Coraggio Consulting
Prince William County School Board Work Session, Wednesday, March 13, 2024

Date: Wednesday, March 13, 2024
Place: Prince William County School Board, Virginia
Length: 2h 14m (video)
Official meeting video (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjFe3lJOxDI
Official School Board page (PWCS): https://www.pwcs.edu/about/school_board/

Machine transcript (speech-to-text) produced by Coraggio Consulting. Not an official county record. Names and numbers may be misspelled; check the video at the timestamp before quoting.
Speech-to-text: whisper.cpp, model large-v3-turbo. Produced 2026-11-01. Timestamps are [HH:MM:SS] into the meeting video.

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[00:00:02] Okay, I'd like to call this work session and final markup for the final fit or for the fiscal year 2025 budget The Prince William County School Board to order. Thank you We will begin tonight's work session and final markup with opening remarks from superintendent dr. McDade Followed by updates from Shaquille Youssef our chief financial officer And then I will share the ground rules for markup and we'll open the meeting up to board members for discussion following tonight the board will vote to approve the final budget for fiscal year 2025 and next week's meeting on march 20th at this time i'll turn things over to dr mcdade thank you so much

[00:00:35] dr latif uh welcome all to our work session for the final markup of fiscal year 2025 the budget team and school division leadership work together to develop this budget which continues to support our vision 2025 launching thriving future strategic plan on february 7th our team submitted the fiscal year 25 proposed budget to the school board the school board then held a public meeting on the proposed budget on february 12th and then a public hearing on february 21st tonight we are here to conduct a work session for the final markup of fiscal year 25 budget on march 20th the school board will consider approval of the fiscal year 25 budget and capital improvement program which

[00:01:15] will then be submitted to the board of county supervisors for their consideration later this spring i want to thank each of our school board members for your engagement your thoughtful feedback and suggestions throughout the budget season i also look forward to partnering with our school board as we collaborate to ensure a budget that best addresses our students needs a couple of things i want to reiterate that i think is important not just for our discussion tonight but also for our public i want to reiterate that this budget reflects specific strategic investments in certain areas as our students needs have shifted so where you'll see in certain areas of the budget where it may look like a

[00:01:51] significant increase I want to remind everyone specifically that what we're seeing is an overall increase in the percentage of students who are English learners as to date 25% of our student population are identified as English learners so where we have increased needs as we continue to grow in our student population for English learners you'll see that reflected in increases in the budget our percentage of students that are economically disadvantaged as determined by federal criteria has reached approximately 42 percent and our students with disabilities have increased by approximately 10.7 percent over the last five years and when we look

[00:02:28] at how funds are allocated the higher needs students also have a higher per pupil dollar amount and that's reflected in different both school and department budgets where you may see some significant increases given the significant growth in the student populations that i've highlighted the cost per pupil to educate students with higher needs has increased and this impact how we allocate funds and consider resourcing our schools and our division offices that support schools so what's being proposed in terms of additional markups are directly driven from strategic priorities as well as feedback from our school board members and our constituents

[00:03:05] through various opportunities in public comment. And so you'll see some of that reflected in what we're going to propose here in Markup. So at this time, I would like to welcome our chief financial officer, Shaquille Youssef, and he's going to provide an update on the proposed budget for fiscal year 25.

[00:03:23] Also our chief operating officer, Vernon Bach, is going to provide an update on the capital improvements project. Shaquille. Shaquille Youssef: Thank you, Dr. McDade. Good evening, Dr. Lateef, school board members.

[00:03:39] I have a short presentation here on what has transpired since we last met and proposed the budget in February. Before I start, I would like to introduce the members of my budget team sitting in the back there, Natasha Valencia, Kathleen Addison, and Joe Mondoro.

[00:04:05] So in terms of county revenue, the BOCS is meeting on March 19th to receive a revenue update. The tax rates that they advertised is the same from the previous year at 96 cents, .966, for real property.

[00:04:30] The real property taxes may come down depending on how the county votes and what their budget process is. They did add a $3.70 advertisement for computer and peripheral taxes, which is the highest rate possible.

[00:04:48] So the county revenues, we plan to keep the same, but it is pending finalization of tax rates from the BOCS. The next item is state revenues.

[00:05:06] I'm sure a lot of you have received updates and followed where state revenues are. The General Assembly on March 9th approved the budget, the governor's proposed budget. They approved the budget with additional K-12 resources, primarily dedicated towards a compensation supplement for 3%.

[00:05:30] They reintroduced the Hold Harmless Grocery Tax supplement. They also introduced L tiered staffing ratios, which present a challenge in implementation given our current hiring environment, plus in terms of looking at how we're going to staff this.

[00:05:53] In addition, one of the things we do not have right now is the VDOE state revenue calculation template. Now this is considered for us the gold standard from which we are able to take the state budget numbers and provide it in terms of what it means for PWCS.

[00:06:15] We're still waiting for that to happen. I'm not sure where the disposition of this budget will go. We've heard, we really haven't heard anything concrete from our folks in Richmond other than there may be a line item veto by the governor.

[00:06:33] So we really at this point do not have any other information. So our current estimates are still at the levels held by the governor's budget pending the governor's action on the budget.

[00:06:51] The next two slides, I'm not going to go into detail. I really cannot do a good version of Donna Eagle she presented this but this is just the slide carried over from when we proposed which talks about the different groups we have and the percentage increases that we are proposing for each of the groups and the next slide talks about average salary increases over the years since 2021 we've gone from 2.8 5% 7% 5% and a range

[00:07:24] of 5.2 to 6.1 percent in the 2025 budget the next slide is the markup additional investments and I'm going to hand it over back to dr. McDade thank you so much mr. Youssef so following the first presentation to the board of the proposed budget we've since then had a significant amount of input and feedback from the board as well as we've heard public comment on the budget and as a result of that you'll see some additional investments that are being proposed tonight that is in direct response to the feedback that we receive

[00:08:02] and I do want to thank the board for your proactive involvement in the many conversations that we've had to really push thinking around how we can maximize every dollar for the benefit of our students so I do want to go through each of these and specifically give a short summary of where we are the first one is the opportunity to provide student telehealth services for all students and we will need to allocate one FTE to oversee all of that and manage that the total cost for programming for it in addition to the FTE is 1.5 million because it would cover all 90,000 plus students who would want to take

[00:08:37] advantage of this and do want to note that student telehealth is being used in other school systems within Virginia and there's it follows all of the compliance and regulations and there's protection for you know student protected information as well all of those things are considered in this the second one is the an additional assistant stem and robotics court coordinator which is a really dire need we are growing in leaps and bounds in our robotics programming and so we're adding a hundred and sixty five thousand dollars to the budget to cover the need for the assistant robotics coordinator

[00:09:16] the third investment that we're proposing as an addition is software and this is to support the FOIA office to make sure that we are in compliance of legal compliance with records document review retention and preservation and production FOIA demands have increased significantly and it is outpacing the actual bandwidth that we have within the office so this is a hundred and fifty thousand dollar investment to make sure that we're making good on our commitments and legal requirements for FOIA the fourth item is an additional

[00:09:51] staff member support staff member in the school board office to achieve a more effective one to two support ratio for each board member that's a hundred and eight thousand dollars and 108 thousand six hundred forty dollars keep it in mind that you know what we give here can be wages salaries and benefits additional funding for the communications department this is a $25,000 investment to support marketing for specialty programs particularly specialty programs that may be struggling and need an additional boost and support in marketing and then we're also adding a human trafficking specialist and that is

[00:10:30] a hundred and eleven thousand dollars we are also just as a reminder we are required to implement the Virginia Literacy Act in full force we're getting next year we right now only have one language arts supervisor and they represent k12 and the lift for VLA and science of reading implementation will require a focus on k8 a focus person dedicated for k8 we really need someone k868 and then 912 instead of one person 912 and so we're at least proposing this

[00:11:04] year to add one at minimum to address the needs for k8 and then we have a additional administrative interns for middle school and high schools. This was something that I did bring forward to the board as a concern after getting reports and feedback from our school administrators around some of the burdens, the administrative burdens that exist, especially in schools where there are higher percentage of students with needs that require additional attention from administration, so this will go a long way in supporting our schools, and that's all of our middle schools and high schools.

[00:11:40] We also are responding directly to feedback around the compensation package. So we initially proposed a lift for teachers 12 through 18. We're gonna expand that from 12 to 18 to 12 to 20 years.

[00:11:56] And then we're also going to lift the experience cap for years of teaching experience to 25 years. Now, both of these together, the first one increasing the lift is going to be to the tune of about $2.1 million. And then raising the cap is $1.3 million.

[00:12:14] And at this time, I do want to invite Dr. Donna Eagle to just give us a brief overview of what this really means for our workforce. Thank you, Vern. So good evening.

[00:12:30] In terms of the expansion of the cap from 12 to 18-- or the lift, excuse me, from 12 to 18 years to 12 to 20 years, You know, we compare our salary scales to counties that are contiguous to us as well as Manassas City and Manassas Park School Divisions.

[00:12:52] Our primary competitors for our salaries are Fairfax and Loudoun because their hiring requirements are similar to ours. So those are the primary counties and also they're the most competitive as compared to us. And so when we're comparing our salaries, we do keep a very close eye on our teacher scale as compared to their teacher scale by years of experience.

[00:13:13] And based on these comparisons, when we started this work, when we established a compensation unit in the division, in the HR department in FY20, we realized that we were lagging the market in several areas throughout the scale.

[00:13:30] In some areas, the lag is larger than others as compared to Loudoun and Fairfax. as a result as resources have become available over the past several budget years the school board has funded differentiated compensation for teachers with various experience levels and just to kind of give you the history lesson as a reminder in FY 23 we allocated an additional 12 million dollars over and above the division raise for teachers with one to four years of experience that received in the equivalent of another step and also teachers from 5 to

[00:14:10] 20 years experience that who would now have 7 to 22 years of experience they received a total of between 10.1 and 11 point 11 percent increase in raises and then in FY 24 we put another this current school year we put another 6 million because we're continuing to close these gaps and we allocated an additional step to teachers from 6 to 15 years of experience which would now have 7 to 16 years of experience and those teachers received an average of

[00:14:44] 8% and in our proposed budget as dr. McDade covered in the initial proposal we did have where our teachers with 12 to 18 years of experience would receive an additional step which is 3% over and above the division average so which that would yield raises from eight to nine percent and as she stated in this markup we're recommending that we expand that lift to include teachers completing 12 to 20 years of experience at a cost of a little over 2.1 million and the lag

[00:15:20] from for teachers from 18 to 20 years of experience is the next priority in terms of ensuring competitive salaries as I think you're all aware based on the information that you have been provided as we move up in years of teaching experience our scales become much more competitive eventually surpassing the salaries offered by our competitors in fact PWCS continues to offer step increases after a teacher reaches 30 years of experience whereas Fairfax and Loudon do not and should additional funding become available the next

[00:15:58] priority area in our scale would be for teachers from 21 to 25 years of experience but at this point in time we are recommending an expansion based on the funding that we know we have to extend the lift from for teachers from completing 12 to 20 years experience as of June 30th 2024 in regards to the experience cap you know this is for new hires to the division who have previous experience and historically these experience caps have been used as a cost control measure to prevent extremely experienced teachers from seeking

[00:16:38] employment in the final few years of their teaching careers and so over the years you know we have continued to increase this cap the experience cap as the labor market has become tighter and tighter in order to attract teachers with you know experience to the division and the superintendent's recommended budget what was initially proposed was to lift it another year so to take it up to 23 years so what that means if a teacher comes to the division for instance with 28 years of experience they would be placed on the same spot on

[00:17:15] the scale where a PWCS teacher with 23 years of experience is placed so it's called a experience cap so what we're recommending in markup is to move the experience cap from 23 years to 25 years and this move does allow us to better compete for talent in addition any teacher who has been previously capped here at PWCS will be moved to the appropriate step for their years of experience up to and so those teachers you know currently a PWCS teacher going

[00:17:51] into FY25 who has 25 years of experience is placed at step 19 so this would allow those 262 previously capped teachers who have between 23 and 25 years of experience to move to the appropriate step relative to their years of experience so it allows us a better compete for talent and it also rewards our previously capped veteran teachers that are in the division between that have between 23 and 25 years of experience to actually move up a step or two depending on how much experience in addition to the step movement that they

[00:18:30] would have received and the increase that they would have received as part of the base budget and double down on our commitment we knew that you know we couldn't do everything in in one fell swoop when it comes to compensation because there's a lot of work that has to be done to get us to the place where you know we are on par and we have parity with other school systems as it relates to compensation so what we've done is incremental changes and investments over the years which is something that we have outlined in the strategic plan that we were committing investing in competitive wages and so So we've done that.

[00:19:07] So if we do get additional dollars, you should expect that we would be targeting that next group that Dr. Eagle just described that we knew already we needed to target. So -- but we started with the 12 to 18 based on the dollars we had.

[00:19:23] And that was where the biggest lag was. But we knew the next group had to be going up to 25. So additional funding would allow us to move more aggressively into addressing some of the areas that we already knew existed and was a part of the plan but was a phased approach year over year great Thank You dr. McDade it is important to note that the board members have previously had the opportunity to share with the superintendent any additions or revisions to the proposed fiscal year 25 budget and those have already been taken into consideration we will begin by going around the table to each board member for an opening comments and then

[00:20:02] following the brief opening comments will then follow this process where each Each board member, in turn, will have the opportunity to present any proposed changes they may have that they have not previously shared with the superintendent. If there is a change, each change must be moved and seconded, followed by a discussion and a vote.

[00:20:21] No board member may speak twice about a budget change unless until all board members have spoken once about it. After all board members' comment is complete, the matter will be called upon for a vote by the chair. A change may be offered and voted on once. Should there be any changes, there will be compiled and a final vote on the budget with all changes incorporated will be taken.

[00:20:40] Likewise, should there be no changes to the proposed budget, a final vote will be taken to accept the budget as presented. Board members are not so bound but otherwise pledged to each other not to offer amendments to the budget in open session as being duplicative of the work session efforts, allowing for a straight up or down vote on the budget that is reflected in the final vote of the work session.

[00:21:00] Board members may make any comments or discuss changes offered in the work session in open session at the budget meeting okay we will now move on to opening comments and then following open comments board members will have the opportunity to present any proposed changes we'd like to start mr. Wilk thank you mr. chairman thank you executive cabinet and staff that are here tonight I know this is the most exciting things for you but we appreciate your time and obviously the hard work and diligence that went into formulating and composing this budget I

[00:21:35] I think, you know, I always say this, especially kind of post-pandemic, you know, in the past, I think one of the big things for me is with previous administration was trying to connect the dots. It felt at times that things were just put into the budget for nice two halves, but it didn't really align with what was ultimately the strategic plan.

[00:22:00] At that time, I probably couldn't even tell you what the full strategic plan of that was. I do know we were promoting a world-class institution, but the core components of what we offer is a big reason why I'm not what people might have saw in the past of someone who was literally breaking down and cutting things or trying to cut things galore out of a budget.

[00:22:22] Those days are done, largely because when these budgets are presented, well, first of all, they hear our feedback, but this budget is aligned to our core values of equity, inclusivity,

[00:22:32] Innovation integrity resiliency and well-being and it goes along with the strategic commitments of learning and achievement for all which we see with the academic support obviously the support and the raises for our teachers positive climate and culture that goes even to facilities and renovations and programs family community engagement one thing I you know I want to highlight that was I'm appreciative of is the additional funding to promote specialty programs you know a hot topic has been uh last couple uh weeks has been uh the under utilization of some of our buildings

[00:23:08] and so for me something like this is really important to me when i have one of my buildings that is under capacity that i believe has great specialty programs but in my experience there's been a disconnect with the community and understanding like what the cambridge program is because back in the day apparently the credits didn't transfer as seamlessly as ap credits to college those days are done so i think we have to dispel that i think and do our best especially targeting uh those uh buildings like uh freedom or potomac garfield that are under capacity uh organizational uh coherence i think again you know we've seen with the cip uh and the structure

[00:23:47] you know in the past i felt like a lot of you know the central office hirees were people who were strictly based in a central office position but what we've done is expanded and all those those those positions might be categorized as central office the majority of those people are school-based they're just not kind of in one school they don't have one real location in a hub therefore they're categorized or classified as central office employees ultimately in the end our goal I always look at is our output which we saw a couple weeks ago with our student vision profile reports

[00:24:23] is to produce students who are critical thinkers digital citizens innovative visionary resilient and global collaborators that is our ultimate goal and in this budget I feel like we have met those goals you know a big area of mind that was a focus this year is you know I've always been passionate about the arts and I know dr. Lateef has expounded over the cappies and having participation and stuff like that and a lot of it's not necessarily funding you know it is you know yes I did make some requests and things but once I understood that it's more of a facilities issue we got to kind of figure

[00:24:57] out the layout of buildings you know one big focus of mine is you know what we've seen with the pandemic post-pandemic there was an immediate decline in enrollment in like our choirs our orchestra our theater and performing arts I want to look into that more I want to make sure that our counselors both at the middle and high school are definitely promoting those as much as the specialty programs because I think they can be in conjunction with one another and we don't necessarily want kids dropping choir or orchestra because they feel like that's the only period that they have to take like an IT class in one of our things so we got to figure out that process I want to make sure we figure out you know when

[00:25:35] it comes to performing arts and really everyone uses those stages you know in our schools and our high schools you know I understand that every building cannot be a Colgan obviously it's one of our newest buildings and newest facilities but what can we do to further help our arts programs in some of our older high schools if we can't make space for them to house like props and sets why don't we get rear projectors or something where it could be more digital and it can appear like a set whereas you can't store them in normal situations I'm very happy with the stipends I think that's very good one area that I know the administration is looking at is the strings and looking

[00:26:15] and seeing with their team I'd like to see them get the stipend but I also understand there's logistical work that has to be done with that before anything happens like that with the votes so that's enough of me rambling that is my overall feedback and I reserve whatever time is left thank you mr. Wilk mr. Denik I don't think you had any time left thank you this is my first budget season with the school board so I am learning and studying and going through the

[00:26:49] budget I appreciate the chart clearly labeled with all of the additions I know in my district the robotics position was something huge so I think that that's or the funding for that so I think that that's great I also I know that that thought we appreciated across the across the county the other position that I liked in this chart was that human trafficking specialist I think that's much needed in the year that we're in right now and the other thing that I appreciated also is the additional administrative interns I know that that

[00:27:26] was a huge topic with amongst our schools and of course the teacher the teacher jump in pay that's great and I appreciate that we're still trying to further increase that jump and so I hope that our teachers are excited about that that little effort that we made even though that's a big effort it's a big leap so thank you guys for for doing that and I think that's it that's all I have thank you thank you mr. and mr. Blake good evening everyone I don't have

[00:27:59] much to say I'm very happy with this budget it aligns with our strategic plan and that's it thank you mr. Jesse I'm gonna read through my statement some of these are sort of questions that i'm not expecting an answer to tonight but uh uh it's it's something that i think we should discuss so the first thing is uh when did the staff recommend for significant

[00:28:34] delays to brentsville high school for example for the renovation and the 14th high school for the construction moving back in prince william county afternoon response i got some answers The question was the declining enrollment of the UVA article that first, or the UVA article that first triggered the need to delay projects.

[00:28:59] So where did that, or who provided the UVA article upon which the staff began to determine if it was necessary to postpone all of these projects? Dr. McDade, I'd like to ask, did you or your staff decide to overrule the previous board?

[00:29:16] Last year's board said this is what you're going to do. and this year during mid-year it was appears that that was overruled or did your uh did you have a discussion with any board members before your staff began to overrule the last board regardless of whether this was done with or without the knowledge of a board member there are two points i'd like to point out once last year board approved a project i don't think that neither your staff nor a single board member including the chair has the authority to stop or delay the process

[00:29:56] on a approved project dr latif as you did today did you send the first uvr article to all the board members and encourage us to consider that the other thing is then when is this important because i find it's hard to believe that with all the adjustments needed to make the budget these changes were being considered and created by staff not in november or december 2023 but probably last summer or early fall no one has the authority in my opinion to stop

[00:30:35] a project approved and started by last year by the last year board casual two-on-two discussions are not a form formal vote to amend the project this includes planning drafting rsp etc the who is essential because any stoppage of work on a approved project by previous boards need the board approval i cannot believe the staff moved forward with all these significant delays without

[00:31:06] discussing this with you dr latif dr latif wasn't one of your campaign campaign pleasures to build more schools to relieve overcrowding now we are delaying those schools did you decide work should stop and wait until 2024 before the full impact of delays were presented to the new port at this last board meeting i said that data presented to the board was a bunch of here's what i meant when

[00:31:40] you show trailers but not rovers you are not providing a comprehensive analysis to the board You are not acknowledging the loss of time that the Rovers and the teachers assigned to the room lose when one leaves and the other one has to set up.

[00:31:59] You are not acknowledging students of Rovers have a more challenging time meeting with their teachers, either one of them, the one that's left the room or the one that's in the room. When you present us with the data you have declared will be placed by you in your presentation in the CIP your data you say for the program capacity will be done in 2024 you know the data that you're using does not accurately reflect the capacity

[00:32:37] of a school yet you list schools that are under or over capacity based on that data and declare that they are over or under capacity. And some board members last week used that data to say that they are under capacity or not.

[00:32:53] Based on May 20, 2017 planning capacity and program capacity presentation generally documents that the older the school, the more likely the number of students that are overcrowded increases.

[00:33:12] Regardless of whether a school is over or under capacity, When the fire marshal posted a maximum seating capacity of a class is 30 but some periods have 35, the teacher will do the work, have the class, but really we are asking them to break a law.

[00:33:32] When you don't have the need of classroom, you are overcrowded regardless of the number of students. And 19 rovers at Woodbridge High School is a prime example. irrespective of what classroom are used they are needed by that school there are civic significant developments that are planned for our area around this new school and i say significant it's not just a small uh amount and so on one hand i understand your study about kindergartens

[00:34:10] but the the development for the prince william county does not seem to uh equate with what is happening no one has been able to tell me when woodbridge high school has not been overcrowded the school is 50 years old and everyone i talked to everyone said it has always been overcrowded yet any possible relief other than the 14th high school has not been provided based on last year's board the earliest it would get any relief was two years and eight months from now but now we

[00:34:48] We are recommending it will be four years and eight months from now. A whole class of students will go through Woodbridge High School in an overcrowded situation. Woodbridge High School will do what it always does.

[00:35:03] It will do what is required and watch as new schools get relief. The growing number of supporters and I will continue to remind the Occoquan voters what is published publicly or I would say not being done for Woodbridge High School thank you miss Williams thank you chairman Lateef I appreciate it I just want to I was trying to read when something happened I want to thank that

[00:35:39] the staff and dr. McDade for preparing a very comprehensive budget that aligned with our adopted strategic plan wasn't going to go into this but I think at this juncture it's wise that we may want to as a board that has new members take it upon ourselves really to look back at some of the historical things that have gotten us to where we are Justin brought up the old strategic plan it was like a sheet of paper there wasn't a lot of bullet points and and so

[00:36:11] we have moved into a new chapter of this division and operation and we should take our time and our due diligence to learn where we were but we also need to respect where we are and where we're going and use that as the light post to make our decisions along with taking into account some historical information I personally am very appreciative of the additions that were brought up this evening for example the stem and robotics coordinator that's something that I personally have been asking for for years I am so proud of the fact that

[00:36:49] our division is one of the only in the country that now has air land and sea robotics it is the skills that our students learn and gain knowledge of participating in robotics we know are some of the number one soft skills that all major corporations are looking for when hiring people I hear often the chatter about sports versus that versus this yes it's a team effort but we hear right out of the corporations directly we hear directly from them if you can't work on a team if you don't know how to fail we don't want you we don't care you're a straight-A student and so I'm glad to see that we are valuing that and

[00:37:26] we are giving right now it's just miss Carol so I could say miss Carol some additional support in her office I just want to take a moment to give her and shout out for sticking with us and coming back to us and really bringing other faculty into the fold to continue to develop our programming needs for students I've always been a big robotic fan so clearly I'm biased in that situation but it's not just me we are being told by our business partners that this is the right direction to go in so I really appreciate the additional funding for that obviously our FOIA office we are a FOIA office of one there is technology and software out there so I think that it's wonderful that we are

[00:38:06] utilizing that the school board office member I have had some very lively conversations with the current board members and board members in the past about the need to support our wonderful clerk and deputy clerk I think people highly undervalue administrators at all levels we are and I'm gonna say we because I've been one for over two decades the backbones of what makes the executives run and offices run and if you don't know as the saying goes you better ask somebody because you won't have anything typed up any reports made any appointments made any any things so as this school board continues to grow

[00:38:44] and modernize we do need additional help and support for us to be able to function to do our job so I am greatly appreciative of that and I hope that our board as a whole agrees with us the communications department I give them a standing ovation just watching all of the new areas that they are advertising not only for employment, but also helping us change the reputation of some of our schools.

[00:39:11] Mr. Wilke, you brought up Freedom and some of the older schools that have a reputation problem in the community, right? How many people I spoke to during the election season that did not even know that Freedom had won two national awards and had only really seen what they read on Google, which wasn't even accurate because most of those incidences didn't even occur in the school or on the school it occurred around the school so taking time out to rebrand our division to give those schools that suffer from reputational injury depending on who you talk to a chance to really thrive and flourish and help our community members

[00:39:50] understand what is going on in our community schools right now and not what was I think not only is a benefit to those in the building but also our community at large because we know that people move for schools we're the largest employer in this county and if you don't have good schools you're not gonna have a good county budget none of us will be here and you know we might as well end this discussion so I really appreciate that I appreciate the technology that's being utilized by our communication department and the new avenues that they are taking to really spread the word reaching people where they are because we are a county that does not have a centralized communication

[00:40:26] system we don't have a newspaper we don't have anything that really binds us together as a community throughout from one end to the other Prince William County the additional support for human trafficking I think it's wonderful I would love for us as a board to be updated a later date about what we're doing programmatically wise but that's not not right now it's not the time or the place to do that the continual investment and providing administrative support at our middle and high schools as they continue to grow and the needs of our student population our staff changes I think it'll be very instrumental I I do appreciate the upper the nod to the more experienced teachers that has been something that I feel that they have been left out of the

[00:41:05] conversation so I'm glad to see that we are acknowledging that and trying to do what we can within our budgetary constraints as we move forward not only I think we should be looking at the upper end of the scale but I would also like for us to revisit the bottom of the scale $50,000 after coming out of college is still WIC approved at this point in time like we shouldn't have anybody working for us that has to also go seek state benefits and that's the reality of where we're headed I don't know if we're there now it's not our fault but I do think that you know when you work for a school division as a full-time employee you should be able to live somewhere full-time and I know

[00:41:45] that's not solely up to us it's the community that we live in but I think it makes a difference that we continue to do everything that we possibly can to ensure that our employees are well compensated we we have not talked in this update about the CIP I think it is something that from what I'm hearing from our fellow board members that me we may want to consider a separate session to really understand how the CIP has developed what our cutoff date is versus when the BOC BOCS approves projects the timelines involved in getting RFPs

[00:42:22] plans construction all of those things I keep hearing out in in the atmosphere the reason and rationale for some for this decision specifically mr. Jesse brought up the 14th high school is being incorrect and being solely based off of a UVA study I don't I don't feel that's accurate we've talked about it in our first board and when we did our CIP session initially some additional reasons were outlined that seemed to have been lost in the crowd I did ask for an additional update and some more in-depth information that be provided not only to this board to be reiterated but also to the public because we know

[00:43:00] that the media just picked up on the one study and ran with it as if that was a sole decision and there should be no reason why any member of the public would think at this point in time that our school administration would base anything on one singular lens and we have not acted that way to date so I would like not only the information that's been shared with us but another avenue for us to have that discussion for educational purposes we often get a tagline in the press and it's not an accurate reflection of the amount of work or the decisions that go into this process having two by twos are to prepare us to do our job and so that we can come to meetings and make decisions and and

[00:43:36] be informed and ask questions so we don't hold the public here until 12:30 1 o'clock at night it doesn't mean we can't ask those same questions I'm happy to do so if that's going to provide more information to the public but I would like to recommend us having an additional work session maybe on CIP and capital improvement projects I happen to have a love affair with facilities and things of that nature but I feel like we've missed the beat the mark on that and educating our public and that's part of our responsibility to do so so I would like to see some further discussion on that just for our own under for the public's understanding and for some of our new board members

[00:44:13] understanding as well because it's a very in-depth topic and you just can't cover everything all the time when you have new people so I want to reiterate that I appreciate the work that's been done but I could use a little brush up myself so thank you very much and I look forward to the remainder of the work session miss wall thank you dr. Lateef I just I'll try to be brief I want to thank everybody who's worked on the budget and the CIP I know it's very heavy lift there's a lot of data that goes into this a lot of preparation a lot of team planning and who knows what else I know I don't know all that's in

[00:44:52] the sauce but I know the sauce is good so I appreciate it um I I also want to echo the comments about the strategic plan guiding this process I think that's one of the things that we do really well when I look at a new budget or a proposed budget I can see exactly where this fits with the strategic priorities that we identified and I think the public appreciates that those who are paying attention understand that and I appreciate it as a board member as I reflect the needs of my community and I also consider the needs of the community of Prince William as a whole so awesome process I know the development of the

[00:45:28] budget starts probably well as soon as we pass this budget we're gonna start developing next year's budget I know it's a year-long process so I just want to say thank you for that and on that topic I know even you know the development of the CIP is also an ongoing project it is a living document it is year to it's a five-year plan but it rolls year to year to year so while something may be in the plan now it may come out of the plan next year something that wasn't in the plan may come into the plan because we are living breathing community and things change so that's something really important to keep in mind with the budget and the CIP but I do appreciate the additional investments

[00:46:07] A number of these things are things that I specifically asked for, and I'm really pleased to see them in here, things that as I've been out and about in the community, people have told me or have talked to me about over several years, and I'm pleased that we have the resources to be able to put some of these things in, not just what's additional but also what's in the budget.

[00:46:26] Of the highest priority to me is those investments in learning and achievement for all, but I understand, you know, we have four strategic investment categories, and so I'm very happy to see, you know, a number of these STEM coordinator software for FOIA, Sport FOIA, eDiscovery, that's, we need to, we need to relieve, there are ways to do smarter, better, and more efficient and more accurate, so, and not drive people into the ground with doing things the way we've always done them, so I'm really excited about that. I can go on. I just think this

[00:47:01] is great. I really appreciate it. I just want to say in my closing, as we consider the budget and the CIP, we remember that we are fiduciary holders of the budget and the public expects us to make wise decisions and decisions to the best of our ability that will last far into the future.

[00:47:23] And when decisions are made that are rash or aren't supported by data or the facts on the ground then there is a consequence later on and in past years while nobody's perfect you know we try to do it right but sometimes there have been mistakes and some of the problems that were challenged challenged with today are because of decisions that were made in the past so as we work on this budget I do hope that we will keep in mind wisdom fiscal restraint and adherence to data the best that we have and and on that point I do I did forget I was gonna say

[00:47:58] this I know it is my observation that our folks who work with data and all the numbers and try to forecast do a really good job I think and when and when they have noticed that they've been outside a very small margin of error they'd go back and they look and they say okay we kind of missed it by a little bit what happened and then they adjust so I really do appreciate the fidelity to good data and good research because that drives all of our decisions we need to be data driven and I see that in the division I appreciate that and I'm I have been all over in this data so I've been relying on it as I would as a board

[00:48:38] member I'm not the subject matter expert but I rely on the hard-working staff and I have confidence that the information that we're given is useful and accurate and we can make decisions based upon it so I just wanted to say that and I will We'll close with that.

[00:48:55] Thank you very much. - Miss Vice Chair Zargarpur. - Thank you, Dr. Lateef. Thank you to everyone who worked on this budget, who works with the numbers, with the CIP, with the how many students and what we're doing.

[00:49:12] I know that's an ongoing iterative process, which is one of my favorite things about bringing you here, Dr. McDade. The strategic plan absolutely drives everything we do, and I am grateful that not only does it drive our work, but it drives our evaluation of our work.

[00:49:31] I love that you're never afraid to tell us and the public where we are, where we've fallen short, where we need to go, and how we need to get there. And I'm proud to do that work with you. So I'm grateful for all of that. I wanna specifically thank you for putting in the student telehealth services.

[00:49:53] If you are a parent who has had to deal with mental health with your child in Prince William County, You know how hard it is to get kids on lists, kids to get seen, and I'm hoping that since this has worked in other districts that this is a good way to kind of catch our students before things get super serious.

[00:50:12] I've been that parent. I've waited for a bed at Dominion that never came. I've sat in emergency rooms with my child. It's not cool. And we're solidly middle class. I have relatively good insurance. So I wonder if it had existed when she was in middle school, if it could have caught some of those things that we just were bewildered by, if it would have been a better path for her.

[00:50:38] So hopefully this provides a better path for some of our kids and gives our parents and families a peace of mind. The other thing I'm going to just highlight super quick are the teachers. Thank you so much for continuing to work on the pay scale.

[00:50:54] I know it's easy to sit and say, "Well, teachers deserve to be paid more." they work hard and and it's so hard when our buckets of money only come from a couple sources and we are reliant on what they give us and we have to be smart as the decision-makers here on how to make that money get into the right places so I am grateful that we can consider our teachers who were I know they were feeling a little like ignored or not heard and I'm glad that we're able to do something and I know we're going to continue to do things so the the budget has been it's been a pleasure to do this over the past couple years I

[00:51:32] thank you and Dr. Latif I'm done thank you Vice Chair Zargarpur all right excellent just brief comments again we'll reiterate thank you for all the great work the budget is fantastic it aligns with the strategic plan it's another good budget again to remind everyone final numbers won't really you know we'll approve our budget next week but the county then has to approve theirs that might change revenues depending on what they do with tax rates and the state budget won't be finalized until the governor signs it which may or may not happen and they may go into special sessions on that I think the high points

[00:52:11] in this year's budget really align with teaching and learning if you really look at the work we do and so from the teaching standpoint it's another significant raise and I truly appreciate the extra work we're doing to adjust the pay scales in the mid ranges in the now 12 to 20 years and we still have work to do as you heard from Dr. McDade which I think is critical but this is something we have continued year over year to really make significant improvements and I'm very proud of the efforts we've done on that and it's not easy you know I mean we have you know we've prioritized salaries because we believe

[00:52:50] even improving recruitment and retention, and that does work. But, you know, prioritizing salaries takes money away from other things that we have to do as well. So it is a careful balance. And this is, I'd like to remind the public, the 6.1 is on top of the two that went into effect in January.

[00:53:08] So just January 1 was a 2% raise, which we rarely ever do a mid-year raise. But the way the state budgets worked out, they provided some late monies, and we were able to do that. So this will be 2 plus 6.1. So it's really 8.1 moving into next year, so that's very exciting, and if you take a look at the other numbers, they're great.

[00:53:27] So that's on the teaching side. On the learning side, we have invested heavily in tutoring. That's in the base budget. We've invested in adding, you know, there's the science of reading. We're adding some experts for that. We're adding, you know, more instructional coaches.

[00:53:44] You know, I think with every budget, you know, and there's been very few budgets that I've been disappointed with really over the last few years but I could always want more and I think everyone who looks at the budgets would say you know I didn't get everything I wanted and that happens to me every year I would love our council ratios to continue to drop I know the recommended council ratios are one to 250 I'd love to see him at one to you know I'd like to see us beat the national recommendations so you know I have a wish list that's that's really big and continues to sort of you know unfortunately be disappointed by just you know where I think we just as a society need to pour much more money into

[00:54:21] education but with what we have this has been terrific I appreciate dr. McDade all the added additions to the proposed budget this is very exciting and let me let me reiterate the important part also on the teaching and learning on the learning side mental health and we've all talked about how important that is we've heard a lot we've the public has come to speak about it students have spoken about it student board member has spoken about it it has been something that has been accelerated from the pandemic and a real issue this telehealth effort has been successful in other counties across the Commonwealth in the

[00:54:58] country I'm excited about it I think there is a movement in the state budget to help there might be more monies coming to us earmarked for telehealth as well which may help us recover some of the monies we're going to make that investment on but this investment is going to happen regardless in my understanding right we're gonna do this so this is very exciting so anyways that is you know all I have to add and just to say that you know every time we make a vote you know not everyone gets we want not everyone who's out here you know you know certainly we have to make changes and adjust for for for the data

[00:55:35] that we see so we will now move to the next session of the meeting where each board member in turn will have their opportunity to make remarks and so we will I'll start by saying are there any proposed changes at this time we can go either who wants to go first or we can start down with mr. Wilk if you'd like or anybody does anyone have okay let's first start does anyone have any recommended change to the budget any motions mr. Jesse I'd like to move that

[00:56:08] the CIP be amended the proposed CIP be amended to have the 14th high school go back on to the original schedule that was voted on and approved last year do you have a second mr. chairman with a disclaimer please sure out of respect for mr. Jesse and that this really ends tonight this is a work session the chance to change the markup of the budget full transparency I'm not supporting this but in the effort of allowing him to make his pitch once more and if any board

[00:56:46] members choose to speak as to why they're making their decision I'm gonna open this up I've heard a lot of people say well this is what you know the dr. McDade wants well the reality is she makes a proposal for us and what she believes is in the best interest of our school division and so not saying everyone has to speak on this but if people would like to add after he speaks and I think I get to speak with the second I think this is a good Opportunity to have that out because the press is here people have covered this story There's a certain narrative and I think this is a great opportunity for everyone to kind of speak

[00:57:23] So we'll call that your disclaimer in your first comment, okay Who would like to go next on the discussion? So the motion has been seconded we were now open for discussion. Oh sure. Mr. Jesse. Yeah, first of all I just want to clarify a couple things it's been sort of on the web that When mr. Wiggins spoke that he was talking about bullying and people were Some people were saying that was dr. McDade that was not dr. McDade who he was talking about

[00:58:01] So I want to make that clear the second thing Is that as I said before Woodbridge high school is 50 years old? My kids didn't go there. We went to Garfield and as somebody spoke a few minutes ago The reputation of the school also helped determine whether people want to go there or will do whatever they can to get out of there.

[00:58:30] And Garfield did not have the greatest reputation when my kids went there, but we still sent them there. And I can say in all honesty that they started the IB program while my two kids were there. My oldest one could not get into the program, and my youngest one, it changed their life.

[00:58:52] The IB program really worked, so even though it didn't, it was a good school for us, and I want that, but I wanted the teachers and the students, they've made things work, whatever it is, and this school is not only overcrowded, it's grossly overcrowded, and we need to do something about it.

[00:59:18] Now, am I tied to having a 14th high school? No. I want relief for Woodbridge High School, and I would like the staff to figure out something because we shouldn't have to wait five years, but as I told people last night, regardless of what we do, it's going to take five years to get done, but we would need the relief.

[00:59:48] The number of developments that are scheduled to go around where the school is, is high. Over 2,000 people, apartments and so forth, so that's low.

[01:00:05] Is this, is this boggling to my mind that we don't, and yes, it is a living document, but a living document has rules, and when we make major decisions in the middle, it deserves a vote if and then when we moved all these projects back two years one year those were major decisions and that should not be a casual conversation in my opinion it should be a conversation in a special meeting called to get that done we need that we need to help and we

[01:00:43] need to get this done the teachers they will do whatever you tell them they're not going to come here to the board room it's not in their best interest to come but they will get the job done they will teach your kids but they deserve and woodbridge high school deserve and i don't know much about brentsville high school i just looked at it it's older than woodbridge and it deserved that renovation and i don't know why we're waiting so you know as mr wilk said and i appreciate the

[01:01:19] And I knew he was not supporting the program, but I appreciate his second. Thank you. Mr. Denik Thank you, mr. Jesse for explaining that I I again have been overly clear about the CIP and the and the changes that need to be made And I what I heard you say mr. Jesse is that Woodbridge high school needs relief I I don't know that relief is brought about with a new school

[01:01:55] I think that we as a board have other options in providing relief for these Incoming developments that you're referring to that are happening all across the county Prince William County is growing And in different districts more than others, which I explained to you last week You know you're talking about 2,000 incoming projects The Brentsville district has 6,000 homes incoming on a piece of paper um and and they're not voted on yet so they're in the air which means if they do happen we're not

[01:02:32] prepared um in the next four years so it's something that we have to look at which we're we're having those conversations we're talking about it and it's about planning and i think that when we have the conversation now it can prepare us for the future to be prepared later on um so i understand where you're coming from needing relief and a lot of people have said you know know the redistricting and the re and the realigning of of lines and things like that that's a conversation and and I appreciate your perspective I appreciate the parents and the teachers and the students that came out and talked about the need again we're given numbers and I do think that you guys

[01:03:12] have done a great job you mentioned Brentsville high school and it's no secret that I love that school and I went there when it was a middle school High School and it was very overcrowded while we were all walking those hallways together Brentsville High School has gotten renovations there are renovations in the CIP for them it is an old school there are things that are failing but they have addressed those items and the other items of need are on the list to be addressed in the order that they're needed and I trust that if something were to happen sooner something breaks down we're gonna fix it we're not gonna leave it broken but but Brentsville has gotten a lot of

[01:03:51] of renovations and it is an old school but it is a great school the bones are good there so I see what I see where you're coming from I understand what you're saying but I do think that they're doing a great job addressing all of those needs in the CIP I do think that there is is more work that can be added into the CIP more things that can be added in order to to help us further down the road and I've had those conversations with both Vernon and dr.

[01:04:18] aid so thank you that's all I have miss Williams thank you mr. chairman so I'm gonna take the opportunity as the only current elected board member that has spent close to a decade on this very topic of overcrowding in schools and land and land utilization and banking and serving on committees and all of the things I want to say that there is a significant difference from the way that we approached this in the previous administration to how we are doing it in

[01:04:54] this administration to start with I also think that again I'm going to read reiterate what I said during my opening statements and that is when it comes to facilities and land utilization there there's an educational deficit not only among newborn members because you just got here but also within the public the the amount of time that it takes to secure land the process from then each parcel that has to be secured to then developing a blueprint putting those out for requests out for proposals getting that approved then having the board

[01:05:31] approve each step along the way I think that it would behoove this board in the public if we had a separate session on just basic understanding of what when we make these decisions versus when land or developments are approved at the BOCS what that means to us what our cutoff date is all of those things make a a difference. And when we do our budget cycle, to say, I remember, for example, when I first started, I used to get very upset. I was like, well, we know that so-and-so development is getting ready to be approved. I'm sure the planning office was not thrilled every time I called because I didn't

[01:06:08] understand that having a development being proposed but not yet approved, we don't count that because it's not a reality yet. I've also come to learn that just because something is approved does not mean it'll be built right away either. I remember discussions with Maureen Cadigan long, long ago about the type of development that gets approved and the student generation, and we just were updated not that long ago on us utilizing new student generation rates and how we factor students.

[01:06:37] I think that all of those things make a difference. Somehow the rhetoric has become whether or not we need a high school. I don't think that that's up for debate. I think the debate is what, I don't think it's a debate i from my understanding what we were asked as a board is do we want to build a facility that houses 2 000 and some students or do we want to build a facility that houses a thousand and some students we haven't made that decision yet because we haven't had a vote on the cip you you can't continue to do construction if you don't understand if you don't know what

[01:07:13] footprint you're going to use and it would be a waste of our taxpayer dollars to do that i don't think the argument is whether or not we need another high school type facility we know we do i personally am still really upset that i don't have program capacity because i've been asking for that every year for seven years because it's fantastic how many bodies you can put in a building but it doesn't make any difference if we're not planning to how we if we're not planning to plan for how we plan to utilize that facility we need that information and i think what's missed in this conversation it has been said by this administration and please correct me if i'm wrong

[01:07:51] dr mcdain or anyone from the administration that we are undertaking a study to look at all of those factors so that we can make well-informed decisions like we are elected to do i've not trust i do not like the idea of delaying a building when i know not only do we need it a traditional space for our high schools but we also need another independence which we haven't even talked about we have so many students requesting to go there we have to turn them away because at one point in time again by reputation it was a school all the bad kids went to which I don't even know where that started turned down being a school that students voluntarily go to we we have to turn

[01:08:30] them away because they don't fit a traditional education plan we have so much work to do and things to think about I think my understanding of the ask is that we pause and take a minute and utilize for once an administration that's willing to hand us data to back our decisions, or to help us make informed decisions, which I think the public has asked for.

[01:08:53] So I would like to continue down that path, and I think it would do us well to hold a separate work session on how we do this process from start to finish, and clear up the rhetoric that's out there, clear up the misinformation, allow the public to understand the new changes, the new processes that we have, how we work collaboratively in some regards with the BOCS because again I can't emphasize this enough we are two completely separate entities entirely but I think the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result when I entered

[01:09:30] Woodbridge High School in 1990 we had 3,000 students in the school there were rooms to classrooms just like there are now there were no trailers and we still have staff Dr. Healy I think was he was my 10th grade English teacher so I mean I understand what it's like to sit in a high school that's overcrowded from a personal perspective. I also understand that this building not only affects Woodbridge High School, it affects Garfield High School. It affects Freedom High School. It has the potential to affect Colgan. It has the potential to affect Hilton High School because whether we like to acknowledge it or not, when a new building goes up, everybody wants to

[01:10:06] send their kid there because it's new. Even though this administration has made it their absolute priority to ensure that every single school has the same technology and resources available at the division level instead of the school-based level so students don't have to suffer if you walk into Hilton or Garfield or Brentsville you have the same technology at each one of those schools that's that's a huge change so I think you know if we want before we vote on the budget or whatever the case may be whether we need to publish something out there or have a separate Saturday session which nobody ever likes to do but I'm all here for it so that we can really inform the public

[01:10:43] and understand the full picture of what it is that we're trying to do I think would be a very smart decision and i'm highly encouraging that we we do that because clearly there's a lot of misunderstanding on how we got to where we are and what it is that we're trying to do it's been presented as like soul relief for whippers but it doesn't affect it's a high school it's not we're not building an elementary school we're not building a middle school where it's mostly the effects are within the district this affects all of us and i'm i'm gonna actually say the thing that nobody ever wants to talk about but i've been saying quietly getting eyeballs of death at me but if we if we really believe in equity we should really look at all the high school boundaries

[01:11:20] and yes please gasp but it's true colgan has more students bounded within their boundary district than that building can hold forget program capacity what are we going to do when we build another high school and it's right next to three high schools we are we just going to boundary that one again and repeat the same mistake over and over and over again it is painful to wait but it is even more painful to continue to make the same mistakes without honoring our own commitment with what we said we do, which was value equity, do the best that we can for our students and our staff

[01:11:57] and our parents. I don't want my child to go to an overcrowded school like I did. But right now, that's what's going to happen in my own family and the community that I live in. It's because my community, Woodbridge District, has more development coming on board sooner. We have a whole other town center in addition to affordable housing coming. And I know for a fact, going back to Maureen Cadogan when you put in apartments for low at low cost even though we were told back then oh it doesn't make more people young people make people that's the whole point so forgive me for the long rampage but I think it's time while we have the opportunity this is a brand new board

[01:12:33] we're all very intelligent confident individuals we have an administration it's dedicated to serving our entire community we respect the silos for which we were elected but we embrace equity throughout our division and finally, finally put a nail in the coffin of the East versus and West and treat everybody equitably, redistrict our schools, have meetings with real estate agents because they're really the ones that get us in trouble when it comes to where your student's going to go, and move forward in the right direction for the benefit of all of us.

[01:13:04] Because my school has 11-some trailers. The West now has more trailers than they ever had because they're growing faster. So what's happening here is now happening over there. But we don't have to keep repeating the same thing. We have the opportunity and the time, and we will have the data to back up making a more informed decision.

[01:13:20] And I'm going to continue to advocate for that. And trust me, it's painful. Seven years is a very long time to spend looking at land and working with former board members and working with the BOCS and still be in this very same situation. I hope that we can wait on the study, utilize the information that's coming out of it, and really make smart decisions.

[01:13:43] And Dr. McDade, if you could refresh our memory a little bit about what that study entails, that would be fantastic. capacity study yeah sure I'd be happy to you know I just want to go back to you know earlier you know the high school was slated to come online in 2026 and we went to the board and had conversations regarding you know pausing and at that time it was still 25:57 and we paused to not not plop down the prototype but go

[01:14:17] into a full redesign and then september 30 hit and we had we had seen something we hadn't seen in many many years with uh our enrollment dropping and dr cartilage and his team as many of you have stated tonight is very efficient does a wonderful job at projections and for the first time in years they were outside the margin of error which is a one one percent margin of error so you know we we had to pump the brakes and say hey what's going on here and we leaned on several other organizations out there the Weldon Cooper Center at UVA

[01:14:53] projects enrollment project or enrollment for all divisions in Virginia and their projections were in line with what we were seeing in fact the Weldon Cooper Center actually projected us to lose more students over the next five or six years than what our models projecting Dr. Cartlidge and his team also consult with two of the leading demography organizations in the nation one on the East Coast one on the West Coast and their interpretation was the same so we leaned on several data sources to really capture what we were

[01:15:30] seeing with declining enrollment and again this is the first time it's a phenomena for the first time that we've seen in Northern Virginia since 1970 so So, you know, with that in mind, you know, we took a look at high school projections. And so, you know, looking at 2030, 2031, if we were to, with the 14th high school coming on in 2029, we potentially have 800 vacant seats in the high schools and the community where that's going to be impacted.

[01:16:00] And so, you know, being fiscal stewards, we thought let's pump the brakes, let's gather some more information we thought it would be responsible to take more time to study the enrollment to see if the enrollment projections were going to play out as as if everybody else is projecting gives us a little more time to study that gives us a little more time also to engage in conversations around many different topics that folks had mentioned tonight like transfer rates any specialty programming at the 14th high school and again we have not said that that we're not building the 14th high school we're moving forward as if the 14th high school is coming

[01:16:39] on in 2029 with a capacity of about 1400 students and i want to be very very clear when we design that building the design will be intentional so that we can expand onto that building so when we engage with the architect it will be with the expectation that that's a a building that we can easily expand on to should we see enrollment begin to, you know, increase.

[01:17:06] So that's the goal here. And, you know, that's kind of where we are with our enrollment projections. So I just want to be clear, it was leveraging a lot of different data points in making that decision. I do, but I do want -- thank you for that, Vern. But I do want to make sure that everyone's clear what the capacity study will entail.

[01:17:25] So maybe if we could have -- I'm sorry, yeah. No, no, no, that was good information, but I do want -- Matt to share like what what that will entail thank you dr. McDade so this year we have committed to updating the capacity metric at the high school level to mirror program capacity that has been rolled out first at elementary and then at the middle school level when we use planning capacity at the elementary level we soon realized that as a product primarily of the k-3 class size reduction grant the metric was not capturing the true space of these elementary schools

[01:18:03] for example if we were assuming 24 students per classroom at the elementary level and the school appeared to be at 80% of capacity but there were 10 trailers present something didn't make sense and with the reduction for grades K through 3 the grant could allow those class sizes to be reduced significantly from 24 you know down to 15 14 students per classroom so that was the primary motivator for shifting from a planning capacity to program capacity at the elementary level it also captures those nuances like gifted ELL's programs

[01:18:38] all those other variety of programs that can reduce a school's capacity when the class sizes are reduced when we moved forward and rolled out the middle school program capacity we noticed that division-wide there was a difference of about a hundred and eighty seats between planning capacity at the middle school level versus program capacity at the middle school level you pick up space in a middle school from the gymnasium as being one of the core classrooms that serves a class throughout the whole day in turn you lose a classroom for the health course that's there periodically throughout the term what that suggests

[01:19:18] to us initially is that at the middle school level when you don't have a class size reduction grant lowering class sizes there's still utility in having program capacity and at the same time the impact or the magnitude that we might expect at the high school level might be more similar to what we saw at the middle school level than what we saw back when we shifted from planning to program at the elementary level nevertheless our team is committed to updating the regulation that outlines program capacity and it's

[01:19:54] our intent to have this rolled out for high schools by the end of this calendar year okay miss wall thank you that was interesting and I had forgotten that the piece about the elementary school programming capacity etc etc so that was good good to hear that some of the arguments that I've heard for putting

[01:20:28] this since that's the motion that's before us putting the 14th back on schedule from previous CIPs proposed CIPs is the methodology of the data which we talked about a little bit and I didn't know if there was anything you wanted to add to that at this time but I had a couple of other things top arguments that I wanted to address is there anything you the only thing I do I do want Dr. Cartlidge to just -- when Mr. Bach talked about the Weldon Cooper study, which was only one study, and actually that study was after our team had already done all

[01:21:05] of the data analysis, and when that study came out, it just really reaffirmed what they had already saw. That study is a little bit more aggressive, but we believe that our data is even more accurate because Dr. Cartlidge and his team has had an opportunity to change the methodology and use data from PWCS even resources that gives us more accuracy.

[01:21:26] So I do want you to just give some visibility into some of the ways that you capture data to project enrollment. Mr. Yes, thank you, Dr. McDade. So first of all, one of the key enhancements this year is partnering with the Virginia Department of Health and using address level data to identify where past live births occurred and then correlating that with the attendance area to which they're assigned today.

[01:21:54] As Dr. McDade mentioned, the Weldon Cooper projections that came out months after we projected and in fact validated what we were anticipating. That was kind of the third validation. The first one was with the Lapkov and Global Demographic Research firm based out of California.

[01:22:15] And then the other one was with statistical forecasting. This is the firm that the prior board used to audit PWCS's projection methods back in about 2019. So working with those two independent firms on the redesign of our model assisted in our confidence in moving forward.

[01:22:36] The statistical forecasting firm in fact projected some of our schools so that we could compare our model's projections to what that firm would have projected using all the most current data and the gold standard for projection methods at the K-12 level.

[01:22:54] Thank you, Dr. Cartridge. Thank you. That's very interesting. And I think it's important to note that we -- wow, am I too close? -- that we were using our own methodologies that had been new and improved from 2019 and the things that we learned, right?

[01:23:12] And that we also had been pulling in statistical data from, you said, the Virginia Department of Health. And I remember we had that conversation because it explained some of the things that are happening in my district, schools that are very under capacity, next to schools that are very overcrowded because we were able to narrow down, you know, zoom in on the zip code data.

[01:23:33] And like the opening of innovation and how we kind of underestimated or we overestimated how many kindergarten classes we were going to need, for instance. And that has implications. It was small, but then we had to move people, et cetera. So I appreciate that a lot, and I think it's important that we understand, you know, we do the best we can with the data that we have, and we have a lot of good folks working on data science for us.

[01:23:55] My other thing that I've heard a little bit about, and people have come in and talked about, and I'd like to know a little bit more about, is this situation of, like, rovers versus trailers at a school. You know, Battlefield High School, for instance, is at the same percentage capacity as Woodbridge High School right now currently.

[01:24:15] Battlefield has experienced a precipitous drop in capacity. It used to be at 150%, maybe five years ago. Now it's at 103. Those two schools are at 103. But Battlefield has a lot of trailers, and Woodbridge does not. And so I wondered if you could speak to some of the ways that the division offers schools to deal with the ebb and flow of a few more students.

[01:24:39] Because as I'm reading the data here, Woodbridge High School in the 2023-24 year has an excess, or sorry, has a deficit of 110 seats. But then by just the school year 2025-26 school year, the projection is a deficit of only 20 seats.

[01:24:58] And then by the 26-27 school year, it would have a surplus of available seats of 64. So this is a little bit of an accordion going on at Woodbridge right now. And yet the school, as I can tell from our data, doesn't have any trailers.

[01:25:15] So would somebody like to speak to maybe what that is, maybe give the public an answer or some light enlightenment on that? Ms. Waugh, I'd be happy to speak to that. And Dr. Cartledge and his team really lead an effort every year that really takes a look at enrollment at all of our schools, Really starts fairly early in the year after the year starts Looking at you know where the September 30th enrollment comes in and then what are the needs to supplement space at schools and and You know one of the ways we supplement is through portable classrooms

[01:25:50] We go out on site we send teams out on site meet with the principal walk the space review the space Look at options for how we might be able to address the overcrowding and one of those solutions sometimes is portable classrooms To date, Woodbridge High School is not elected to utilize portable classrooms to help mitigate any overcrowding that they might have.

[01:26:12] And is that a school-based decision? Up to now, it's been a school-based decision. Dr. Cartledge and I have worked pretty closely with leaders, and so we'll be taking a little bit of a different approach moving forward. We always want the input of our school leaders and what we're doing to impact their school environment, but it'll be a collaborative decision.

[01:26:31] so the comments we've heard about 19 classes on rovers that that was a school-based decision yes ma'am okay and then the last question I had I think was perhaps addressed by Miss Williams a little bit but just this idea of having student we show student population decreasing yet others say that it's going up you know just kind of this like declining and rising population and I know I think we addressed that I think we probably addressed that but just those population estimates in general for our region I know I've seen news articles on

[01:27:11] this that don't even relate to PWCS but they just relate to the Northern Virginia area in general this is a phenomenon that we have not experienced in the Northern Virginia area in the last well since the 70s right is there anything you want to add to that because obviously it is going to affect it does affect us it's a new mindset that we have to get our heads wrapped around that we're not rapidly growing like we were in the early 2000s yeah dr. cartilage can you recap some of the reasons why we're seeing some of the enrollment projection decreases that we're seeing and which has already actually started

[01:27:48] this year so kind of at a larger scale thinking about population beyond k-12 we're seeing increases in domestic net out migration from Northern Virginia of populations choosing to move further out from the DC City Center so the exurbs of Fauquier County Stafford they're also moving farther south to the greater Richmond area and even farther south to the Carolinas and Georgia and in some of our speaking engagements we've learned just from anecdotal pieces of evidence

[01:28:22] evidence that a variety of families that leaders knew, you know, in fact did relocate to Georgia. So we're kind of seeing some anecdotal evidence validating what we're seeing through US Census Bureau data suggesting that there are increases in population moving away from the region.

[01:28:42] We also look at the international migration to our region. That's another component that can influence population here. And the Northern Virginia Regional Commission, they've published recently validating that, yes, domestic net out migration for Northern Virginia and Prince William County specifically, we are seeing more people leave domestically.

[01:29:06] We're seeing a little bit of an uptick in international migration, but the study cites that because there were several travel restrictions that have since been lifted, that's kind of a pent-up demand that is coming through in the most recent data that's available from the Census Bureau.

[01:29:25] In addition to that, we have decreasing birth rates. That's a nationwide trend. And given the data that we receive from the Virginia Department of Health, Prince William County is not immune to that trend. We are seeing decreases overall in the most recent data that then become our kindergartners five, six, seven years into the future.

[01:29:45] sure okay thank you I mean it's clear to see that what we're observing with our own data is being validated by many other data points and as I look at the data from this chart which is the current and projected capacity utilization amendment assessment and I can stop actually dr. dr. Latifian pick it up at a different time but go ahead we'll wrap this all right so um you know as I look at this even if we were to build the 14th school the 14th high

[01:30:19] school in 2029 as proposed and at a reduced seat capacity of 1400 even if we were to do that we would still have 459 seats available division-wide at the high school level that's delayed with a reduced capacity now if we proceed the way I'm looking at this data if we proceed to add this back in as the motion put forward by Akaguan district representative if we proceed to add this back in in 2027 without adjusting the seat capacity when it would open with

[01:30:57] over we would open it with over 3,000 surplus bases for students. Am I correct in how I'm reading the data? We'd have an over 3,000 surplus. I'd like to kind of just summarize what you're seeing there in the data. If we moved forward with a 2557 capacity 14th high school by 2030 our furthest out projection year we would have a projected 2856 seats vacant throughout all 14 high schools in the division that equates to the largest school in our

[01:31:37] current institution so there'd be more seats empty than we have seats at Garfield okay wow if we reduce the capacity to 1400 then in that 2030 year across the whole division we would have just under 1700 vacant seats projected if we build nothing and we're not suggesting that we're at this point the data is supporting a delay but I'm just saying if nothing were built in 2030 the projections suggest about 300 seats vacant throughout the whole division at

[01:32:13] the high school level so a redistricting in theory if these projections come true you could effectively balance enrollment across the whole district okay that that's really interesting and and something to think about and I understand it's not being taken out of the CIP it's being proposed for a two hour two year delay to assess and build a new plan and assess specialty program and everything else but even if we were to remove it and we

[01:32:47] redistricted everybody we'd still have a surplus of 300 something seats okay All right, thank you mr. I'm gonna okay When you when you do that projection because we're talking a lot about development and growth and things that are incoming I think I asked this before but do those numbers include and let me be clear voted on Development because I am also speaking about things that have not gone all the way through yet, which I understand

[01:33:22] But in the past we we didn't plan and we ended up with an issue at battlefield and peeping and Patriot over there on that side for those years because i was here for that alive and paying attention so i'm just asking you out loud does that include the voted on projects incoming so in the projections we are projecting a snapshot in time in the future each projection year is september 30th

[01:33:54] of that school year therefore our baseline for projecting is our current september 30th point in time. The developments that had rezoning approval at that point in time are built into the projection models. Anything that has since gained rezoning approval will be picked up in the projections that we project this coming September. So in the spirit of the CIP, we're

[01:34:23] an agile process. We respond to things that come to fruition. Let me have Ms. Zargarport because She hasn't commented yet and the rules are such that we'll have it and then we'll go back to questions.

[01:34:40] Ms. Zargarpur. - So as the representative of Colgan, who that is very overcrowded, we have rovers at Colgan and we have trailers. And we had them when my daughter's now graduated, but she went in as a freshman with those experiences.

[01:34:58] So it's been a while there too. Meanwhile, Hilton, which is just a couple miles the road is under enrolled and we we've heard people talk about different kinds of facilities that we may want to consider I'm not against building something I think it's well worth the time to wait and see what we learn in our reports and see what it is that we our community actually needs there's potential I you know I work for Fairfax County Public Schools we have secondary schools mr. Denick said she went to you went to basically middle high school right at one point right so there's a lot of things we can consider

[01:35:35] about how we do whatever we're gonna do and I am of the mindset that I think if we take in the information we can make a better decision that way so I'm not against building something I just want to make sure that something really suits the needs of our school division and our students so Miss Williams and then mr. Jesse and then mr. Wilk oh I guess mr. Blake you haven't talked on this issue right have you okay mr. I mean I just think that we have to be good good

[01:36:09] fiscal stewards and I think that going with mr. Bach and dr. McDade's recommendation is the right thing to do I mean and just in my district even though Hilton is not in my district it's still a Dell City School and both of my schools are under enrolled if I would say both of my Dell City Schools so I So I think that taking time to study and see, like everybody up here has mentioned, shifting the lines and sending kids to schools, we might alleviate.

[01:36:44] I'm not against not building this high school. I'm not very happy at the spot where you want to build it, but I think that we should definitely delay and get all the right information so that we can make the right decision.

[01:37:00] So 300 million dollars is a lot of money to spend you know and not do the right thing So that's my comment. Thank you. Mr. Blake. Miss Williams and then mr. Jesse then mr. Woke. Thank you I just want it for the sake of clarity. Do we have already?

[01:37:16] And I believe the answer to this is no, but do we have already a Footprint for the smaller scale school or do we only have the footprint for the larger? Yeah? Yes, ma'am we have a footprint for the larger high school or which has been our prototype so to we would have to do a full engagement a full redesign effort to design a building at 1400 and so we do not have that at this point okay so that's also part of what extends out the process yes ma'am should the board decide on budget approval night that we whatever I'm just theoretically change our mind we do the

[01:37:55] 25 it would condense the amount of time to actually build the school because we already have the plan correct ma'am it would okay and then but that is part of the discussion and debate the board has to do and that's why we pause and then what I'm concerned about that I hear in this discussion and I think is brought up every year is we have to sort of figure out some better mythology or some sort of backup plan for lack of a better way to determine in the sense that we only operate off of what is approved but we don't have a contingency plan for

[01:38:34] if a development goes offline if a development that was approved 20 years ago suddenly comes online during the middle what do we do with these students what do we do with the staff what do we how do we handle that we don't ever talk about that and I to me that's one of the most challenging things I'm not saying that you're gonna magically come up with a solution I don't expect you to have one because we've not asked that question and that's really I think the heart of what's going on what do we do in the meantime I heard you say a minute ago that you were reconsidering the site-based decision on whether or not to have trailers which I think is a very important discussion that we've not had before because it does create

[01:39:13] inequities the real question right now is not just at Woodbridge but at Freedom at Colgan what do we do in the meantime we know it takes a long time to build a school some people love trailers some people don't but I think it might behoove this board and the administration if we started having those discussions on what could we do what are the options we've not really explored them we've always band-aid we'd always piecemealed and if we could at a later date really sort of entertain those type of ideas and how what are the other options out there can't just be trailers maybe it is I don't know you

[01:39:52] know maybe maybe it's temporarily moving students not advocating for that I'm just saying we haven't done that maybe it's time to consider that in the future for when we have these issues because again 3,000 students 1990 Hilton open 1991 we lost a bunch of programs some of them never came back some just came back now we don't have a plan for that so I think it might be smart as we move down the line to start having those conversations because when we sit and we talk about you look at the student generation rate that snapshot is only for what we know right now if 17 new developments come online throughout the

[01:40:30] county those numbers are no longer accurate it's true so it's helpful that our CIP and our budget is a living document my school was elementary school was slated to open one year then I got pushed back then I got moved forward so I think we also need to be mindful of that there are all changes that we could make as we move on next year it may be pushing the high school up sooner maybe it's a discussion of another building but I think we we owe it to the public out there to also entertain what do we do in the interim so I don't know we're

[01:41:03] but thank you mr. vice chair mr. Jesse the the one thing I want to say is that when I said that the last board approved something and when you say pump the brakes I understand what you're saying what I'm saying I want to make very clear is that when the brakes are pumped on something that has been approved that

[01:41:40] is the significance and when you talk about schools at three hundred thousand dollars a million dollars and renovations that are very expensive the board should have a special meeting to decide whether the brakes should be pumped because what happened if i understand it correctly is that uh the plans were going forward on the 14th high school and the brakes were pumped correct well when i when i Referred to the brakes being pumped that was with engagement with the board where the engagement with the board

[01:42:20] By two when on your two and two meetings is not You overrode a decision from the previous board. Okay, and you can look at dr. McDade or I think but Yeah, let's have dr. McDade answer that mr Jess that's actually I mean it's really for the board to respond to because we don't have the authority to overrule the board There's nothing that I can do or anyone on the staff can do without permission from the board So we don't have that authority. So I mean, I don't think that that's a question for us I think I would defer that to

[01:42:57] the school board because there is never been a time in my administration that I have done anything without Going seek first seeking the board's Support so that's a question for the full board to address And I'll leave it alone after this what you just said is that you'd never do anything without going to the board going to the board and two and two meetings and So so forth something as significant as these delays

[01:43:31] Should have been in my opinion brought back to the entire board in a meeting and voted on and it was not so I'll leave it at that Just a clarification mr. Jessie. This is what we're doing today So if the board so Joe if the board so chose to vote to proceed in Not have the delay that can be done tonight so that we are doing that and the this is a proposed budget a proposed CIP This is proposed the superintendent explained the development of the proposal to the board But this is the vote. This is what we're talking about tonight and dr. Madea

[01:44:09] I you know, I fully understand that but you're missing the point when the project was delayed before this vote. And I have no problems within the middle of the year that we say we need to stop and we need to pump the brakes.

[01:44:31] But on a project that has been approved by the previous board, you stopped it and the board did not give official approval. Now, the problem with that is that this is the eighth delay.

[01:44:49] The community is getting to the point where we don't trust you we don't trust the board because every time we look around this high school got pushed back the first time the first two or three times it was because the location over on the other side of near holy road and so forth the community didn't want it so two three times it was delayed but now it's delayed we have no confidence in our board that we're not going to delay it again and in the

[01:45:23] meantime woodbridge high school is needing relief they said garfield high school doesn't need it but we do okay and uh so that so that's that's just my point and you agree with it i i or not that's but i just want to make that the other thing is when we look mrs jesse fought for years to get rid of the trailers in ocaquan community district and we got rid of almost every trailer

[01:45:56] yourself for maybe one or two and they're coming back and they're coming back in strong thing and it's just sickening that we have a school that we added the addition on within the last five ten years and now we have a trailer out in front of the school and my understanding from talking to some of my principals probably every it looks like almost all our schools are going to have elementary schools are going to have trailers so the other question is if all our elementary schools

[01:46:35] are getting over capacity where in the heck are they going to go when they go to high school it it doesn't just this doesn't seem to make sense to me okay the other thing i would like to say is stop if you're going to delay woodbridge you're going to lay delay everybody until this is done You know adding on to elementary schools right now you're saying Elementary schools are getting lower. So why are we going to add on to them?

[01:47:06] It just doesn't make sense and let's see. I think that's all. Thank you. Mr. Wilke. Okay. Well, I Was worried. I thought this was gonna be initially what I was gonna say But that's okay because at first I was worried this wasn't gonna be germane anymore, but now it has become So first of all, I want to acknowledge that I understand in some sense although we're not talking apples to apples But, you know, if any of you recall that when we were at work sessions, you know, my belief and my constituents' belief was that Grand Park at the time was dilapidated and it was up for renovations.

[01:47:45] And every year, despite knowing that I was going to lose, I did put it up for a motion to move it up an additional year and respectfully died 1-7, 1-7, ooh, if I was Kitty Brick, one seven one seven one seven one seven one seven and so my point is i get the frustration but i also understand afterwards you know i was reticent because i knew i was doing what i needed to do for my community and i made that attempt at the work session it failed i had to move on now i do want

[01:48:25] to highlight because it was just mentioned that we need to pause potentially across the board And I just want to talk about where the CIP the proposal currently stands because of the modular classroom situation in the Potomac District.

[01:48:41] It's no secret. I have the fastest growing community in the entire east side of the county. And that is Potomac Shorts and my community right now, that elementary school, we were talking about, you know, schools being young, five, six, seven years old. I have three.

[01:48:57] I'm sorry, five modular classes right out front with a projection of 150 to 300 more students coming next year leading to a total of eight modular classes now there continues being discussing about the future housing units and what is coming the projections let me tell you this so currently right now and i talked to the head developer there there are 2152 residential units in potomac shores right now right now if we opened up an elementary school back there it would fill a traditional size we are anticipating by the

[01:49:35] time this is done 3987 residential places whether it be single-family homes single-family townhomes condos luxury velas whatever but we are looking at just under 4 000 students so this proposed cip which has this moving up year which has always been the plan does free and alleviate space over 250 to 300 million for projects like this in areas that need it it also frees up additional funding

[01:50:11] for other things like renovations i think grant park could get some additional support i mean heck in a dream scenario and like we all might have these dream scenarios i'd love money to go to of Dumfries Elementary for renovations, but that's not where we're at, right? So we can't pause right now.

[01:50:28] The stark contrast of what we're talking about here, you can see it going down Riverview Drive and Potomac Shores. There is nowhere for people to go. It's bustling, it's overcrowded. Now, quickly touching on the high schools, everyone is thrown out there about their high schools, their statement, Forest Park is at 112% capacity, right?

[01:50:49] It's overcrowded. It has three trailers to help alleviate the overcrowding. On the other end, I have a high school that is under capacity and for the foreseeable future, that building is going to be under capacity, which in effect could impact things like equity pro, not equity programs, specialty programs and other different areas that, you know, if we had a full building, we can maybe do different course offerings and such.

[01:51:16] So I see the situation, you know, follow the proposals and look at potentially putting additions onto our existing buildings where it's needed most and as I think has been kind of reiterated here by multiple board members look at these glaring boundary issues to fill the number of buildings that are under capacity right now at this time so that is my piece thank you miss wall this is your last time okay

[01:51:54] thanks I wanted to address something a little bit just kind of bigger picture about schools and construction and students the the driver of a new school is need it's not that it was in a document or that was promised or anything else school construction follows students enough students equal a new school and obviously you can't build a new school if you have all the

[01:52:28] neighboring schools at approximately 100% capacity, you have to have a large enough surplus in order to justify the building and filling of a new school or else you potentially decimate the neighboring schools because there will be an outflux of students from the schools and then you run into problems where you have to cancel programs and classes and can't get enough kids to be on the girls basketball team because you just don't have enough students to field all of the opportunities.

[01:53:01] students ought to have and that have that they have other high schools so I think we need to keep in mind that yes if you have housing developments and you have an increase in students then you then you justify a new school but you don't justify it just because it's somebody's turn or it was promised in the past and things do change as we've seen in our region you know even with something as simple as teleworking coming online and becoming so much more prevalent people are not commuting and so they're not living in expensive jurisdictions like Arlington and Alexandria they're leaving and they're

[01:53:39] going to Culpeper and somewhere else because they can work in their sweats from their basement so I think these things affect us and we need to keep in mind what drives school construction its need and yes any school that is overcrowded has a need I personally experienced this with all my high schoolers at Battlefield now we have the reverse problem at Battlefield where we're seeing a precipitous decline in student enrollment and it will have its own set of problems because Gainesville wasn't right-sized Gainesville was

[01:54:14] built too big and we've now experienced all these demographics that we heard about where we're having this aha moment of like oh we're not growing leaps and bounds like we were in the past so I think we really do need to be wise and Ms. Daggerpur was very modest in her approach to Colgan but that's where our real overcrowding is and I want to emphasize it again according to our data Colgan is at 142 percent capacity with 10 trailers. Freedom, OP and Forest Park are all at about 112 percent capacity from our latest data. Freedom has 11,

[01:54:50] Osborne Park has 7. I had zero for Forest Park. I didn't know if they had three or zero. But in any event the next tier down is Woodbridge and Battlefield at 103 104 and then all the rest of our high schools all seven remaining high schools are under capacity and this is something that we really need to address we we have a right sizing problem and others have mentioned it redistricting is not popular I know people don't like it but that's what our real problem is

[01:55:22] now as for the issue of whether the division has done something improper by proposing that this 14th high school be delayed two years my opinion is it has not done anything improper the division works for us and has done their due diligence in assessing the data and has made a proposal to us and the proposal comes forward as a proposed CIP and we as the decision makers evaluate as dr.

[01:56:00] Latif said we evaluate the proposed CIP and then we make the vote depending on whether we accept the recommendations that have given been given to us based on the data that we have and our trust in our division employees and our superintendent or whether we think we know something different or something better so I think I disagree I think the process has been straightforward there's been integrity in the process and just because we've been made aware aware of proposals through a two by two does not mean that our power to make the decision has been taken away from us because we sit here tonight having this

[01:56:37] work session our second one and that's what we're doing now is taking in the feedback and evaluating all of the evidence before us in order to make a wise decision okay so reserve my comments for last I will not be supporting mr. Jesse's motion and I'll tell you why so first and foremost to add on to what Ms. Ball said, the process as Dr. McDade and her office and her administration

[01:57:14] receives data, they analyze the data and they share the data with the board and they do it through numerous mechanisms. And the decision to, after the analysis, to make a recommendation for the CIP or for the budget for that matter, for the big budget, which is about 1.8 some billion dollars, is a proposal.

[01:57:36] called the superintendent's proposed budget and all the power to approve the budget is vested in the full authority of this board at all times and so she makes her recommendations she communicates the recommendations in many different methods and the board has been made aware of this proposal and all that went into making the proposal of delaying it we had a one hour specifically in the last CIP work session just dedicated to the enrollment trends and the concerns and all of that that went into it so this

[01:58:12] hasn't come lightly I think it's important to know that the superintendent's office and the administration is well aware of the concerns of the community I have heard the folks in the community I understand their disappointment and concerns about overcrowding as chairman at large I have to deal with overcrowding across the county and under crowding. I have a school at Hilton which is way under capacity that might get dropped from the Virginia High School League's Division 6 to a lower division. This is a historic, you know, competitive championship high school that has

[01:58:50] a really remarkable tradition that has been cannibalized by the way the lines were drawn when Colgan went into effect. And so that is an issue. We have some undercapacity, and we have some issues that have to be dealt with there.

[01:59:09] And you've heard a lot about that tonight. So as chairman at large, for me, my responsibilities are to the entire community. And it's not bounded by any boundaries, and it is for the best of this division. And so moving forward, I do, you know, support the superintendent's proposal on this.

[01:59:28] I think it's also important to know that Woodbridge is a great high school. It's a fantastic place. There's a reason why there's a lot of folks there. There's a reason why folks don't choose to go to other schools that might have programs that attract them. There is capacity, for example, the Sizzle program at Hilton or the IB program at Garfield.

[01:59:47] But folks love Woodbridge. It's also a historic, wonderful high school. I don't get any emails about students being unhappy and parents being typically unhappy with the school. Is it overcrowded? Yes, and I've seen those emails recently, of course.

[02:00:03] It's always been a little bit overcrowded. But you know, at a lot of our schools that are overcrowded, folks are happy to be there. And so I'm not saying that that's why I'm voting on this. I do recognize we need to reduce the overcrowding. I recognize we need to do that. And that's something that, you know, we've built many schools.

[02:00:20] I think it's 27 or 28 schools this century alone, maybe more than that. Probably the most schools in any division this size in the nation this fast. And so we have tried to keep up, but the enrollment numbers are concerning.

[02:00:37] And the last thing I wanna do is be closing schools. And so, you know, we don't wanna have to deal with that, but we have to be thoughtful and methodical about this. So if we do move to a 1500, 1400 model, That in and of itself puts a delay in it. And so the board has been made aware of that for the last three months.

[02:00:55] And tonight is the night we're gonna make that vote. So at this point, I'll call for the vote. So all in favor of supporting Mr. Jesse's motion, say aye. What? We don't have to remake the motion. It's been seconded.

[02:01:13] Okay, Mr. Jesse's motion is to, he moved that we do not delay the 14th high school. So all in favor of Mr. Jesse's motion to not delay the high school, say aye.

[02:01:31] Raise your hand, okay? Let the record show Mr. Jesse votes aye. Okay, all opposed, and that leaves seven votes. All other members vote no. Motion fails.

[02:01:47] We're moving on to does anyone else have any proposed changes to the budget that they'd like to make a motion for? As seeing none, we will now move to the next part of the meeting, that is so so this you know marks the end of the work session and dr. look mr.

[02:02:13] chairman I think you had one hand up for some questions sure I'm sorry so again I I am new here so I have not done a budget session with you all before I I had questions and I now I know for next year I will send them ahead of time I do think that these are important questions that people in my district have asked in past and I just wanted them answered on the record and I think that if I can quickly ask these at a high level to explain some things I think that's going to be helpful so sorry I know we sat here for an hour discussing but that's

[02:02:52] yeah Justin what's the increase of 48% to the diversity equity and inclusion part of the budget it's a eight hundred and seventeen thousand dollar increase can you just explain because I know we've had a conversation and you explained me what some of those programs were and i wanted to be able to ask that all right um one i want to acknowledge that we did hear public comment on this so we um pulled out the diversity equity and inclusion uh budget and i think it's important to note that the diversity equity and inclusion

[02:03:28] office while it addresses systematically um equity and access across the board it houses also multiple, you know, federally required compliance pieces of the division. For example, in the DEI office, it also houses Title IX as well as Title VI and the investigative process that goes with both of those.

[02:03:52] Can you just quickly say what Title IX, Title VI is? Sexual harassment, discrimination, harassment overall, and does that cover it, Wade? Yes, ma'am. covers any allegations of discrimination based on sexual harassment or sex which is title nine and of course race title six um and there are investigators uh in that office who are tasked with investigating those complaints and rendering judgments in accordance with our title nine and title six responsibilities so that so it's just important to note that that's all housed in that

[02:04:28] office and so all of the that the personnel expenses that go with um both title six and Title IX are also housed in the DEI office. Additionally, anything that we do by way of programming that supports ensuring that students across this system have equitable access to programming, for example, is found in their budget. So for example, in this office, we support paying for SAT tutoring during and after school budgeting to make sure students can take the SAT without

[02:05:06] having to pay for it that's all found in the DEI budget so we increase funding to support in-person SAT prep for high school juniors to the tune of $256,000 that's an off-cycle investment in the DEI office so students who are taking the SAT this includes both the teacher time for preparing students and access to the SAT materials that's in the DEI office we've increased funding to support the staff members in the high school who are we have equity teams that get supplemental pay in the high school and those money is used for high dosage tutoring before and after school for AP IB Cambridge and

[02:05:46] dual enrollment courses that was to the tune of about sixty five thousand dollars we also increased funding to support compliance investigator training to make sure that all of our investigators for Title IX and Title VI are getting appropriate training and refreshing on the training so we had an off-cycle investment there and then for our equal opportunity schools which the board we presented to the board on that whereas students across all demographics who are not currently taking AP IB or Cambridge courses but in would for all intents and purposes qualify to take those courses we put in supports to inform their

[02:06:24] parents target do certain student surveys and target support so that we can increase access to advanced coursework for students who traditionally have been underrepresented in those courses before we were paying for that we had to pick up the cost for paying for EOS in the DEI office so that that's all the types of programming that you'll see there and then the last thing I would say is that that's a part of the increase that you just mentioned our family and in community engagement we moved it from the Office of Multilingual Services and Supports into DEI and so because their job is to

[02:07:03] ensure that all families are being engaged so we've increased funding to support our family and community engagement series that's the educational series that we offer monthly to all of our families which also requires translation services which are extremely expensive and so we've increased funding to cover translation services for example um just for cambodian translation it was like seven thousand dollars um that's all in the dei office and then any salary increases for for all of those positions that i just talked about in the compliance um salary increases there that shows

[02:07:40] up in the budget and that's across the board sometimes you may see a department's budget increase and they've really not added any new programming but when we have staffing increases in a 3%, the 2% increase we got in January, the 6% increase, all of that makes the cost for personnel increase and it shows up in that department's budget.

[02:08:03] So that's what you're seeing in the DEI office. It's all of the work that we're doing in the actual strategic plan, but I think the one thing that was really important to note is that I don't think that people realize that in the DEI office we also house Title IX and Title VI and we're funding that there.

[02:08:23] Thank you the multi-tiered system of supports doubled for both budget cycles I just noticed that it was a hundred and eight percent increase can you explain that a little bit what went into that that's in Dr. Flanard's shop so she probably would be better poised to give some details thank you Dr. McDade and good evening thank you for your question and actually what we did was an analysis of the title 6b grant which is a special education grant and The tenants of that grant are actually better utilized, and so we reorganized the individuals

[02:09:02] that were being funded from Title VIB to MTSS, so it's actually a net zero, although it does appear to be an increase. It's really just a shifting of funds. And can you just -- what is MTSS for?

[02:09:17] I'm sorry. Yes, ma'am. Thank you. Multi-tiered system of support, so that is really looking at providing a systematic way for our students that have gaps and have a need for potential remediation and/or intervention and then providing targeted support and instructional practices to identify and fill those gaps.

[02:09:38] Awesome. Thank you. See, again, I'm not a mathematician, but I can see where there's increases and decreases, so that's what I was looking at. This summer school, I noticed, went down by 40 percent, which, you know, I like savings, but I'm also wondering, was there not as much demand or what was again that is a really good question because on the onset it does look like there was a decrease we didn't have a decrease in the students what we're able to do is capitalize on the ESSER dollars to utilize those towards summer school funds so that way we can better use our funds great and then one more I noticed it's also in my district the governor's

[02:10:16] school increased by sixty-five percent is that due to enrollment or it's a combination of stuff in the 24 budget the governor school drew down on their fund balance they had fund balance and there was it was growing so in lieu of us contributing the city of Manassas and city of Manassas Park making contributions we used fund balance and then yes there is an increase in in in in some of the enrollment but it's mainly due to that and so in 2025 we had

[02:10:55] to restore our funding because there was no fund balance. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Trinetic, appreciate it. Any other questions, comments, concerns? Okay.

[02:11:10] Just for clarification, Dr. McDade or Shaquille, if we do get extra monies on the state budget, if that gets approved, are those baseline increases or are they one-time dollars? Does anyone know?

[02:11:27] That's a good question. Depending on the nature -- so there's compensation supplements and the grocery tax. You could consider those baseline adjustments. One of the things I alluded to earlier on was that without the VDOE calculation templates, we really can't determine what our match is supposed to be.

[02:11:51] But I would say the majority of that would help with our baseline. Okay. Wonderful. Okay. because if we if we do come back and we have to look at some of the other things that support the strategic plan we'll have an idea of what we can use that money for especially if it's baseline adjusted that's always better than the one time okay wonderful okay at this point now there being no further other questions concerns you have your hand on the button you're good okay okay oh we need a motion so at this point we call for a vote to typically accept the

[02:12:31] budget as presented or with changes we there hasn't been any changes as presented and then like I said you'll go to the board meeting we'll hear the budget we'll have a presentation at the meeting again you're not bound by today's vote if you're supporting the budget you can certainly change there but typically this is where we have the final questions if anything changes in the next week you certainly have time to ask questions to the staff ask clarifications there's still more time for questions and discussion at the next meeting miss Argerport please make a motion thank you mr. chairman I move that the Prince William County School Board accept the fiscal year 2025 budget as presented in this evening's work session and final markup do I have a

[02:13:10] second chairman miss Williams any discussion okay all those in favor of the motion well this is a straw this is not not binding right so that's what I said earlier. So, okay, all in favor, aye, hands in the air, 7, yes, and opposed, and 1-0, Mr. Jesse. Okay. Do we have another motion? Oh, they got it, got it, got it. All right.

[02:13:48] At that point, there being no further board business before this board, the meeting is adjourned. This is so... Look at that. Look at that.

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