for these properties. And so if there is a rezoning to a different zone, that would be a different matter. But in terms of eligibility, this map is based off of the current zoning. There are a lot of areas in there that are zoned at a much lower, at a greater density per acre.

[04:46:12] There's a lot of things that are missing, but we can take care of that at a later date. Let's assume that there are areas within the county that are not served by sewer. Will they be eligible?

[04:46:43] So any areas of the county that are not eligible for sewer would not meet the basic, the minimum requirements, the minimum eligibility criteria for this ordinance. For the state code? Yes. Are there any areas of the county that are now subject or not subject to potential sewer?

[04:47:00] I'm sorry, can you repeat your question? Is sewer precluded in any area of the county at this point in time per the new comp plan? No. So it could go anywhere with an extension of sewer as part of a rezoning.

[04:47:16] Presumably if the board approves it as a county attorney's office, is that? On one of the slides, you were talking about the density bonuses being in accordance with the comp plan. And although the density bonus is already granted, may have been in excess of what was in the comp plan, Did any of those density bonuses exceed what was allowed for in the actual underlying zoning ordinance?

[04:47:48] So those were rezoning cases that asked for bonus density, so they got the zoning that they needed for their... But they didn't exceed the actual zoning that they were asking for, correct? That's correct. They were allowed, under that zoning district, they were asking for to have those densities.

[04:48:09] So there really wasn't a density bonus above and beyond the ordinance? just because the ordinance didn't and doesn't implement the comp plan as currently written, there really wasn't an increase in density beyond what the zoning ordinance in that particular zoning district would accommodate, correct?

[04:48:28] Correct, but the zoning is usually measured, when you do a rezoning, measured against consistency with a comprehensive plan. So in these cases, they were over the comprehensive plan density, even though their zoning accommodated that.

[04:48:47] And that's a decision by the board to make as to whether they had a comp plan amendment made along with the rezoning, correct? Would you like your second tranche of time, Mr. Supervisor Rear? Madam Chair, this is a very complicated issue.

[04:49:03] And I don't want to lose track of it because I've got some issues. Can I just finish this thought and then I can come back for the second tranche? The reason I ask that is because we now have applicants coming forward with applications that are not in keeping with that past precedent, where they're asking for bonus densities above and beyond what is allowed in that particular zoning designation, and then now alleging that that is enabled by the comp plan.

[04:49:37] But we still have a comp plan that is not enabled by the zoning ordinance or a zoning ordinance that does not comport with the comp plan. take your pick um and i'll i'll leave you i'll leave it at that for the moment but i do have some other significant issues madam madam chair and i suspect this will take much longer than two tranches i i will say this too um again because we have a seven o'clock i'm gonna let this discussion go until you know 10 till so that we can all have a break and then we can also resume

[04:50:09] after um the items on our seven o'clock supervisor franklin you're next hi you're next yeah i i withdrew but I'll just make a couple of comments to some of the guidance that we need to eventually give to our staff I am also in agreement with 2305.1 because it gives us and the applicants particularly the most flexibility particularly with regards to bonus density I do understand that we want to

[04:50:46] get added to 2304 and certainly supportive of that but quite frankly I learned never to rely on any other governing body to get something done or trusted until it's actually done and so in the meantime I think we should be pursuing one of these options of course I think should be 2305.1 and I do just want to say that and this is separate from this discussion but I'm going to tie it together we have the affordable housing trust fund that's tied to the ordinance which obviously i'm supportive of but i also just want to point out that you know i am pushing for

[04:51:25] a separate program entity that can help with the immediate needs for housing assistance we have people that are going to be evicted in a couple of weeks or next month and they need immediate housing assistance and so I will also be pushing for those measures because this helps with the creation of affordable housing but we need some type of mechanism for those that are suffering from housing challenges in the moment so I think the the planning staff for your work on this I think you all have done a lot of work bending over backwards for eight members of the body

[04:52:03] and I know that we're all looking forward one way or another to getting this done and so thank you for your work and looking forward to continuing the discussion. Quickly Supervisor Franklin how do you feel should it apply to future rezonings applications under future rezonings the second one? Okay all right Supervisor Vega. Thank you Madam Chair. Tanya in regards to 2305.1 can you tell me how many other jurisdictions in the Commonwealth have adopted this ordinance

[04:52:41] specifically? Based off of our knowledge no other jurisdictions have adopted it since it became available back in I believe early 2020. Okay I think that we all agree there is no debate in regards to needing an ordinance it's just landing on which one is the appropriate one that's going to protect the taxpayers of this county and quite frankly the authority of this board and I think that my colleagues, a few of them, have raised concerns over it. It gives me great concern the fact that no other jurisdiction in the Commonwealth of Virginia is operating under 2305.1 since it

[04:53:20] was introduced in 2020. And so in accordance to that specific one, the sales and rental price for the affordable units shall be established that the owner or applicant or both shall not suffer economic loss as a result of providing the required affordable dwelling units. My question to you is what are the protections for the county in regards to that?

[04:54:07] Supervisor Reagan, can you repeat the section of the draft ordinance you just referred to?

[04:54:35] Sure. It says the sales and rental price for the affordable units shall be established that the owner or applicant or both shall not suffer economic loss as a result of providing the required affordable dwelling units. And you can correct me if I'm wrong, right? But reading this, my interpretation is in reality, there is no protection for the county. And if I'm mistaken, I'd like clarification.

[04:55:01] Well, I will say that I believe that language comes from the state enabling authority, so we did closely track that. I don't know if the county attorney has anything to add with regards to that particular question. Ms. Washington is correct. That language is required by the 2305.1.

[04:55:18] Okay, and so I guess my question, let me be a little clearer, is there specific language to protect the county and the ability of this board to vote, protect of such. Madam Chair, members of the board, if you're going to have the affordable dwelling unit ordinance, it would be staff administratively applying it. It's not coming to the board. And there lies, I guess, the biggest concern. Supervisor Weir, you mentioned in terms of density, this hasn't even passed and we've been deliberating and discussing this. I've had

[04:55:55] developers bring projects to me and stating that when I ask for a reduction in density, because again, we're looking right at negative impacts, whether it be to traffic, to schools, to the environment you name it I was told that once this passes they're going to come in because they can come in and ask for even greater density and so that's the big issue that I have is that in many ways this is arbitrary right I have yet to see county staff make a recommendation that goes against you know what the district supervisor asks even though there are concerns highlighted

[04:56:31] in the staff report county staff still goes ahead and moves with recommendation and so if the consensus on the dais is that we need an ordinance. Why don't we as a board come up with which one is the most appropriate one and not ignore the fact that it puts us in a very, I would say, dangerous situation to adopt an ordinance that has not been adopted anywhere else in the Commonwealth? Madam Chair, and that's a question for the dais, and I'm happy, you know, to hear from my colleagues, but it's concerning, and I don't mean this to be disrespectful or

[04:57:07] offensive to county staff but the fact that some of these questions are basic and there's a lot of back and forth it goes to show that our own staff is not well prepared or knowledgeable enough on this new ordinance that again hasn't been adopted in any other jurisdiction in the commonwealth and that perhaps we should go with something that we've already seen that it works to get the ball rolling to ensure that we address the needs in terms of making these homes affordable. All right I'm going to go on to supervisor angry um next i'm just going to answer the questions yes yes 2305.1

[04:57:46] and and then my question for this board is what what what are you trying to do here what like we know that we are here today because we have gone in a different direction for this county to allow more housing so if the question is you don't want to see density in certain places then let's just speak to that because we're going to start something here today uh and and miss joney ducky i you know you uh have been running the housing office i want to uh thank you for stepping up because this affordable piece has not been an issue for the county so this is very new

[04:58:22] for princeton county so we need to figure out and get started with something i like what you brought us but for this day i want to know let's just talk playing plain language here what are we talking about? Where don't you want to see density? And then let's address those issues because density is in the obstacle and density is on the east end of the county.

[04:58:45] And if we're talking about anything else that makes sense in transportation and metro and any of this, it's going to be that we need density and we need homes for people to live in. So those are my answers. Yes, yes. 2305.1.

[04:59:01] And what are our next steps? That's what I'll ask you all. Thank you. I'm actually going to go with Supervisor Bailey because she hasn't made a first round of comment before I go back to anyone else. So, Supervisor Bailey. First, let me start by thanking county staff for all the hard work going back and forth with this.

[04:59:17] We appreciate your time and your knowledge base. And this is not easy for Prince William County because it's the first time we've done this in Prince William County. And so, we don't mean to make it difficult for you. We just mean to make sure that we get it done. Joni, thank you.

[04:59:34] I think in some cases we've pushed the button with you. We've asked you to do some stuff that requires a different skill set sometimes. Did I say that right? I said it okay. And I think it's time for us to move.

[04:59:51] People want to live in Prince William County, and we need to stop dancing with this. That's my one-eighth. Yes, yes, 2305.1. We need to use our housing trust fund. We need to build our housing trust fund.

[05:00:09] One of the things that I want to know is how do we build our housing trust fund? We've had subject matter experts come in, thank you, to help us with this over three years. And we're smarter than that.

[05:00:25] We can get this done as a team. That's just kind of where I am. I'm ready to move forward with this, and I appreciate your time. Is that good, Madam Chair? That is good. Thank you. So I'm going to comment before people go into the second round.

[05:00:41] Obviously, yes, we should adopt affordable dwelling unit ordinance. We should have adopted one a long time ago. Yes, obviously, it should apply to future rezoning applications. 2305.1, that's something, I'll be honest with you, I've been teetering on because I do have concerns.

[05:01:00] You know, at the same time, I know that this has been in the works for a very long time. I know that people are eager to get started. The most important thing we need is the housing trust fund, being able to use that. When I've spoken to different advocates, that's what they keep emphasizing.

[05:01:18] I do think 2305.1 is cumbersome. I do think it's confusing, but I'm willing to continue to work on this because we're not going to vote on this until next year. So I think there is more work that can go into this. Certainly my staff will circle back after speaking to some housing applicants.

[05:01:37] I think the big thing is, yeah, I also, I will say, I am nervous about turning over our authority, you know, to the, I am nervous about the bonus density and us not having a say in it because the community doesn't mean it necessarily has a direct say.

[05:01:55] But again, we're not voting on this today. There's still work to be done, conversations to be had. i don't think that this is gonna you know result in um cabrini green anywhere in the county you know particularly in somewhere in some of the rural areas um people are nervous about this because housing has long been a fight in this county growth has long been a fight in this county and i think we need to have more conversations with the public i think we need to make sure that we're engaging people more and to be quite honest if we are able to get access

[05:02:26] to 23.04, well then, you know, we're going to take it. And this will not live very long. So I have two minutes left, but I'm not going to use them all because we're getting close to seven o'clock and I'm trying to run a tight ship. And so with that, I'm letting people go into their second round of comments and Supervisor Weir, you're up. All right, Madam Chair, I'll try and keep this brief. I mean, yes, we do need an ordinance. I don't think there's any disagreement there, but we have to get it right. And I would suggest that adopting a section of the state code that

[05:03:03] no other jurisdiction has chosen to use, no other jurisdiction has made any attempt to use to be trailblazers is probably not the right thing to do. It's telling that no other jurisdiction has adopted it. And I suspect that the reasons they haven't adopted it are many of the same reasons and concerns that I have, particularly with respect to density bonuses and whom grants or who has the authority to grant the density bonuses or proctor the program.

[05:03:32] You know, at the end of the day, the only real difference between 2305 and 2305.1, or the only significant difference, is the density bonus maximum. Under 2305, it caps at 30%. Under 2305.1, it caps at 95%.

[05:03:48] So you've got that delta of 31 to 95% that no other jurisdiction in the state has chosen to go to. If indeed densities being sought by development interests are not going to exceed 30, it seems to be the indication, then why would you go with 2305? Bearing in mind that 2305.1 is prescriptive, not permissive. Everything in here is a shall. With 2305.1, at least you know what your ultimate

[05:04:27] cap is. You don't have a cap under 2305.1 until you get to 95 percent. And I don't want to hear that, well, the industry is saying they're not going to come in, because I've heard they are. And we have no control over the density once they come in. With respect to the future rezonings, we can't make a decision, at least I don't believe we can make a decision, as to whether or not we're going to accept it for future rezonings. I'm looking at the state code right now, and we have to adopt reasonable ordinances. So if we allow it for a current rezoning but don't

[05:05:02] allow it for a future one, I believe we'll find ourselves in court yet again. It's all about expectations. I mean, I've had a lot of discussions with the development community. I've had a lot of discussions with the affordable housing community, and even the affordable housing advocates don't believe the 2305.1 is the way to go. They're not even convinced 2305 is the way to go. Everybody would prefer 2304. And since we just added that to our legislative package, why would we go through the trouble of doing that and seeking a legislative change if we're just going to adopt something else

[05:05:40] entirely anyway? I noticed in the report that the marginal impact on infrastructure has already been accommodated in the comp plan. I'll call BS on that one just flat out because at an unknown density, you have no idea what the infrastructure impacts are, particularly with respect to transportation and schools, not to mention the fire department and the police department. We're already underserviced in many areas. And telling me that the comp plan in its current form

[05:06:18] accommodates those increases in infrastructure requirements is silly. There's no way it can accommodate it because it wasn't even considered when the comp plan revisions were being drafted, at least not to the extent of development of 2305.1.

[05:06:38] And then we get into the whole issue of who gets to grant these bonus approvals or these bonus densities, and it sure as hell ain't us. It's your office and the zoning administrator. And I would suggest that everybody at this dais, whether they want to admit it or not, doesn't trust your office or the zoning administrator to grant those density bonuses because at the end of the day, we're the ones who are going to get hung out to dry on them.

[05:07:04] We're the ones that are going to get blamed. You guys aren't. But we're going to suffer the repercussions, the consequences, and having to deal with the public. At least that's mitigated to some large degree under 2305. With respect to who chose it, if I recall, if it was chosen at all by a board, it was chosen by the previous board in a meeting that was not held in this room, but in a room with crappy acoustics where you can't hear a single word that's on the tape, and I don't remember anybody giving direction on it.

[05:07:35] In fact, I believe several people were missing from that meeting. And now we're being given, essentially, an ultimatum. Which one do we pick, even though we're already looking at 2304? We need to do this, yes.

[05:07:56] We need to consider all the implications. And I'm kind of curious why, given all the money we've put into this and all the time and effort and consultant time, why we don't have dual-track proposals, given the 2305 and 2305.1 are very, very similar.

[05:08:13] Why don't we have a set to choose from? One draft ordinance based on 2305 and one ordinance based on 2305.1 rather than just giving us a single option. I appreciate that comment, and that's something that we can discuss a little bit later, but I'm going to have to move this again because we're coming up on time.

[05:08:33] Supervisor Bodie. Thank you, Madam Chair. A couple things. I'm going to try to be as brief as possible, understanding time. So for one thing, as was mentioned before, if we don't adopt either one at all, we don't get to start availing ourselves or availing the industry with the trust fund. We now have the tune of $10.5 million in that trust fund, and we currently aren't still able to use it. If we can kick the can down the road even longer, and again, as Supervisor Franklin said earlier, we have no assurance that even us putting it in our legislative agenda this year will get it passed next year at all, because it was vetoed this year, right?

[05:09:14] And so then we're going to sit here maybe two years from now, finally able to avail ourselves of the trust fund. To me, we're already behind. We shouldn't be waiting for a wish and a prayer that somehow it gets passed next year, and then we're going to have to give more time to draft the new 2304 that comes out of that, which who knows how long that's going to take.

[05:09:36] So one, we have a trust fund. Senator Franklin gave a directive for the trust fund four years ago. We're finally at the cusp of maybe being able to avail ourselves of it in months, a few months from now, maybe. But then now we're going to stop the bus again and try to go back to the drawing board. I just don't believe that's the right thing to do.

[05:09:53] Two, in terms of dual tracks and what was given to the board back in 2022, when a consultant do a study of the three lines of code, 2304, 2305, 2305.1, it's given to the board. there is a matrix I'm staring at right now that has a breakdown of the differences between them.

[05:10:13] Frankly, as much as folks on this data are trying to say that 2305 is somehow going to be a lot better, I'm not seeing that. Even when you go down to program enforcement, 2305 still says may only apply when developers seek rezoning or special exception or may apply to a site plan or subdivision plat. Looking at both ends of the spectrum still on that situation. The last thing I'll say is the reason why we haven't seen this used, 2305.1, especially in Northern Virginia, is basically every other Northern Virginia locality has access to 2304. Albemarle, Arlington, Fairfax, Loudoun, the cities of Alexandria, Fairfax, and Charlottesville. Even folks outside of us have

[05:10:53] access to 2304. If we could, we would. Everyone else that has access to either 2305 or 2304 goes to 2304. We don't. That's the reason why no one else has done 2305.1, because guess what? It was passed right before the pandemic happened. So for two and a half years, no one was doing anything around affordable housing because no one knew what was going to happen around immigration, migration patterns, transportation, all that stuff. So that's another factor to consider when this was passed versus when we're looking at it today. The last thing I'll say before I wrap up here is that everyone in the states agrees we do adopt an ordinance. That has been said, I think, by everyone

[05:11:31] here. We have an opportunity here to adopt something in a few months which will at least give us a step. Not the step we all want. We all want 2304. We've heard that loud and clear. Well, we'll show the community, show the development community, show the state that we're serious as much as we can be under the current lines of code we have access to that we want to do affordable housing right. To me, that's a better step to step onto to then advocate to the state They give us an even more flexible line of code because we're doing the best we can under what we currently have.

[05:12:04] To me, that's the right step. But for us to throw our hands back and say, oh, well, we don't have access to perfect. We might as well throw out the baby of the bathwatering, be the enemy of the good. To me, that's not an acceptable outcome based on the fact that we have a housing crisis in this county that we have not addressed yet. Thank you, Madam Chair.

[05:12:20] All right. Supervisor Franklin. Well, I will say Supervisor Bodie almost said word for word everything I was going to say. So thank you for that, because those are all incredibly important points, especially the rationale for why other jurisdictions are not under 2305.1.

[05:12:39] It's because most of them already have ordinances, and for those that don't have an ordinance, they're not working on an ordinance. So we have to make sure that we're providing full context for some of these discussions. A couple other things I would say. I know that there's concerns about ceding our authority, particularly as it relates to bonus density.

[05:12:58] And this is kind of a comment slash maybe a question, but if bonus density is the challenge that some of my colleagues are having, then let's have a conversation around bonus density and if that needs to be adjusted and if that needs to be looked at a little bit more.

[05:13:15] But quite frankly, we're still a board and we still approve projects and we still meet with applicants to say what we want and don't want in projects. And, yeah, sometimes they still bring the projects to the board, and it's up to us to vote yes or no, right? And so those are just discussions we're going to have to have.

[05:13:33] But if we're concerned about bonus density, then I think we should focus the discussion around that. But thank you, Supervisor Bodie, for those comments. I think they were incredibly important. And we've been talking about affordable housing in this county for about four or five years now.

[05:13:50] And obviously, you know, I'm itching for an ordinance. The affordable housing community is itching for an ordinance. Those that need more affordable options are itching for an ordinance. And so I'm not interested in continuing to have discussions around kicking the can down the road even further.

[05:14:06] If we can do 2304, that will be wonderful. But quite frankly, again, like I said earlier, you know, I learned a long time ago, don't wait for Congress. And what I've learned more recently, don't wait for the General Assembly. But if eight of us can make a decision to move forward and have kind of the power in our hands that we have jurisdiction authority over, then we should exercise it.

[05:14:27] Thank you. All right, Gordy, and then Vega, and then we're going to take a small research before 7 o'clock. I appreciate everything my colleagues are saying, but as someone who's been elected to help manage the growth of this county, I am not going to cede my authority that the voters have given to me to a staff member who's not accountable to our voters.

[05:14:53] I have 6,000 homes proposed for the Brentsville District. Who else has that many homes in their district being proposed right now other than Bob? So in order to manage, and oh, by the way, there is not a single school in the CIP for Western Prince William, not a single one.

[05:15:16] And so in order to manage this growth and to get it done right so that we do not make the same mistakes that we made in the 2000s, in the 90s, and in the 80s, we can do things differently. But that requires doing what we're supposed to do, and that is plan, and that's what we're hired to do.

[05:15:41] And so for me, as I'm looking at, and again, I'm talking to the developers, and every single development is going to, and this is everything from T6 transect in the Sudley Corridor to the T1B. I've got it in every single transect.

[05:15:56] So we're trying to manage this and look at this from every different aspect. And I'm the one who pushed for T6 in the comp plan. And so because I see the opportunities to create those activity centers where we can get to the type of real affordable housing that we need.

[05:16:15] But let's be honest, the developers that we're depending upon put us in this mess to begin with. They built one housing type for a decade, and that was townhouses. They built one housing type. So now every time a single-family home goes on the market, it gets bid up.

[05:16:36] And so that puts pricing pressure on every single other housing type in the market. And that's where we are. And in my district, we have 4,000 homes either proposed or approved in the last decade, and 90% of them were townhouses.

[05:16:54] Imagine going to an auto dealer and you got to choose one type of car, four-door sedan, but you need a pickup truck or you need a minivan. So for us to be able to manage this appropriately and to, so the problem I have with 2305.1 is that it becomes an administrative process, not a planning process, that we work on, we coordinate this, we deal with all the things to make sure that we can accommodate that growth as a county. And so, and the other point that I would make is, the general assembly session will

[05:17:34] be done on February 26th. We will know on that day whether it's passed. And I make myself absolute commitment to reach out to the governor and ask him to sign the bill to give us this tool to help us get to what we need. That's my commitment. And so I appreciate all the work.

[05:17:57] And in terms of the second question, the future rezonings, I'll be honest with you, Nobody's coming in for 95% density bonus. They're coming in for about a 10%. So I'm happy to live with the comp plan, with what it's doing, because that's the reality that we're dealing with anyway.

[05:18:17] No one's going to go over 20% because these guys want to make as much money as they possibly can. And so going over 20% is going to end up costing them money. And as I said it, we've got houses that have been sitting on the market for six months and are not selling that are supposed to be workforce housing units.

[05:18:41] Now, again, I believe it's a factor of marketing. We've got to be better at that. But at the same time, you know, these developers are going to stop building and they're not going to want to do this if they start losing money. So I'll leave it at that. Thank you, Madam Chair.

[05:18:57] All right, Supervisor Vega. I'm sorry, Supervisor Bailey, I'm going to get you. We're going to pick this back up, but I do want to have a small recess before we go into the 7 o'clock meeting. So Supervisor Vega. Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to be very clear that no one on this day has said that we're going to kick the can down the road. We're willing to take action. 2305 is not perfect. It's not ideal, but I think that we can all agree that that's where we can land on. And so to say that, you know, we have to go with 2305.1, that's not accurate. And let me be even more clear, because Supervisor Gordy, what you said hit the nail on the head. We don't just have a housing

[05:19:37] crises. We have an overcrowding crisis. We have an infrastructure crisis in this county, and it all stems from poor planning. The ability to give our authority to these developers so that they can come and ask for a crazy amount of density is irresponsible. And folks keep asking, why is it that things never change? 2305.1 is going to only aggravate those issues. Forget about the environment challenges that we have are we to assume that people that need affordable housing don't have a don't don't have a need for a vehicle i mean there are just so many questions right and so

[05:20:16] many concerns and i'll remind my colleagues that served with me in the first year i raise the issue that i raised in my first five minutes of speaking because i know what it's like to have projects that don't belong in my district be rammed down my throat i know what it's like i haven't forgotten and going down this road where these recommendations are going to be made by the planning office for approval. The district supervisor may be against it, but I know how the story goes and how it will end. It will pass whether the district supervisor likes it or not, because we've seen it happen time and time again. And so I remind my colleagues, there is consensus on this day is for 2305. Madam Chair, you've stated that we're not voting on anything today, but we certainly have to give the

[05:20:56] planning office direction as to which direction to take. And I would hope, I would hope that we're prudent about the decision that we're going to make while we wait and see what happens in the General Assembly come February. All right, thank you so very much. We are going to now take a nine minute break and talk meeting at 7.05. I'm gaveling us back in. All right, thank you very much. So before we get started, we have something to present to the Girl Scouts. I see you guys,

[05:21:30] I see you gals out here. So Supervisor Bailey, if you can join me down at the podium so we can do

[05:21:37] a presentation. And can we have Girl Scouts Troop 2903 and 18003 come up? We can have the girls.

[05:22:19] Okay. Okay. All right. So if you'd like to read. Wow. Okay. Okay. Okay. This is to command and recognized the Girl Scout Troop 2903 and 18003. On March 12, 1912, Juliette Gordon Lowe started Girl Scouts in Savannah, Georgia. The first troop was made up of 18 girls who all shared a sense of

[05:22:56] curiosity and a belief that they could do absolutely everything. There are now over 900 active girls in the Girl Scouts organization in Prince William and Fauquier counties. The girl organization, the older, excuse me, girl organization, POGO, has encouraged high school age girls to remain in Girl Scouts by offering more diverse activities and experiences. In 2023, the Prince William County Girl Scouts program awarded four Prince William County school graduates from the gold

[05:23:28] Award, the highest honor bestowed by the Girl Scouts organization. Troops 2903 and 1,8003 have made significant and lasting positive impacts throughout Prince William County, demonstrating exemplary commitment to community service and social responsibility. These troops have engaged in numerous service activities reflecting the values of citizenship, compassion, and dedication to the betterment of our community.

[05:24:00] The Prince William County Board of Supervisors hereby recognizes and commends Girl Scouts Troop 2903 and 18003 for their outstanding community service, selfless contributions, and commitment to making Prince William County a better place for all.

[05:24:17] Their actions reflect the highest ideals of service, compassion, and leadership. Congratulations. Good evening, Supervisor Bailey, members of the board, and guests.

[05:24:35] My name is Tammy Gentilini. I am the service unit manager for 80-4, and I'm also the Girl Scout leader for 2903. On behalf of Girl Scout Nation's capital, it is an honor and a privilege to stand before you this evening to accept this accommodation.

[05:24:53] We are deeply grateful to Supervisor Bailey for recognizing the dedication and the hard work of our girls and our exceptional leaders. Our Girl Scout Troop 2903 and 18003 have committed themselves to serving our community in meaningless ways.

[05:25:17] Just to name a few things that we have done is we support the Axe Shelter and we have also created comfort pillows for cancer patients. We also participate in Reefs Across America, and we also support and serve Northern Virginia Humane Society.

[05:25:39] And that's just a few things that the girls have done. So this honor and this award means a great deal. So on behalf of Girl Scouts, the troops, and Nation's Capital, we want to say thank you. Our Girl Scouts staff, come on up.

[05:26:03] Let's go. Everybody.

[05:26:07] Thank you so very much.

[05:27:24] And I appreciate the Girl Scouts, I used to be a member, for all that you do. We are, before I get started with public hearings, I wanted to reiterate that 14B and 14C, the applicant has requested deferral to a date uncertain.

[05:27:39] I know it says that on the agenda, but I wanted to emphasize that that is something we are not going to be covering today. So with that, I would like to open the public hearing for 14A, and that's the rezoning for Smith Crossing in the Gainesville District. Do we have anyone sign up to speak? uh good afternoon uh evening yes we do we have to sorry yes we have a presentation i'm rushing

[05:28:02] all right so sorry guys let me call down the applicant good evening i'm sherman patrick i'm

[05:28:47] with compton and dueling we're representing the stanley martin companies on this application the proposal is for a rezoning that is called smith crossing which is not coming up i almost

[05:29:25] left the office without hard copies and i thought no planner ever goes without hard copies to a meeting and I had a thought I might need the copy stand but there's no copy stand working in the back but not on the big screen okay just someone's working on it okay can you all see do you all have on your screen okay all right thank

[05:30:00] you I'm sorry I didn't know that okay so this case involves 234 acre property that is planned conservation residential the property is would have a hundred 17-acre conservation open space area and it would be proffered to be protected as natural area and this is a key part of the conservation residential concept. There are active recreational activities that are inconsistent with the type of conservation residential designation and conservation area

[05:30:35] and those are specifically proffered out in the conditional zoning. The residential development is consistent with the comprehensive plan and is within the one to two homes per acre range recommended by the plan. In addition, there's a substantial commitment to the conservation open space, and the proposal includes even additional areas set aside as common open space, as park space, and recreational areas and transitional buffering throughout the community. The exhibit

[05:31:08] that you see before you is of the layout of the proposal. And you can see that much of this area here that is currently wooded or in various states of vegetation are going to remain. And that, in fact, is 117 acres of conservation open space. We had a Planning Commission hearing on September 11th. The Planning Commission had 10 items that they wanted us, I'm sorry, seven items that they wanted us to look into further, all of those have been addressed.

[05:31:48] They're spelled out at the beginning of the staff report. I will note probably the thing that was most important at that planning commission hearing was that we have an additional community meeting, and that additional community meeting was held on October 28th, and we believe was quite successful.

[05:32:04] It gave the residents of the area an opportunity to come and ask questions and get additional information about the application directly from the applicant. Sorry, we're having a rocky road here with the, can you move me back one?

[05:32:37] Okay, all right. So this is a location map for the property. You see the Smith Crossing property outlined in yellow. It is about a quarter of a mile north from Conway Robinson Park. It shares a common boundary with Heritage Hunt of a mile in length.

[05:32:56] The property is 500 feet east of the Oak Valley development, the closest point in Oak Valley. There was, because it is and has some proximity to Manassas National Battlefield Park, a thorough archaeological study was done of the property, and there was an area here that was known as Pageland that this property is adjacent to, and there was some concern that there were two camps, small camps, during the Civil War on the property.

[05:33:30] There was an influenza outbreak. There's no record of where those bodies were buried, and so they wanted additional conditions. There are 15 to 20 people, perhaps, and so they wanted additional conditions, which are provided in the proper conditions that will require additional archaeological study of the site as the development goes forward.

[05:33:52] This is the comprehensive plan map that goes along with the property. You see the site, again, outlined in yellow. areas to the west are planned RN3 and RN2, and the area to the east is part of what we call the digital gateway. The goals of the conservation residential designation are the preservation of open space, clustered housing, variety of housing types, and permanent conservation of at least 50 percent of the open space, and this application would have over 50 percent of open space being

[05:34:27] preserved. This is an exact quotation from the comprehensive plan. Residential developments in the CR district should be characterized by compact cluster development. These areas will offer a range of housing types that are smaller than conventional rural and suburban homes and are located on smaller lots. And then you can see that the cluster development would be located in a smaller footprint within the total acreage. In this case, the footprint of the development area

[05:35:00] That is 114 acres, as juxtaposed to the 117 acres that are going to be preserved open space. The density is based on the housing chapter base density is 1.27 homes per acre, and the density on all housing types is 1.6 homes per acre.

[05:35:22] Here is a listing again of the acreages that are involved in the – this thing isn't forwarding the way that we would want it to. So the application was submitted in June of 2023.

[05:35:41] It's been under review for about 17 months. There were a total of six submittals. There are actually more than this. We've done some additional things to the proffers since the Planning Commission in response to some of the questions and concerns that they had and also in response to some things that Supervisor Weir asked us to address.

[05:35:58] The consultant analysis, just for everyone's benefit here in the audience, involves all of these documents as a part of the application. Frequently I hear people stand up and say, what about archaeology? This is to let people know that an archaeological survey was done as a part of the analysis of the property, just as a traffic impact analysis was, and all of these other items that I've listed out here. Community outreach began when the application was filed. All of the surrounding property owners within 500 feet received notice of the application.

[05:36:33] Community meetings were held with the Heritage Hunt Homeowners Association in April and May. Also, prior to the Planning Commission, written notices were sent again. The property was posted. There was the additional community meeting that I've already mentioned. And then there was written notice as well as posting of the property prior to this hearing.

[05:36:53] State and county agency reviewers have looked at this. There are 20 different agencies who have reviewed it. Most of them have reviewed it each time it was resubmitted. But there has been a very robust and thorough review of the proposal. This is the layout for the land use plan of the property.

[05:37:11] The property is broken down into four land bays. Land bay A, that is right in the center, is the location of villa-style homes. The villa-style homes are technically a single-family attached type unit, but near the end of the presentation, I'll show you what those look like.

[05:37:30] They are very much like single-family dwellings, detached, and they, we call it live like single-family detached homes because of the architecture. The two stories high and they're very wide types of units. Land Bay B is the village house. That's a smaller single-family dwelling property. And then Land Bay C is the cluster housing type and would be the largest size home and lots in the community.

[05:37:58] This is the transportation improvement plan that goes along with the property. You see the purple line going across the screen there. That is a new road that's being constructed.

[05:38:14] It's a realignment of Artemis Road. Artemis Road today is a gravel road. It has a number of curves in it, and the width, obviously the surfacing, the drainage, none of those things comply with the VDOT, the Virginia Department of Highways, requirements for road design.

[05:38:35] And so the road is being replaced for a little over a quarter of a mile from the point that you see to the east of the Smith Crossing proposal and all the way out to Cat Harpen Road. One of the other elements of the road that does not meet standards is where it intersects today with Cat Harpen Road.

[05:38:59] This is old Artemis Road or existing Artemis Road. And you can see that it comes into Cat Harpen Road at an angle. and VDOT would now require that road to come in at a perpendicular. Also, it is very close to Thornton Road, and the access management standards would require the road to be separated further from that intersection.

[05:39:20] The two intersections are simply too close to one another. So the new alignment of Artemis Road solves a lot of problems. Some of the existing safety issues associated with old Artemis Road, Some of the quality of transportation network that's hampered by the old road.

[05:39:39] And the new road would be a paved road. It would have sidewalk, curb, and gutter along its length. And then also you see to the left of this slide an aerial photograph with improvements drawn in that would show you the improvements that would go along with Cat Harpen Road, Artemis Road, New Artemis Road intersection.

[05:39:58] And there would be right and left turn lanes constructed there. Something that was discussed at the community meeting was a lot of people said, well, will there be a traffic signal? The answer to that is that under the current standards, VDOT will not allow a traffic standard there.

[05:40:15] They have a thing they call their warrant analysis. And under the warrant analysis, it does not meet requirements for a traffic signal because of the volumes that are there. There was some question also about the crosswalk. Similar to the signal warrant analysis, you have to do a crosswalk warrant analysis.

[05:40:33] Now, we anticipate that there will be a crosswalk somewhere. We don't know exactly where BDOT will approve it, but there is a trail that is coming along Cat Harpin Creek today and comes down and intersects with a trail that runs along the west side of Cat Harpin Road, and we want to tap into that with this trail that passes through the property.

[05:40:55] And I'll explain more about the relevance of that trail, but it's called the Cat Harpin Greenway, and we have a better exhibit it further in. The amenity network, we call it, that's the open spaces that are within the cluster development area, includes 10 acres of pocket parks and playgrounds and picnic areas and community garden areas.

[05:41:19] And these are all for the benefit of the residents of the community. There are additional areas that go beyond that 10 acres that are transitional areas along the property lines and buffers along the roads and the like. The compass rezoning is over here, and I mentioned before that there is some proffered conditions associated with this, and I have another slide that will show that in more detail, and this is that slide.

[05:41:50] So here we have existing Artemis Road. Actually, it goes to the right, and this would be new Artemis Road in this area. Here are the proposed homes in the land bays in Smith Crossing that are closest to the property here that's been rezoned for a data center.

[05:42:11] There is a 50-foot buffer being provided as a part of this rezoning. Also as a part of this rezoning, the dwellings along this boundary would have sound attenuating doors and windows to help dampen any sounds that are coming from the data center site.

[05:42:28] The data center site itself has a 50-foot buffer. Then it has an additional 50-foot landscape area for all intents and purposes. It's an additional buffer. And then it has this limits of clearing and grading that you see here outlined in brown, cloud-like fashion.

[05:42:45] And also, there's this intersection here that's drawn in. So this would be a driveway into the site. And since you're all familiar with the design of data centers, you know that they always have a road that comes in and goes around the unit. So the data center buildings themselves were actually back in this area, and they could be easily 200 feet away.

[05:43:02] There are some additional environmental areas here and down here and down here that also provide additional setbacks. And then on top of all of that, there's a data center study group that is out there working to figure out how to make sure that data centers in the future do not have the negative impacts on neighboring properties that they have in the example in the city of Manassas.

[05:43:25] The open space systems are interconnected by trails and sidewalks so that they're easy to access. These are walking distance rings that show the proximity of different open spaces to the residents in the future.

[05:43:47] And I mentioned before the Cat Harping Greenway. This is the Cat Harping Greenway concept map that was prepared by the Parks Department. Smith Crossing is way down here in the corner, but I use their exhibit because here is the Cat Harping Greenway that has been built in this subdivision.

[05:44:06] There's another leg of it that is planned to go to the northwest and eventually connect with James Long Regional Park, and then that could go even further over to Silver Lake at some future point. But the goal in going toward the east is to connect to Conway Robinson State Park.

[05:44:22] And right now you see that there's a dashed red line that goes into Heritage Hunt, and the concept and thought was that that part of the Cat Harping Greenway would be located in Heritage Hunt, but there are no funds to build that, and they don't have the right-of-way to go through Heritage Hunt.

[05:44:41] And so the applicant in this case, Stanley Martin Homes, is going to build that section of the trail that I pointed out earlier that will become a part of the Cat Harping Greenway concept plant map. Our street network we've looked at before, so I'm going to keep moving on that one.

[05:45:05] This exhibit is to start to give you some sense of the kind of place that they're trying to create. Communities with identity frequently have a need to locate and identify accesses to things like the trailhead and to community features.

[05:45:24] Certainly the gateway coming into the community is always important, but also this will include park areas where there is seating and picnic areas throughout the community. This would be a landscape overview. It's showing the locations of landscaping and buffering.

[05:45:41] You can see a park area, a preserved vegetated area up here. We, of course, have all of this land bay D that is going to be the conservation preservation area. You see outlined here a resource protection area, and Stanley Martin is going to restore that area.

[05:46:03] There was some fill on the property associated with the former agricultural use of the site, And they encroached on this RPA, and this is going to be restored with the development of Smith Crossing. Landscaping and street tree typicals.

[05:46:22] This is a better exhibit to talk about the RPA that I was mentioning. Here's restoration area. All of this hatched area, these diagonal hatchings, are showing the locations of some of that fill that I mentioned got on the property as a part of the agricultural practice.

[05:46:39] That area where it encroaches on RPAs and floodplains, and you can see them scattered down in little spots in these areas, are going to be restored. This area in the middle would be, it's not encroaching on an RPA, it's not encroaching on a floodplain.

[05:46:55] And so the better way to handle it so that it has less impact is to cover it with a topsoil. So there'll be topsoil added to the top of it. It'll be planted with pollinator meadow type seed plantings.

[05:47:11] And in addition to that, it will be revegetated with 450 bare root stock tree plantings, tree seedlings, per acre throughout the entire area. This was the amount of treed area was something that came up at the Planning Commission.

[05:47:30] and Supervisor Weir asked Stanley Martin to increase the number of tree seedlings being planted from 100 per acre to 450 acres, and that is included in the proper conditions that have been executed by the applicant. Also at the Planning Commission meeting, there was discussion about a wooded area up here, and Stanley Martin has carved out this area and created another community park area so that they could save some of that space in that wooded area.

[05:48:02] Here we have some examples of the community open spaces. This particular item is the central park area within the community. Here we have the community garden and the clubhouse.

[05:48:22] The clubhouse will be a minimum of 3,000 square feet in area, and the swimming pool that's being proposed is a 25-meter pool. In addition to that, there will be some hard surface playing courts and other amenities in this vicinity for the residents of the community.

[05:48:40] This is a pocket park within the community, and we have the community park that I mentioned before. So this view, I'm not sure how it's showing pretty well there.

[05:49:00] It doesn't show very well on this monitor. It gives you a closer look at the trail system that's being proposed. So the trail system would cross Cat Harpin Road, we believe here near the intersection, And then work its way through the community and along the, there'd be a natural trail that would follow the Greenway, Cat Harpin Greenway.

[05:49:24] This is Cat Harpin Creek right here. And then there would be connections to that through the natural area in these areas. This, again, is a highlighting of some of that fill area associated with the agriculture that is being replanted with 450 tree seedlings per acre.

[05:49:44] This is a rendering of the villas. So we have the villa layout here with the park that you saw in the earlier slide, and down here is the swimming pool and clubhouse area.

[05:50:01] The villa itself, they're the two-story units that I described at the very beginning of the conversation. They look a lot like single-family dwellings without side yards, single-family detached dwellings without side yards. There is an exception, and this is an improvement that came, again, from Supervisor Weir's office, Where there are two affordable dwelling units here that are placed side by side but architecturally they've been Crafted in a way so that it looks like that's one unit because one of the things that we want to avoid with the Implementation of the affordable dwelling unit strategies is we don't want the affordable dwelling units to stand out

[05:50:38] We don't want everybody on the street to say oh, that's the affordable house. So this fits in very well It looks like one unit, but it's actually two units. That's why you see these two doors here and then this is two units over here. This is an example of what the village house architecture would look like. There will be a good deal of variation in the units and then the next view is of the cluster house type design and the the unit designs can change or vary quite a bit depending on the desires of the

[05:51:16] individual purchasers. And so with that we have a few more slides that I could go through or i can use i think i will use them for reference rather than to continue the presentation at this time but if you have any questions for me i'd be happy to try to answer them at this point or if you want to move into other areas we can uh wait and then all right so we're definitely going to take questions if we have any so board members jump in the queue but i just want to say i see a lot of young folks i see a lot of new faces in the audience thank you guys for coming

[05:51:50] you know um unfortunately um we y'all came during the evening session we have a certain order we have to do the land use cases first and this is going to be long no offense to the applicant they don't hear this it's going to be kind of dry so i have my chief of staff virginia douglas stand up virginia if you guys would like to set up a meeting with my office so that we can go in depth about your issues and figure out a resolution that might be better because it's a school night and this is is going to go late so if you guys want you can go up i'm sorry yes really because we have to take

[05:52:27] up all the stuff we did earlier we're going back to addu we're going to do um they're not gonna do it's up to you guys if y'all want to hang out y'all can hang out if you want to meet with my

[05:52:42] chief of staff you could do both you know i cannot bump it okay okay yes so you can you know go um If you want to step out for a second and get her card and get her information.

[05:53:22] Okay. All right. Madam Chair, would you entertain a motion to amend the agenda to put their presentation shortly or their issues immediately after the Smith Crossing application? Well, yes. We're going to go back to public comment time and then what we left earlier. So it's up to y'all.

[05:53:41] No, it's not. We're going to do this, and then we go to public comment time. But the public hearing is going to take time because we have the applicant. We're going to have questions from the applicant. We're going to have planning staff do a presentation, take questions from them. Then we open it to public comment time for people who want to speak directly to this item in person and remote.

[05:53:59] Then we close and then we take a vote. We discuss or we vote. We do a motion. We discuss. We take a vote. And then when all that's done, we get to you. So I don't know how long that was taking. I just wanted to give you guys that option. Okay.

[05:54:16] But I would go right now while Virginia's here and get that card. All right. I'm so sorry about that, Sherman. Did anyone have any questions on this for the applicant? Oh, wow. Okay. All right. Thank you. Treasure this day because it may never happen again.

[05:54:33] All right. Planning. Good evening, Chair Jefferson, Supervisors.

[05:55:00] My name is Alex Venegas from the Planning Office, and I'll be presenting this case. This case, the case planner is Vanessa Watson. She did a wonderful job working with the applicant to get us a much better product than the original application.

[05:55:18] So this is a request to rezone property from A1 Agricultural to PMR, planned mixed residential. It includes several waivers and modifications. They're requesting to be allowed to develop 375 units, single family attached and detached.

[05:55:40] The general location is to the west. We have Kethartman Road. We have Heritage Hunt over here, and then Artemis to the east. Staff is recommending approval for this application. In the long-range land use, the classification for this property is CRES, Conservation Residential 1C, which allows up to two dwelling units per acre.

[05:56:10] Around it, we have RN2. We have parks and open space. We do have an area of environmental resource protection overlay. And then, as Mr. Patrick alluded to, over here we have I-3, which is related to the Compass and Digital Gateways projects.

[05:56:31] For the zoning district, it's A-1. Heritage Hunt is PMR. The SR-1 is Heritage Farms. And then we have the reserves at Fallen Oaks up here. So, from the standpoint of staff, the proposed density and development is consistent with the long-range land use.

[05:57:01] Some of the criteria for the CRES1C is single-family residential, target density is two dwelling units per acre, open space is 50%, not 30%. The residential cluster development concentrates development on a limited footprint, is what we saw in the layout, where you have the density more compact, which allows opportunity for more open space.

[05:57:32] Smith Crossing is proposing a density of 1.3 to 1.6 dwelling units per acre. That includes affordable dwelling units and offers more than 50% open space. And the applicant shall convey the natural area preserve acreage, which is approximately 117.39 acres, to the homeowners association once it's established.

[05:57:56] The school's division did look at this application, and the impact statement indicates that the school board is not opposed to this application. As part of the application, the applicant is offering trails, as Mr. Patrick went through, as an extension of the Kedhartan Creek Greenway.

[05:58:22] They've made a commitment to affordable dwelling units, split at 5% from 80 and below, and then another 5% up to 120% of the AMI. They're also offering electrical car chargings stations with each one of the units as an option to the homebuyers.

[05:58:48] In addition, for the properties that are adjacent to the proposed data center area, they are providing sound attenuating design as an option in the contract. for any new dwelling unit that's within 100 feet of the adjoining property area that's zoned PM PBD. There is a Civil War cemetery study that the applicant has proffered to,

[05:59:22] and it will, the proffer includes a condition where, or a proffer where the Our county archaeologists will review and look at the scoping for that. The applicant did meet on several occasions with the community as well as the district supervisor's office.

[05:59:44] Both planning commissioners, Dr. Liver at the time, as well as Commissioner Ross. And met twice with the Heritage Hunt community HOA. Since the planning commission public hearing, they did conduct a community outreach meeting as requested by the planning commission at bull run middle school on october 28th and they did make some additional revisions to their proffers to address concerns that they heard from the planning commission fire and rescue there were some issues that it one it was outside of the four

[06:00:22] minute travel area the station workload associated with station four in gainesville currently exceeds the capacity so the applicant in their recent proffer has submitted a monetary contribution of five hundred dollars per unit to be paid for each unit during after receiving occupancy permit planning staff's recommendation and the recommendation of the planning commission is to approve this uh application uh with the uh proffers dated october 1st 2024

[06:01:01] and we will gladly take any questions supervisor weir thank you madam chair i have questions for both the applicant and staff but i'll start off with you i've got one question for you alex yes sir um when considering the school enrollment impacts were the numbers of students generated by other applications currently approved yet unbuilt or currently in the pipeline factored in or was

[06:01:38] this done as usual by the school board in a vacuum and considered only been in and of itself so uh the process uh the school's uh division uh their staff no longer goes through the to get approval through the school board they analyze it they uh the way it was described to me is that um what they do is they look at all approved and then anything else that we're presenting at the time. They do not look at future applications that haven't gone before the public body or that are going to the public body to look at that as

[06:02:18] part of their analysis. They just look at the approved rezonings as well as the application that's at hand. To follow up on that, when's the last time we did a a build-out analysis um i think 2021 was the last yeah we're currently updating it now so it's currently three years out of date and absent the current building building forecast how how do they come up with an accurate justification of how many students i mean it's a rhetorical question

[06:02:50] okay um a couple of quick questions for the applicant have the proffers been amended or have you taken care of the additional landscaping issues with the neighboring property on the north side post staff analysis or staff report in the for the Kevin Smith property correct the proffers haven't been amended as they had already been circulated for signature when that issue came up but we're happy to commit to do

[06:03:28] so and recirculate the profits for signatures can you articulate what we're doing yeah the on the plan as briefly sure with this property owner he had some concerns about tree plantings it's a little bit of a struggle to put them here on these lots so we're going to add supplemental plannings here in this area that's open space and then on his property should he allow us to do so uh buffer plannings back there also you're committed to doing that yes absolutely uh last question um you know my issue with afdu

[06:04:02] uh what is your offering period is that is that in the october 1 24 proffers yes your period it should state as agreed that it would start at the uh start at occupancy of the unit yes all right that's all i've got senior advisor vega thank you madam chair um i guess doesn't matter which one of the two can you talk to me a little bit about um the challenges i guess or the reason why we can't formally place the open um space area into a real conservation easement we've received a handful of emails and so just kind of curious as to what the deal really is in regards

[06:04:41] to that so we met with the land trust uh to discuss the project and they actually gave us of parameters of which they would be willing to accept it, a conservation trust over the property, they ask that we not engage them or we not formalize it until after the rezoning because they don't want candidly developers using their group as a way to get rezonings approved.

[06:05:13] So we've set up in the propers that we would use our best efforts to get the property into trust with the HOA would own the property, but the trust would have the deed of trust over it for the conservation. And I guess that's where the issue stems from, right, that the HOA is involved.

[06:05:33] I think you're pretty familiar with Doves Landing and the success that we had in my district to actually put Doves Landing into a real conservation easement. Yes. And so when you say that you've been speaking to folks, who exactly are you engaging in terms of land trust? So we were using the same group that we've used on other projects actually adjacent to Dove's Landing.

[06:05:55] Okay. Can you give me a name? They prefer that I not. But do you understand how this looks and the unsettling feeling that the community has in terms of guarantees that this is actually going to remain open space and that it's not going to be developed in the future? Indeed. So it's in a oh it's an open space zoned it's owned by the HOA the concern is that the county doesn't want to own it because they don't want to maintain it my understanding the HOA is happy to have it but people get concerned about the HOA actually maintaining ownership because not today but what happens in 15 years you know that HOA starts making decisions that are counter to what we're

[06:06:33] doing here tonight that becomes problematic so I think it's in everybody's benefit to get it into a conservation trust so yes we've committed to that in the proffers uh thank you and then in regards to the uh i appreciate it's 117 acres um that has been classified as open space is that correct correct and while i appreciate that um during the presentation uh sherman was talking about what all is going to be put there um and whatnot i assume that this was in consultation with the county arborist just to make sure that we're um in par with what's required in terms of percent of native plants and so forth with regard to native plants and absolutely and in fact there

[06:07:13] were some areas uh i'm gonna see if i can find the slide uh this area which sherman mentioned was filled we actually worked pretty extensively with the county arborist to determine how to treat that area to get it first to a pollinator garden and then convert it to uh forest with a reforestation plan so that was all done with the county arborist okay that's all i have madam chair for now thank all right thank you so much and I just want to quickly mention we're going to vote on this later tonight amending our meeting calendar for a joint meeting with the school board and one things we're going to discuss with school board

[06:07:46] is their CPI process CIP I'm sorry CIP process and also what their enrollment looks like because of some areas and some schools they are seeing fewer students with that thank you so very much if we don't have any more questions um i am going to go ahead and open the public hearing and let me get those sheets all

[06:08:25] right looks like we have one person signed up to speak in person that's margarita moylan and i know you know the drill but if you can just say your name where you reside you have three minutes to speak my name is margarita moylan of the gainesville district i live in the oak valley neighborhood which is right off of cat harpen road across from the proposed smith crossing project

[06:08:59] Cat Harpen is a two-lane country road and cannot handle the added number of cars that a project of this size would bring. It is a very dangerous road. Just a few months ago, there was a terrible accident right at the entrance of my neighborhood, and within the last year, there's been at least one fatality on Cat Harpen Road.

[06:09:21] My neighbor was also involved in an accident which left him severely handicapped with years of rehab. I do believe his injuries contributed to his untimely death. Adding 375 homes that would likely have two drivers per residence would stress an already stressed road.

[06:09:39] My other concern is that this project is with Stanley Martin, and we have all seen the playbook in the past. They apply and are approved for a housing project, only to flip it to a data center project. Devlin Technology Park is one example.

[06:09:59] In the past, they stated that nobody would want to buy homes next to data centers. Yet this project is being planned next to what is currently slated to be the largest data center complex in the world. Also, this project's land being set aside for conservation easement is already riddled with problems.

[06:10:22] For years, the landowner was dumping fill dirt onto the property illegally and then confronted, claimed he was doing it to farm the land. The land is unstable and can't be built on. I do believe that the county should defer this project until further studies can be done.

[06:10:43] I would also ask that each and every one of you who are voting on this, please drive on Cat Harpin so you better understand the impact this project would have and can see for yourselves how dangerous this road is. Thank you.

[06:11:01] Thank you. We do not in the audience. I'm so sorry, y'all. But we have to kind of keep it quiet. I also have to keep the meeting moving so y'all can speak at a good time. now do we have anyone signed up to speak all right i'm going to turn it over to um supervisor bode thank you madam chair chris can we please begin oh yeah so good evening uh we have our first

[06:11:28] speaker tonight uh which is going to be miss rachel groves uh so it's rachel ellis um also that's okay um also there is someone else trying to log into the meeting so if you want to check the Zoom, I guess, entrance. Rachel Ellis, Gainesville District. I applaud the developer for

[06:12:01] the mix of housing. I will say that up front. However, I've got lots of issues with this problem or with this project. Data centers don't belong next to housing, and housing doesn't belong next to data centers. You can't do anything to make me think otherwise. I have a problem that I went to the open house and there's that section A, which is the top part. And I said, why can't, that's where all the trees are going to be cut down, like acres of trees. And I'm like, why can't

[06:12:38] that be moved down here in that open space? And that's the filled dirt area. So they can't build there. So instead they're cutting down trees. And I just want to say like a baby tree can collect 5.9 kilograms of carbon dioxide per year. A 10-year-old tree can collect 22 kilograms of carbon dioxide per year. So put that in perspective when you're building a massive data center campus next to homes. In my opinion, this isn't real conservation residential. We're trading rural

[06:13:17] preservation for density. And Cat Harpin Road is from that area north towards 234. That road is not meant for this many, this many cars on it. I still have, you know, I asked Mr. Young at the meeting about HOA fees. Again, you have affordable housing mixed in. How does the HOA fees impact them? Like, is there different than everybody else? There's a pool, there's, there's questions.

[06:13:51] he didn't have an answer. Maybe he has an answer tonight. Is there a different HOA fee for the affordable housing families? Yeah, that's all I have for you. It just is icky to me.

[06:14:10] It's icky. That's all I can say. I have a really hard time with this one. Again, I applaud the mix of housing. I'll give him credit for that. That's all I got for you guys. Thank you very much. Thank you, Ms. Ellis. Next speaker, please. Yes, our second speaker is going to be Ms. Jessica Groves.

[06:14:30] Good evening, Chair Jefferson and board members. I appreciate the time tonight to speak on this project. I'd like to voice my concerns about Smith's Crossing.

[06:14:47] My main concern is sprawl. I understand Prince William County needs more housing, but this is too much density for the land that you've selected.

[06:15:05] To add 300 homes to a two-lane road will prove detrimental to safety. When you add that much more traffic to Cat Harpen Road for a rush hour at the end of Cat Harpen and 234, it'll be dangerous. It'll be dangerous for everybody on 234 and the residents that live there now and to be residents.

[06:15:27] This is high-density housing being put next to farms and houses on 10-acre lots. It's not compatible. It's not compatible. And if Digital Gateway does go in, it's not compatible with data centers either. And if Digital Gateway does go in, upgraded windows are a joke, a serious joke.

[06:15:51] I'm also really disappointed at the amount of old growth trees that are going to be cut down so that a former dumping site can be reseeded for preservation. That is not preservation. It's disappointing that this was even brought to the board.

[06:16:10] It's a disgusting project, and it's probably going to go through, and I understand that we need housing, but the western end of the county is going to feel impacts from this. So, thank you very much.

[06:16:28] Thank you, Ms. Crow. Next speaker, please. Yes, third speaker is Ms. Laura Harder. Hello, Chair Jefferson and Board of County Supervisors.

[06:16:43] It's great to talk with you this evening. My name is Laura Harders. I live in the Gainesville District, and I know you've seen me before in person. and virtually speaking on data center projects and some different planning problems that are happening, especially on the western side of the county. So I just wanted to make sure I checked in and let you know that I do have concerns about this project for Smith Crossing. It is the first conservation residential project that you'll be approving since that designation was

[06:17:22] instated. I'm concerned about the pollinator garden and reforestation and not being natural open space and really falling away from the original intent of conservation residential. During the planning commission meeting, I was shocked to hear the Stanley Martin representative actually claim that this project was goodwill by Stanley Martin to prevent more data centers from being built. But really what it feels like is high-density housing being crammed right by the Prince William Digital Gateway, which is going to be the world's largest data center

[06:18:00] corridor. So it really doesn't make a lot of sense. I ask you to please defer. Forcing sprawl in rural areas of western Prince William County is not good planning. I ask you to please defer because this will also put additional strains on our roads, our schools, and there'll be other ramifications um and i also i noticed some of those people in the crowd i wanted to say hi i think that's occoquan swimming um that is a great group um they do a lot for swimmers and athletes and they are the top in prince william county in my opinion for year-round swimming so

[06:18:37] it's great to see them i hope they get to speak later during public comment time and yeah that's it i hope you all have a good evening thank you thank you miss harters next speaker please yes our fourth and final speaker is Ms. Vida Carroll. Good evening. Vida Carroll here, Brentsville.

[06:18:59] First off, I want to thank Supervisor Vega for asking, well, only two. Thank you, Supervisors. We are in Vega for asking questions for the first half of the night. But I want to thank Supervisor Vega, especially for her question, because that's exactly the same question and concern i have with this project um what are we doing with this conservation area and the intent of conservation residential as stated by the applicant himself tonight includes preserving

[06:19:31] the county's open space and that was the intent of it when it was adopted by our comp plan in december 2022 which i mean y'all know i was at that meeting as well um and i feel this is the conservation residential project y'all are voting on and i just i i need i really wish this one was done right i because my main hang up on this project is not the housing um or any of kind of the add-ons it's it's the conservation residential portion of it what land are they conserving this

[06:20:07] stanley martin is conserving an old dirt dumping ground and they are clear cutting trees to put in housing while they conserve land that has already been completely destroyed because it is cheaper for them to plant some trees on old filter than to build homes there. And it's cheaper for them to clear cut trees than to actually conserve it. And I also have serious concerns about this land being permanently placed in a true conservation easement with a true third-party landholder.

[06:20:33] Not just you're going to try, this should be a proffer, something proffered in before you get building permits, that this land has to be in a true conservation easement, not held by the HOA, not held by some landholder, not held by Stanley Martin. And if we allow this to be kind of waived and done in a squishy manner, what does it mean for conservation residential cases down the line?

[06:21:00] It is not true conservation. It is not truly permanently holding that land for public access, for public use, it's holding it by an HOA, which, I mean, 15 years down the line, they can flip it in a proffer amendment, as I'm seeing proffer amendments left and right on all kinds of rezonings lately. So I have real concerns about just getting conservation residential right, and this county should be dictating what it is, not the applicant dictating what conservation residential is. The county should be saying, this is what we want it to look like, and this is what the applications need to come in with if that's a third-party conservation trust holding the land

[06:21:39] then that should be in the proffers concretely not squishy not flaky um and yeah so i think it needs to be deferred it needs more work it needs to be cleaned up we need to do this right um because it's going to set precedent for a lot of other cases so please defer thanks thank you miss carroll thank you mr graves back to you madam chair all right thank you so very much this now concludes our public hearing on item 14a i would like to i'm looking at you supervisor

[06:22:13] rare i'd like to entertain a motion madam chair uh pretty quickly yes i will make a motion it's in here it'll take me a minute to get there um i'm going to try and keep this very very brief and i want to i want everybody to know this is not directed at the applicant you know it's unfortunate that this is the first conservation residential rezoning that this board is going to handle that the county has handled because quite frankly there's conservation residential has very little to do with conservation simply because it's in the title of the zoning district

[06:22:51] it's nothing but window dressing to provide cover for poor planning practices adopted as part of the last comp plan and seemingly doled out in many cases some of the previous board's most favored members of the community you know it is rather ironic that here we are getting ready to adopt an application for a rezoning to put houses next to an approved data center instead of a data center next to a house. I'm kind of having, I have a problem with that. However, it does sort of underscore the flawed nature of the past comp plan when we're doing exactly the inverse of what we

[06:23:25] swore we weren't going to do. That being said, you know, I don't have a whole lot of choice on this one. I'm not in the, not in the habit of putting the, putting the board in a position where it would be facing litigation for turning down a rezoning application that is in accordance with the comp plan, regardless of how flawed the comp plan is.

[06:23:51] I have to live with it, and quite frankly, I've polished this, fill in the blank, about as much as I can. And I would like to thank the applicant for working with my office and, quite frankly, doing more than any other developer has ever done with my office, essentially acceding to my demands, or, excuse me, requests.

[06:24:10] so i will grudgingly move um rezoning 2024 stroke 00005 smith crossing subject to the proffers dated 10-1-24 second all right um we're for discussion if anyone has anything they want to say on the project please oh wow no one has anything you know you want to

[06:24:42] i mean it's just a quick question are you all going to disclose this to the homeowners about the data center okay i think we're good let's take a vote vote unanimous all right thinking about the kids all right so we are on to public comment time this is going to be your time to shine

[06:25:18] our clerk of the court andre madden's going to go get clerk of the board whatever y'all i'm coming back from medical leave y'all see i got my little walking stick this is smoother than i thought it would be maybe later i don't want any witnesses all right and i will i'm sure none of you has come up and these are the previous one i don't think any of you guys have spoken before the board

[06:25:58] before so what i'm going to do is i'm going to call you up five at a time you're going to say your name and the magisterial district where you live i don't need your home address unless you want to show up and knock on your door there is going to be a timer you have three minutes at the end of the three minutes i cut you off um because i want to make sure that we're getting everyone who wants to speak so the first group of people steve amato matthew mash and you're going to speak at the microphone back there. Kelly Call, Samantha Alger. This one's a little

[06:26:35] hard. Lindstrom. Sir Lindstrom. I'm sorry, what? Lincoln? Layton? Okay. Yeah. You go up there.

[06:26:53] So that's the first group of speakers. All right, Mr. Amato. Thanks, kids. Just bear with me. Well, go quick. Good evening, supervisors and Madam Chair. Appreciate the time to comment. I just want to provide some observations on the affordable housing unit ordinance that's been in development.

[06:27:20] I've monitored and I've attended presentations in person and virtually, including today, and it started back in March 2024. I've also participated in one of the public feedback sessions that the planning office hosted back in April.

[06:27:36] And I provide these observations and comments for thought and possibly implementation into this initiative. So what exactly is the initiative? Is it to institute this ordinance and a housing trust fund?

[06:27:57] So I think that has to be very well defined so that the public understands this. Strategically, what I do not see as the planning office goes through this endeavor, which I give them a lot of credit and a lot of kudos for their work, what is the strategic application? And what is missing is there's nothing that addresses what are the factors causing housing to be unaffordable. Lately and in today's 2025 Prince William County

[06:28:31] legislative agenda, I do not see anything where it asks to meet with our state legislators, or federal legislators to address the factors that have contributed over the past four years to having housing unaffordable. Those factors are high inflation, high mortgage rates. You have high insurance, housing insurance, whether you're a property owner or a renter. You have high energy

[06:29:02] costs, property tax levied by the county, personal property tax. These are all factors that need to be addressed and it's not in the legislative agenda. It is not being addressed to get an attack at that problem. Whereas the housing trust fund to me seems like we're throwing money to solve a problem. We need to solve the issues that are contributing to this. Now, if this is implemented as housing trust fund, it's going to be 10 to 12 more FTEs, permanent FTEs that has to

[06:29:38] be budgeted forever. And another thing that I'm not a fan of is what I've heard from several supervisors of a housing assistance fund, because now we are redistributing the equity of the citizens of Prince William County to other citizens. And to me, that is a no-go. So these are just some of my observations. I put them out there, and I will plan to continue to see how this progresses, this initiative through the county. If I can be any of assistance, I would offer my

[06:30:12] help in that endeavor. Thank you. Thank you. Next speaker. Hi, I'm Matthew Mast. I live in the Occoquan district. I'm a coach with Occoquan swimming. Thank you for the opportunity to speak tonight. Our program serves over a thousand residents across the same county, reaching families in every district. Swimming isn't just a sport for these athletes. It's a tool for personal growth. It teaches life skills like discipline, perseverance, and teamwork, and it provides our youth with a healthy outlet to build confidence and resilience. As a coach, I've seen

[06:30:50] firsthand how impactful these lessons are both in and out of the pool. However, providing these opportunities isn't always easy. Despite serving so many county residents, working with county staff to utilize existing facilities like Veterans Park has been an uphill battle. Right now, all we're asking for is the chance to rent lanes at a time when the pool isn't otherwise being used. It's a small request, but it would have an enormous impact, not just for our swimmers today, but for future generations. Long course training is essential for competitive swimmers. It's a standard used in major competitions like the Olympics. Olympics only happen in 50-meter pools.

[06:31:25] Training in 50-meter pools helps athletes prepare not just physically, but mentally. Imagine spending the entire season training in a 25-yard pool, only to show up in the competition that's completely different in format. It's daunting and can shake even the most confident an athlete. Access to a long course pool like the one at Veterans Park allows our swimmers to step on the blocks feeling prepared, confident, and ready to compete at their best. Beyond the benefits to athletes, this initiative also makes sense financially. Rinsing out unused lanes during dead times creates an opportunity for cost recovery. We're willing to pay our fair share of rental fees to cover the associated expenses, which can offset operating costs for the entire

[06:32:02] facility, which turns a loss right now. This isn't about creating new expenses. It's about using existing resources in a way that benefits both the community and the county. At the same time, we've heard about the county's plans to invest in new recreational facilities that don't include swimming. This sends a message that swimming and the thousands of families who rely on the sport are being overlooked. All we're asking is to use the resource that already exists to better serve the youth of this county. We're not asking for a new facility or a major financial investment. We just want to work with the county to make the most of what's already available.

[06:32:35] We share a mission to serve the residents of Princeton County. Giving us access to Veterans Park would help us empower youth to chase their dreams, compete confidently, and grow into the best adults they can be. Let's work together to make that happen. Thank you. Next speaker. Hi there. My name's Kelly. I'm one of the coaches with Locked One Swimming.

[06:32:58] I'm sure, hopefully you've been all caught up on kind of the email chain as far as what we're looking for. But a better understanding about us, we are a 5013C. We are a nonprofit team here in the area. Just as amazing as these kids are, we have 500 just like them back home anticipating, you know, working with you all to secure some long course lanes.

[06:33:21] Something that you probably don't know unless you come from a swim background is long course lanes from which we're discussing. It's the only way to make Olympic trials. A lot of these kids are working towards that. We have top athletes, not just in the area, but top athletes that are ranked throughout our country.

[06:33:40] Our team is highly competitive, and it's very serious in its training. These kids are training two hours every single night for 11 months consecutively, and they don't take breaks. They're very, very serious, and we just would like your support in getting a pool space that is efficient for their training.

[06:34:02] One of the interesting, or maybe a comparison would be like a very competitive football team, Never having access to a 100-yard field. They only get to practice in a 50-yard field. Or a cross-country runner being limited to only a small backyard to run in.

[06:34:22] So to understand what we're asking for and why we're asking for it, it's imperative to the success of these guys. And when we go off to big competitions, everybody else has access to this kind of training.

[06:34:38] and these guys are coming in with very limited access or no access, and we're just hoping that you will see the need and be willing to work with us. Like Matt said, we're not asking for a handout. We're not asking for anything free.

[06:34:54] Currently, we utilize three pools in Prince William. We pay approximately $200,000 every season in pool rent. You know, we just want to be heard, and we believe that there is a solution that we could come to.

[06:35:11] We believe that we could work together and find something, but every single time that we address it or we would ask for a sit-down meeting, we always feel like we are shut down for various reasons, and none of them really make sense.

[06:35:27] So we're coming to you in hopes that you will hear us, and you'd be willing to explore this conversation a little bit more. I think that these kids are worth it. They're incredible young athletes. You're going to hear from them and their passion.

[06:35:42] So thank you for hearing us out. Thank you. Next speaker. And for the kids, if you guys don't, you guys can't applaud, but you can go like this after each person speaks if you want to do that. There you go. Okay. Hi, my name is Samantha Alger.

[06:35:59] I live in the city of Manassas. Hold on, I'm sorry. Come closer, speak up. And generally, I'm going to let you speak, but if you, if I call you, if you do not live in Prince William County, we're going to put you at the end because we always have county residents. No, you can go on.

[06:36:14] You can go on. I'm going to let you go, but just to let everyone else know and make sure that you speak into the mic. My grandparents live in Prince William County and my dad grew up there. I'm a year-round swimmer and I swim for a CCS. There are two swim seasons, short course and long course.

[06:36:30] Right now, the only pool in the area that has long course lanes that we can use is Veterans Park. The reason I'm here is that I would like the county to allow my swim club to use lanes of Veterans Park pool for us to use, for us to practice. It would help me to practice in a long course pool because the only time I get to swim in a long course is in competition.

[06:36:50] It is hard to get pacing down when I can only swim in a long course pool a few times a year, and each time is in our race. Our team would like to have a few practices of Veterans Park to help us get our timing down for long course meets. My coach has tried to rent lanes from Veterans Park but hasn't been able to.

[06:37:05] We would pay for the use of the pool so the burden on the county would be minimal. Many of the team members are taxpayers in Prince William County and should get the benefit of using the pool that they pay for through their taxes. Thank you. Before you speak, I'm going to call up the next group of people so they can wait behind you.

[06:37:25] Allison Cosgrove, Elle Carpenter, Nathan George, Samantha Myers, and Victor Wall. All right, you may speak now.

[06:37:43] Ladies and gentlemen of the board, thank you for taking the time to listen tonight. My name is Leighton Meador, and I am a 12-year-old swimmer for OCCS. I live in the Occoquan District. I'm here tonight requesting that our team have the opportunity to swim at Veterans Park Facility in order to train in a long-course pool.

[06:38:10] For background, our team competes in long-course meets during the summer, but we train in a short course pool. To present some analogies, this is similar to training for a half marathon and showing up on race day expected to run a full marathon. Or, if you like baseball, it would be like practicing with a pitching machine that throws a 55 mile per hour pitch, but then facing a pitcher that throws a 75 mile per hour pitch. The point I am making is that we should be able

[06:38:44] to practice like we compete having a chance to practice at veterans park just one day a week will afford swimmers OCCS swimmers the same opportunity as other area swim teams again thank you for your time and listening this evening thank you hi my name is Allison I swim for OCCS I think we should have a long course pool because we can only practice in a short course pool it will help our practice for long course to be better our coaches can also see what we need to

[06:39:20] work on for long course so we could get better times and maybe in our races too that would be very fun to be in a long course pool to see how it is and if you let us to be at veterans park you'll make a lot of swimmers and coaches very happy you'll let a change a lot of swimmers in a good way because we could be so much better at long course so if my statement we would like to use the veterans park long course pool to swim in thank you so real quickly i wasn't sure if i can hear your name and where you generally reside if you could say that again my name is Allison and do you live in Occoquan or I live in Prince William County all right good enough

[06:39:58] you guys are young all right next speaker hello my name is Elle Carpenter I live in Prince William County I am here to stand up for our needs to use a long course swimming pool I think we need to use a long course swimming pool to be ready at race day if we don't have that opportunity and we only get to practice in a 25 meter pool which is half of that i don't think we get the

[06:40:34] mentally have the right motivation to do it because when i was little i swam in a long course meet and got no training for in a long course pool and i really want to make that a change, because I was so scared and didn't really know what to do, and I want to make a change for us and the upcoming swimmers in our community. Thank you. Thank you, and I appreciate your comment. You, you know, did that without notes. That's especially impressive. Next speaker. Good

[06:41:10] evening, fellow citizens and Prince William County Board of County Supervisors. My name is Nathan George. I am a seventh grader attending Marsteller Middle School in the Brentsville District and a year-round summer for Occoquan swimming. Like many of you, my family enjoyed watching the Olympics this summer, especially swimming. We admire what they do and strive to compete at a high level.

[06:41:30] These athletes swim in a long course pool, a pool we do not have an opportunity to practice in. Each spring, we start our long course season. During this season, we still practice in a short course pool, meaning we only swim in a long course pool during our competitive meets. Transitioning from practice in a short course pool to competing in a long course pool creates anxiety it can lower our confidence. Training in a long course pool before competing would make us more confident and prepared for these meets. I was recently informed that an outdoor long course pool does exist in our county. Veterans Park is an available facility but more funds must be allocated to Prince William County Parks and Recreation for Veterans Park pool for

[06:42:09] us to use it. I understand that opening this pool to swim clubs that would pay for facility rental would incur additional operating costs, such as staffing and maintenance. Prince William County has allocated money to other sports. Therefore, I ask you to consider earn earmarking funds to cover these additional operating costs at Veterans Park.

[06:42:29] Swimming means much more than just getting fast or competing in meets. It keeps us physically and mentally healthy and helps us grow and foster relationships with our coaches and peers. I am sure many of the people here know the phrase, hard work leads to success.

[06:42:45] Part of realizing success is having the materials and resources that best set you up for success. We have the facility to do that and request it be made available to us. Further, additional benefits to funding Veterans Park should be considered. As leaders, I know you share a vision to create beneficial opportunities for Prince William County, including the creation of more jobs in the county for pool staff, fostering more opportunities for the youth of this county, and promoting health and wellness for our young population.

[06:43:16] Giving more funds to parks and recreation to operate Veterans Park Swimming Pool would provide swimmers with more opportunities to practice and prepare for our long course season. Thank you for allowing me the opportunity to address you this evening. Thank you so very much. Next speaker.

[06:43:35] Hello, my name is Samantha Myers. I am from the Brentsville District. I am here to tell you why it is important to let OCCS use a long course pool. The transition of competing in a short course pool to a long course pool is a big change. There are less turns, less underwaters, and generally less breaks.

[06:43:53] Us being able to use your long course pool would help us compete better. At the beginning of the long course season, it is hard because when you're halfway down the pool, you think you're done. But in reality, you have a long way to go. Having the opportunity to use your long course pool would mean we could start the long course season at our best. We wouldn't need to get used to the pool because we would already be training in it.

[06:44:11] Beyond the benefit of using your long course pool, if you let us use your pool, it would draw more attention to the swimming community. This, in turn, would encourage more people to learn how to swim. Humans are not born natural swimmers. We have to learn how to swim like we learn how to walk. 56% of the world population doesn't know how to swim.

[06:44:28] Around 4,000 people die from drowning each year. Many learn how to swim when they are old. Swimming is extremely good for your body, and it's a low-impact sport. Swimming is also good for you mentally. The amount of dedication needed to be on a competitive swim team can help you in life. My coaches always tell us the way you do one thing is the way you do everything.

[06:44:46] This means that by being disciplined, dedicated, and hardworking in the water, we are also these things outside the water. You see, many swimmers get good grades and generally just be nice people. Swimming is a very important part of life. It is much more than swimming laps and is less than every day. It provides a community of talented people.

[06:45:02] Thank you for listening. Thank you so much. Before we get to the next speaker, I just want to call up the last couple people, Emery Clements and Raylene Rickman. You guys can make it. And I do agree, swimmers are generally nice people.

[06:45:17] Of course, I used to be a swimmer, so, you know, a little biased. All right, you may proceed. Hello, everybody. My name is Victor Wall. I'm a student at Benson Middle School and in the Coles District. It is an honor to be here in front of everybody. I've been swimming since the age of five at my local neighborhood pool, and it's taken me to something I cannot even imagine today.

[06:45:38] It's taught me hard work, dedication, responsibility, and I love the sport that you train for every day. One of the biggest challenges that affected me as a swimmer is the switch from 25 yards to 50 long course meters in the summer and just having to go to a meet and feel so much more pressure than you usually do to compete at a higher level and a higher competitive standard.

[06:46:01] I want there to be an even playing with us, with swimmers near you. One of the biggest dreams me and my friends have had since we were little was going to the Olympic trials. I'm on track to try and achieve this goal right now, but it would make it so much easier to just get that little long course training in every day in the summer at Veterans Park Pool.

[06:46:26] Having Veterans Park wouldn't be a change. it would be an astronomical change for our training as a team. This could make us the better version of ourselves and live up to our potential as a swimmer. I hope you take everything into consideration for us swimming at Veterans Park this summer. Thank you. Next speaker.

[06:46:47] Hi, my name is Emery Clements. I'm from the Gainesville District of Prince William County. Thank you for giving us time to speak in front of you all. I know that you all are very busy and this is kind of not as important as you would think to have someone speak for, you're probably thinking, why? Why are they speaking up here?

[06:47:14] This isn't as important as, this isn't very important. Like, this isn't something that everyone cares about. Well, I'm up here speaking because a lot of people care about this. I know a lot of people don't think about that, but a lot of people do. A lot of people don't know how to swim, and it costs them their lives. So many people don't know how to swim, and it's unhealthy.

[06:47:43] Swimming is good for your mind, good for your body, and sorry, I'm incredibly nervous right now. We're friendly, mostly. You're probably thinking someone more sophisticated should be up here, someone smarter, someone who's not 12.

[06:48:10] Well, I'm up here speaking because we are being, swimming is being left, all the leftovers from other sports, we are being overlooked. And you put so much money into other sports and build dozens of data centers all over our communities.

[06:48:31] Maybe you could put just a little bit of that tax revenue into swimming, just a little bit. I'm passionate about this sport because today I'm a swimmer who goes to East Coast Championships, but if it were not for my chance to come to this sport, I would be a nobody to everyone in this room.

[06:48:52] No one would care or know what I do to this day, and they wouldn't care. They just wouldn't care. There are so many reasons that I love this sport and that I care about this sport, and all the people in it, but I don't really have enough time for that.

[06:49:10] So 4,567 people die from swimming almost every single year, and like Samantha Myers said, 56% of people around the world don't know how to swim. Swimming in a long course pool would improve our mental and physical ability to go to meets and be prepared, not be nervous, not have anxiety about what we're swimming.

[06:49:39] We should be treated as equally as any other sport, and we should not be overlooked like what is being happening. And that's it.

[06:49:59] Thank you for your time. And please know that it's not about being important or, you know, it's always great to hear from the community. So never think that your voice doesn't matter, all right? And our final speaker. Thank you. Good evening, Madam Chair and ladies and gentlemen at the board.

[06:50:16] My name is Relene Rickman of Stafford County, Rockville, Rock Hill District. I'm speaking on behalf of Occoquan Swimming. We live in Stafford County, and this is our third year with Occoquan Academy. We are passionate about our coaches' team and swim families and would like to see every opportunity for our kids to grow.

[06:50:33] I have two daughters that swim, one at a competitive level, and the other who recently started a few months ago. We drive at least one and a half hours or more each day to the pool. They have the opportunity to engage their whole self, foster inclusion, and mental wellness by training and exercising, but also by participating in a team activity that creates an opportunity for them to form meaningful relationships, enhance their social skills, and have stimulating forms of activities definitely outside of all of their smart devices.

[06:51:07] Swimming, like other sports, teach kids hard work, discipline, and commitment, which are attributes that we would like for all our kids to develop to become model citizens. We actually had the privilege to attend the Paris 2024 Olympics this year, And we saw some amazing swimming and heard some heartwarming stories about perseverance and the importance of the community.

[06:51:31] But what's most important is that during those interviews, spotlights, and conversations with those athletes, they mentioned how their coaches and most importantly, their training facilities and accommodations were instrumental to them achieving the best success. Today, we ask for your help to grant access to the long course practice lanes at Veterans Park and provide an even greater advantage, as you have heard, for our future Olympians.

[06:51:57] Thank you for your time. Thank you. Before we move on to your remote public comment, I just want to say, first of all, I am very impressed with all the young people here today. And because, you know, you know better, sister. But I also have to say, I'm sorry because I'm a parent, behind impressive young people are impressive parents, parents who care, parents who are putting a lot of time and energy into their children, making sure that, you know, they're going to swimming, making sure that there are age-appropriate activities.

[06:52:29] So I wanted to hand it to the parents as well, because you guys do a lot of work in supporting your young people. And young people, listen to your parents and clean your room. Eat your vegetables. But I also want to say that this has been a very good lesson in civic engagement. It is very important to engage with local government, to understand how local government works.

[06:52:47] You know, I know you've got to sit through a presentation earlier that may have been kind of not fun. So I thank you for doing that. I thank you for coming out and speaking and sharing your voices. And, again, you know, don't be ashamed to use your voice.

[06:53:04] What you have to say, it's just as important as the presentation that you heard earlier. So, you know. Anyways. Madam Chair. Yes, Supervisor Franklin. May I just say I'm Supervisor Franklin. I represent the Woodbridge District where Veterans Park is located.

[06:53:19] So I also just want to thank you all for coming out. And we'd love to work with Supervisor Bodie to see about getting those extra width for the lanes. I'm not a swimmer, so you all are going to have to educate me on how all that works. And I'm looking at Chris, who is going to help us and get some staff to figure out what that looks like.

[06:53:39] And all of my colleagues are going to support it, right? My chief of staff is right back there, and I already talked to a lot of people. So at the very least, you have our commitment to look into it. So thank you. Thank you so very much.

[06:53:55] We are going to go to, we have one person, I believe, online, a supervisor voting. Yes, ma'am. Chris, can we bring them up, please? Yes, we can. This is Laura Harders. Hello.

[06:54:13] Hi, Chair Jefferson and Board of County Supervisors. This is Laura Harders from the Gainesville District. I just wanted to stay on for public comment time to applaud all the young people who just spoke and the coaches from Occoquan Swimming. My first thing, I'm so glad that Supervisor Franklin mentioned that you're the Woodbridge Supervisor, and that's where the Veterans Park pool is located, because that is crucial for you all to meet with her, to speak with Chair Jefferson, and to kind of get the ball rolling.

[06:54:46] I'm thinking Parks and Rec also, that would be a major conversation with them, and it sounds like a win-win. Yes, I do have a swimmer, and having long course lanes available would be such an added benefit to Prince William County, to the athletes.

[06:55:02] I know only of a very small number of Prince William swimmers who have gone on to qualify for Olympic trials, and I'm just thinking, you know, long vision that this could be such a great opportunity to make use of those long course lanes that are in high demand, that are available and find a win-win for the swimmers to be able to use that and work with the county so thank you i was just so encouraged to hear all them come and speak and to advocate for their sport and hope you're able to continue the conversations with them so i just wanted to stay on to say that

[06:55:38] thank you good night thank you miss harters thank you chris have a great night i will let you know you guys have a few fans i've gotten a couple emails so you know thank you again for coming out this is the end of public comment time if you want to stay, hang out, we've got more stuff to do might not be fun, it is a school night, I'm just saying thank you so very much so board, what we are going to return to supervisor Weir I believe is giving a card to one of the coaches, I think

[06:56:13] yes, alright, so for the board we are going to resume where we left off with the 2 o'clock meeting the affordable housing dwelling you know ordinance i know that people want to speak most people have already spoken twice we supervisor supervisor bailey want to speak we cut her off so i would like to return to her i don't know if you have any additional comments angry but all right so supervisor bailey

[06:56:49] if you wanted to you know use your second five minutes to address the afdu we'll do that and then we're going to move into supervisor's time and then we are going to move into closed session and if we have a readout we'll do that and then we will adjourn so Supervisor Bailey the floor is yours thank you madam chair I'm just looking through my notes here may we may have addressed everything but the one thing that I wanted to to mention was in terms of I mean I think this is such an important

[06:57:23] thing for us to move forward with and I you know I every look every bit that I have here my notes have been covered really but I think this is important that we move forward with but one of the things that what I think it was mr.

[06:57:39] D'Amato mentioned earlier we really need to define what affordable and this may be remedial but we really need to define what we are talking about when we say affordable housing I think that would help us to educate the public and make them more comfortable with what we're talking about I think it's a project that we need to move forward with but defining it is is critical you know it's it's not the traditional affordable housing based upon what we remember in the past it's the need that's really important

[06:58:13] and so um joni mentioned earlier on in this process 2019 1922 2022 i'm tired um that uh it's it's attainable housing for everyone and i think that's the attitude that we have to have with this and i i hope my colleagues can begin to embrace that portion of it it's a change for us is a change for us and so i you know my notes just pretty much said everything that everybody

[06:58:47] else has been talking about but i think that's important and when when we talk about the trust fund we need to be able to understand how do we support that what does that look like what is it going to be used for and define that as well because we need it so those are the only two things I really need to say, Madam Chair. Thank you. I appreciate that. I know, Supervisor, where we've said this, you've had your two segments of time. I'm going to close this out.

[06:59:19] I'm just going to say this because someone brought this up when we're talking about Smith Crossing, about HOA fees. And I also think I'm in a great position to talk about the need for affordable housing and affordable homeownership. You know, I moved to Prince William County in 2015 because this was the affordable place to be. This is what I could afford to buy.

[06:59:38] single mom, working on the hill, making $2 an hour. And I had saved up and I was ready to buy and I was financially stable. And I was able to make my dreams of home ownership come true in Montclair where I bought a townhouse. So when I hear things, some of the questions I'm hearing, you know, like HOA fees, are they going to be different for people who live in affordable housing? I don't think we really understand what the buyers look like. These aren't necessarily people who are living paycheck to paycheck or have limited financial stability. These are

[07:00:13] hill staffers. These are nurses. These are police officers. These are fire. These are people in jobs where they're not necessarily making six figures, but they have a solid income. They are stable. They are in a position that they are able to buy. And I'm going to talk about this a lot and I'm going to share my story a lot because I think we have to dispel some of these myths about people who are, you know, trying to buy these units.

[07:00:39] They're people with jobs. They're people who, as part of their financial calculus, they're going to look at how much the HOA fees are and whether or not they can afford them reasonably. And so I wanted to mention that because, again, these aren't people, especially when you're going to buy.

[07:00:55] I mean, the underwriters put you through, you know, they want to know everything about you. So I just want to be clear that we have to get away from something. People have to get away from their notions of what this looks like. These are people who have jobs. These are people who are financially stable.

[07:01:12] They're not making, you know, the money that, you know, a doctor or lawyer is making, but they still can't afford to buy. It would be great to allow them to have an opportunity to participate in the American dream. So I just wanted to say that to close this section out.

[07:01:31] We are now going to move on to supervisor's time. Before we go around the horn, we have a few things that I'm sorry. Before we close that out, I wanted to make sure that staff had enough direction from us on the questions that were asked.

[07:01:47] So I will say that we have the majority, and I apologize because I did take notes, you know, I don't know if you guys did. We have the direction that we're currently moving in. We have, you know, you have the guidance to continue to move in that direction. You know, I am going to, I have some additional comments, my staff and I, and I'm sure others do as well.

[07:02:06] And as for 2304, you know, we'll see what happens if that actually gets approved, if it moves forward, where does it stand with the governor's office. This is going to be something that we're going to have to be flexible and nimble, and we'll see. Madam Chair, they have direction for what, for 2305.1 or 2305?

[07:02:26] 2305.1, and for us to apply to future rezoning. And I know that we're not voting on it, but I just want to go on the record, stay in my opposition to that. We are aware of who, you know, and I appreciate that.

[07:02:42] I mean, this is a difficult conversation. We may, you know, there may be a need for an additional work session or something around this. Again, let's be flexible. Let's be nimble. And let's ask questions. Let's ask the hard questions. So if everyone's ready, we're going to move on to item 12, supervisor's time.

[07:03:00] I'm going to start with 12A and 12B and then do 12C separately. I'll move, Madam Chair. Second. All right. I don't think there's any discussion about who we're appointing. So let's take a vote on 12A and 12B.

[07:03:27] Unanimous. All right, 12C, that's to amend our meeting calendar. Can I get a motion? So moved. Second. All right, any discussion around this? All right, let's go ahead and vote.

[07:03:50] So now we are going to go around the horn. I'm going to start with Supervisor Gordy. Start with me. All right, thank you, Madam Chair. Well, it seems like it's been forever since we had a meeting, but it's good to see everyone as we are well beyond the halfway point of November.

[07:04:11] A lot has happened in the intervening time. Just a couple of things I'd like to point out. First of all, I want to appreciate the Noakesville Library for hosting a honey tasting. It's amazing how different honeys taste, and it was a very educational experience.

[07:04:26] Thank you for the Noakesville Library team for putting that together. I want to congratulate our Office of Elections and all of the volunteers and people who spent the day working the polls, uh, to ensure that in Prince William County, we had safe and secure elections. A great job. Um, and I really just want to commend them on a job well done, uh, on November the 5th. Um, last or a couple of weeks ago, we cut the ribbon on the university boulevard and Prince William Parkway ribbon cutting. We were very glad that, uh, supervisor angry figured

[07:05:03] out how to get there. Just had to go around his elbow to get to his back. But he got there eventually. But thanks for everyone for coming out and supporting that event. And then I also want to recognize Oakdale Baptist Church, who last Sunday celebrated their 164th anniversary uh and so um and uh has a rich history in prince william county um and then lastly i just want to say uh happy birthday to all of our marines 249th birthday on on the 10th and uh so very

[07:05:43] happy for them uh i do have one directive uh without objection i direct county staff to advertise a public hearing on december 17th 2024 for the board to consider a lease of approximately 2.9 acres of county-owned property located at 9349 Hornbaker Road in Manassas to Patriot Property Group for the purpose of customer parking at Farm Brew Live. In the last thing, a notice of appointment, I'm providing notice of my intent to appoint Tom Smith to the Sustainability Commission, and my staff has sent his information to the clerk. That's it. Thank you, Madam Chair.

[07:06:22] Supervisor Franklin. Okay, hello. On Wednesday, October 23rd, I spoke to residents at the Newport Estates HOA annual meeting. We had a discussion about upcoming projects in the community and discussed how I could assist them with receiving support from the Virginia Department of Conservation Resources as well as VDOT with some easement challenges and some soil issues that they are having in their community.

[07:06:55] On November 1st, I participated in the ribbon-cutting, the Quantico VRE station. And on November 8th, I visited the Woodbridge Forest Apartments and Townhomes, where I had the opportunity to tour the community with the property manager and hear about the successes that they've had, as well as some things that my office can help them with regards to residents and management.

[07:07:18] So looking forward to working with them. On November 12th, I spoke to the residents at the Ripon Landing Master HOA annual meeting, providing them with an update on recent upcoming projects in the Woodbridge District. Last week, and I'll make this very quick, I participated in two ribbon cuttings and one groundbreaking event.

[07:07:35] First, I spoke at the Opitz Boulevard Express Ramp Ribbon Cutting. This project, funded by Transurban, better connects Woodbridge residents in that particular area to the 95 Express Lanes. I just want to thank all of our partners for that project. I also participate in the ribbon-cutting of the new commuter garage that's located across from Sentira.

[07:07:55] This provides additional commuter parking options for transit and carpooling on the I-95 corridor and will also offer a parking structure for residents visiting Stonebridge and Sentira Hospital. Thirdly, on November 16th, I spoke at the Potomac Shores Station House Groundbreaking Ceremony and Marketplace Retail Event alongside Supervisor Bailey for the completion of the VRE garage and the groundbreaking brings us closer than ever to the long-held goals of VRE service and commercial development at Potomac Shores.

[07:08:27] A couple of upcoming events on Friday, November 22nd at 6.30. I will be participating in the holiday tree lighting at Stonebridge, and so please come out and join us. And then also just want to acknowledge that the Virginia Board of Education has named seven Prince William County schools as recipients of the Exemplar Performance Award.

[07:08:48] And for 2024 through 2025 Highest Achievement Awards, Featherstone Elementary in my district was named as one. And for the 2024-2025 Continuous Improvement Awards, Freedom High School was named as an awardee. And so I just want to thank the school system for all the work that they've done. Dr. McDade, of course, my partner, Lori Williams, for the support that she's provided to our Woodbridge schools and looking forward to meeting with them for our upcoming legislative session. So thank you. And I'd like to note I was also at that groundbreaking event at Potomac

[07:09:24] Shores. But all right, Supervisor Vega. I was not at that groundbreaking event at Potomac Shores. But I do want to start off with on 10-26, we had the Kaboom Ribbon Cutting Ceremony over at Fairmont Park. For those that don't know, this has been a project that's been in the making for over a year that's about when parks and recs came to me and they kind of talked to me a little bit about this project for those that are not familiar with the kaboom organization this organization pretty much finds donors that for a certain period of time remain anonymous and they

[07:09:58] provide a brand new park for areas that are underserved or that need some tender love and care if you will and so we were working with parks and recs and then the time came and the big reveal was that the donor of the brand new park was AWS, and so certainly want to thank Seth and Janet for their hard work. I want to thank Jane Byer also, who's my appointee to the Parks and Recs Commission, for all of their hard work, and certainly to the community as well, who came out during the design phase, and then to all of the volunteers who helped bring this project to life. It's pretty incredible to go on site and see so many members of the community, but also want

[07:10:36] to give a special shout out to our county executive for being in attendance a bigger shout out to Elijah Elijah got down and dirty let me tell you he was working he was moving mulch he was painting and I know he's not here but Elijah to you and to your wife thank you for coming out and for supporting this project and again to Seth as well also on 10-26 I along with two of my colleagues that I happened to see that day at Thomas Jefferson High School in Fairfax County Supervisor franklin and supervisor bailey we participated in the democracy for girl scouts um what do we call

[07:11:12] it conversation discussion um you know so pretty much we were responsible for a classroom and we had to talk about what it is to serve and be in public office and it was just a really cool experience i had to teach fourth graders and so it was a very interesting class and i want to thank the organizers for taking me into consideration on 10 29 i had a fantastic time i'm talking to the Chamber of Commerce on their policy maker series this is something that you do every month they find somebody that's in leadership and we talk about our role and what it is that we do here in the county on 11 to we had a successful

[07:11:49] annual quote drive and I want to thank all of our community partners who donated jackets to kids in need this winter season who are going to be nice and cozy thank you again to your generosity and for partaking in this event that has become one of the staple ones here in our district on 11 six I I was here attending the Public Safety Communication graduation.

[07:12:08] I want to congratulate the ladies. I think there was one gentleman, right? So to the ladies and gentlemen, gentlemen, congratulations on graduating. On 11, 10 through the 12th, I attended VACO with Supervisor Bailey, Supervisor Angry, and Supervisor Franklin.

[07:12:29] And it was a very informative weekend, if you will. and I always say that Prince William County, everywhere we go, is always well represented. Thank you to our county attorney and to our county executive for also being in attendance. On 11-13, my staff and I went to the Manassas Health and Rehab Center.

[07:12:47] This is just a gentle reminder. I know that during the holiday season we get caught up with spending time with our loved ones and whatnot, but let's not forget those that may not have relatives or loved ones to spend the holidays with, so it was just really nice to be able to kick off the festivities of the fall season with these folks and so if you're able to do so i highly recommend that you take the time to do so um and last but not least upcoming events choice for tots donations will be collected until december 7th so swing by the office and drop off your donations and uh on december 7th we're going to have our coals district annual christmas tree lighting ceremony so for those that want to attend please attend and i still have a whole minute that i'm just going to sit here and take because

[07:13:26] Supervisor Gordy's rushing me. That's all I have Madam Chair. All right, going to Supervisor Bailey. Supervisor Vaca, I love you. Okay, it has been a long month. On October 23rd, my staff and I attended the 2024 Salute to the Armed Forces where the wonderful John Register was the keynote speaker and that was with our own Chamber of Commerce and his theme was Amputate to Elevate, Adapt,

[07:14:02] innovate, and transform important processes for growth and survival. And he is one of our special Olympiads, so it was really good to meet him. Thank you to all my amputees, appointees, forgive me, I'm sorry, John, appointees for attending the meeting that we had on the 23rd.

[07:14:26] On the 25th, what a wonderful and absolute wonderful GovFest that we had with our community staff here. It was wonderful. I had a pleasure of being the guest speaker at the PTK Alpha Beta Row chapter where I spoke about leadership and morale.

[07:14:45] On the 26th, I enjoyed participating again with my colleagues, Democracy for Girl Scouts at Thomas Jefferson. We had such a good time with those Miller schools. They were fun. They were fun, and they were like sponges absorbing about democracy and voting. And so, i.e., I congratulate them again today for the proclamation that we presented.

[07:15:05] 27, thank you to staff, for my staff, for participating in the Dumfries Pink and Purple event, bringing awareness and an end to breast cancer and domestic violence. And then on the 29th, I was the featured speaker, along with my chief, and I attended the Grand Park Middle School Talent Show, which is always a great time.

[07:15:24] November 1st, my chief and I attended the wonderful VRE ribbon-cutting ceremony for Quantico Station House. It was a great turnout, and so thank y'all for y'all's support. On November 7th, as we celebrated Veterans Day, I had the pleasure of speaking at the Potomac Middle School for the second annual Veterans Day program, and that was wonderful.

[07:15:44] Their parents and their teachers and counselors were also veterans, and we just had a great celebration. I attended the Marine Corps cake-cutting ceremony on the same day, and my staff and I also attended the Rose Grand Opening Ribbon Cutting in Dumfries, and so the rows is open.

[07:16:02] Thanks to my staff for attending the Public Safety Communications graduation. Congratulations to all. And then, as Supervisor Vega said, from the 9th through the 12th, we attended the VACO Conference, and Karen attended with me, and I think she had a great time.

[07:16:18] It was very informative. November 13th, thanks to my chief for attending the Prince William Veterans Treatment Docket graduation. Leave no veteran behind. And then on November 14th, thanks to VDOT and Transurban for a wonderful ribbon-cutting ceremony for the 95th Express Lanes Opitz Boulevard ramp.

[07:16:42] Hey, hey, hey, I listened to y'all. Listen to me. Okay, thank you. I want to thank Alex, Salah, and Ricky for supporting the Keswick Forest Community Town Hall HOA. It was very important. We had 40 people there, and it was great.

[07:16:59] Then on the 15th, I want to thank my staff for participating and supporting the Neabsco Potomac Community Garage ribbon-cutting. Colleagues, congratulations. And then on the 16th, we attended the National Adoption Day. And later on the day, Supervisor Franklin and I had a wonderful groundbreaking with Potomac Shores Head House groundbreaking ceremony, which is the initiation for the VRE in our community, which is going to be a game-changer for the Potomac District.

[07:17:34] On the 18th, thank you to Executive Director Bob Schneider for the OmniRide experience. It was great. Yesterday, I learned a lot through the citizens on the bus ride while we were there. And this morning, I had the pleasure of speaking with voice at my church for the CRC outreach presentation that we did.

[07:17:59] And we do have great news in reference to that. To the county exec, thank you for your wonderful email to let us know that DEMAS is completing the 1-11-15 mental health illness demonstration waiver that we needed for the CRC, so that's going to happen.

[07:18:20] Okay, caution. Okay, like to give a notice intent for Kimberly Palacio to be a part of the Trails and Blue Ways Council. And then I'd like to issue a directive. May I continue, Madam Chair? Hurry. I will do it later. I don't want to hurry because this is important.

[07:18:37] It's in reference to the taxes. Thank you. I'd like to issue a directive with consent, if possible, direct county staff and the county attorney's office to review the Code of Virginia and county code as they pertain to the net worth of elderly and disabled residents seeking tax relief to provide this information and prepare a recommendation going forward to increase the net worth limitation for the board's consideration.

[07:19:09] Further direct county staff and the county attorney's office to review the county code as it pertains to prorating real estate tax relief to elderly and disabled taxpayers to provide this information and provide additional recommendations to allow the proration of real estate taxes.

[07:19:29] Thank you. Supervisor Weir. Thank you, Madam Chair. I believe everybody on this board has either received verbally in this chamber or in writing in some fashion or email complaints from the residents about construction noise, how early and how late it ends.

[07:19:45] And I believe all of you have seen the email from the CXO with the comparison of our hours as compared to our neighboring jurisdictions. So just so nobody's taken by surprise, I will be bringing forward a resolution and a draft amendment to Section 14.5, subsection 3.

[07:20:04] Yes, that is the noise ordinance, but this is separate from the rest of the noise ordinance to align our hours with those in Loudoun and Fairfax, essentially shaving off an hour from the front end, an hour from the rear, and not subjecting people to noise at 10 p.m. or 6 a.m.

[07:20:24] I've got four minutes left. Good. I don't believe that 10 minutes is sufficient to discuss a matter of the gravity of which we were dealing with tonight with respect to the affordable housing, so I'm going to just make a few additional comments. First, I would note that both 2305 and 2305.1, due to their prescriptive nature, are nothing but cookie-cutter, cut-and-paste ordinances with little to no editorial options.

[07:20:52] This is something that should take a good planner less than a week, and that we have fooled around with it for more than a year is more of an indictment of our process than anything else. This path was embarked on without a resolution, without a recorded directive, and not in the public eye by a previous board and a departed planning director.

[07:21:17] I will point out also that we have no ability to adjust densities or negotiate them. They are formulaic, established by code, administered at the sole discretion of staff. Yes, 2304 is limited to a handful of jurisdictions, and that is our fault for not pursuing addition.

[07:21:35] We kicked that can down the road for decades. That's on us. But 2305 is used in multiple other jurisdictions from Tidewater to Richmond and elsewhere. It's not that it doesn't exist. It exists everywhere other than the handful of jurisdictions eligible for 2304.

[07:21:53] This seems to be done in a push to use the housing trust fund, but I think if you look at the staff presentation, you'll note that it's a de facto gap financing for developers and not really monies that's going to go to those most in need of it or those who will be directly impacted by affordable housing.

[07:22:11] To be quantifying with you, 2304 is the answer, and we're in this position because we as a board and previous members and previous boards have kicked down the road for, kicked the can down the road for decades. I have, as Tom has, been assured by members of the General Assembly that 2304 will be addressed this year.

[07:22:31] It will probably, as last year, get through both houses of the General Assembly, and this year will be sponsored by somebody who the governor will not automatically veto just because of the sponsor's name on the bill. That's the only thing that held it up last year, especially given, and I don't think it'll happen this year, given the governor's new position on affordable housing.

[07:22:51] Thank you, Madam Chair. Supervisor Bode. Thank you, Madam Chair. First, welcome back, Madam Chair. I know that was said earlier, we missed you the past couple of weeks, so glad to have you back. Hope you're recovering well. We had a great election day back on the 5th of November.

[07:23:09] Like my colleague said before, kudos to Eric Olson, the registrar, all of his staff, the election staff, and of course, as soon as Vega said before, all of the countless volunteers that spent sometimes 15, 16-hour days at the polls, getting them ready, working the polls all day, and then just tearing them down to make sure, as was said before, we had free and fair elections where everyone felt secure in the election.

[07:23:34] Also, of course, thank you to everyone who voted, either in person on election day or availed themselves of early voting, either by mail or early voting locations. This was our first year and our first election cycle of having the new ordinance in place at the expanded versions of our satellite voting locations.

[07:23:52] By and large, I heard it went very well, despite the more contracted number of days. I heard that places like the DMV got so packed that people went to the Dumfries location, went to Furlazzo, and we were able to do that because of how we changed the ordinance. Is it perfect? Not yet, but I think it was a good test run in probably one of the most populated elections.

[07:24:13] in the four-year cycle that we're gonna have. So I wanted to thank everyone that worked on that, and of course, thank the county exec for working with the electoral staff to get that over to us ahead of the presidential election. I have one item of housekeeping. I'm gonna put in my notice of intent to appoint Latonya Thomas to the development, sorry, Department of Social Services Advisory Board.

[07:24:35] I've already sent her resume and her cover sheet to our clerks. So events, I'm gonna be very brief as most of these events have already been talked about. One that's unique to my district was back on the 29th of October, we had our traffic safety town hall.

[07:24:51] We had over 40 people in attendance to that, both online and in person. So again, wanted to thank the LRPRA for their partnership on that, all the county agencies and PD who attended that and participated, and of course, everyone who participated as well.

[07:25:06] We're looking to have a similar one farther east of my district, probably around the medieval corridor the coming months so please the beginning of the year look out for that on the 1st of november i went to the quantico station ribbon cutting on the 7th i went to the public safety communicators uh session 52 graduation alongside a couple of my colleagues on the 14th i went to the opitz boulevard express lanes ramp ribbon cutting that's a great project alongside the the garage you know a tri we call we call it a tri-district uh a project between myself the uh woodbridge District and the Neabsco District. We have a lot going on in that sort of microcosm of the malls,

[07:25:42] Stonebridge, the hospitals. So it's a great place to have those new transit and transportation projects all cut at the same time. On the 16th, I was able to attend the National Adoption Day celebration at the courthouse. Brought one of my two adopted kids with us to that event. Really touching moments. I know the judge himself said it, but it's always great to go to a courtroom and have a reason to smile and laugh as opposed to what usually happens in courtrooms. So wanted to thank the staff that made that possible as well. I also went over, I know Sears are angry and I missed each other, but I went over to Chen Park for the Seals on Wheels event that they had

[07:26:22] over there the same day. Actually managed to be there just enough time to see a wedding take place um there so that was always great to see and thank you to Jacqueline Smith and her staff we're putting those on I know Chin Park gets a lot of love from her staff so I appreciate that um thank you to everyone who came to my listening session last night for the transformation temple we had 120 plus people on a zoom meeting on a Monday night uh a lot a lot of of interest from the community around that project um based on the the uh the planning calendar will likely come up at the beginning of December, but again, want to thank folks who came along for that.

[07:26:59] This morning, well, actually, also what happened on last night, my staff also attended the Mill Park HOA annual meeting, so thank you to my staff who attended that. This morning, I participated in the mock interviews at Woodbridge Senior High School. This has been sort of a yearly tradition for me to get over and interview some of their students there so they can work on those interview skills, and that's it for current events, upcoming events.

[07:27:25] On the 3rd of December, I am co-hosting a Housing Matters Town Hall with Supervisor Bailey's office at Ikea from 630 to 830. And finally, I wanted to give kudos to the Litter Crews and to the communications staff for Veterans Day. Thank you, Madam Chair. Supervisor Ingrid. Thanks, Madam Chair.

[07:27:41] So you witnessed the wedding, too. Oh, yes. Thank you. Yeah. So last but not least, one of my predecessors, one of the predecessors of the chair, Kathleen Seafelt, had her 90th birthday a couple weeks ago while we were in between board meetings, on the 12th.

[07:28:06] So I know, Ms. Seafelt, you're probably not listening to board meetings, but happy birthday. She was a trailblazer when she first became chair, was a big advocate for specialty transportation. The parkway is named after her. People forget that. So then happy birthday, Ms. Seafelt. Thanks for that.

[07:28:23] I'll start with the seals on wheels because I witnessed the wedding too. Maybe they married some people over there. I'll tell you what. Right at the back of the band, which is pretty cool. So she runs a great program over there. So anyway, a lot has happened since our last meeting, so I'm going to simply consolidate much of what has already been said here.

[07:28:45] But some of the highlights of our time away was Neopsco District held its first community day under my watch, and it was very well attended, very great event. We even had Bullet, the pit bull, got adopted.

[07:29:01] So they brought a dog out, and he got adopted shortly after that. And it was at Cloverdale Park, which is our premier park now because everything there is just perfect. So that was a good thing. Also, yeah, congratulations at the ribbon-cutting at the VRE station at Quantico.

[07:29:19] Vaco Conference was a success. The tri-district ribbon-cutting for not only the express lane, but also the parking garage, all sorts of success. And I want to congratulate all the newly installed officers at the Dale City Volunteer Fire Department for starting their new term there.

[07:29:37] Upcoming events this Thursday, November 21st, partnered with Planning for Senior Life and White Glove Solutions to co-host a Saving Claire event at Westminster at Lake Ridge where we will be discussing resources for our senior residents.

[07:29:54] And on Monday, November 25th, I am finally on the docket to have a co-event with our chair, Chair Jefferson. We're going to do a community listening session at Belleville Middle School, 6.30 p.m. Thank you, Madam Chair. That is all.

[07:30:12] All right. Thank you so very much. This has been a long meeting, but it's good to be back. It's good to see everyone again. And I really want to start by thanking Vice Chair Kenny Bode for doing an excellent job. You know, I called him and let him know, like, hey, Kenny.

[07:30:30] I don't want to know what you said, Supervisor Weir. But seriously, I do want to thank you for doing a good job of stepping in. You know, we were in regular contact. I'm not going to say constant because, you know, but it was regular. And really stepping in, not just filling in for me, doing directives, keeping me abreast of everything.

[07:30:50] So I just wanted to say, I think we all agree that Supervisor Bodie did a very excellent job. So I wanted to acknowledge that. Okay, everyone's doing the jazz hands. I think we could clap because there's no one in here. Oh, wow.

[07:31:07] That is on tape. That is on tape. There better not be a glitch. But that's all I really want to say. I know this was a long meeting. I'm so very impressed, again, with the young people who showed up, who, you know, came out and spoke their heart. You know, it's really great, you know, whenever we see new faces in the chamber.

[07:31:25] And with that, and since Supervisor Angry had mentioned, you know, our town call coming up, I have a lot of events. I'll just let everyone know that I'm going to be rescheduling. You know, we're going to be speaking, obviously, with your office, Supervisor. We are about doing something next year since I had to miss that.

[07:31:43] And I had a local government day, again, with middle schoolers that we're going to be looking to reschedule early next year. So with that, thank you, everyone. We are going to go into closed session. We are back.

[07:32:04] We are back from closed session. Motion is certified. Second. We'll give it to Bob. All right. All in favor? Got to figure out a name for that.

[07:32:29] Motion to adjourn? Not yet. We got to vote. I just wanted to beat Kenny and Bob for once. Okay. Vote unanimous. second no i wanted to guess like all right let's vote motion passes five to three supervisors franklin vega and we are voting

[07:33:06] i want the police out of this room you're not going to see what happened - Oh my gosh. - It's a good thing you didn't. We wouldn't even leave.

[07:33:21] - Wow! - I'm glad I didn't know.

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